# Site General > Pet Related Laws & Legislation >  OMG! Look what the opposition is doing!

## SPJ

http://www.change.org/petitions/view...ronment_safety

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_771subliminal_ (05-19-2010),_Aes_Sidhe_ (05-19-2010),_Jason Bowden_ (05-19-2010)

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## Aes_Sidhe

WTF  :Surprised:  :Surprised:  :Surprised:  I'm really start thinking to go back to Europe....

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_Jason Bowden_ (05-19-2010)

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## Jason Bowden

I hope they don't ban any snakes!
I've got 6 boas over here.  All 6 are high end animals that I plan on breeding.
I've enjoyed reptile keeping as a hobby all of my life.
Please join and support USARK!!!


We are out numbered! There will be new laws passed in the near future that will affect us all!  I hope this doesn't get out of hand.  I beleive USARK is prepared to take the big snake issues to the supreme court if they have to.

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## boasandballs

That is just great.  As if we don't have enough going on they publish that.

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## Raptor

That's why you start a counter petition that has all the real facts.

Edit: considering the creator is a member of "Farm Animal Rights Movement" this isn't a surprise. Means that the person is just another peta supporter.

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## Sariel

Talk about inflation and fear mongering.. 
 So not only are we horders and shut  ins, but apparently not we're sexual deviants who enjoy watching small mammals get tortured. Im so enraged right now I could cry.

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## akaprincesssophia

Who ever wrote that first paragraph sounds like he was the one pleasuring himself while typing it up. Unbelievable !!

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## Twisted Reptiles

That article absolutely ridiculous. I'm just baffled at the number of people commenting and supporting it on the site.  Did they even bother to read it and are they that blind that they cannot see the irrationality of the information presented?  

No, they are inspired by the shock and awe picture of a native Australian snake eating a dog in Australia in February 2008.  

Just what we needed.

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## coldblooded

Wow....this is outrageous. I have no words.. A lot of anger, though!

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## Jason Bowden

The real facts!

There are jackasses out there that feed dogs and cats to their big snakes!

The wildlife and fisheries here in LA had to deal with this earlier this year.  Many snakes were confiscated, etc..  I don't know all the details, but the snakes taken were required to have a permit because they were over 12 feet long.  The wildlife and fisheries was notified by an anonymos call that these people were feeding dogs and cats to the big snakes.

Few can ruin it for us all!

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## Snakeman

who jerks it while watching a snake eat anyway?

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## PurplePython

As much as I don't want this ban to go through, or people to think negetive about reptile keepers, there are some people who have no business owning reptiles. I have seen many reptiles living in such terrible conditions or treated so badly or owned for the wrong reasons. Unfortunately there would most likely be no reasonable way to control who can own snakes and who cant.... If all of us reptile people want to keep our reptiles, we should start fixing the problems in our own backyard. Don't ya think?

Just look at how many idiots post youtube videos of doing random stupid crap with their animals. One guy on youtube has a video of him tossing live mice into a pirahna tank and you hear a bunch of guys in the backround going "OH YEAH! AWESOME! GET HIM! THATS SO COOL!" meanwhile, these pirahnas were ripping apart this baby mouse to shreds.

Half of the problem is in our own backyard and we shouldnt get mad over what the media says when clearly no one gives a crap about what other reptile owners are doing. Just like when I went to the Wheaton show.... I saw quite a few tables where it actually made me want to puke at the conditions some of the animals were in.

Sorry if you dont agree with me, but someone had to say this stuff right?

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blb (07-18-2010)

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## Sariel

> As much as I don't want this ban to go through, or people to think negetive about reptile keepers, there are some people who have no business owning reptiles. I have seen many reptiles living in such terrible conditions or treated so badly or owned for the wrong reasons. Unfortunately there would most likely be no reasonable way to control who can own snakes and who cant.... If all of us reptile people want to keep our reptiles, we should start fixing the problems in our own backyard. Don't ya think?
> 
> Just look at how many idiots post youtube videos of doing random stupid crap with their animals. One guy on youtube has a video of him tossing live mice into a pirahna tank and you hear a bunch of guys in the backround going "OH YEAH! AWESOME! GET HIM! THATS SO COOL!" meanwhile, these pirahnas were ripping apart this baby mouse to shreds.
> 
> Half of the problem is in our own backyard and we shouldnt get mad over what the media says when clearly no one gives a crap about what other reptile owners are doing. Just like when I went to the Wheaton show.... I saw quite a few tables where it actually made me want to puke at the conditions some of the animals were in.
> 
> Sorry if you dont agree with me, but someone had to say this stuff right?


