Oh my god, please not IBD.

No, but I'll surely see them at the next expo. Sept 20th.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Do you guys think its worth it to move my entire hatching rack to another room? Away from my adults? Or would it be too late?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Is it possible for a snake to die of IBD without exhibiting any of the symptoms?

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Anybody got answers to these?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Anybody got answers to these?

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Well, for the first one I would say yes, move them if you can .. UNLESS you have others snakes in the house, thus potentially spreading it even more.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Do you guys think its worth it to move my entire hatching rack to another room? Away from my adults? Or would it be too late?

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Yes, I think it would be worth it. I doubt if it would do any good if it is IBD, but if it's something else like a parasite it might not be too late.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Is it possible for a snake to die of IBD without exhibiting any of the symptoms?

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I've never heard of a case of IBD without symptoms, but I imagine the symptoms could go unnoticed if the infection was quick and the snake wasn't monitored for some time.

RodentKing BOI thread = many name changes, bad customer service, no call backs, no/late shipping, etc.

As far as it being IBD - if you've had them since April -- and this is the first you've seen of it (since you check them everyday) -- I would venture it's more likely to be something else and you just caught the last struggling moments for the poor girl. Unless (and there's always an unless) you've gotten a recent addition or have been to a show or in contact in some way with an infected animal and it's just caught it.

I'm willing to make a small donation as well if you want to shoot me your paypal address.

If I had money to give, I would .. but I need it for my own collection and I am moving soon so .. times be ruff. If you really need some help, I could spot you some in a pinch to get this taken care of though.

ugh this sucks... keep us updated.

I had a similar problem with a neonate boa 5 years ago and it turned out to be neurological problem not caused by IBD. My vet did a necropsy and also sent the body to Dr. Elliot Jacobson to run additional test and it came back negative for IBD, known viruses, bacterial infections, etc. My reptile vet brought up the idea that this neurological problem could have been caused by other factors such has excessive heat, extreme dehydration, or chemicals such as PAM (provent-a-mite).

Everyone had told me PAM was safe to us but I should have been way more careful. I was just starting out and I didn't know any better. I had just set up the quarantine tub for this little guy the same day I got him and I sprayed PAM all over his enclosure. I let it air out a few minutes and put his water bowl in. After I had inspected him I put him in his tub and off he went into his hide.

After about 2 days I started noticing he was star gazing and then started twisting like your ball python did. I immediately took him to the vet and he brought up the concern about IBD and the symptoms did match. I agreed on the necropsy which came back inconclusive. My vet suggested sending the body to Dr. Elliot for additional testing since he is an expert on the matter. Well the good thing was it wasn't IBD and I was ecstatic about that but was sad to loose this little guy.

So don't jump to conclusion on this being caused by IBD as it is apparently not as common as people think it is, per Dr. Elliot and my vet. But then again this was years ago. For all the noob out there using SPAM, don't make the same mistake I did. Just a little SPAM goes a long way. Now I only pre-treat my cage liners, aspen, or whatever I'm going to use as substrate and never spray directly in the tub and its worked the same for me. If you do decide to spray PAM directly in the tub make sure you air it out and make sure everything is completely dry in the tub before putting your animals back in.

If you need some funds I'll donate to help with the necropsy. PM me your paypal address. Good luck with the necropsy.

Sam

I really feel like a cheap jerk here, but all you that have offered to help me out a little bit, it would really make a difference. I don't have paypal but my dad does, I just don't know what I need to give you for you to be able to donate to me, any help would be appreciated.

PS, I have the all the CH's moved far away from my adults now.

Also, now I cannot go to the vet until tomorrow, her body is in the fridge, is going to be ok until tomorrow?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

I really feel like a cheap jerk here, but all you that have offered to help me out a little bit, it would really make a difference. I don't have paypal but my dad does, I just don't know what I need to give you for you to be able to donate to me, any help would be appreciated.

PS, I have the all the CH's moved far away from my adults now.

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Just need the email address that is connected to the PayPal account.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cuda

Just need the email address that is connected to the PayPal account.

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Thank you all so much I really really appreciate this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by StickyTongues

I had a similar problem with a neonate boa 5 years ago and it turned out to be neurological problem not caused by IBD. My vet did a necropsy and also sent the body to Dr. Elliot Jacobson to run additional test and it came back negative for IBD, known viruses, bacterial infections, etc. My reptile vet brought up the idea that this neurological problem could have been caused by other factors such has excessive heat, extreme dehydration, or chemicals such as PAM (provent-a-mite).

