# Ball Pythons > BP Husbandry > Advanced BP Husbandry >  Need Help - Stool Oddity

## Kinra

I was looking through my rack checking on everyone tonight and I came across something really odd in my butter's tub.  It appears to be stringy stool.  I've never seen anything like this before.  

Can anyone tell me was this is:




I don't have any experience with snake diarrhea but that's certainly not how I pictured it would be.  Could it be something she couldn't digest that maybe one of the f/t rats I fed her ate?  Is it time for a trip to the vet?  She's about to go blue so I should be able to get a sample to do a fecal exam.

I'm just really confused right now.   :Confused:

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## spitzu

Kind of looks like a tape worm from what I can remember.  Whatever it is... Gross.

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_Kinra_ (10-06-2011)

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## Kinra

> Kind of looks like a tape worm from what I can remember.  Whatever it is... Gross.


If that is what it is, I agree it is extremely gross.  >__<

I guess I will be calling my vet tomorrow.

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## mpkeelee

I'm on my phone so its kinda hard to see but if u believe it to be a parasite put it in a plastic bag and in the fridge. Ur vet can look at it and prescribe some medsgood luck I hope its not a parasite

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_Kinra_ (10-06-2011)

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## Kinra

> I'm on my phone so its kinda hard to see but if u believe it to be a parasite put it in a plastic bag and in the fridge. Ur vet can look at it and prescribe some medsgood luck I hope its not a parasite


It looks like it was in there for a few days (it was under the paper so I missed it), so I don't think refrigerating it will make a difference at this point.  I did save it to take to the vet though.

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## Homegrownscales

Weird I would def consult the vet on that one. I have never seen anything like that. 


Check out what's new on my website... www.Homegrownscales.com

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_Kinra_ (10-07-2011)

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

Yes take that to the vet to see if it's a parasite. That is odd. Snake poo comes in all shapes, sizes, and colors, but that is definitely not something I've ever seen.

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_Kinra_ (10-07-2011)

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## CoolioTiffany

I even agree that is quite odd looking. If it were a parasite I'm sure it would've still been hooked up inside the intestines instead of pooped out. Definitely something to get looked at though, I have never seen this before either. Better safe than sorry.

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_Kinra_ (10-07-2011)

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## Kinra

So it took it to the vet this morning.  I also go lucky and she left me a nice stinky mess this morning that I was able to bring to the vet as well.  That weird thing is in fact a tapeworm and my vet is going to call me later if he finds anything else when he does the fecal exam.  

The scary thing is that it is as long if not longer than her.   :Surprised:   AND I have no idea where/how/when she got tapeworms.  >__<

On a positive note, I don't have to worry too much about the rest of my collection having tapeworms since they can only get them from rodents (or bugs but I can't see a BP eating bugs).  

My best guess on how she got it is either one of the f/t rats I fed her had it or she ate something when she escaped for a week.  Honestly I'm actually hoping she got it from the f/t rats because the thought that there might be mice/rats in my apartment scares me.

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## mpkeelee

Have u ever fed live? If so where did u get the feeder from? Did u get the snake from a breeder? (Same feeder questions about breeder) if so then the source has to be put out so others can be aware and so the breeder can check his animals. I'm not an infectious disease expert but I don't think a parasite can be frozen, ingested and reproduce. Maybe. It prolly came from when it got loose. Hopefully ur vet will help narrow it down. Sorry to hear it. Good luck

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## Kinra

> Have u ever fed live? If so where did u get the feeder from? Did u get the snake from a breeder? (Same feeder questions about breeder) if so then the source has to be put out so others can be aware and so the breeder can check his animals. I'm not an infectious disease expert but I don't think a parasite can be frozen, ingested and reproduce. Maybe. It prolly came from when it got loose. Hopefully ur vet will help narrow it down. Sorry to hear it. Good luck


I'd have to double check her records (I'm at work now), but I don't think I've ever fed her live.  
At this point I'm not willing to say where I got her from until I talk to them.  It doesn't seem fair to cast doubt on anyone when it is likely she may have gotten it when she escaped.  I also highly doubt she had it when I got her but I haven't had a fecal exam done on her before.
I also believe it is possible for parasites to survive in a freezer.  They have to reach a certain degree before they die so it's possible my freezer isn't cold enough.  I don't really know though.  
Treatment for this is going to be interesting though.  They were out of the inject-able medication so I have to give her a little pill on Sunday when I feed and again in 2 weeks.  I haven't quite worked out how I'm going to get the pill into the rat though.   :Razz:

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## Annarose15

> I haven't quite worked out how I'm going to get the pill into the rat though.


Not to be graphic, but will the pill fit down the rat's throat once it's thawed? I'd try poking it down there a good way so it doesn't get dislodged when she strikes.