Its not something that hasnt been said to death at this point. What that doesnt justify is that kind of hate filled, misrepresented bias. Every following has people that abuse and misrepresent it. While two wrongs dont make a right, it doesnt make mean that we need to sit back when those outside of our hobby choose to attack it in this fashion. Many of us ARE stepping up and working towards education, but you are never going to eradicate it. There are tons  of good and loving pet owners out there and nearly as many people who either dont care or care more about the dollar in -every- aspect of pet keeping. Its a problem that needs to be fixed country wide, but it doesnt need to be fixed by people spewing hate and false information like its truth. It also doesnt need to be fixed by pointing fingers unless its directly at those people who are mismanaging the care of their animals.

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_SPJ_ (05-19-2010)

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## Jailene

omg, it sounds so idiotic. the person who wrote it is obviously uneducated and is completely playing on peoples fears and insecurities. 

Has anyone seen the family guy episode when lois ran for mayor.

for people who didnt see it  here is the link. 

YouTube - Family Guy - Undecided Voters

this is what this support snake ban reminds me of. :Rolleyes2:

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_Christine_ (05-19-2010),_Danounet_ (05-19-2010)

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## PurplePython

> Its not something that hasnt been said to death at this point. What that doesnt justify is that kind of hate filled, misrepresented bias. Every following has people that abuse and misrepresent it. While two wrongs dont make a right, it doesnt make mean that we need to sit back when those outside of our hobby choose to attack it in this fashion. Many of us ARE stepping up and working towards education, but you are never going to eradicate it. There are tons  of good and loving pet owners out there and nearly as many people who either dont care or care more about the dollar in -every- aspect of pet keeping. Its a problem that needs to be fixed country wide, but it doesnt need to be fixed by people spewing hate and false information like its truth. It also doesnt need to be fixed by pointing fingers unless its directly at those people who are mismanaging the care of their animals.


You are absolutely right that it doesn't mean they should be able to make up stuff to make us reptile owners look bad. But the bottom line is, these people wouldn't be making up all of this crap to try to end our rights to own these pets unless there were these terrible reptile owners out there doing this kind of stupid crap like feeding dogs and cats to snakes.

Am I mad that these people are making up stuff to make these animals look too dangerous to own? Yeah, I am. But can I understand why they want these animals banned based off of all of the bullcrap surrounding this hobby? I can see understand that too.

I see both sides of the coin. If these people that are encouraging the ban have other reasons why they want these animals banned as pets, then of course they are going to make up facts or make problems seam bigger than they are.

People will do that naturally if they are against something.

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## jbean7916

"Individuals who own monstrous sized reptiles often have "crush kitten/crush puppy" sexual fetishes"

First of all, WTF??????? This is disgusting!! I understand that some people are uncomfortable with one animal eating another, but to claim it's a sexual fetish? This sounds just completely uneducated and sophomoric.

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## Raptor

Well, I made an account on the website and reported the petition, claiming that is had a lot of misinformation, was extremely biased, and was derogatory. Maybe if enough people sign up and file complaints it'll get removed.

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_Danounet_ (05-19-2010),Foschi Exotic Serpents (05-19-2010),MissDixie (07-03-2010),_musicalKeyes_ (05-19-2010),_Sariel_ (05-19-2010),Zach (05-20-2010)

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## Sariel

> You are absolutely right that it doesn't mean they should be able to make up stuff to make us reptile owners look bad. But the bottom line is, these people wouldn't be making up all of this crap to try to end our rights to own these pets unless there were these terrible reptile owners out there doing this kind of stupid crap like feeding dogs and cats to snakes.
> 
> Am I mad that these people are making up stuff to make these animals look too dangerous to own? Yeah, I am. But can I understand why they want these animals banned based off of all of the bullcrap surrounding this hobby? I can see understand that too.
> 
> I see both sides of the coin. If these people that are encouraging the ban have other reasons why they want these animals banned as pets, then of course they are going to make up facts or make problems seam bigger than they are.
> 
> People will do that naturally if they are against something.


I have to disagree, if you dont agree with a hobby or a way of life then by all means have and even share your opinion, but stick to FACTS. If I feel the need to get onto a soap box about somthing I dont start twisting evidence I have to make it look ten times worse than it is. I think thats immoral to be put lightly.
  These people are also specifically targeting reptiles  when the cases of mistreatment are far more few between than things like puppy mills, dog fighting rings, true animal horders, and thousands of other cases of unlicensed and   improper keeping of many other exotics. 
 Again two wrongs dont make a right and it doesnt mean we should ignore a lesser problem for another one, however, to say that we arent doing anything is unfair when alot of people are working very hard at correcting the situation and getting very little recognition for it. 
 if we're going to agree with those people attempting to ban reptiles because there are some bad keepers out there, then the same should apply for all animals and we should all just go join PETA and the HSUS.

