# Colubrids > General Colubrids >  Jack the Russian Rat Snake/elaphe schrenckii (progression)

## redshepherd

Officially the tiniest snake I have ever owned or held. I finally got my russian rat snake! Born 7/17/17 from Zerkle, and his name is Jack!  :Very Happy:  I wanted one for quite awhile, so I jumped on the chance. He's a wild type elaphe schrenckii. I've been trying to call them Manchurian Black Water Snake, as I think this name makes more sense.

Not many pics yet as I want him to settle. And he is SO small, soft, and fragile! Amazing. I feel like if I breathe too hard, he would blow away. LOL






And his current setup, just a 15qt sterilite. I'm afraid of putting him in anything larger, as you can see he is SO TINY in this tiny tub! I even lose track of where he is in here. I believe he would be able to live in this size for at least another 6 months. He's currently eating large mouse pinks.

He moves in this twitchy way and I already saw him come out to drink water and hang out near the bowl for awhile. That tiny water bowl is like a pond to him.



I'm super excited to watch him grow up, though it will take a couple years!  :Very Happy:

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## BluuWolf

Ahhh! What a little little noodle! I've been waiting anxiously for this lol I can't wait to watch him grow!

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_redshepherd_ (10-19-2017)

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## Starscream

my feelings right now:

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_BluuWolf_ (10-20-2017),*Bogertophis* (05-13-2018),C.Marie (07-12-2018),_Ditto_ (11-27-2018),dr del (10-20-2017),_Godzilla78_ (10-19-2017),_Kira_ (10-19-2017),_redshepherd_ (10-19-2017),_tttaylorrr_ (10-19-2017),_zina10_ (10-24-2017)

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## Godzilla78

That it!  I WANT ONE!  Seriously, I was  :Reading: ing about Russian rat snakes for an hour yesterday, and now seeing your new baby has put me over the edge!!!! :Love:

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_BluuWolf_ (10-20-2017),_GpBp_ (04-18-2018),_redshepherd_ (10-19-2017)

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## MissterDog

Precious boy!!!

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_BluuWolf_ (10-20-2017),_redshepherd_ (10-19-2017)

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## tttaylorrr

i'm excited to watch his progress. congrats!!! i've always been jealous of your collection.

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_BluuWolf_ (10-20-2017),_redshepherd_ (10-19-2017)

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## piedlover79

That is one adorable tiny noodle!  I agree...don't breath too hard on it!  Heehee

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_BluuWolf_ (10-20-2017),_redshepherd_ (10-19-2017)

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## hilabeans

GASP!  I love him!  Now I'm totally regretting not giving them my address.  :Wink: 

I CANNOT WAIT to get one of my very own.  Congratulations on your precious, tiny, Jack.  I'm going to love watching him grow!

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_BluuWolf_ (10-20-2017),_redshepherd_ (10-19-2017)

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## redshepherd

> my feelings right now:


OMG this is great LOL!! 




> That it! I WANT ONE! Seriously, I was ing about Russian rat snakes for an hour yesterday, and now seeing your new baby has put me over the edge!!!!


Seriously, better jump on it if you want one!! Apparently they will have more next spring and summer though.  :Very Happy: 




> i'm excited to watch his progress. congrats!!! i've always been jealous of your collection.


Thanks taylor!! I love my various dudes!

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_BluuWolf_ (10-20-2017),_Godzilla78_ (10-19-2017)

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## Godzilla78

> Seriously, better jump on it if you want one!! Apparently they will have more next spring and summer though.


I know a dude that breeds colubrids, he owns about 90 snakes.  I will see if he can help me obtain one of these gems.

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_BluuWolf_ (10-20-2017)

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## redshepherd

> I know a dude that breeds colubrids, he owns about 90 snakes.  I will see if he can help me obtain one of these gems.


What is his name? I don't think there are many people in the country breeding Russian Rat snakes right now, so the more the better LOL.

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## Godzilla78

> What is his name? I don't think there are many people in the country breeding Russian Rat snakes right now, so the more the better LOL.


Yeah I have no idea if he has any, and if he does, I would bet he is not selling them.

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## BallPythonWannaBe

Nice  :Very Happy:

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_redshepherd_ (10-20-2017)

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## redshepherd

He ate a large mouse pink today! Only his 3rd day home. And I even handled him yesterday too. I think it's sorta a testament to how hardy russian rat snakes are. I couldn't take any feeding pics though, since he's rather shy about me walking over to watch him, too bad!

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C.Marie (07-12-2018),_Godzilla78_ (10-20-2017),_hilabeans_ (10-20-2017),_Starscream_ (10-21-2017)

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## Godzilla78

I found one hatchling for sale online, through a breeder on Kingsnake.com.  Then I realized I have already spent my snake budget for the year, and I sobered up, lol.  Definitely on my wish list though!  Such an infamous reputation these critters have!

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## redshepherd

> I found one hatchling for sale online, through a breeder on Kingsnake.com.  Then I realized I have already spent my snake budget for the year, and I sobered up, lol.  Definitely on my wish list though!  Such an infamous reputation these critters have!


Oh yes, that one is from Ken Foose, like the only other person other than Zerkle who actively breeds them LOL.
I think you mean famous  :Very Happy:  They have such a renown personable temperament.

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_Godzilla78_ (10-20-2017)

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## hilabeans

Are you using a UTH with his tub?  Is he ok with handling right away, or are they like BPs and need an acclimating period of being left alone?  

Looks like he's doing ok with the attention so far!

