# Feeders > Breeding Mice >  Top soil as alternative bedding for mice

## breederfeeder

I read a few forums where people would use topsoil as an alternative to pine shavings.  They said literally only had to remove the top layer of soil once a month.  It's a lot cheaper than pine or recycled newspaper. However, they have to bake it in the oven prior to using it.  I thought since mice in the wild live in dirt, couldn't you use topsoil out of the bag?  I can't imagine baking or freezing topsoil.

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## LadyCalypso

I never heard of that, personally I use aspen for my mice, pine can give them respiratory issues.

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_CALM Pythons_ (02-11-2018)

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## Stewart_Reptiles

> I read a few forums where people would use topsoil as an alternative to pine shavings.  They said literally only had to remove the top layer of soil once a month.  It's a lot cheaper than pine or recycled newspaper. However, they have to bake it in the oven prior to using it.  I thought since mice in the wild live in dirt, couldn't you use topsoil out of the bag?  I can't imagine baking or freezing topsoil.


I guess if you want to clean a muddy stinky mess why not, again complicating thing, you need something absorbent not soil. If you want to do this as a business there is no need to reinvent the wheel.



> I never heard of that, personally I use aspen for my mice, pine can give them respiratory issues.


Pine is fine, pine found in store is kiln dried, I produce thousands of rodent each year with no respiratory issue (going on 11 years now), I am curious how many do you produce and what was the percentage of respiratory issues in your colony?

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wolfy-hound (01-12-2018)

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## LadyCalypso

> Pine is fine, pine found in store is kiln dried, I produce thousands of rodent each year with no respiratory issue (going on 11 years now), I am curious how many do you produce and what was the percentage of respiratory issues in your colony?


This past year was actually my first year breeding mice, and I think I got around a hundred or two, and I had I think 2 have problems. But being new to it I was going off from when I had hamsters and how pine was bad for them, so if I sounded ignorant in my last post I'm still learning and thank you for the insite  :Smile:

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## OhhWatALoser

Personally I just don't picture this in my head working out very well.  It turns to mud when they urinate and what will it do for the feces? They may live on dirt in the wild, but they also have square miles to do their business. Ball pythons live on dirt, most animals live on dirt. The small amount of space we give them compared to the wild,  forces us to do things differently than in the wild.

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_Godzilla78_ (01-13-2018)

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## Sunnieskys

I would not like to clean mouse mud. Ewww. Recycled paper is what I used. Cleaned thoroughly once a week.

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## breederfeeder

I read in a few forums people really like using soil over the pet store bedding.  I'll probably give it a try when Home Depot sells topsoil again in the spring.  $1.50 a bag

http://www.petshub.com/forums/topic/soil-as-a-substrate

http://www.gentlechristianmothers.co.../t-165697.html

https://www.reddit.com/r/PetMice/com..._as_substrate/

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## Stewart_Reptiles

> I read in a few forums people really like using soil over the pet store bedding.  I'll probably give it a try when Home Depot sells topsoil again in the spring.  $1.50 a bag
> 
> http://www.petshub.com/forums/topic/soil-as-a-substrate
> 
> http://www.gentlechristianmothers.co.../t-165697.html
> 
> https://www.reddit.com/r/PetMice/com..._as_substrate/


People who have 1 pet mouse or maybe 2 in a cage, I thought you wanted to be a feeder breeder  :Confused: 

When you will have 1.3 to 1.4 + babies (anywhere from 18/24 to 36/48) it will be a different story

Again you are complicating things when it's not all that complicated and proven methods have been around for a long time. You get your info from pet owner forums and show breeders forums and that will not get you far those people do not have business in mind, cost efficiency or practicability.

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## breederfeeder

> People who have 1 pet mouse or maybe 2 in a cage, I thought you wanted to be a feeder breeder 
> 
> When you will have 1.3 to 1.4 + babies (anywhere from 18/24 to 36/48) it will be a different story
> 
> Again you are complicating things when it's not all that complicated and proven methods have been around for a long time. You get your info from pet owner forums and show breeders forums and that will not get you far those people do not have business in mind, cost efficiency or practicability.


I'll probably try it later on one colony to see how it compare.  I been using cat litter for long time never had issue with my hamsters and mice.

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## cchardwick

Topsoil - Brilliant!  I actually just tried Cypress mulch with fantastic results for both my mice and rats.  I live in a dry climate so there's nothing getting wet or turning to mud.  Rodent bedding is a huge expense, it's probably a quarter of my total costs raising ball pythons.  Anything to cut those costs and keep the animals healthy is a bonus.  I'm going to try it next!

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## breederfeeder

> Topsoil - Brilliant! I actually just tried Cypress mulch with fantastic results for both my mice and rats. I live in a dry climate so there's nothing getting wet or turning to mud. Rodent bedding is a huge expense, it's probably a quarter of my total costs raising ball pythons. Anything to cut those costs and keep the animals healthy is a bonus. I'm going to try it next!



how often did you need to replace the mulch?  Winter months Home Depot doesn't sell topsoil.  For now, I been using cat litter.  Cheapest cat litter I found was from Tractor Supply which comes out to be 14 cents a lb.  Topsoil nothing but soil 4 cents per lb for $1.49 for 40 lb bag of dirt.  Just imagine the economy to scale

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## breederfeeder

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/pr...covers-8-cu-ft

What you think of pine shavings for horse as bedding for mice?  8 cu ft for $5.99 seems cheap enough.

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## copper

The pine shavings at Tractor Supply are not kiln dry.  Id be more worried about the oils in that one.  I have a bag just as big as that of kiln dry pine from Walmart for $6.  Lasts me at least a month for 4 giant tubs and 4 small standard cages.

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## Stewart_Reptiles

> The pine shavings at Tractor Supply are not kiln dry.  Id be more worried about the oils in that one.  I have a bag just as big as that of kiln dry pine from Walmart for $6.  Lasts me at least a month for 4 giant tubs and 4 small standard cages.


Tractor supply pine is fine I have been using it for 11 years and  produced well over 50000 rodents.

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## CALM Pythons

> I read a few forums where people would use topsoil as an alternative to pine shavings.  They said literally only had to remove the top layer of soil once a month.  It's a lot cheaper than pine or recycled newspaper. However, they have to bake it in the oven prior to using it.  I thought since mice in the wild live in dirt, couldn't you use topsoil out of the bag?  I can't imagine baking or freezing topsoil.


The smell of the mice on Topsoil will be over barring unless they are in a outside building you have were it doesn't effect you. Not to mention the muck it will make. Stick with Pine or Aspen.    


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