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## tjm

I dont know what to say about this. They are so trying to make us like bad and seems to be working. See i love animals, i have one cat, one dog, and my water monitors. I also have a pet rat, and i would never feed any of these to my monitors. I hate feeding my monitors rats, but it has to be done. Do i enjoy it, no. So does this make me a twisted person, do i get off watching my monitor eat,f no. So who gives them the right to say we do. All i have to say is we better win this fight.

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## Sariel

http://www.change.org/profile/view/131022


 This is the person responsible for that article, shes currently crowing about how her petition has passed through florida congress for consideration. I invite everyone else to politely and  articulately inform both her and her supporting audience on the facts they are sorely lacking in.

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

I cant get it to even come up. What can we do about this? Im serious. Does anyone have any ideas? There are thousands of decent moral people with children, families, full time jobs, who own these beautiful animals. How can we get more positive press about our side? I cant pull it up so I cant read it but this woman sounds purely evil. People who come up with disgusting things like that are usually the ones harboring those thoughts. How could any senate member or judge or any decent person at all believe someone like that? Its extremely twisted just from what I gather here. This is not some prohibition for an illegal substance. Its not about pro choice or racisism. Its about people who love animals and their reptiles just as much if not more than those other people love their dogs and cats. We feed them. We bathe when needed. We buy thousands of dollars worth of equipment to ensure they have the correct environment etc etc..

Whats wrong with these people. Seriously. I have no respect for people like this. They are too concerned with the lives of other people and how they can make someone else miserable. There is no humanity in those actions whatsoever.

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## Sariel

> I cant get it to even come up. What can we do about this? Im serious. Does anyone have any ideas? There are thousands of decent moral people with children, families, full time jobs, who own these beautiful animals. How can we get more positive press about our side? I cant pull it up so I cant read it but this woman sounds purely evil. People who come up with disgusting things like that are usually the ones harboring those thoughts. How could any senate member or judge or any decent person at all believe someone like that? Its extremely twisted just from what I gather here. This is not some prohibition for an illegal substance. Its not about pro choice or racisism. Its about people who love animals and their reptiles just as much if not more than those other people love their dogs and cats. We feed them. We bathe when needed. We buy thousands of dollars worth of equipment to ensure they have the correct environment etc etc..
> 
> Whats wrong with these people. Seriously. I have no respect for people like this. They are too concerned with the lives of other people and how they can make someone else miserable. There is no humanity in those actions whatsoever.


Im betting what she/he is talking about is they submitted a letter and got a static response back that it was accepted and would be takin into consideration. basically the same replies we get whenever we send something to the same people. 
  That said Im on their page challenging them to put forth facts to support their claims while giving my own AND Ive sent emails to who I think are authorities on the site expressing my displeasure with that thread and how it reflects on their site as a whole.

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## Jason Bowden

I guess they're trying the sex sells tactic.!?
Pretty disgusting!  Where does this stuff come from? Reptile hater terrorists!

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

Ok here is where we need to start.. Every member on here needs to sign up at that site. If you choose, send her a message (polite) and explain why you think this is wrong. Explain our love for our pets. Our dedication. Explain that we are of all races, creeds, religions, etc. 

I am starting my own petition. Then I, as should you, will be posting all this information including links for the site, the horrible petition, and this woman, in a blog which will be sent to everyone on my myspace friends list. Members here need to forward this to your own myspace, facebook, fauna, redtailboa.net and any other forum you may belong to. Tell everyone you know and don't know.

If we put our foot down and ask for everyones help we will be heard. We are getting too quiet and comfortable lately. We need to keep fighting even harder than the ones trying to take our animals from us.

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_Beardedragon_ (05-19-2010),_Christine_ (05-19-2010),_cinderbird_ (05-19-2010),_coldblooded_ (05-19-2010),_Jason Bowden_ (05-19-2010),_SPJ_ (05-19-2010)

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## Sariel

Send me the link to your petition, Im all over it. 


 I already linked hers on my facebook QQing about how upsetting and outrageous it is.

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## jbean7916

I've been trying to sign up on the site for the past 15 mins but can't seem to connect to the page. Must be a BP lover overload!! 

Looking at it more and more, the photo she shows at the top of the page, while disturbing, isn't even the photo for the story she attributes it to. PLUS, the story she's using as shock value for this petition is A) Located in Australia, B) a WILD snake!!! This is simply outrageous!

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## Sariel

> I've been trying to sign up on the site for the past 15 mins but can't seem to connect to the page. Must be a BP lover overload!! 
> 
> Looking at it more and more, the photo she shows at the top of the page, while disturbing, isn't even the photo for the story she attributes it to. PLUS, the story she's using as shock value for this petition is A) Located in Australia, B) a WILD snake!!! This is simply outrageous!