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## redshepherd

> Are you using a UTH with his tub?  Is he ok with handling right away, or are they like BPs and need an acclimating period of being left alone?  
> 
> Looks like he's doing ok with the attention so far!


Yeah, I have a UTH set to 80.

He's okay with it quite apparently, since he ate  :Wink:  I was sort of testing the russian rat snake's good rep as a hardy snake, and I was not wrong. They are possibly THE most adaptable and hardiest snake of all snake species lol!

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_Godzilla78_ (10-20-2017),_hilabeans_ (10-20-2017)

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## hilabeans

What are you thinking for long-term enclosure, once he's grown?

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## redshepherd

> What are you thinking for long-term enclosure, once he's grown?


They won't reach closer to adult size until 2-3 years down the line, but I'm currently thinking a 4x4x2 foot AP cage! So 4 feet length and 4 feet tall. Or a custom glass cage around that size.

For now, he can live in this 15qt for at least 6 months, and I'll just upgrade tub size. The biggest sterilite tub is the 110qt and that would also fit an older one comfortable for quite awhile.

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_Godzilla78_ (10-20-2017),_hilabeans_ (10-20-2017)

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## Starscream

> They won't reach closer to adult size until 2-3 years down the line, but I'm currently thinking a 4x4x2 foot AP cage! So 4 feet length and 4 feet tall. Or a custom glass cage around that size.
> 
> For now, he can live in this 15qt for at least 6 months, and I'll just upgrade tub size. The biggest sterilite tub is the 110qt and that would also fit an older one comfortable for quite awhile.


Sterlite also has 50 gallon tubs. I don't know what the footprint difference is, but I couldn't find this size on their website for some reason? They sell it through Walmart, though, which is where I got mine. It's pretty tall so if you wanted a more arboreal temp cage when he gets older/before you get the 4x4 that might work.

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_redshepherd_ (10-24-2017)

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## Prognathodon

Such a neat little guy! Jealous!


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_redshepherd_ (10-24-2017)

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## zina10

Well, how did I miss this !!!!!!!!!

I kept checking the Ratsnake forum, LOL 

He is SOO cute. You will be surprised how fast they grow, though !! 

Mine used to rattle their tails when "hunting", and then smash the food around. Very dramatic !! hehe...

Unless a house is quite cold, these snakes do not need heat. Maybe a light bulb on a large cage to give a bit of a warmer spot. The only time mine were upset, is when I lost AC and my house got to warm. 

They are from a rather coolish climate..

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_Godzilla78_ (10-24-2017),_MissterDog_ (10-24-2017),_redshepherd_ (10-24-2017)

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## hilabeans

Beyond excited...I couldn't stand the wait and just ordered a little russian dude from Zerkles.  Perhaps Jack's clutch-mate???  
He'll be here Friday.   :Taz: 

If you've got updates on Jack, I'd love to hear them!! Are you using a UTH for a little belly heat?  Zerkles advised just for an 80 degree hot spot, but not sure if they need it.  Our ambients in his room are between 74-76 in the summer and 69-72 in the winters...

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_Godzilla78_ (10-24-2017),_zina10_ (10-24-2017)

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## zina10

> Beyond excited...I couldn't stand the wait and just ordered a little russian dude from Zerkles.  Perhaps Jack's clutch-mate???  
> He'll be here Friday.  
> 
> If you've got updates on Jack, I'd love to hear them!! Are you using a UTH for a little belly heat?  Zerkles advised just for an 80 degree hot spot, but not sure if they need it.  Our ambients in his room are between 74-76 in the summer and 69-72 in the winters...



Aw man...I'm jealous !!! 

I never gave a "hotspot" per say (UTH) but I used a cage and it had a light above it and branches under the light, so they could climb up there if they wanted it "warmer". They did occasionally, but they seemed more bothered if the house got to hot, rather then being cooler. 

But I would go by the breeders recommendations, esp. while they are so small. To make the transition easier.

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_hilabeans_ (10-24-2017)

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## hilabeans

> Aw man...I'm jealous !!!


I totally have you and redshepherd to blame (or thank!) for this as it was your past threads singing the praises of these that turned me on to them.  I've never heard of them before and thought I was destined for a bp since i am a "beginner".  But _everything_ about the Russians appealed to me, whereas I wrestled with some of the beep's known habits.  This just feels right.   :Smile: 

So THANK YOU both!!

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_redshepherd_ (10-24-2017),_zina10_ (10-24-2017)

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## redshepherd

> Sterlite also has 50 gallon tubs. I don't know what the footprint difference is, but I couldn't find this size on their website for some reason? They sell it through Walmart, though, which is where I got mine. It's pretty tall so if you wanted a more arboreal temp cage when he gets older/before you get the 4x4 that might work.


For some reason I totally wrote up a reply to this but somehow it didn't submit! Anyway, thanks, I found the 50gal online! I haven't seen it in stores though, but that will definitely work for quite awhile or even permanently for one of these guys.  :Very Happy: 




> Well, how did I miss this !!!!!!!!!
> 
> I kept checking the Ratsnake forum, LOL 
> 
> He is SOO cute. You will be surprised how fast they grow, though !! 
> 
> Mine used to rattle their tails when "hunting", and then smash the food around. Very dramatic !! hehe...
> 
> Unless a house is quite cold, these snakes do not need heat. Maybe a light bulb on a large cage to give a bit of a warmer spot. The only time mine were upset, is when I lost AC and my house got to warm. 
> ...


