# Site General > Pet Related Laws & Legislation >  Update on girl killed by python

## GoFride

Remember the little 2 year old girl killed by a Burmese python here in Florida a couple of years ago? That case is about to make headlines all over again. The jury is being selected today. The mom and mom's boyfriend are charged with manslaughter and child neglect. They bought the snake at a flea market, hadn't been feeding it for a while, and were keeping it in a glass terrarium with a quilt for a cover. What a tragedy!

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## fndjason4

this is just great. i hate when idiots give a bad name to a good honest thing. i hope people will see this is human failure and not some bloodthirsty animal, but im sure this is just wishful thinking. (sorry for being insulting but i really really think these two deserve whatever they get). just my two cents.

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## Skittles1101

I agree these things just make me angry. STUPID people shouldn't be able to own pets of any kind. Any kind of animal is capable of killing someone (except a bunny or something like that...you know what I mean lol) if they are living in crappy and unsafe conditions. It's sad that these things happen and then the poor snake looks like the bad guy. I'm glad they are being charged though, clearly they were neglectful and unsafe.

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## MasonC2K

A quilt? Seriously?

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## Skittles1101

> A quilt? Seriously?


What's wrong with a quilt? If I could use one thing to protect me from a huge hungry and neglected bermese python it'd be a quilt....

NOT!...it's ridiculous isn't it?

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## Trogdorpheus

I think they should require a license to own burms and retics and other large constrictors, that way we reduce the number of times morons get a hold of animals they can't handle.

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## Maixx

Is there a news link for this?

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## BigJ

> I think they should require a license to own burms and retics and other large constrictors, that way we reduce the number of times morons get a hold of animals they can't handle.


I'm sorry but all that does is start to limit our rights which leads down a slippery slope of them eventually taking them away all together. Same thing goes for many other rights, mainly our right to bare arms...

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## llovelace

Burms are roc in Fl, a permit is required.  The animal in question was in a tied pillowcase, in the aquarium, with a quilt as a cover  :Wag of the finger: , I'm wondering if what else he will be charged with as far as permitting, and animal neglect.

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## GoFride

Supposedly the last time they had fed the snake was a month prior, when they gave it a roadkill squirrel. It's my understanding that the two adults in the house did not have any money to provide food or proper housing for their pet.

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## llovelace

> I think they should require a license to own burms and retics and other large constrictors, that way we reduce the number of times morons get a hold of animals they can't handle.





> Supposedly the last time they had fed the snake was a month prior, when they gave it a roadkill squirrel. It's my understanding that the two adults in the house did not have any money to provide food or proper housing for their pet.


But they had the money to buy the snake from the flea market?  I'm sure they had the money for beer & smokes every day! Hell my animals grocery list gets done before the people grocery list.

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_Redneck_Crow_ (07-13-2011),_Simple Man_ (07-11-2011)

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## JamieH

:Rage: 

ugh. This makes me hate people. 
I hope they get charged to the fullest extent for being neglectful. 


ugh.  :Rage:  :Rage:  :Rage:  :Mad:

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## wolfy-hound

My neighbors were astounded that their ball python "escaped" from a 55g tank(bare by the way, no hides, no nothing) that they had draped a blanket over. So it's not a single case of stupidity... it's rampant. But these are the same types that leave their infant with a large dog, or think it's cute to get a picture really close to a bull moose in the wild, etc etc.

It's just because there was a snake involved that people start going "We should make a permit system or outlaw those dangerous snakes!"

Why isn't there a push to ban dogs? They kill a lot more kids per year than giant snakes have... ever.

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## Dave Green

It's a shame that you can't outlaw stupidity...

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## lk_holla

> I think they should require a license to own burms and retics and other large constrictors, that way we reduce the number of times morons get a hold of animals they can't handle.


In this instance I think it would be more useful if they required a license to have children, therefore reducing the number of times morons have kids they can't take care of properly.

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_Jay_Bunny_ (07-12-2011),rgang (07-25-2011),_wax32_ (07-12-2011)

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## CatandDiallo

> Why isn't there a push to ban dogs? They kill a lot more kids per year than giant snakes have... ever.



This!

(Even though dogs are by far my favourite animals and I would never want them to be banned, they have killed not only kids, but adults too).

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

I had been hoping they would get charged with it because there had been previous talk of child abuse and neglect anyway. I'd read reports where people suspected one of them may have accidentally killed the little girl and put the snake on her to make it appear that the snake had done it. 

Wasn't there a report that said there were no bite marks found on the girl?
If the snake had done it, there would be a mark where it struck and bit. Plus a bit of blood.

:edit:
If I remember correctly.. It was found just laying on top of her. It was not wrapped around her. It was not trying to swallow any part of her. None if it makes any sense to me.