Everyone had told me PAM was safe to us but I should have been way more careful. I was just starting out and I didn't know any better. I had just set up the quarantine tub for this little guy the same day I got him and I sprayed PAM all over his enclosure. I let it air out a few minutes and put his water bowl in. After I had inspected him I put him in his tub and off he went into his hide.

After about 2 days I started noticing he was star gazing and then started twisting like your ball python did. I immediately took him to the vet and he brought up the concern about IBD and the symptoms did match. I agreed on the necropsy which came back inconclusive. My vet suggested sending the body to Dr. Elliot for additional testing since he is an expert on the matter. Well the good thing was it wasn't IBD and I was ecstatic about that but was sad to loose this little guy.

So don't jump to conclusion on this being caused by IBD as it is apparently not as common as people think it is, per Dr. Elliot and my vet. But then again this was years ago. For all the noob out there using SPAM, don't make the same mistake I did. Just a little SPAM goes a long way. Now I only pre-treat my cage liners, aspen, or whatever I'm going to use as substrate and never spray directly in the tub and its worked the same for me. If you do decide to spray PAM directly in the tub make sure you air it out and make sure everything is completely dry in the tub before putting your animals back in.

If you need some funds I'll donate to help with the necropsy. PM me your paypal address. Good luck with the necropsy.

Sam

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Whoops! Didn't mean to say SPAM there in the second to last paragraph. That would have been pretty!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Ok lets say it is IBD, how is it transmitted, if I have other snakes in the same room, is it likely they have it, or is it just contact, or what? I only quarantined for 3 months, this snake was with the rest of my collection, I moved it 2 floors away from the other snakes but crap...I'm so scared.

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according to the link provided in this thread, here is the anwer to this:

The snake mite (Ophionyssus natricis) is suspected to be a vector, passing the virus from one snake to another. Often, with an outbreak of IBD, the snakes also have concurrent mite problems. Other possible ways that the virus can be transmitted include direct contact between infected and noninfected snakes, contaminated bedding, venereal transmission and intrauterine transmission to developing embryos in viviparous species and to eggs in oviparous species, although the direct route of transmission has not yet been identified.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mcavana

according to the link provided in this thread, here is the anwer to this:

The snake mite (Ophionyssus natricis) is suspected to be a vector, passing the virus from one snake to another. Often, with an outbreak of IBD, the snakes also have concurrent mite problems. Other possible ways that the virus can be transmitted include direct contact between infected and noninfected snakes, contaminated bedding, venereal transmission and intrauterine transmission to developing embryos in viviparous species and to eggs in oviparous species, although the direct route of transmission has not yet been identified.

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If thats the answer, and it IS IBD, this would lead me to believe that my other snakes have not caught it. I have had no evidence of mites in my collection ever. This snake has never come in contact with any other snake in the 4 months that I have owned it. No other snake has ever been on this snakes bedding. Most of you have seen my set up, I will highlight the enclosure that this sick snake was in.

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/b...iams58/ibd.jpg

Which cages do you think are most at risk?

Those videos are horrible to watch, I can't imagine what it is like to be watching it in person and being one of your snakes... you shoot me the email address I'd be willing to chip in a bit too to help you figured out what happened to her.

Please someone correct me if I am wrong... but IBD doesn't take 4 moths does it? I thought I read somewhere that it was something that made a snake almost immediately sick...

If you read about IBD it clearly says they dont even know how its transmitted... If it turns out to be IBD I wouldnt panic and start destroying your collection. But I wouldnt visit anyones house that has reptiles or go to pet stores that sell reptiles, and also dont buy anymore snakes for a while until you know your in the clear...

With so little known who knows some snakes may have an immunity.... Who knows...

I was under the impression that boas could carry IBD without symptoms, but pythons don't live past the 30 day mark. Correct me if i'm wrong (it's been know to happen). I'm really very sorry to hear about this. Please keep us updated.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mochelem

If you read about IBD it clearly says they dont even know how its transmitted... If it turns out to be IBD I wouldnt panic and start destroying your collection. But I wouldnt visit anyones house that has reptiles or go to pet stores that sell reptiles, and also dont buy anymore snakes for a while until you know your in the clear...

With so little known who knows some snakes may have an immunity.... Who knows...