Haha I was waiting for you to see him!  :Very Happy:  That's good to know that they grow fast, because I really want him to grow up quick LOL. I saw someone on another site post a pic of their yearling russian rat snake, and it was still so small, so I was thinking they must grow pretty slowly... But maybe that one was just being underfed or weird.

Can't wait to see more feeding behaviors when he grows up! Right now, he's pretty shy, being so tiny.

And lol yeah, my house is currently 79 degrees so I see him chilling on his leaves on the cool side, probably trying hard to cool off!

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_zina10_ (10-24-2017)

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## redshepherd

> Beyond excited...I couldn't stand the wait and just ordered a little russian dude from Zerkles.  Perhaps Jack's clutch-mate???  
> He'll be here Friday.  
> 
> If you've got updates on Jack, I'd love to hear them!! Are you using a UTH for a little belly heat?  Zerkles advised just for an 80 degree hot spot, but not sure if they need it.  Our ambients in his room are between 74-76 in the summer and 69-72 in the winters...


Daaang congrats!!! You jumped on it!!  :Very Happy:  Probably is Jack's clutch mate, since this was their last late clutch! Hatchlings tend to be shy, being SO small and prey for literally anything, so you won't see that outgoing nature until they're larger.

I used a UTH last week when it got cooler, but set to 80. So it only really turned on more overnight. I just removed it since it suddenly became so hot around here since yesterday.

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## zina10

Ok, this is now a whole 2 days without our Russian Ratsnake update...

*drums fingers on the desk*

 :Smile:

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_redshepherd_ (10-27-2017)

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## redshepherd

> Ok, this is now a whole 2 days without our Russian Ratsnake update...
> 
> *drums fingers on the desk*


 :ROFL: YAY, here we are!!

Well, he's being a great little shy hatchling! I'm afraid of putting him anywhere for pictures, because he is so small and fast. I've been handling him daily or even twice a day, for 5-10 minutes each, and he seems to be calming down already with realizing I won't kill him every time I open his enclosure. He's very aware of what's going on around us though, it's pretty interesting. Sort of reminds me of the awareness my scrub python displays, except docile! LOL

I have his tub near my turtle tank, and as I was putting him back today, he looked up distinctly to watch my turtle (making a lot of movement in her tank) that was a couple feet away.

So far though, he still only eats if I leave the prey item in his tub, but he eats it right away. He hasn't struck at the prey when I offered yet. I think I'm still too big and scary right now.

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## zina10

aw man, so cute , so cute !!!!
 :Smile:

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_redshepherd_ (10-27-2017)

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## Prognathodon

> So far though, he still only eats if I leave the prey item in his tub, but he eats it right away. He hasn't struck at the prey when I offered yet. I think I'm still too big and scary right now.


My husbands VBB and King Rat are the same way for feeding, and both are big boys. May be an Old World ratsnake thing, or a Zerkle-snake thing. 


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_redshepherd_ (10-27-2017)

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## BluuWolf

So cute! I'm so jealous! Its crazy how you can already tell how inqusitive he is even at such a young age. 

You say you've been holding him daily, is that typical to do to keep a colubrid tame? I'm only used to holding my BPs weekly but am for sure getting a old world colubrid soon hopefully (Although sadly not a Russian Rat) I would love to try and keep them tame as they get big as well.

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_redshepherd_ (10-27-2017)

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## redshepherd

> My husband’s VBB and King Rat are the same way for feeding, and both are big boys. May be an Old World ratsnake thing, or a Zerkle-snake thing. 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Interesting! I wonder if Zerkle leaves the prey in their enclosure, so that's what they're use to. LOL




> So cute! I'm so jealous! Its crazy how you can already tell how inqusitive he is even at such a young age. 
> 
> You say you've been holding him daily, is that typical to do to keep a colubrid tame? I'm only used to holding my BPs weekly but am for sure getting a old world colubrid soon hopefully (Although sadly not a Russian Rat) I would love to try and keep them tame as they get big as well.
> 
> Sent from my LG-D690 using Tapatalk


It depends on the colubrid species, just like it depends on python/boa species. Russian Rat Snakes are known to be naturally docile and inquisitive, especially as they get older, but I'm just holding daily for now since my tiny one was so shy... and testing to see if it helps haha, which it does appear to be. Many other old worlds are more defensive, and just can't become docile/tame like a BP or russian rat snake would because it's not in their nature. Many tend to be require more "advanced" handling skills.

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## redshepherd

The kid's already noticeably bigger than when I got him 3 weeks ago! It's noticeable in person probably more than photos. He doesn't feel quite as fragile of a mushy worm anymore. I'm glad to see him growing fairly quickly!

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_Alicia_ (12-05-2017),C.Marie (07-12-2018),_hilabeans_ (11-08-2017),_MissterDog_ (11-07-2017),_Prognathodon_ (11-08-2017),_Starscream_ (11-08-2017),_zina10_ (11-07-2017)

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## MissterDog

I'm totally looking forward to his future color changes as he continues to grow! Curious how many grams he weighs lol Cutie as always!

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_redshepherd_ (11-08-2017)

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## redshepherd

> I'm totally looking forward to his future color changes as he continues to grow! Curious how many grams he weighs lol Cutie as always!


Im curious too! Maybe Ill weigh him today. Im guessing 30g. LOL

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## BallPythonWannaBe

So cute!

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_redshepherd_ (11-08-2017)

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## hilabeans

Bump  :Smile: 

Want an update - how's Jack doing?  Bonsai has taken to his hide for the last 1.5 weeks and we miss him very much.  He went blue and his eyes are now clear, so I'm assuming he'll shed soon.  We've been resisting the urge to pester him, but it's bumming us out not to see him.