Yah Ive been on the site since all this started and its running pretty slow, been timeing out often. I can only hope its because we're all getting on to make our side heard  :Smile:

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## Dabonus

I would hope anyone with half a brain would be able to tell how absolutely ridiculous that site is. It just comes across as sad and pathetic.

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

Its telling me server issue. I wonder if the site is having issues? I'll work on it and I will post it if it ever cooperates with me.

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## Gabrial

Wow! Where does this person get theseideas from? Never in my life have i jerked off to a snake eating, or any animal for that matter. Did give me a laugh for a second cause of how stupid this person is but this is a bid blow to snake keepers. People like that piss me off. :Rage:  :Wag of the finger:  :Mad:

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## MitsuMike

First off this guy doesn't even have a PhD in psychology to even use anything he used as a reference or even an expericene with reptile keepers either. Who ever this guy is, is a VERY uncrediable source.
And here is the thing dogs killing people are about 100x's more common than a snake killing a person. Seeing there has only been 1-2 cases of pythons/boas killing a human.
Im sorry but there is more of an issue with wild boars and cas/dogs out in the world than their are snakes and hate to break it to all the I hate snake ppl, but they cause more terror and problems than a Burm/boa or ball.
If I ever met this dude I would let him pick between a room with a 20 foot burm who's a pet and a fighting dog of some sort. I bet he's dumb enough to pick the fighting dog and then he would be torn to shreds by something "that is less dangerous" than a snake.

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## MitsuMike

Hey if some random person can write something like that, why can't we? here's a fact ppl don't know:
The most recent official survey, conducted more than a decade ago, determined there were 4.7 million dog bite victims annually in the USA. A more recent study showed that 1,000 Americans per day are treated in emergency rooms as a result of dog bites. In 2007 there were 33 fatal dog attacks in the USA. Most of the victims who receive medical attention are children, half of whom are bitten in the face. Dog bite losses exceed $1 billion per year, with over $300 million paid by homeowners insurance.


I mean seriously what's next you can't own certain fish b/c they can bite your finger? We aren't allowed in the ocean b/c of shark attacks? Like really?? People are freaking stupid and learn everything from movies. So far I have helped about 10 of my friends realize that by ball pythons can't and won't KILL them in their sleep.

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

Help! What type of picture should I use for this petition? A snake would turn alot of people away. Should it be one of a family type theme? Another animal or reptile? What can I use to get people to read it with an open mind without turning them away or misleading them? Im almost done with the petition. I think its pretty good. I trying a different approach instead of just saying oppose the bills.

Edit.. Does anyone have a family pic of you and your kid with a snake and one of your other pets? Like a dog or cat or something? That I may be able to use?

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## Raptor

I have a picture of me holding my corn snake.

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

Im looking for something that shows we do love our other pets and our children are in no danger. I have plenty of my animals but no family type pictures. As much as I hate to say this, we also need to consider the masses of people who would see a picture of someone with tattoos and piercings as more proof to their claims. I have tatts and piercings myself but Im looking for something that will cater to the ignorance of the people who sit around and have nothing more to do other than send letters and emails to senators all day. We need to show something that would be accepted by anyone, even them.

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## Raptor

Well, the reason I'm volunteering my picture is that bluntly put, I look like I'm 12. Here's the picture I'm talking about**:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...e/100_3245.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...e/100_3246.jpg

Don't know if I look that young in the pictures though.

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## 771subliminal

> Help! What type of picture should I use for this petition? A snake would turn alot of people away. Should it be one of a family type theme? Another animal or reptile? What can I use to get people to read it with an open mind without turning them away or misleading them? Im almost done with the petition. I think its pretty good. I trying a different approach instead of just saying oppose the bills.
> 
> Edit.. Does anyone have a family pic of you and your kid with a snake and one of your other pets? Like a dog or cat or something? That I may be able to use?


i do somewhere let me see if i can find it

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## alittleFREE

I have a picture of me as a little kid holding our old RTB...



Oh wait.. I also think I have some pictures of my dad and some school kids with the same boa, when he took it to a school and did a presentation or something with it.

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## Sariel

> I have a picture of me as a little kid holding our old RTB...
> 
> 
> 
> Oh wait.. I also think I have some pictures of my dad and some school kids with the same boa, when he took it to a school and did a presentation or something with it.



Oh I like that one  :Very Happy:

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## Danounet

> Im looking for something that shows we do love our other pets and our children are in no danger. I have plenty of my animals but no family type pictures. As much as I hate to say this, we also need to consider the masses of people who would see a picture of someone with tattoos and piercings as more proof to their claims. I have tatts and piercings myself but Im looking for something that will cater to the ignorance of the people who sit around and have nothing more to do other than send letters and emails to senators all day. We need to show something that would be accepted by anyone, even them.


