# Ball Pythons > BP Husbandry >  Mice Hopper vs Rat Fuzzies?

## JeweledPeach

I have 1 ball python right now who is about 5-6 months old. He is on 1 live mouse hopper once a week and is doing well. He is always willing to eat and has never refused a meal for me. It seems to be a good size and puts a lump in his belly for a day or two.
I just recently decided to expand my collection with three more beautiful morphs. From what I've been told, they are all 150-200 g max and have been on 1 live rat fuzzy once a week. 
I'd like all 4 of them on the same thing, but I'm not sure who to switch to what. What's better in your personal openion as well as nutrition wise? I was thinking rats, but then I heard they're higher in fat? Not sure if this is true? Also heard that mice are higher in calcium which they'd need right now since they're growing babies.
I also raise and show rabbits, and was wondering if rabbit can be on the menu in the future? How big is too big for an average adult ball python? I was thinking no bigger then a 7 week old rabbit, about .75-1.25 lbs.

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## RobNJ

For convenience purposes, rats...for nutritional purposes, hardly a difference. Mice have considerably less mass than rats of a similar size.

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JeweledPeach (01-24-2013)

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## PigZilla50317

I personally would get them and keep them on the Scented sized food they expect until a quarantine period goes by and the get comfortable with their new home so you don't shock them into some having feeding problems. Switch after a few weeks to a month

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Crazymonkee (01-25-2014),JeweledPeach (01-24-2013)

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## Stewart_Reptiles

Both hopper mice and rat fuzzies are fed to start of hatchling right out of their eggs at this point you are underfeeding your BP




> From what I've been told, they are all 150-200 g max and have been on 1 live rat fuzzy once a week.


BP that size can take down an adult mouse or a rat pup.

Switching prey type is a matter of preference, availability and convenience other than that gram per gram it's pretty much all the same the only difference is that down the road you will feed one prey item versus multiple.

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ballpythonluvr (01-23-2014),*bcr229* (01-23-2014),Crazymonkee (01-25-2014),JeweledPeach (01-24-2013),Stephanie01 (01-28-2013)

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## satomi325

> I have 1 ball python right now who is about 5-6 months old. He is on 1 live mouse hopper once a week and is doing well. He is always willing to eat and has never refused a meal for me. It seems to be a good size and puts a lump in his belly for a day or two.
> I just recently decided to expand my collection with three more beautiful morphs. From what I've been told, they are all 150-200 g max and have been on 1 live rat fuzzy once a week. 
> I'd like all 4 of them on the same thing, but I'm not sure who to switch to what. What's better in your personal openion as well as nutrition wise? I was thinking rats, but then I heard they're higher in fat? Not sure if this is true? Also heard that mice are higher in calcium which they'd need right now since they're growing babies.
> I also raise and show rabbits, and was wondering if rabbit can be on the menu in the future? How big is too big for an average adult ball python? I was thinking no bigger then a 7 week old rabbit, about .75-1.25 lbs.


Rats and mice of the same size are almost identical in nutritional value. But yes, rats have a slightly higher fat content. Just only a few percentages. BPs grow at a faster rate on rats than mice. BPs on rabbits grow even faster.  Feeding a single rat is more convenient than feeding several mice. Some snakes won't eat more than one or two feeders in one sitting, so keep that in mind too when feeding single vs multiple prey. 


I feed adults 1-2 small rats a week. 1 medium would be the largest.

I tried feeding rabbit before, but no one wanted it. Even my most aggressive feeders.  It was even scented with rat.

I used a live newborn baby rabbit. It was about med rat size.

~1 lb rabbit seems too large Thats ~453 grams for an adult if you feed weekly. I personally don't feed more than small-med rats weekly to adults. Thats between 70-110 grams.

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JeweledPeach (01-24-2013),nimblykimbly (01-28-2013)

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## OsirisRa32

I've only ever heard of rabbits for much large species of snakes as food...like retics

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## satomi325

> I've only ever heard of rabbits for much large species of snakes as food...like retics


You can feed rabbits (or any other type of feeder animal) to any type of snake as long as it's the appropriate size.

I don't know this person directly, but one guy fed his ball pythons exclusively rabbits once they got large enough to eat them. The snakes grew like weeds after that.

Personally, none of my adults would take rabbits. But if they would, I would rather feed them that than rats. It is much cheaper for me. My local rabbit breeder charges $1/newborn rabbit, which is the same size as a med rat.

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## sorraia

I'd say get everyone on rat fuzzies (or maybe the next size up for some of the larger ones), just more convenient than trying to feed more of a prey item.