Has Jack had a shed with you yet?  If yes, did he disappear for days while he went thru the process?  Any recent pics to share?

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## redshepherd

> Bump 
> 
> Want an update - how's Jack doing?  Bonsai has taken to his hide for the last 1.5 weeks and we miss him very much.  He went blue and his eyes are now clear, so I'm assuming he'll shed soon.  We've been resisting the urge to pester him, but it's bumming us out not to see him.
> 
> Has Jack had a shed with you yet?  If yes, did he disappear for days while he went thru the process?  Any recent pics to share?


Hey! Yeah, Jack also spends the majority of his time in the hide.  :Very Happy:  Hatchlings are tiny and shy, so I'd guess they're going to be ball pythons for awhile until they gain some size. He's shed with me once, and he hid during shedding too.

Jack was also active for the first few days he arrived here, nervously checking out the new environment and making sure I won't eat him. LOL

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_hilabeans_ (11-16-2017)

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## hilabeans

> Hey! Yeah, Jack also spends the majority of his time in the hide.  Hatchlings are tiny and shy, so I'd guess they're going to be ball pythons for awhile until they gain some size. He's shed with me once, and he hid during shedding too.
> 
> Jack was also active for the first few days he arrived here, nervously checking out the new environment and making sure I won't eat him. LOL


Ok, cool! Our little one was so active the first few days and then poof! he disappeared.  Good to know it's normal.  Did you have to bump your humidity up for his shed?  Ours is around 60%-65% at the moment.

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## redshepherd

> Ok, cool! Our little one was so active the first few days and then poof! he disappeared.  Good to know it's normal.  Did you have to bump your humidity up for his shed?  Ours is around 60%-65% at the moment.


That humidity is totally fine for russian rat snakes to shed  :Smile:  I'll bet they would still shed well at 50% humidity.

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_hilabeans_ (11-16-2017)

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## redshepherd

Jack's snake mites are basically all gone since the last treatment, but I'm treating his enclosure and things around it tomorrow with PAM to be totally sure. So hopefully it's all good! 

I'm glad I caught it early. The two adults I saw before were the only two, I killed them both myself, and I never found another.

I've fed him only twice for the past couple weeks since I found mites, to lessen the chance of poop so often LOL.

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_hilabeans_ (12-05-2017),_MissterDog_ (12-05-2017),_Starscream_ (12-05-2017)

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## Starscream

Good to hear! I was wondering how the little guy was fairing. And that the mites didn't touch his appetite lol.

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## hilabeans

So glad he's on the mend!  What an ordeal, how are _you_ recovering?

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## redshepherd

> Good to hear! I was wondering how the little guy was fairing. And that the mites didn't touch his appetite lol.


Yeah! It wasn't much mites, thankfully.




> So glad he's on the mend! What an ordeal, how are _you_ recovering?


Thanks! I'm dandy haha, I saw the last of the baby mites after spraying/cleaning everything with nix that day. I also covered my ball pythons and boa with frontline and sprayed the other pythons cages with nix, so I feel much safer.

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_hilabeans_ (12-06-2017)

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## redshepherd

Re-applied frontline to all my snakes again, just in case, and the place seems pretty mite-free to me! 

And he's grown! His browns are obviously getting blacker, and his stripes are noticeably yellower. Also getting more chill as well.

Unfortunately just been posting a bunch of iphone pics LOL. I'll get nikon pics eventually!

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## redshepherd

Size and color update- slightly blacker, especially near the tail. These guys don't grow too fast, don't they? LOL

9 months old now

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_Alter-Echo_ (04-06-2018),C.Marie (07-12-2018),_hilabeans_ (04-06-2018),_MissterDog_ (04-06-2018),_Prognathodon_ (04-06-2018),_Starscream_ (04-06-2018),_tttaylorrr_ (04-06-2018)

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## hilabeans

Sweet Jack!!  I've been hoping for an update on him. 😊

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_redshepherd_ (04-06-2018)

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## zina10

> Sweet Jack!!  I've been hoping for an update on him. 😊


He looks wonderful !!! 

I do think he grew quite a bit  :Smile:

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_redshepherd_ (04-06-2018)

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## redshepherd

> Sweet Jack!!  I've been hoping for an update on him. 😊


Oh I'm glad! haha not much to update it seems though, I wish he grew about 10x faster.  :Please:  The tiny brown noodle stage is taking awhile LOL




> He looks wonderful !!! 
> 
> I do think he grew quite a bit


Thanks!! GOOD! I think I got used to how quickly my ball pythons grow.

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_zina10_ (04-06-2018)

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## tttaylorrr

happy to see the lil guy again  he looks great!

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_redshepherd_ (04-07-2018)

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## redshepherd

Finally got some more interesting pics and a gif too! WOOHOO.

32 qt growout enclosure. He's 9 months old and I deem him too small still for a 4 foot enclosure, especially since he burrows in the coco chip. Don't want to lose sight of him and accidentally hurt him when I'm scooping poop!

These snakes do everything don't they... Burrow like a dumeril's, climb, curl up and sprawl out on branches. Really interesting!

Jack still doesn't strike when I offer him food though. He will only eat if I leave it in front of him and close the tub lib. LOL

And I'm always so lazy to take out the big camera for him nowadays, especially since he's so small! Bad iphone pics for awhile.  :Very Happy:

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## Phillydubs

Great shots and info!!

does he ever go off feed or in spells..? What about around shed and how many times has he shed for you?

i ask because he seems similar in size an age to my mandarin who I know is a diff type and all but his behaviors and actions sound a lot like jack. He was eating weekly and up to two large pinks or small fuzzies then just stopped. He shed over the weekend and hes back to being all active but still wont eat. 

