# Miscellaneous Herp Interests > Invertebrates >  A few random spider (8 legged spider not ball python spider) shots

## jmugleston

Hopefully next week I'll be showing pics of these pairing.
Haplopelma lividum




Poecilotheria metallica




Poecilotheria ornata

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## boadaddy

Very nice! What do you use for hides for the ornamentals?

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## jmugleston

Rolls of the cork lining used in kitchen cabinets.

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## Neal

Just curious why you have the two different tarantulas near each other?

Not trying to seem like a jerk or anything but that could of had a bad outcome, and it wasn't a smart decision to do.

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## boadaddy

Oh cool thanks, good idea! Neal really dude those are males in female enclosure's, same species for breeding is a smart decision but dumb comments = not a smart decision! :Wag of the finger:

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## stratus_020202

Thank you for the 8 legged warning.  :Smile:  Gave me time to prepare to jump out of my chair. 

Those are nice, as far as spiders go. Kind of give me the skeebs. Pretty though. Good luck with the pair!

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## jmugleston

> Just curious why you have the two different tarantulas near each other?
> 
> Not trying to seem like a jerk or anything but that could of had a bad outcome, and it wasn't a smart decision to do.



 Neal, when a mommy spider loves a daddy spider....... :Wink: 

....never mind. Perhaps at a later date I'll explain why having a male and a female OF THE SAME SPECIES in the same general area (even if it is just for a short time) is actually a very smart idea.

The above pictures serve as primes examples of sexual dimorphism. All the species pictured above are very well known in the hobby, Haplopelma lividum, Poecilotheria metallica, and Poecilotheria ornata, so I'm a bit surprised by the comment. While the females are known to be brightly colored, the males turn a dull color upon their ultimate (mature) molt. To get more spiders I put the males in with the females. They do their thing, and then the males are removed. He then gets another week to "recharge" and then I place him with another female. Kind of like this:



And now the above male will produce another sperm web and pair with another female early next week. 

Call me crazy, but I think it was a very smart idea to have them together. Though I think the outcome I anticipate is different from that which you hinted toward above.  :Smile: 

If the above examples of dimorphism look amazing, check out my other posts or my FB pictures. Some of the males are 1/2 to 1/3 the size of the girls. Those are scary pairings but the little guys get the job done.

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_shelliebear_ (04-09-2011)

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## shelliebear

> Oh cool thanks, good idea! Neal really dude those are males in female enclosure's, same species for breeding is a smart decision but dumb comments = not a smart decision!


To someone who knows nothing about tarantulas, the two in the photo together look absolutely nothing alike, and I too though they were different species being put nearby. I was curious also.
I don't think it was a dumb comment at all. Perhaps taking out the "wasn't a smart idea" part would have sounded much less inflammatory, but other than that, I don't think it was dumb.

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## shelliebear

> Neal, when a mommy spider loves a daddy spider.......
> 
> ....never mind. Perhaps at a later date I'll explain why having a male and a female OF THE SAME SPECIES in the same general area (even if it is just for a short time) is actually a very smart idea.
> 
> The above pictures serve as primes examples of sexual dimorphism. All the species pictured above are very well known in the hobby, Haplopelma lividum, Poecilotheria metallica, and Poecilotheria ornata, so I'm a bit surprised by the comment. While the females are known to be brightly colored, the males turn a dull color upon their ultimate (mature) molt. To get more spiders I put the males in with the females. They do their thing, and then the males are removed. He then gets another week to "recharge" and then I place him with another female. Kind of like this:
> 
> 
> 
> And now the above male will produce another sperm web and pair with another female early next week. 
> ...