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## llovelace

> In this instance I think it would be more useful if they required a license to have children, therefore reducing the number of times morons have kids they can't take care of properly.


So so so so so true




> I had been hoping they would get charged with it because there had been previous talk of child abuse and neglect anyway. I'd read reports where people suspected one of them may have accidentally killed the little girl and put the snake on her to make it appear that the snake had done it. 
> 
> Wasn't there a report that said there were no bite marks found on the girl?
> If the snake had done it, there would be a mark where it struck and bit. Plus a bit of blood.
> 
> :edit:
> If I remember correctly.. It was found just laying on top of her. It was not wrapped around her. It was not trying to swallow any part of her. None if it makes any sense to me.


Interesting, but in the news reports the snake had stab wounds, from where they claim to have been trying to get it from around the little girl.

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## MikeV

I preach this everyday :l 

People will eventually find out I have snakes, so when they come in my room and see them they always ask "well wont it kill you" or something like that... and ofcourse I tell them that its pretty much impossible

But, then you get these genetically deficient zombies who think a QUILT will stop even the smallest snake from escaping

MORONS. *sigh* I really have no patience or sympathy for people like this, everything about how they handle, care and house their animals just strikes me at my core, nothing diturbs/angers me more  :Mad: 

Sorry for being harsh but as I said, I have no sympathy for these people. May they get whatever is coming to them

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## Mft62485

I remember this story a while back.  I may be wrong on this, but I believe parents found the child with the snake around two in the morning and didn't call the cops until around 9.  There were some pictures of police removing the snake from the house, and it didn't look all that big.  I'd say it was big enough to kill a 2 year old, but it was not that thick of a snake.  I hope these people get what they deserve.  I still can't believe they thought a quilt was a good idea.   :Surprised:

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## sgath92

> In this instance I think it would be more useful if they *required a license to have children, therefore reducing the number of times morons have kids they can't take care of properly*.


I've been saying that for years! Some people just aren't cut out for being parents. Yet they seem to be the ones that breed the most.  :Surprised:   :Surprised:   :Surprised:

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## GoFride

The trial starts at 8:30 tomorrow morning.

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## garweft

I don't know it is Florida.....

That other lady wrapped her kid in a garbage bag, dumped her in the woods, partied for months, lied to police, and just got a few years (time served) for the lying. These 2 might be up for a honesty reward and a commendation down there..... :Confused:

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_babyknees_ (07-12-2011),_MasonC2K_ (07-12-2011),_wax32_ (07-12-2011)

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## lasweetswan

> I don't know it is Florida.....
> 
> That other lady wrapped her kid in a garbage bag, dumped her in the woods, partied for months, lied to police, and just got a few years (time served) for the lying. These 2 might be up for a honesty reward and a commendation down there.....


Yes, this is what it is coming to in Florida.

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## jarobin

god that makes me so sad for both that little girl and the python! those people obviously had no idea what they were doing. my bp is in my step-son's room and doesn't even weigh an ounce yet and we have lid clips to keep the snake from getting out. it was one of my first instinctual thoughts to protect him! no way should the snake be blamed for this, those parents should be prosecuted to the fullest extent. a BLANKET? i mean come on!

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## masterofdestiny90

Here is a link to a story about it.

http://www.cfnews13.com/article/news...n-python-trial

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## Trogdorpheus

> In this instance I think it would be more useful if they required a license to have children, therefore reducing the number of times morons have kids they can't take care of properly.


I've been saying this for years... /agree

And as per the other couple of people that were hesitant about the licensing I mentioned, I don't think it should be something that limits rights... just something to maybe put a 2 week wait period between someone saying "HEY THIS IZ KOOL" and actually buying it, so maybe a few idiots who want it on a whim change their minds. It would also help calm the public uproar about it, even if it was a simple online exam about basic husbandry then they mail you a certificate to allow you to own one.

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## anatess

3 or 4 years or so ago (maybe even after this incident made headlines) Florida passed a law to require permits for Burmese Pythons (and other big snakes like anacondas, retics, etc.)
This year, they passed a law to completely ban them.  You can't own nor sell one in the state of Florida anymore.  Those who already own one are grandfathered in, but they can't breed them and you can't even give them away.


And yes, I don't trust Florida courts anymore - this is the state where Casey Anthony can get acquitted but it is against the law to put a pregnant pig in a pen.

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## Generationshell

Does anyone know what happened to the snake? 
I hope it didn't die or they didn't kill it :/ 
By not feeding the snake or securing it in a tank the parents were just asking for a death wish to be granted to their child. It is really sad. Because the snake was going off pure instinct and survival. The parents however should have known better.