He will defensively strike the food but then run. I leave it for him like I used to and notta

hoping he just needs to shake the shed cobwebs and get back to it

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_redshepherd_ (04-18-2018)

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## GpBp

Omg, I love him! I love rat snake's little faces  :Love:  Tell him I love him  :Bowdown:

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_redshepherd_ (04-18-2018)

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## redshepherd

> Great shots and info!!
> 
> does he ever go off feed or in spells..? What about around shed and how many times has he shed for you?
> 
> i ask because he seems similar in size an age to my mandarin who I know is a diff type and all but his behaviors and actions sound a lot like jack. He was eating weekly and up to two large pinks or small fuzzies then just stopped. He shed over the weekend and he’s back to being all active but still won’t eat. 
> 
> He will defensively strike the food but then run. I leave it for him like I used to and notta
> 
> hoping he just needs to shake the shed cobwebs and get back to it


He's never missed a meal, even in shed. I don't keep track of sheds since it's a thing they'll do whether you like it or not, but I'd say around 6 times since October maybe? :S I'm just guessing.

I think mandarins require a lot of cover and hides in order to feel secure enough to eat, kind of like ball pythons, especially young ones. You mention yours is all active, which might be a sign that he is feeling insecure in his setup and is looking for a place to hide or burrow. I'm pretty sure mandarins normally hide most of the day, like ball pythons.

russian rat snakes are more easy and bold snakes in that they don't particularly need hides and "cover" and will eat anyway, even hatchlings.

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*Bogertophis* (05-13-2018)

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## redshepherd

> Omg, I love him! I love rat snake's little faces  Tell him I love him


hehe thank you!

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_GpBp_ (04-18-2018)

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## MissterDog

I love seeing updates of Jack! Makes me super pumped about getting my girl, especially when I get to see pics of him being active! Photo where he's chilling on the branch with lunch is my fav!

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_redshepherd_ (04-18-2018)

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## RickyNY

I love Jack! I want one, but I'm getting a Morelia first.  :Razz:

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_redshepherd_ (05-13-2018)

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## redshepherd

Yes, I put him on the door handle for no reason. And then the unexpected happened: russian rat snakes can defy gravity.







Okay, he's actually climbing down by pushing against both sides of the door crack using muscles left and right, all the way down his body. But still, it surprised me when he started going for the door crack and making his way down. I even offered him a hand, but he refused for awhile. (Eventually he took my hand... how sweet  :Razz:  )

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*Bogertophis* (05-15-2018),C.Marie (07-12-2018),_hilabeans_ (05-15-2018),_MissterDog_ (05-15-2018),_Prognathodon_ (05-15-2018),_RickyNY_ (05-26-2018),_Starscream_ (05-15-2018),_zina10_ (05-25-2018)

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## zina10

I absolutely just LOVE him !!!! 

You are lucky to have such a cool dude, and its only going to get better  :Smile:

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_redshepherd_ (05-25-2018)

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## redshepherd

> I absolutely just LOVE him !!!! 
> 
> You are lucky to have such a cool dude, and its only going to get better


I'm glad you think so! I jokingly complain with my friends about how he's in his hide 95% of the time, but I'm assuming it's normal for being a young one. I say that everyone tricked me into getting another ball python LOL

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_hilabeans_ (05-25-2018),_MissterDog_ (05-25-2018),_Prognathodon_ (05-25-2018)

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## zina10

> I'm glad you think so! I jokingly complain with my friends about how he's in his hide 95% of the time, but I'm assuming it's normal for being a young one. I say that everyone tricked me into getting another ball python LOL


Aw, but he is a teeny baby still, they need their security !

Once he is big enough to go into a bigger enclosure, make sure he has a lot of climbing areas and different hides etc. Put the cage in a area that gives him a lot to look at. They are nosy. He probably can't see through the tub all that well. 

Once he has a "playground" and lots to look at, you will notice him being nosy. Of course it will take him a little while to settle and get used to a new "place" first. They get more brave with age/size  :Smile: 

He is awesome !!!

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_hilabeans_ (05-25-2018),_MissterDog_ (05-26-2018),_redshepherd_ (05-25-2018)

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## RickyNY

> 


Little Devil!  So that's how they do it!!! :Surprised:   :Salute:

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_redshepherd_ (05-26-2018)

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## redshepherd

It's a wild snake!!! 




Or not, it's just Jack... 





Climbing on my aralia plant.  He then decided to just stay there propped up on the uppermost leaves for forever and refused to come back down, so I had to force him off which freaked him out. :I

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*Bogertophis* (05-30-2018),C.Marie (07-12-2018),_MissterDog_ (05-30-2018),_Prognathodon_ (05-31-2018),_Starscream_ (05-30-2018),_tttaylorrr_ (05-30-2018),_zina10_ (05-30-2018)

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## zina10

> It's a wild snake!!! 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or not, it's just Jack... 
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Omg..I love it! And I bet so did he  They are such awesome snakes! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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_MissterDog_ (05-31-2018),_redshepherd_ (05-30-2018)

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## Charles8088

How big is Jack now?

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

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## redshepherd

> How big is Jack now?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


Not much bigger. But darker though!

I might be biased, I don't think I'll ever consider him "big" at any point LOL.