Urgh!!! My almost 4, 3 and 2 year old nieces and nephew were hanging around with me in the bed where I was opening the packages were my new baby boas came in today.... They were waaaaay more exited to see and hold the boas than I was. Too bad I had my hands full to take pics with them  :Sad:

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## Ralphieeeee

What a stupid page. All I know is that Gillibrand is all for that ban(US Senator for NY) I got a letter back from her in the mail saying that she pretty much hates snakes and anything that has to do with them. Oh well for her vote.

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## 771subliminal



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_Danounet_ (05-19-2010)

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## alittleFREE



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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

Those are great pictures. I like them all. The last one seems to make the most sense for this cause. If you dont mind I'll use that one. It looks like something that would grab peoples attention  :Smile:

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## alittleFREE

> Those are great pictures. I like them all. The last one seems to make the most sense for this cause. If you dont mind I'll use that one. It looks like something that would grab peoples attention


Do you mean 771subliminal's last picture, or mine?

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## BPelizabeth

purple python.....I don't think I agree at all with anything you are saying on this thread.  There are plenty of bad "pet" owners out there.  Does that mean that we should ban all the fish, dogs, cats and etc.  Because there are far more poor pet keepers in that area than in the snake arena.  And if you want to go with the route that these big snakes are dangerous...what about feral cats.....they do much more damage than some of these snakes and are out there due to poor husbandry issues with owners.   :Wag of the finger:

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## PurplePython

> purple python.....I don't think I agree at all with anything you are saying on this thread.  There are plenty of bad "pet" owners out there.  Does that mean that we should ban all the fish, dogs, cats and etc.  Because there are far more poor pet keepers in that area than in the snake arena.  *And if you want to go with the route that these big snakes are dangerous...what about feral cats.....they do much more damage than some of these snakes* and are out there due to poor husbandry issues with owners.


Before you start to argue with me why dont you read what I actually said?

I never said that the snakes are dangerous.

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## kilabyte

That article is obviously propgander created by people whom are afraid of, dislike, and have no knowledge of snakes. The masses may be listening to this type of articles and the vast majority are just as ignorant about snakes. 

I was watching an episode of "cops" this evening and the cops were called for a Burmese that was found on someones front lawn in Las vegas. The snake most likely was an escaped or released pet as he was really calm when the cop took hold of him to try & get him into a cage.The cop who had little to no knowlege about the snake was saying things like "a child may have been killed a dog a cat etc etc" painting the snake to be dangerous. Neighbors also were saying they also captured large snakes recently. So 2 things bad are happening here on primetime TV. The masses are getting uninformed information painting snakes in a negative light. Pet owners are either irresponsible by letting them go or escsape giving the puplic the oportunity to exploit snakes in a negative light because the vast majority are uneducated about these animals. 

The politicians who are going to vote on this bill need to be educated by the leaders and top experts. You then may have then have a good shot of having this bill modified or vetoed. Good luck :Salute:

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

> Do you mean 771subliminal's last picture, or mine?


Yours. With the school kids and the RTB.

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## alittleFREE

> Yours. With the school kids and the RTB.


Oh, in that case, go ahead and use it! I don't mind at all.

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## Beardedragon

Really? Whos going to take that seriously. Read that... Anyone, person or crongress member, who reads that and believes it is an absolute idiot.

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

> Really? Whos going to take that seriously. Read that... Anyone, person or crongress member, who reads that and believes it is an absolute idoit.


I agree Matt butt think about the hoards of people who actually will believe it. That woman makes it sound like this is something she knows for a fact. Like it was some survey or study. She says nothing that would lead the average close-minded person to believe it is only her twisted opinion on the subject.

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## Beardedragon

> I agree Matt butt think about the hoards of people who actually will believe it. That woman makes it sound like this is something she knows for a fact. Like it was some survey or study. She says nothing that would lead the average close-minded person to believe it is only her twisted opinion on the subject.


I know, but the amount of people not believing it is what counts. The first half isnt even facts, its made up and if anyone took the time to look it up they would see that...which they wont of course. 

 The picture is just horrible... but no matter what animal you have youll find a picture out there that is just as bad. The snake is just acting on instincts, the owner is at fault not having a secure cage.

We all know this, so im beating a dead horse here.... but anyone non snake owning who believes this should be the ones banned for being so close minded...and retarded.