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Yeah, don't do anything crazy until you get the test done on the dead snake, it could turn out to just be something that one snake had. I am very sorry for your loss and hope you can figure out what has happened soon so you do not have to worry!
And maybe its just me, but I would absolutely never freeze a snake, no matter the state it is in. I have money I have saved in the bank just for my pets, I would have them euthanized, I have had to freeze tarantulas in the past and even that isn't pretty, as soon as they start to feel the cold they twitch and make terrible positions and although I know they do not feel much it is hard to deal with, I would never freeze an animal with a spine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

If thats the answer, and it IS IBD, this would lead me to believe that my other snakes have not caught it. I have had no evidence of mites in my collection ever. This snake has never come in contact with any other snake in the 4 months that I have owned it. No other snake has ever been on this snakes bedding. Most of you have seen my set up, I will highlight the enclosure that this sick snake was in.

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/b...iams58/ibd.jpg

Which cages do you think are most at risk?

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Based on what mcavana said, I think your collections is fine, that is considering you wash your hands in between handling, and that none of the other snakes have touched the infected snake or its bedding etc... But at this point with the rest of your collection, only time can tell.
I wish you the best! Good luck man.

She looked very thin. How and when had she been feeding? If she didn't eat, and was wasting away, perhaps it was just her last day before dying. I did not see any stargazing moves, at least nothing that to me seemed like it.
It could be POSSIBLE to not show any symptoms for 4 months, but I would highly doubt it. I was always told that pythons rarely live more than a month. Boas were the ones that could carry without dying. Is this true? I couldn't say for certain sure.
Don't panic yet, and just tell yourself it was a CH baby, so it could have been several things unrelated to IBD.
If it IS IBD, then you can deal with that then. Don't borrow trouble.
HUGS and I'll think good thoughts for you. Please keep us updated, and if you have records of eating, or possible regurgitation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wolfy-hound

She looked very thin. How and when had she been feeding? If she didn't eat, and was wasting away, perhaps it was just her last day before dying. I did not see any stargazing moves, at least nothing that to me seemed like it.
It could be POSSIBLE to not show any symptoms for 4 months, but I would highly doubt it. I was always told that pythons rarely live more than a month. Boas were the ones that could carry without dying. Is this true? I couldn't say for certain sure.
Don't panic yet, and just tell yourself it was a CH baby, so it could have been several things unrelated to IBD.
If it IS IBD, then you can deal with that then. Don't borrow trouble.
HUGS and I'll think good thoughts for you. Please keep us updated, and if you have records of eating, or possible regurgitation.

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The snake had never regurged, but I did have to assist feed it 4 times (once a week for the last 4 weeks).

(oh geez, 666th post)

No one can conjecture as to the cause of death; only the necropsy will show the cause.

Also, it would be very unwise to conjecture that the collection is safe if the necropsy confirms IBD.

At this point, I feel the best thing is to not let any snakes into or out of your home and get the necropsy done.

Also, I would be scrubbing like mad-- get every tub and water dish cleaned with a bleach solution, all utensils cleaned with a bleach solution, door knobs, walls, rack units, poles, scales, everything. Scrub everything down and start with a completely sterile environment.

Wow Pete, Im late in the thread, but I wish you the best of luck for reals

Quote:

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Originally Posted by starmom

No one can conjecture as to the cause of death; only the necropsy will show the cause.

Also, it would be very unwise to conjecture that the collection is safe if the necropsy confirms IBD.

At this point, I feel the best thing is to not let any snakes into or out of your home and get the necropsy done.

Also, I would be scrubbing like mad-- get every tub and water dish cleaned with a bleach solution, all utensils cleaned with a bleach solution, door knobs, walls, rack units, poles, scales, everything. Scrub everything down and start with a completely sterile environment.

---

I'm scared to even open tubs for fear that the virus will get in easier. What ratio bleach to water are we talking about?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

I'm scared to even open tubs for fear that the virus will get in easier. What ratio bleach to water are we talking about?

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1 part bleach, 10 parts water should be fine.

So do you guys think her body will be ok in the fridge until tomorrow?

As long as it is not too cold to freeze the body, yes, it should be fine...

Let us know how things go.

I asked that you post the vet reports once you get them back ( and samples will have to be tested, so you might not get an answer tomorrow) Just to know that those who donated's money went to the cause. Of course, if thats not too much to ask. :)

I wish you well, and hopefully this was a fluke thing. - Alicia Holmes

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mooingtricycle

Let us know how things go.