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## Jessica Loesch

> Does anyone know what happened to the snake? 
> I hope it didn't die or they didn't kill it :/ 
> By not feeding the snake or securing it in a tank the parents were just asking for a death wish to be granted to their child. It is really sad. Because the snake was going off pure instinct and survival. The parents however should have known better.


"Gypsy, who recovered from her wounds, has been in the care of a wildlife centre since the incident. Jurors will be shown photographs of the snake during the trial, which is expected to last one week, but the animal will not be produced in court as evidence."

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz1RvsAyItQ

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## llovelace

Defense attorneys fired back that Hare and Darnell never had reason to worry about the pet python named Gypsy before.

Over the time period, this snake was a part of Jaren hare's life and Jason Darnell's life. That this snake was around multiple children. That this snake was in fact no different than a family dog, said J. Rhiannon Arnold.

Seriously? What planet is this lawyer from?!

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## Generationshell

A lawyer that knows nothing about snakes...

And I am so glad that snake recovered and lived :/ 

No license or restriction in the world will cure stupidity. 

In my opinion they deserve being convicted. The crib was 15 ft away from the unsecured tank and the people admitted the snake had gotten out hours before it killed the 2 yr old. 
AND.... the Grandma had told them countless times to get rid of the snake and even offered to buy it from them. But no.... they would rather neglect it and now look who is really suffering.

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## Russ Lawson

> I had been hoping they would get charged with it because there had been previous talk of child abuse and neglect anyway. I'd read reports where people suspected one of them may have accidentally killed the little girl and put the snake on her to make it appear that the snake had done it. 
> 
> Wasn't there a report that said there were no bite marks found on the girl?
> If the snake had done it, there would be a mark where it struck and bit. Plus a bit of blood.
> 
> :edit:
> If I remember correctly.. It was found just laying on top of her. It was not wrapped around her. It was not trying to swallow any part of her. None if it makes any sense to me.


I have yet to see a report or news story that stated that the girl had any bite marks or other signs that the animal actually was trying to constrict and eat her. I believe it is most likely that if the animal actually did kill her, it was seeking a source of heat, and its weight caused her asphyxiation. I think it is entirely possible the "family" could have killed her and blamed it on the snake, adding in the stab wound to make it more convincing to police. Regardless of how the girl died, they both deserve to rot in jail for child neglect resulting in death at the very least.




> 3 or 4 years or so ago (maybe even after this incident made headlines) Florida passed a law to require permits for Burmese Pythons (and other big snakes like anacondas, retics, etc.)
> This year, they passed a law to completely ban them.  You can't own nor sell one in the state of Florida anymore.  Those who already own one are grandfathered in, but they can't breed them and you can't even give them away.
> 
> 
> And yes, I don't trust Florida courts anymore - this is the state where Casey Anthony can get acquitted but it is against the law to put a pregnant pig in a pen.


Actually the most recent Florida law for RoC's (now lumped into a list called conditional species) allows for "reptile dealers, researchers, and public exhibitors" to keep and breed these species, and sell them out of state or to individuals in the state who are permitted to keep them. It makes it illegal for them to be kept as pets by the general public, but it is not an outright ban.

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## Hannah Shafiei

The poor animal... If i was a snake, i know id be very hungry as well... I dont blame the animal for eating that innocent little girl. :Sad:  its a inctict. everyone gets hungry once in a while! :Please:  :Please:

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## Hannah Shafiei

[QUOTE=Hannah Shafiei;1600387]The poor animal..dont blame it for "apperently eating that child . :Sad:  . everyone gets hungry once in a while so the parents could have fed him!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :Please:  :Please:

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## sandersnd44

I hate stupid people. I just recently got my first couple snakes and everyone I know is like they will eat you!! And then go on to tell me horror stories they have heard about snakes. They funny part is all the stories have a dumba$$ snake owner lol. Stop blaming snakes for human stupidity.

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## lidjamay

I also read in one of the articles they had a red tail as well, and that friends had tried to take the snake off their hands multiple times but they would not give it up. 

I see this seriously limiting our rights to our snakes. But when a dog kills a child they mark it as neglect towards the owners and nothing ever happens. I love dogs and I think it is completely about how they are raised, trained, and treated as with any animal. And so far nothing negative has happened to the herp world because of this case but I think it is going to happen sadly. I know Pits and Rots have a bad name because of cases like where the owner has mistreated the animal and there are limits on where you can live when you have a pit/rot but there has never been a law passed where you can not own one. 

Let's just hope and pray this doesn't screw us over in the end  :Sad:

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## Clear

> And yes, I don't trust Florida courts anymore - this is the state where Casey Anthony can get acquitted but it is against the law to put a pregnant pig in a pen.