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C.Marie (07-12-2018),_richardhind1972_ (07-12-2018),_RickyNY_ (07-12-2018)

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## Skyrivers

I am a ninja. I am one with the door....... There is not a lock I can not pick or cage that can hold me. (evil laughing)





>

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_RickyNY_ (07-12-2018)

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## redshepherd

Interesting, I'm now noticing a more obvious color AND marking changes in the last month! He looks different even compared to the end of May. 

These are today at 1 year old. You can see in the first picture how every other stripe is fading to black, while every other stripe in between is developing a more clear black shape in its centers. 


INTERESTING HUH!  :Surprised: 





And this here is just a pic from last October (also in the beginning of the thread) for comparison! Looking at this myself makes his growth more obvious too or else I'll just think he's 20g forever LOL


His head is the only thing that hasn't become black yet, it's still sorta a weird grey brown. GET GROWING JACK, I'm tired of this tiny-snake grey-brown scales BS haha

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C.Marie (07-12-2018),_Prognathodon_ (07-13-2018)

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## redshepherd

Getting bigger... and getting darker... Still anxious and not inquisitive about me whatsoever, unless I tell myself that his activity when taken out is inquisitiveness (it isn't). He has only come out of his enclosure of his own accord twice ever so far. The rest is the same old, he'll sit there and look around anxiously until I pick him up, or he tries to flee. Keeping him is no different than any other docile quirky colubrid LOL. I would switch him out for a keeled rat snake if his personality is still like this as an adult, because the rumored inquisitive/outgoing personality that owners rave about is the entire reason why I picked schrenckii, not so much their looks. 





Also, there's been a wildfire nearish in the hills in the next city over. I hope it gets stopped soon and the weather better stop being so hot. Evacuating with my snakes would suck! :S

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_dakski_ (08-10-2018),_Jus1More_ (08-09-2018),_MissterDog_ (08-09-2018)

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## MissterDog

Jack is getting so handsome and looks awesome in natural daylight! Here is hoping once he grows more he'll be more bold with you and less cautious! Also hoping everyone stays safe!

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_redshepherd_ (08-09-2018)

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## redshepherd

I don't think I mentioned on the forum, but Jack rattled his tail at me the other day!! LOL. It was hitting the side of the tank and super loud too, very amusing. But also why Jack.

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_MissterDog_ (08-10-2018)

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## Zincubus

> I don't think I mentioned on the forum, but Jack rattled his tail at me the other day!! LOL. It was hitting the side of the tank and super loud too, very amusing. But also why Jack.


All my four Kings rattle their tails when they're coiled around the mice ..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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## redshepherd

> All my four Kings rattle their tails when they're coiled around the mice ..
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


It was when I opened his cage and reached in, he was apprehensive about me.

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## Zincubus

> It was when I opened his cage and reached in, he was apprehensive about me.


It's just a warning to you to not touch or disturb them at that moment ..  just like a dog's warning growl ...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

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## redshepherd

> It's just a warning to you to not touch or disturb them at that moment ..  just like a dog's warning growl ...
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


I know zincubus. Lol

The "why" wasn't a literal question

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Zincubus (08-10-2018)

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## Zincubus

Ahhh  :Smile: 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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_redshepherd_ (08-10-2018)

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## RickyNY

How is Jack doing? Has he become more inquisitive/better towards you? Some say it takes them a while to get out of shy mode. 
Hope he's doing better for you.   :Wink:

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## redshepherd

> How is Jack doing? Has he become more inquisitive/better towards you? Some say it takes them a while to get out of shy mode. 
> Hope he's doing better for you.


I sold him a month or two ago! He was about 1 year and 4 months old. He basically is just as inquisitive or not inquisitive as any other average colubrid, but people I saw online have really hyped it up with a bit of projection, so my expectations were different from reality LOL. I strictly bought him for what people describe so lavishly about their personality, but turns out he hides all day like a ball python. Just a typical docile, shy snake.

And funnily, my friend Missterdog with Kallari the melanistic russian rat snake and I compared notes as Kallari and Jack grew up, and Jack is on the shy side even in comparison to Kallari. So I guess I just lucked out with a ball python in a russian rat snake body LOL.

But Genesis, my northern pine snake hatchling, is showing all the activity, boldness, and inquisitiveness that Jack didn't have- I absolutely love her. So she made up for it!

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_MissterDog_ (11-26-2018)

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## RickyNY

That's a shame, I wanted to see him grow and you telling everyone how smart and friendly he was.  :Very Happy: 
I would like a Colubrid, now that I got my Carpet python. I was thinking of a Kingsnake, Rat snake, Bull snake or a False Water Cobra. And the Russin Rat snake always come to mind and is due to the same reasons you mentioned: "the rumored inquisitive/outgoing personality that owners rave about". I guess they are not all like that.

Thanks Red  :Good Job:

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## redshepherd

> That's a shame, I wanted to see him grow and you telling everyone how smart and friendly he was. 
> I would like a Colubrid, now that I got my Carpet python. I was thinking of a Kingsnake, Rat snake, Bull snake or a False Water Cobra. And the Russin Rat snake always come to mind and is due to the same reasons you mentioned: "the rumored inquisitive/outgoing personality that owners rave about". I guess they are not all like that.
> 
> Thanks Red


Colubrids are amazing, you have to have one or two in the family! 