I asked that you post the vet reports once you get them back ( and samples will have to be tested, so you might not get an answer tomorrow) Just to know that those who donated's money went to the cause. Of course, if thats not too much to ask. :)

I wish you well, and hopefully this was a fluke thing. - Alicia Holmes

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Yes of course. Little update: Thinks are not looking good. I was checking on the other CH females, and I caught one stargazing. I touched her head and she recoiled and a bunch of mucous flew out of her mouth. It appears she has an RI. She is now isolated away from my already isolated CH females.

Looks like the animal was in the beginning of death throas when you first found it, and that is what you were seeing. Assist feeding is very stressfuul and can injure the animal.

Dont mix ANYTHING. All of those animals in that room need to be taken care of individually, and SERIOUSLY lock everything down. Dont touch an edge of the rack without washing your hands first and after.

Seriously. Consider this as a worst case scenario. Dont touch your pants, dont touch anything, use gloves. Throw gloves away after EACH animal. Use gloves for EVERYTHING in that room. Even touching the Door handle if you have one on it. consider everything dirty and carrying the virus.

Avoid touching anything sick as much as you possibly can.

There is also an excellent possibility that you simply got imported snakes that had parasites or bacteria that took 120 days to kill the first snake.

That is not an uncommon scenario. Babies go through all kinds of crap.

If I think the people you got them from are who I recall them as being, then substandard snakes would be no surprise at all.

Did you get fecals done or use any meds at all on the babies when you got them?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Yes of course. Little update: Thinks are not looking good. I was checking on the other CH females, and I caught one stargazing. I touched her head and she recoiled and a bunch of mucous flew out of her mouth. It appears she has an RI. She is now isolated away from my already isolated CH females.

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Oh boy, this does not sound very positive at all. Clean, clean clean and see if your vet will work a deal to look at all of your snakes...
Remember to employ very strict qt procedures when dealing with your snakes in order to avoid cross-contamination.
Take care and remember to breathe...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Just got off the phone with the vet, they can't do it but they can sent it to Guelph for me and its $250. I've got $5 in the bank right now. Gotta borrow from mom and dad I guess...no bumblebee for me...

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Peter, Guelph is a top notch place (are you sending the snake direct to the vet school there?). It's well worth the money to find out what killed this CH hatchling.

Until then I would completely seperate and strictly QT the CH group and any other snake showing any signs of illness. I would get busy with cleaning, disinfecting, buy disposable gloves, do not share prey or husbandry tools, etc. I would close the collection until you know better and put on temporary hold any incoming snakes (and of course, nothing going out). I would not go near other reptiles (shows, pet stores, etc.) nor allow anyone near yours until you know for sure what went on.

Peter to be quite honest what struck me in that hatchling that passed was the appearance that it had a severely concave belly. How big were these hatchlings when you got them in? If you only assist fed that one 4 times, and have had them for months - was it not eating before or had it started to eat after the 4 assists or had it only had those 4 meals into it? Did you get any information from this supplier as to whether these CH's were flipped and had never had a feeding yet or were properly hydrated and cared for before they were sold to you? Of the rest of that group, are they gaining weight appropriately or do others have this same look to them?

After you got in this CH group what other snakes have you brought into the collection?

I'm no expert on IBD but it does strike me as odd that a delicate and small hatchling would take this long to die of IBD. I, like others here, was under the impression that IBD was a far swifter killer of pythons. My gut instinct is that this little snake died of something else and I'll be very interested to read the findings coming back from Guelph.

Oh wow, Im so sorry to hear everything you're going thru, it's every herpers nightmare. my prayers are with you and your collection!

If you need help with money, I can see if I can donate a couple dollars to your cause. It may not be much but 10 dollars could go a long way sometimes. :]

I'm terribly sorry that this his happening to you. I believe too that I find it odd for the snake to have taken that long to die of IBD. If the other snake has an RI, then I suspect there was probably a nasty bug or parasite in the group you bought.

Good luck and let us know the results! This information could help us learn a whole lot of what to expect and watch out for. Your doing a fantastic job and taking this very well.

Hey peter... very late on this thread and I cannot offer enough condolences.

I have to say I concur with the thoughts surrounding IBD as being faster than that. Often larger breeders will place a hatchling male BP in with a boa before bringing it out of QT... as the python will die before the QT is up.

Sorry for the graphic and not so popular image, but many of us know that is done.