I have been feeding 4 snakes, acquired 2 more snakes yesterday. The 2 new snakes are babies, 60 grams, and have been eating mouse hoppers, so for now Ill keep them on that. My other snakes (larger male is 185 grams, I forget offhand what the smaller male is, the females are 215 and 220 grams) have been eating rat fuzzies. Now that I see the two in front of me, the mouse hoppers are a tad smaller than the rat fuzzies, but not by much. My two older girls are about ready to move up to the next prey size, the boys can probably stay on rat fuzzies a little longer. This is just what Ive been doing so far.  :Smile:

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JeweledPeach (01-24-2013)

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## JeweledPeach

I am happy to report that the one on mice had his first rat today! I didn't scent it, as I've never had problems with him in the past, and it turned out I wouldn't have needed to. Looks like he'll be good to go when the others get here in late Feburary  :Wink:  SO happy I was blessed with an easy eater!
Thanks everyone!!

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## MarkS

Feed them what they're willing to eat.  As long as the snake is getting enough to eat it really doesn't matter what it is.

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## Stephanie01

This is good info! I wondered why my Pastel was such a pig last night. She packed back a pinky and a hopper. Only home for one day and ate like a superstar! I'm impressed. I will definitely move her up to adult mice though for next feeding.

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## nimblykimbly

Just my humble opinion - I would think it would make the best sense to switch to rat fuzzies if they will take them, since eventually they will be better off on rats as they grow too large for mice... might as well switch them all earlier and not have to worry about switching  later, when they might be more stuck in their ways... I've read some people's concerns that their snake wouldn't take a rat and instead would down several mice in a feeding. Personally, I'd like to avoid that if I possibly could!  :Smile:

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## nimblykimbly

> This is good info! I wondered why my Pastel was such a pig last night. She packed back a pinky and a hopper. Only home for one day and ate like a superstar! I'm impressed. I will definitely move her up to adult mice though for next feeding.


My pastel will inhale anything I put in there for her too! And right after we got her, also! No necessary transition for her! She is the best eater I have ever seen!  :Smile:

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## bpdesign

I used both for a long period of time but I am currently changing my snakes slowly over to mice completely. The reason being, I breed my rodents and the mice as more convenient. The mice take up less room, can handle more babies, and I don't have to euthanize retired breeders and find someone to take them like with the rats. With a mouse colony, I can use all sizes (except pinkies) for my snakes.

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## BulkMice

they are real close gram per gram, and in most cases the mouse per gram is gonna cost quite a bit less.

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## Expensive hobby

I may have weird logic on this, but I breed rats, and currently have like 7-8 litters born in the last 2 weeks, so I have a lot of sizes available, but I still buy adult mice for my smaller snakes. Why? Because buying 14 adult mice costs me like $10, whereas a medium rat would cost around $4-6 each. So ya I could feed off what I have every week, but then I don't have any grow outs in the larger size ranges. So I spend $10 a week to save $28-$42 a week.

Makes sense to me lol


I like my Dubstep to go Wop Wop Wop Wop

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## bcr229

> I used both for a long period of time but I am currently changing my snakes slowly over to mice completely. The reason being, I breed my rodents and the mice as more convenient. The mice take up less room, can handle more babies, and I don't have to euthanize retired breeders and find someone to take them like with the rats. With a mouse colony, I can use all sizes (except pinkies) for my snakes.


You may want to re-think that.  If you ever have to re-home your snakes, a lot of people don't want ball pythons that only eat mice, as feeding several mice per week gets a lot more expensive than feeding one small rat per week.

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## patientz3ro

I can't speak for all BP's, but I recently switched from mice to rats, despite the fact that Ajja has been a total mouser all her life. Prior to making the switch, she would display very distinct behaviors when she was ready to eat. She typically starts poking around the corners of her cage and trying to stick her nose between the back wall and screen top. Almost like clockwork, every 8 days or so. She also gets a LOT more active during the day and comes to investigate every time the doors are opened. When I start seeing that, I feed her. When she's been fed, she goes into the warm hide and "turkey naps" for 3 or 4 days. After a few days, she's back to her normal cruising patterns at night, and lounging during the day. 

A few weeks ago, she started "hunting," I dropped 6 large mice in for her. She ate the two largest and ignored the other four. The next feeding was another 6 of about the same size. She ignored every one. After leaving the mice over night, I saw that she was still hunting, even with,the mice in the tank. On a hunch, I picked up a medium rat that afternoon. She immediately started trying to eat it. Afterward, back to sleep for 4 days. The only explanation I have is that the largest mice I had were still too small for her to consider prey. 

Just to stir the pot, I'd like to point out that the rat was about 130g, and Ajja is about 1400... The rat was just barely larger than the thickest part of her body.

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## JMinILM

For babies I like to offer both hopper mice and rat fuzzies. Most will take either. I have heard that there is less calcium in the baby rats, so that is why I do it. If a particular snake will only take one or the other I don't sweat it. I have a ready supply of both rats and mice so its not a big deal either way. Once they are big enough to take weaned rats I try to only feed rats.

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