My goodness! I had no idea. I'm starting to hate you--your photos are making me research tarantulas like crazy, and I'm not getting the shivers anymore, either.  :Very Happy:   :Very Happy:   :Very Happy:  
j/k about the hating part, but, wow! So he is of the same species as her? That's unbelievable--he's differently colored, he's smaller, doesn't look like her at all  :Surprised: 
Is this a species where the female will eat the male after breeding, or does the male have those little sleeves above his mouth to hold her teeth in so she doesn't eat him until they are done mating?
What do they do whilst "courting"? 
Fascinating, tarantulas are, and to think I might have missed out on learning about them because of my stupid fear.
 :Wag of the finger:

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## jmugleston

> To someone who knows nothing about tarantulas, the two in the photo together look absolutely nothing alike, and I too though they were different species being put nearby. I was curious also.
> I don't think it was a dumb comment at all. Perhaps taking out the "wasn't a smart idea" part would have sounded much less inflammatory, but other than that, I don't think it was dumb.


The first portion to the post was fine. Seeing seemingly different spiders near each other would cause many without experience to question the photographer's/keeper's intentions. The dimorphism in some species is such that you can mistake them for different species. Male and female king baboons (Pelinobius muticus) were originally thought by biologists to be different species. The adult female are 7+ inches, bulky,  and look like the texture of velvet. The males are ~4", skinny, and fuzzy. 

I do think the latter part of the post was inappropriate and indicative of Neal needing to do a bit more research previous to making posts questioning the intelligence of another keeper's actions.





> My goodness! I had no idea. I'm starting to hate you--your photos are making me research tarantulas like crazy, and I'm not getting the shivers anymore, either.    
> j/k about the hating part, but, wow! So he is of the same species as her? That's unbelievable--he's differently colored, he's smaller, doesn't look like her at all 
> Is this a species where the female will eat the male after breeding, or does the male have those little sleeves above his mouth to hold her teeth in so she doesn't eat him until they are done mating?
> What do they do whilst "courting"? 
> Fascinating, tarantulas are, and to think I might have missed out on learning about them because of my stupid fear.


We rarely loose a male to a female when we pair them. I know of one species where post coital cannibalism seems to be common place but most have other things to attend to. The idea that they always eat the males probably stems from keepers with too small of cages (nowhere for the males to run) and a condition of the keepers' methods. If the males have somewhere to run they typically get done and boogie. If not, they are typically treated as any other thing walking near a female spider's burrow or hide. Also if keepers pull the male out afterward he can survive and mate with other girls. If they leave him in there, he will become food with few exceptions. The species pictured above doesn't have the hooks to hold her fangs (even with those an angry female won't be held back), but he was in little danger. They have a pretty routine process they go through with mating and once that starts little can persuade them to stop. Once they're done he pushes her back and books it up the wall. If you're careful, patient, and attentive, males can live or quite a while and breed with multiple females during their short lives.

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_shelliebear_ (04-09-2011)

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## shelliebear

Wow! That's a lot of work on the keeper's part--incredible! 
 :Surprised: 
I can see why they'd think they were different species.  :Wink:  That dimorphism is insane. 
Thanks so much for the info!  :Very Happy:

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## Boanerges

Love the Poecilotheria metallica's  :Good Job:   :Good Job:  Good luck with getting your egg sac  :Salute:

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## Lucas339

P metallicas have to be the best out there! good luck getting a sac!

Did you say you have never lost an animal during breeding?  If so, you are lucky my friend!  once had a female Cyclosternum fasciatum eat 2 males for me!  Poor guys just wanted to get them some!

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## jmugleston

> P metallicas have to be the best out there! good luck getting a sac!
> 
> Did you say you have never lost an animal during breeding?  If so, you are lucky my friend!  once had a female Cyclosternum fasciatum eat 2 males for me!  Poor guys just wanted to get them some!


Nope. I mentioned I rarely loose males. Certain species are more prone to grabbing the males. C. fasciatum is one. Chromatopelma cyaneopubescens is another that is notorious for eating the males. Many of the other species in the hobby are able to pair without the male being sacrificed.

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_shelliebear_ (04-12-2011)

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