My fear though, and my caution... and I really hate even suggesting it. But the show Aug 10th in Mtl. Is there a chance you brought something home with you accidentally?

Or something intentional? Supplies, feeders, etc. that may have come into contact with this baby snake and may not have been 100% sanitized? If her immune system was already compromised it may have sped things up for her.

I am not sure if you remember a thread on R-Canada regarding an individual's snake that was accidentally poisoned by the active ingredient in Nix and displayed very similar symptons to IBD? If I remember this happened before they got the snake and the effective was cumulative and did not show up immediately.

You mentioned no mites, no treatments, so just asking... did you treat an enclosure or anything that may have possibly come into contact with her.

Just grasping here.

The other concern would be if the second snake is showing symptons of an advanced RI, then very carefully trace your QT and handling procedures within your snake room.

What tools are used on what snakes, any shared tubs, shared cleaning areas, etc.

My heart goes out to you Peter. :(

Bruce

Quote:

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Originally Posted by frankykeno

Peter, Guelph is a top notch place (are you sending the snake direct to the vet school there?). It's well worth the money to find out what killed this CH hatchling.

Until then I would completely seperate and strictly QT the CH group and any other snake showing any signs of illness. I would get busy with cleaning, disinfecting, buy disposable gloves, do not share prey or husbandry tools, etc. I would close the collection until you know better and put on temporary hold any incoming snakes (and of course, nothing going out). I would not go near other reptiles (shows, pet stores, etc.) nor allow anyone near yours until you know for sure what went on.

Peter to be quite honest what struck me in that hatchling that passed was the appearance that it had a severely concave belly. How big were these hatchlings when you got them in? If you only assist fed that one 4 times, and have had them for months - was it not eating before or had it started to eat after the 4 assists or had it only had those 4 meals into it? Did you get any information from this supplier as to whether these CH's were flipped and had never had a feeding yet or were properly hydrated and cared for before they were sold to you? Of the rest of that group, are they gaining weight appropriately or do others have this same look to them?

After you got in this CH group what other snakes have you brought into the collection?

I'm no expert on IBD but it does strike me as odd that a delicate and small hatchling would take this long to die of IBD. I, like others here, was under the impression that IBD was a far swifter killer of pythons. My gut instinct is that this little snake died of something else and I'll be very interested to read the findings coming back from Guelph.

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The vet I'm taking the body to tomorrow is taking care of all the sending, I'll ask them tomorrow but I'm not sure exactly where in Guelph it's being sent. When I bought them, he said some had been started on mice, and some needed a little more persuasion. At present I have 9 that are eating rats and doing fine. The other 11 consisted of 6 mouse feeders (also doing fine, just don't weigh as much as the rat feeders naturally) and 5 non feeders. I waited as long as I could and tried all the tricks to get them to eat but those 5 just wouldn't eat. I began assist feeding all of them, and then this. The female that died was one of the non feeders. I have not brought any more snakes into the collection since I got these CH's. I'm just hoping and praying this is not IBD. I am scheduled to get a bumblebee from Mark Mandic on Sept 9th. If all this is not resolved by then I will see him again on sept 20th, at the expo, were I can get it from him then. Do you think the vet results will be back by Sept 20th?

lets pray that it is only from the assist feeding and malnutrition rather than ibd.. I have delt with rodentkings before for feeders with no problems on multiple occasions, my freezer is still stocked up. I saw they were selling CH babies and I was almost tempted to buy some but I decided I would rather not.. I am kinda glad at this point. as for guelph, they send it to the university, you can actually take it yourself and it will probably be cheaper.. I seem to remember a post by corey woods about where its located.. that was on reptilescanada if your going to search it..

Good luck and I hope your collection is not at risk of IBD.
Richard

Wow, I am so sorry for what you are going through. I can't add much to what has been said but if you have a paypal addy so I can help out with the bill, pm it to me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Loft Lizard

Hey peter... very late on this thread and I cannot offer enough condolences.

I have to say I concur with the thoughts surrounding IBD as being faster than that. Often larger breeders will place a hatchling male BP in with a boa before bringing it out of QT... as the python will die before the QT is up.

Sorry for the graphic and not so popular image, but many of us know that is done.

My fear though, and my caution... and I really hate even suggesting it. But the show Aug 10th in Mtl. Is there a chance you brought something home with you accidentally?