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## punkoldschool

> Really? Whos going to take that seriously. Read that... Anyone, person or crongress member, who reads that and believes it is an absolute idoit.


yea but look at how many of those idiots are sighning the petition.
i only regret that im not able to help with this since i live in scotland and anything i have to say is going to be irrelavent in the end. although i have taken it upon myself to send a polite email to the site complaining that they are allowing people to make petitions using outright lies and i feel disgusted as a snake owner about what has been said in that article  :Mad:

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## redstormlax12

The part about masturbation is extremely inappropriate and out of hand. There is no way any politician can accept any of the signatures. To generalize us and say we masturbate to our snakes constricting cats and dogs is just awful. And people are actually signing this get rid of snakes? How often do they see our pet snakes? Do they realize there will still be wild species in the United States? 

This is absolutely idiotic. I cant explain the amount of anger something like that brings up. They are making themselves look stupid. Thank god for USARK.

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## 4theSNAKElady

Sounds to me like the guy who wrote it was really a psychotic himself....

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## Vypyrz

> Really? Whos going to take that seriously. Read that... Anyone, person or crongress member, who reads that and believes it is an absolute idiot.





> The part about masturbation is extremely inappropriate and out of hand. There is no way any politician can accept any of the signatures.


There are politicians who believe it. Thats why these bills for proposed bans keep getting written...

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## SPJ

> Really? Whos going to take that seriously.


Never underestimate the stupidity of people.

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## musicalKeyes

I joined and commented on her profile.

Where's are petition?! Is it done yet? Show me where to sign!  :Good Job: 

Edit:
I also reported the petition. Simply put, I wrote "This petition is offensive, inappropriate, and contains no actual factual information." Hope all this reporting does the trick.

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## BPelizabeth

> Before you start to argue with me why dont you read what I actually said?
> 
> I never said that the snakes are dangerous.


Wow..touchy much!  First of all I never stated that YOU said they were dangerous.  I said....if you want to go that route.  Meaning I was overcoming an objection.....if and before you used it.

Secondly....I certainly did not attack you therefore you really don't need to get so offended, I merely disagreed with your points.

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## Raptor

FYI folks, it's not a woman. It's a guy. The L stands for Luke.

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## CallmeUmaster

Anyone who would believe that childish post are easily manipulated and weekwilled people. Those claims arnt evin logical. Also, "technically" if you look it up cats kill and destroy more things on the planet than any other animal so if you look at it that way somone feeding there snake cats would be doing the world a favor. I wouldnt ever do it nor do i think somone else should feed there snakes cats or dogs, just saying. This sad sad little person just doesnt like snakes and he wants to get everyone with him. What are peoples problems? Were not all perfect and there is always a couple bad seeds but in general i just dont see a problem. Just another guy who has a fear of snakes and wants them gone and saddly people are so naive that they will believe any crap they read or hear and they will go along with it.

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## SPJ

This ahole posted ANOTHER petition against us!

http://www.change.org/petitions/view..._ban_on_snakes

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## Sariel

> This ahole posted ANOTHER petition against us!
> 
> http://www.change.org/petitions/view..._ban_on_snakes


That link doesnt bring up a petition for me.

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## SPJ

For whatever reason the link does not always direct you to it...on www.change.org

Type in "sb 373" under search and it is there.

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## Jay_Bunny

> That's why you start a counter petition that has all the real facts.
> 
> Edit: considering the creator is a member of "Farm Animal Rights Movement" this isn't a surprise. Means that the person is just another peta supporter.


Sorry just started reading this thread, saw this and had to comment. Just because someone is for better treatment of farm animals or doesn't agree with raising animals for meat doesn't mean they are a member of PETA. I get really offended every time someone puts ALL AR (Animal Rights) people in the same boat with PETA and suggests that we are all nutjobs. 

Okay, back to the thread.

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## MarkS

> Really? Whos going to take that seriously. Read that... Anyone, person or crongress member, who reads that and believes it is an absolute idiot.


well apparently at least 268 people DO believe it. That's how many have signed his petition now.

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## Sariel

Actually if you search some of those people who have signed it, they cant possibly be reading and researching what theyve signed.  One dude for example had signed like four petitions in a minute. 

  Some of the people signing, are just wantonly signing things for ratings or whatever their motivation.

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## MitsuMike

Wow look at this crap:
"CRUELTY TO ANIMALS: Keep in mind these monstrous sized snakes feed from LIVE ANIMALS.  Pigs. Goats.  These animals scream in terror as the snake hovers over them, and once grabbed-they slowly suffocate, breaking ribs - still alive. Death is NOT immediate.   Undoubtedly since reptile keepers are capable of feeding a cold blooded reptile a goat or pig, what would stop some people from feeding them FREE snake food-trapped stray/feral cats, and free to good home cats and dogs--they justify feeding them companion animals because "they have to eat".  People do not check on strays and unwanted dogs and cats, and done behind closed doors, thus they simply become SNAKE FOOD. In other words, they hardly ever get caught and get away with it."