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## Kinra

> Not to be graphic, but will the pill fit down the rat's throat once it's thawed? I'd try poking it down there a good way so it doesn't get dislodged when she strikes.


Yeah that would probably work, I was also thinking about making a small cut and sticking it in.  Playing with a dead rat is not high on list of fun stuff to do.   :Razz:

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## AZ_Equine

> So how did it turn out? Did you get the pill in via the rat? And how long did it take to get rid of the tape worm? Did you ever figure out where she got it?


 Oops, scratch that- thought it was an older post that got bumped up- was looking at your membership date- mistaken it for the original post date. My bad.

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## Homegrownscales

I thought at one point I had read a thread about another members ball getting a tape worm from a rat that they thought had a flea on it? For some reason all I can remember is fleas carrying tapeworm eggs. I might be wrong though. But perhaps if there was a flea on a rat that had been frozen and it was carrying a tape worm egg. Thats could be how it was contracted. That's so crazy though. Ps don't quote me. I could be totally remembering the wrong thing. 


Check out what's new on my website... www.Homegrownscales.com

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## babyknees

Oh yuck, this is so scary. Good luck to you and your snake! I hope you figure out how she got it and she makes a full recovery.

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## Maddumpling

I might be wrong but I dont think it came from f/t mice/rat. When a rodent is frozen, freezing should have killed most of the things on or in the rat. And I'm assuming that the frozen rats were not something that were frozen for only a day.

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## Kinra

> I might be wrong but I dont think it came from f/t mice/rat. When a rodent is frozen, freezing should have killed most of the things on or in the rat. And I'm assuming that the frozen rats were not something that were frozen for only a day.


I've heard from someone that tapeworm eggs don't die when they are frozen.  I have never feed her live and I'm sure I don't have mice/rats in my apartment that she could have eaten when she escaped.  I trust the place I got her from 100% so I'm sure she didn't have tapeworms when I got her.  That means the only way she could have gotten them was from a f/t rat.  I've heard some pretty horrible things about the place I was getting my f/t rats from lately too.  

Again, I can't prove where she got the tapeworms from, so I will not name names.

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## mpkeelee

How is the treatment going? Any luck getting the pill in the rat? I hope everything works out and it clears up soon. Is this type of tapeworm specific to certain animals or is any living animal subject to invasion?

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## Maddumpling

> I've heard from someone that tapeworm eggs don't die when they are frozen.  I have never feed her live and I'm sure I don't have mice/rats in my apartment that she could have eaten when she escaped.  I trust the place I got her from 100% so I'm sure she didn't have tapeworms when I got her.  That means the only way she could have gotten them was from a f/t rat.  I've heard some pretty horrible things about the place I was getting my f/t rats from lately too.  
> 
> Again, I can't prove where she got the tapeworms from, so I will not name names.


I never feed live too not only because they could bite the snake but things like parasites. I'm not saying you are wrong, but I'm just curious, could tapeworm eggs really live that long in a frozen rat if its been frozen for over a week or something.

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## RichsBallPythons

Tape worm is known to survive the freezing temps of freezers.

There is stuff you can have on hand to treat tape worm called panacur i think its 12$ a tube. Its a paste and best given by injecting the paste into the rats mouth/throat. This way snake isnt stressed and is getting its meds.


Inspect your rodents in freezer, if they have black dots on them could be fleas on them.

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## Kinra

> How is the treatment going? Any luck getting the pill in the rat? I hope everything works out and it clears up soon. Is this type of tapeworm specific to certain animals or is any living animal subject to invasion?


I tried to give her a pill stuffed rat on Sunday, but she wasn't interested because she is in shed.  Hopefully next week she will take the rat, if not I will go back to vet and hope they have the injectable meds in stock.  There are only 2 ways snakes can get tapeworms: insects and rodents.  I don't think tapeworms are species specific either, but the only way to get them really is to eat the eggs.




> I never feed live too not only because they could bite the snake but things like parasites. I'm not saying you are wrong, but I'm just curious, could tapeworm eggs really live that long in a frozen rat if its been frozen for over a week or something.


I will check with my vet to see if he knows anything about this, but I do know that rats/mice need to be frozen to a certain temp to kill the parasites.  I don't know what that temp is though.

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## Maddumpling

> I tried to give her a pill stuffed rat on Sunday, but she wasn't interested because she is in shed.  Hopefully next week she will take the rat, if not I will go back to vet and hope they have the injectable meds in stock.  There are only 2 ways snakes can get tapeworms: insects and rodents.  I don't think tapeworms are species specific either, but the only way to get them really is to eat the eggs.
> 
> 
> 
> I will check with my vet to see if he knows anything about this, but I do know that rats/mice need to be frozen to a certain temp to kill the parasites.  I don't know what that temp is though.


I would like to know that too. Its really gonna bug me and worry me if I have to actually worry about some tapeworms being on my frozen rats.