Yeah, I think keepers will always more or less project what they want to see onto their snake and rave about it, since they love their animals. Some snakes are definitely bold and outgoing from a young age, like my northern pine snake. But some are not, like Jack (though he was already over a year old, so I don't think he'll necessarily be especially bold in his life LOL). I don't think russian rat snakes are necessarily _more_ inquisitive or outgoing than many other colubrid species- the chances of a bold, fun snake could happen over a range of species. But since russian rat snakes are indeed universally docile snakes and are very easy to care for, people are very excited about their pets.

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_MissterDog_ (11-26-2018),_RickyNY_ (11-26-2018)

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## distaff

Well, I'm still planning to get one.  I think they are beautiful. 
Exotic Pets LasVegas recently listed an adult for sale, but $200 plus shipping is out of the budget for me right now.

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## redshepherd

> Well, I'm still planning to get one.  I think they are beautiful. 
> Exotic Pets LasVegas recently listed an adult for sale, but $200 plus shipping is out of the budget for me right now.


That's actually an awesome price for an adult! Hatchlings are sold at around $175 plus shipping. I sold yearling Jack for I think $200 plus shipping.

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## zina10

Every Species has their own special quirks and every single animal still has their own personality. 

I can say without a doubt though, that Russian Ratsnakes USUALLY are very much inquisitive and fearless snakes. Very friendly and very personable. No projection on my part whatsoever. 
I belonged to a reptile club back in Savannah and we would regularly get together and we would also have "shows". Not to sell animals, it was for education in conjunction with wildlife parks. While the only colubrids I had were the Russians, I've been around many others. While many were bold, outgoing and not shy, they didn't seem to interact as much. My Russians were usually a hit, esp. Scarlett.  

They would watch everything going on. Literally watching it. Moving in the enclosure to get a better view. When I opened their enclosure, they would slither over and come out. Unless they were in shed. I could tell 100 more stories of their rather unusually social behavior but I don't want to start sounding like I'm making up stories. Scarlett DID go on walks with me, staying in the same position while peeking out over the zipper of my hoodie all the way until home. I could also walk around the house doing chores, washing dishes, dusting, and she would keep going around my waist, up my shoulders, around and back down and so on and on. Sometimes settling in the hood of a hoodie. Never seemed to feel the need to "get away". Absolutely fearless and not worried. Such fun and funny snakes.

They were more apprehensive when young, of course, like most snakes are. The older, the more confidence they had. 

There are many owners throughout many years of reptile keeping that have noticed their extraordinary social and outgoing behaviors, to the point where that is indeed a trait for that species, but again, each individual is different. 

Most BP's are very shy and stay shy. I had 2 back then that were the most chill snakes ever. They went with me to every representation at wildlife parks, schools, and everything. Never missed a meal, didn't hide much, one actually liked to drape on a branch like a GTP. That was funny, because he looked a little funny, being a rather rotund snake. Knowing BP's I know that these 2 were not the way they normally are. 

I feel sorry that Jack was a shy one, it would have been nice if you could have experienced what some of the Russian owners are talking about. He will probably gain confidence in time, but it seems like he would have never been a typical Russian Ratsnake. 

I still recommend them to people that want a fun and interactive snake. But of course there are other species out there that are as well.

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*Bogertophis* (11-27-2018),_Dianne_ (11-26-2018)

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## Bogertophis

> Every Species has their own special quirks and every single animal still has their own personality....


I totally agree with you on this:  we can generalize about a species, but individuals still have their own quirks & personalities, so it's very unfair to expect exactly the 
same "sociability" from each one.  Some just take more patience & may "get there" eventually, but re-homing is usually a set-back.

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## redshepherd

> I totally agree with you on this:  we can generalize about a species, but individuals still have their own quirks & personalities, so it's very unfair to expect exactly the 
> same "sociability" from each one.  Some just take more patience & may "get there" eventually, but re-homing is usually a set-back.


What do you mean by set-back? He went to a breeder who loves his temperament, and I love the temperaments of my current snakes.

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_MissterDog_ (11-27-2018)

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## Bogertophis

> What do you mean by set-back? He went to a breeder who loves his temperament.


I just meant that if he was still shy, a new home is scary, & typically doesn't enhance a snake's courage.  Nothing against the person he went to, & all the better if that 
breeder is happy with his temperament.

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## redshepherd

> I just meant that if he was still shy, a new home is scary, & typically doesn't enhance a snake's courage.  Nothing against the person he went to, & all the better if that 
> breeder is happy with his temperament.


A snake acclimates to new homes within a few days to a week, provided they are given proper husbandry and temps... They aren't dogs who bond with their previous home.

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## Bogertophis

> ...They aren't dogs who bond with their previous home.


No kidding.  That's not what I said either.

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## distaff

Ok, that does it.  When I get one, I'll get a female, and I'll name her Scarlett.

$200 does seem like a marketable price (I probably spend an hour a day just looking at snakes for sale), but when I say it is out of my budget, I don't mean it is over-priced, just not workable for me, right now.
We do well, financially, but keep a VERY strict budget  for the fun stuff.

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_zina10_ (11-27-2018)

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## hilabeans

Oh man, sorry to see Jack has moved on to a new home.  I will miss the updates on him.  You were one of the deciding reasons I got my Russian Rat.  Your story still ended better than mine - lol!

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## RickyNY

> Oh man, sorry to see Jack has moved on to a new home.  I will miss the updates on him.  You were one of the deciding reasons I got my Russian Rat.  Your story still ended better than mine - lol!


I know hila, I was very heart broken when your Russian Rat snake passed away.  :Sad:

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_hilabeans_ (11-27-2018)

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## hilabeans

> I know hila, I was very heart broken when your Russian Rat snake passed away.