Because of ppl on on youtube our rep is ruined! They should visit ALL the reptile forums and Snake Bytes and understand the economical problem this would be to America and how responisble most of us are.

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## moravaguy

ok im fixing to put my head on the choping block but first if you where to ask me i say lets ban stupid people not the animals they own :Good Job:  .... i agree with getting rid of big snakes or at least register them, saidly we are in a era of time where ALOT of people are sick in the head and i bet there are alot of people who do get aroused to see things suffer, that just how it is. i do feel for people who have high end big snakes but sometimes in life we just have to do what we dont want to. and as far as for facts and things on this site we are talking about there are some very true facts there are alot of cases where people are feeding dogs and cats etc. and that little girl is only one of the many deaths caused by snakes, oh and i do agree with the dogs and cat playing wrong roll because this happens too thus the reason in alot of sates and counties pit bulls are banned and what not. we can fight this and i am trying to fight myself but we also gotta see the persons other side that had to see there animal or, even worse their child being killed....wouldnt you hate snakes also?   but all in all i think before they are banned at least register them first.

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## SPJ

> that little girl is only one of the many deaths caused by snakes


The snake was a scapegoat for scumbag drug addict child abuser parents.

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_RR - Mackenzie_ (05-21-2010)

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## moravaguy

> The snake was a scapegoat for scumbag drug addict child abuser parents.



what do you mean they made the snake do it?

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## RR - Mackenzie

> what do you mean they made the snake do it?


He didn't say they made the snake do it.

If the parents were careful, watched there child, made sure a large snake (which they should have already known could have harmed a child) could not escape, their daughter would not be dead.

A snake sees food. Not someone's child.

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## tjm

This is for moravaguy. If a snake killed my son i would not hate the snake. I would hate myself because i would have failed keeping my son safe and for failing for keeping the snake secure.

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## RR - Mackenzie

> This is for moravaguy. If a snake killed my son i would not hate the snake. I would hate myself because i would have failed keeping my son safe and for failing for keeping the snake secure.


I agree.

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

Did anyone else notice that person said the little girls skull was crushed? This dummy doesn't follow the actual news at all. The girl was not crushed in any way. Not only is he a sick fishturd (anyone get that?) He is a liar who simply wants attention.

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## Sariel

> ok im fixing to put my head on the choping block but first if you where to ask me i say lets ban stupid people not the animals they own .... i agree with getting rid of big snakes or at least register them, saidly we are in a era of time where ALOT of people are sick in the head and i bet there are alot of people who do get aroused to see things suffer, that just how it is. i do feel for people who have high end big snakes but sometimes in life we just have to do what we dont want to. and as far as for facts and things on this site we are talking about there are some very true facts there are alot of cases where people are feeding dogs and cats etc. and that little girl is only one of the many deaths caused by snakes, oh and i do agree with the dogs and cat playing wrong roll because this happens too thus the reason in alot of sates and counties pit bulls are banned and what not. we can fight this and i am trying to fight myself but we also gotta see the persons other side that had to see there animal or, even worse their child being killed....wouldnt you hate snakes also?   but all in all i think before they are banned at least register them first.


And with that line of thinking we should be banning ALL pets. This is an argument thats been done to death on this site and many others. Taking away large constrictors will solve nothing. Those same people who either neglected their pets, abused them, or used them to abuse others will simply find another way to do it.

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## rabernet

> what do you mean they made the snake do it?


No - but there is some speculation that she was actually killed by her parents who "staged" the scenario that the snake killed her. I personally don't believe that the snake killed her.

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_771subliminal_ (05-30-2010),_BPelizabeth_ (05-22-2010),fluffpuffgerbil (07-17-2011),Foschi Exotic Serpents (05-21-2010),_minguss_ (05-21-2010),_SPJ_ (05-21-2010)

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## moravaguy

ok ok everyone i am saying that this stuff is the snakes fault if you would look at the begining of my reply i said to rid stupid people but what im trying to say to yall is that people and society has made it to where we shouldnt have these big snakes because as a whole reptile keepers keep on effin up which makes me say yes to this but not to ban but at least register the animal. and i think it should go for all snakes, it would make some more responsible for their actions.

and as far as the girl goes im not refering just to the one girl im saying that there has been more than one case like this, still the owners fault but  if the person didnt have it then the persons child would still be alive, maybe.

oh and for the if a snake killed your kid or animal i said that if you were the other person that had not owned the snake then you would hate snakes because of the exsperiance

see i am in no way saying all reptile keepers are irresponsible im saying i kinda wish this would happen so that when i show off my ball python everybody dont say "well wont that kill you one day?" i wish it wasnt like this but what are we gonna do? people are going to be irresponsible and one day one person will ruin it all for us because alot of people are already scared of snakes and when one shows up in the news for whatever reason that just makes it worse.