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

I wonder why your vet didn't just give the snake a dose of panacure paste via tube/feeding syringe and then have you come back for a second and possibly third dose.. Or give you the proper amount and show you how to administer it. That would have been a lot easier and all vets have it on hand.

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## mpkeelee

> I wonder why your vet didn't just give the snake a dose of panacure paste via tube/feeding syringe and then have you come back for a second and possibly third dose.. Or give you the proper amount and show you how to administer it. That would have been a lot easier and all vets have it on hand.


Maybe that is what the vet was currently out of. If not call them and ask if they have it. Hope they get it in stock soon cuz if ur snake is off feed right now then no meds

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## RichsBallPythons

Panacur is over the counter sold at TSC and other feed stores.

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_mpkeelee_ (10-13-2011)

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

> Panacur is over the counter sold at TSC and other feed stores.


True.. But if the average person is not aware of the proper dosing for snakes and does not have the proper feeding syringe to administer it, it wouldn't be safe to just go get some and give it blindly.

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

You can also buy Flagyl over the counter if you know where to look for more stubborn parasites and intestinal infections but that stuff is even more dangerous if you don't know the particulars on dosage. 

It's always better to have a vet helping with these things for inexperienced owners.

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## Jonas@Balls2TheWall

Parasite eggs can be very hard to kill and can live through "hell"... I know this personally from my experience with aquarium fish. I have successfully gotten rid of parasites like cappilaria and ich before but there are some that are relentless. Flukes would be an example of those, the trick in killing parasites is usually knowing the parasites life cycle and when to come back with the second, third or fourth dose. Tape worms are nasty but they are on the easier to get rid of list, follow your vets instructions to the T and you should be fine. I would recommend getting some of your other snakes poop tested just in case. When I was heavy into Discus I had a microscope on hand and learned how to look for eggs in poop, very interesting stuff. Snakes are a little hardier though and no need to be so picky. You definitely want to get rid of those tapeworms though, have you by any chance ever thought of the infected snake as a slow grower? Just wondering because with fish tapeworms really slow down their growth. If thats the case then you should see some faster growing from this animal once you get rid of the worms.

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## Kinra

> I wonder why your vet didn't just give the snake a dose of panacure paste via tube/feeding syringe and then have you come back for a second and possibly third dose.. Or give you the proper amount and show you how to administer it. That would have been a lot easier and all vets have it on hand.


I didn't actually bring the snake into the vet.  I only brought in the tapeworm hoping they could tell me what it was.  The meds he wanted to give me are inject able and only needs to be done once, but it ONLY kills tapeworms. 




> Maybe that is what the vet was currently out of. If not call them and ask if they have it. Hope they get it in stock soon cuz if ur snake is off feed right now then no meds


She was in shed which is why I think she didn't eat.  If she doesn't eat this week I'm going to go back for a different medication.  She's usually a good eater but sometimes she won't eat when in shed.




> Parasite eggs can be very hard to kill and can live through "hell"... I know this personally from my experience with aquarium fish. I have successfully gotten rid of parasites like cappilaria and ich before but there are some that are relentless. Flukes would be an example of those, the trick in killing parasites is usually knowing the parasites life cycle and when to come back with the second, third or fourth dose. Tape worms are nasty but they are on the easier to get rid of list, follow your vets instructions to the T and you should be fine. I would recommend getting some of your other snakes poop tested just in case. When I was heavy into Discus I had a microscope on hand and learned how to look for eggs in poop, very interesting stuff. Snakes are a little hardier though and no need to be so picky. You definitely want to get rid of those tapeworms though, have you by any chance ever thought of the infected snake as a slow grower? Just wondering because with fish tapeworms really slow down their growth. If thats the case then you should see some faster growing from this animal once you get rid of the worms.


I've never noticed her to be a slow grower, in fact she's usually a little pig.  If this has been affecting her growth I can't wait to see what she does when it's gone.   :Smile:

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## Homegrownscales

I beleive on ft rodents and such things like eggs of parasites can survive until frozen to a certain temp. So the time limit of freezing doesn't matter the temp does. 


Check out what's new on my website... www.Homegrownscales.com

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## meowmeowkazoo

Man, this is why I'm glad I breed my own rats! I hope you get the medication in her, and at least you know what's wrong and it's treatable.  :Smile:

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## Annageckos

I think the most common species of tapeworms come from fleas. When an animal ingest a flea that is carrying tapeworms they can then become infested. There are many different species of tapeworm too. Some species are found in the feces of the host animal, I know raccoons are a common carrier of this type of tapeworm. A lot of parasites, especially those from colder regions can survive freezing temps for months, even years. I think as long as you keep your rodents clean (if you breed your own) or get them from a reputable source (if you buy frozen) you shouldn't need to worry about parasites.

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