Thanks Ricky, it was a brutal loss.  I loved that little guy.

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_MissterDog_ (11-27-2018),_zina10_ (11-28-2018)

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## zina10

> Ok, that does it.  When I get one, I'll get a female, and I'll name her Scarlett.
> 
> $200 does seem like a marketable price (I probably spend an hour a day just looking at snakes for sale), but when I say it is out of my budget, I don't mean it is over-priced, just not workable for me, right now.
> We do well, financially, but keep a VERY strict budget  for the fun stuff.


LOL, that would be to cool  :Wink: 

You know, the other one was called "Rhett" !!  :ROFL: 

Rhett was also fearless, but quite adventurous. While Scarlett would happily hang out "on me" and just stay with me (hence the walks and doing chores together) Rhett wanted to go on adventures. He never tried to "race off" as in being scared and trying to take off. But off he would go, LOL. 

He actually got loose in my car once !!! That bugger. I still don't know how I missed closing his travel tub correctly. We were on our way to one of the educational herp shows at Skidaway Island Park in Savannah, GA. I reached down to change the radio channel and felt something touch my hand. I looked down and there is Rhett, more then halfway out of his travel tub. He was determined to get on the dash and I was determined to prevent that. Of course I was on that long road (going through the marsh) where you could not pull over whatsoever, about to get on a bridge, too. 

So I'm driving trying to hold on to him. At this point he zips up my shoulder, around my neck and hooks around the headrest. Well, oh joy!. We all know how they are once they "hook" around something, good luck pulling them back. So I hold on to him while driving over that bridge and then desperately look for a spot to pull over. I was NOT about to loose my beloved Rhett in the dang car! So I spot a dirt parking lot to the right. I peeled in there and stopped as soon as I could (rather sudden stop) and then proceeded to try to wrestle Rhett off of my neck and the head rest. I FINALLY get him off safely and back into his tub,  whew. I was sweating, LOL. Then I look up and see a pickup truck parked a little ways ahead of me with a few guys sitting on the truck bed just STARING at me. I turned beet red and peeled out of there. I wonder what they were thinking  :ROFL: 

So yeah. Rhett was also quite cool, fearless and full of personality but a lot more adventurous then Scarlett. 

Neither one ever showed the least bit of fear of me or anything. But they were a lot more shy as hatchlings. For example, as adults they would come to the door and immediately come out when opened. As hatchlings I would have to reach in and get them. As hatchlings they hid a lot more,too.  As adults I rarely saw them in hides. Usually only when shedding. 

The only time I have ever seen them distressed is when my house got really hot one summer. The AC broke (of course on a 4th of July weekend) They started to cruise their cages back and forth. They really do not like hot temperatures. Thankfully I got an emergency appointment and got my AC running again within a day.

So here is yet another crazy Russian Rat story. Not made up, I swear.  :Very Happy:

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*Bogertophis* (11-27-2018),_MissterDog_ (11-27-2018),_redshepherd_ (11-27-2018)

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## Bogertophis

> ...
> He actually got loose in my car once !!! That bugger. I still don't know how I missed closing his travel tub correctly. We were on our way to one of the educational herp shows at Skidaway Island Park in Savannah, GA. I reached down to change the radio channel and felt something touch my hand. I looked down and there is Rhett, more then halfway out of his travel tub. He was determined to get on the dash and I was determined to prevent that. Of course I was on that long road (going through the marsh) where you could not pull over whatsoever, about to get on a bridge, too. 
> 
> So I'm driving trying to hold on to him. At this point he zips up my shoulder, around my neck and hooks around the headrest. Well, oh joy!. We all know how they are once they "hook" around something, good luck pulling them back. So I hold on to him while driving over that bridge and then desperately look for a spot to pull over. I was NOT about to loose my beloved Rhett in the dang car! So I spot a dirt parking lot to the right. I peeled in there and stopped as soon as I could (rather sudden stop) and then proceeded to try to wrestle Rhett off of my neck and the head rest. I FINALLY get him off safely and back into his tub,  whew. I was sweating, LOL. Then I look up and see a pickup truck parked a little ways ahead of me with a few guys sitting on the truck bed just STARING at me. I turned beet red and peeled out of there. I wonder what they were thinking ...


That's hilarious, you totally made me  :ROFL:  And they didn't rush over to help or meet you...I can't understand it?   :Very Happy:

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_zina10_ (11-27-2018)

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## zina10

> That's hilarious, you totally made me  And they didn't rush over to help or meet you...I can't understand it?


Nope, they sure did not !!

There I was, peeling into that parking lot, breaking hard, and then wrestling with a snake around my neck !!!! 

Apparently they were scared of either 1. Snake 2. Crazy woman wrestling with a snake

 :ROFL:

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*Bogertophis* (11-27-2018),_Dianne_ (11-27-2018)

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## Bogertophis

> Nope, they sure did not !!
> 
> There I was, peeling into that parking lot, breaking hard, and then wrestling with a snake around my neck !!!! 
> 
> Apparently they were scared of either 1. Snake 2. Crazy woman wrestling with a snake


Possibly more scared of you...since you didn't throw the snake out of the car like they would have.  "Real-life Medusa"!?   :Very Happy:

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_zina10_ (11-27-2018)

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## zina10

> Possibly more scared of you...since you didn't throw the snake out of the car like they would have.  "Real-life Medusa"!?


You have a point !!! 

They probably still tell that story to their kids or something !!  :ROFL:

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*Bogertophis* (11-27-2018)

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