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## coldblooded

> ok ok everyone i am saying that this stuff is the snakes fault if you would look at the begining of my reply i said to rid stupid people but what im trying to say to yall is that people and society has made it to where we shouldnt have these big snakes because as a whole reptile keepers keep on effin up which makes me say yes to this but not to ban but at least register the animal. and i think it should go for all snakes, it would make some more responsible for their actions.
> 
> and as far as the girl goes im not refering just to the one girl im saying that there has been more than one case like this, still the owners fault but  if the person didnt have it then the persons child would still be alive, maybe.
> 
> oh and for the if a snake killed your kid or animal i said that if you were the other person that had not owned the snake then you would hate snakes because of the exsperiance
> 
> see i am in no way saying all reptile keepers are irresponsible im saying i kinda wish this would happen so that when i show off my ball python everybody dont say "well wont that kill you one day?" i wish it wasnt like this but what are we gonna do? people are going to be irresponsible and one day one person will ruin it all for us because alot of people are already scared of snakes and when one shows up in the news for whatever reason that just makes it worse.



Respectfully, I disagree. If we had to have a permit to own any sort of reptile it would notsuddenly make the public more educated on them. They would still claim that your BP would kill you and your sleep, along with your children...because they are uneducated. Education is key in these areas.

There have been very few deaths due to large constrictors in the past 20-30 years.. what was it, less than 20? Horses and dogs have killed many times more than that every year.. we should probably start restricting those too, eh?

Unfortunately, making people get permits and register their animals will most likely not cut down on the intolerance/ignorance. First it'll be the big snakes and lizards, and eventually it'll be the rest of them.. I don't think that's what we need. Just my .02 cents.

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## moravaguy

ok well my point is that a big snake is dangerous period if it is bigger than you you have no control over it.

and i belive that if people will have to do more than buy the snake they may take in more responsiblity for the actions they make (the owner) and if they soon dont more deaths will happen and then they will be gone for sure.

by the way the reason for the less deaths is that there are fewer big snakes than cats dogs ect. but more people hate snakes over dogs and cats so when one snake kills or looks like it killed someone or something loved its like 100 dogs atacking 1000 kids because the fear is already there, i guess.

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## mrmertz

Just look near the bottom at the er, well, certain political group to put it VERY nicely and whom the recipients are. I rest my case. I would expect nothing less from them in a case like this.

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_Ham_ (07-08-2010)

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## g00dluckchuck

i wonder how the author of that article would feel if they knew that that cheese burger they were eating was made from a mistreated cow.  

i love dogs and cats.  my dog is my favorite pet. i'd hate to see a dog or cat get crushed to death.  shoot, i refuse to feed live mice to my snakes.  frozen/thawed all the way. 

to the articles credit, there are some folks out there who really do get pleasure from seeing an animal suffer and die.  i will never understand how witnessing another's misery, whether dog, cat, mouse, or cochroach, could make a person happy. 

one thing the article doesn't discuss, however, is what we are supposed to do with all these unwanted dogs and cats.  there are too many of them and too few homes.

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## kaa8990

In my opinion a snake is less dangerous then a dog anyday. Most snakes bite once and let go with the rare bite and grab. Where as a dog can rip an arm, leg and even your throat off, with bite after bite. I also believe that feeding a dog or a cat to a snake is a horrible idea but what about other countires where dog and cat are on the human menu? 
    Snakes are pets, just like dogs just like cats, if a dog is mistreated it turns just as a snake could. If the feral dog population in this country is growing then why not ban dogs? There has been plenty of cases where dogs have mamed or killed someone, ruined property, or destroyed other animals. I just feel that if everyone wasnt so into the fur and paws like i am they might understand more.
 I do not mean to affend anyone but this posting but i had to vent my opinion.
 :Snake:  4 Life

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## kyle1

My word probably won't count because I live in Wales but I've reported it.

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## DJ_Bizarre

Wow this is getting so much worse as time goes on. It gets progressivly harder to keep our animals in our posessions because of irresponsible owners tainting the reptile community...Uhg...what now

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## Ham

> Just look near the bottom at the er, well, certain political group to put it VERY nicely and whom the recipients are. I rest my case. I would expect nothing less from them in a case like this.


So true!

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## 98bcobra

Anyone seen the new show on Nat Geo wild?  Its about Burms in the everglades and scientist hunting them.  I'm sure it full of drama and over done acting.  I don't own any of the big snakes and never will I like my Ball Pythons but I feel for people who may have to give there pets that they have had for years or breeders that lose everything because these stupid bans they are tring to pass.

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