Or something intentional? Supplies, feeders, etc. that may have come into contact with this baby snake and may not have been 100% sanitized? If her immune system was already compromised it may have sped things up for her.

I am not sure if you remember a thread on R-Canada regarding an individual's snake that was accidentally poisoned by the active ingredient in Nix and displayed very similar symptons to IBD? If I remember this happened before they got the snake and the effective was cumulative and did not show up immediately.

You mentioned no mites, no treatments, so just asking... did you treat an enclosure or anything that may have possibly come into contact with her.

Just grasping here.

The other concern would be if the second snake is showing symptons of an advanced RI, then very carefully trace your QT and handling procedures within your snake room.

What tools are used on what snakes, any shared tubs, shared cleaning areas, etc.

My heart goes out to you Peter. :(

Bruce

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Now wait a minute, I DID treat all these snakes with a home made Nixx remedy. The morning of the expo I got them, I sprayed all the enclosures (not water bowls or hides, just the newspaper substate) The enclosures aired out while I was at the expo, and I put them in when I got home, this was in april however. And I don't think I brought anything home with me from the expo, but if it is from then, I hope you didn't accidentally get anything too.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Somed00d

lets pray that it is only from the assist feeding and malnutrition rather than ibd.. I have delt with rodentkings before for feeders with no problems on multiple occasions, my freezer is still stocked up. I saw they were selling CH babies and I was almost tempted to buy some but I decided I would rather not.. I am kinda glad at this point. as for guelph, they send it to the university, you can actually take it yourself and it will probably be cheaper.. I seem to remember a post by corey woods about where its located.. that was on reptilescanada if your going to search it..

Good luck and I hope your collection is not at risk of IBD.
Richard

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I have a friend leaving for University (Guelph) next saturday (the 30th) and he could take it but that seems like to long for the body to wait in my fridge.

In regards to the snake I thought had an RI, perhaps this was an isolated incident. I know its not normal for a bp to excrete mucous, but I did startle the hell out of her and she had eaten probably a hour before. She is not weezing or popping or anything. Could it just have been extra saliva from the feeding? The snake in question is one of my healthiest ones, one of the rat eaters.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

In regards to the snake I thought had an RI, perhaps this was an isolated incident. I know its not normal for a bp to excrete mucous, but I did startle the hell out of her and she had eaten probably a hour before. She is not weezing or popping or anything. Could it just have been extra saliva from the feeding? The snake in question is one of my healthiest ones, one of the rat eaters.

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It could be. It is especially likely if she had just had a drink of water. You know how their saliva gets very viscous just after drinking. That could look a lot like mucus, especially if you're already on edge.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wilomn

It could be. It is especially likely if she had just had a drink of water. You know how their saliva gets very viscous just after drinking. That could look a lot like mucus, especially if you're already on edge.

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That does sound very likely, the saliva was crystal clear if that makes any difference. Thank you for putting my mind at ease on that one. She will however remain quarantined from the rest of the group until I get things sorted out. And maybe her "star gazing" was just her putting her head up to drink the water? Similar to when swallowing a prey item?

Dude, go to bed. You can't do anything else tonight.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pwilliams58

Now wait a minute, I DID treat all these snakes with a home made Nixx remedy. The morning of the expo I got them, I sprayed all the enclosures (not water bowls or hides, just the newspaper substate) The enclosures aired out while I was at the expo, and I put them in when I got home, this was in april however. And I don't think I brought anything home with me from the expo, but if it is from then, I hope you didn't accidentally get anything too.

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That long ago, then I cannot imagine it is still Nixx poisoning... so you're probably good.

And perhaps the "mucous" was just a nervous snake being startled and spitting up some water.

As you keep an eye on her, you should be able to get a feel for what is going on with her. RIs aren't hard to spot, esp. if they are at that stage. Best to watch her water dish...

Fingers crossed for you.

Bruce

Peter, don't wait and hold that snake's body. Get it to Guelph as soon as possible and in the best shape you can. If it is going to the University, you'll get a proper idea of what went on. Their reputation is one of the best in Canada so I'd be very confident in their findings. Again, well worth the money to my mind so you know truly what you are facing.

For now, there really isn't much you can do. I've no idea how long it will be until you get those results so the best and only thing you really can do is monitor the collection closely, keep strict QT and just go about your business (with reasonable restrictions of course). Please let us know what Guelph says.

Wow, so much in so short of a time. I am very sorry for you man, this can't be easy. I'm praying for the best, you just hang in there!