At least this trial has more evidence  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## sandersnd44

Seems like the over all population is getting stupider. And I have a Theory lol. The stupid are out breeding the smart people because smart people have jobs and ambitions. And also think things through properly lol.

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## Jared2608

Even if the defense attorney was a member of this site and professional breeder, he'd say the same thing.  His job is defend those two morons to the best of his ability.  This is really sad, and the parents should face the full repercussions of the law but at the end of the day, you guys who keep snakes in Florida are the ones that are going to suffer maybe not right away, but it will come.

That's how the world works, a small number of stupid people ruin anything good and wholesome for the majority of normal people.  We have the same thing in S.A with gun ownership.  You basically need to jump through three fuel soaked rings backwards with a burning cloth stuck in your pants before you get a licence and then you have to renew it every 5 years.  This is all because idiots don't know how to control themselves.

If they really had no money to feed the snake, then firstly they shouldn't have bought it, and secondly the child should have been taken from them because as far as I'm concerned if you can't afford a dollars for a rabbit or guinea pig, how the hell are you feeding your child??

The problem with the world today is that everyone is so politically correct that no one calls a spade a spade anymore.  There are some people with below average intelligence, and there are some people that are just not suitable to be part of civilized society.  As horrible as that may sound it's just a fact.  

These two nit wits need to spend as much time in jail as possible, and hopefully that will be some sort of deterrent to keep the rest of the morons like them out of the hobby...But as I said, it'll be you guys in Florida that never harmed anyone that'll carry the can for this one, because it's just much easier for people in power to punish the majority of easy to find honest people, than it is for them to go out and find the minority of sub standard people...

Sorry, Rant Closed!

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## GoFride

Couple of questions; 
At the time this happened, the snake was 8 1/2 feet long and weighed 13 1/2 pounds. Since I know next to nothing about Burmese pythons, what would a normal weight be for this size? Would a Burm this size and weight be weak?  :Confused:

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## Foschi Exotic Serpents

From what I remember of the video it didn't look that big. The cop carried it in one hand and it dangled in a U shape not touching the ground. I'd say 6ft max.

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## GoFride

Closing arguments from both sides tomorrow - then it's up to the jury.

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## R&DP

> I think they should require a license to own burms and retics and other large constrictors, that way we reduce the number of times morons get a hold of animals they can't handle.


Really... More regulations, your not serious. People need to use sense.

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## sgath92

> Closing arguments from both sides tomorrow - then it's up to the jury.


Did they do an autopsy? Has the findings been made public? I am very curious as to whether the snake ever actually hurt her versus whether the parents used the snake to cover up a murder.

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## llovelace

> Really... More regulations, your not serious. People need to use sense.


Those regulations have been passed here in FL.  Unfortunately there are alot of people out there who are just idiots, plain & simple

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## King's Royal Pythons

a license or permit to own one will not prevent them from getting one illeagally...just sayin'

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## llovelace

> a license or permit to own one will not prevent them from getting one illeagally...just sayin'


I hear ya

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## Redneck_Crow

> I think they should require a license to own burms and retics and other large constrictors, that way we reduce the number of times morons get a hold of animals they can't handle.


What I'd rather see is that if a venomous snake or large constrictor escapes and kills or gravely injures someone due to improper husbandry, including inadequate caging and not remembering to secure said caging, that the keeper of the reptile get the book thrown at them.  There should be a long mandatory sentence, irregardless of "it was an accident," zero possibility of a parole, and if they do live long enough to get out, in 20 years or so, they shouldn't be allowed to own any pet, not even a pet goldfish.

Morons are always going to find a way to keep something they can't handle.    But even morons do have some notion that going away to prison for a very long time is something that should be avoided.  And sending them away protects the rest of society from the consequences of their stupidity.

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## adamjeffery

> I'm sorry but all that does is start to limit our rights which leads down a slippery slope of them eventually taking them away all together. Same thing goes for many other rights, mainly our right to bare arms...


i agree ...once they limit burms then it will be balls and then corns and then anoles and then worms...ect ect
they dont want us to own anything at all these days. i am against any legislation that limits my rights
adam jeffery

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## Maixx

> a license or permit to own one will not prevent them from getting one illeagally...just sayin'


I agree completely.
There is good precedent for this in gun control legislation. The responsible owners who were obeying the law have their rights revoked, while criminals and irresponsible idiots are the ones who are still carrying and using them illegally.
You can still get a federal firearms license, they just cost so much that few can afford them. The red tape involved leads to 90% rejection rate.

Sure permits sound good.... a couple hundred a year just to be able to keep a Burm?
-no-

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## sgath92

Licenses have always been used for forcing political views onto the masses. The very first radio acts would label any radio station that broadcasts an unusual religious or political view a "propaganda station" and revoke their license despite the first amendment [if they still did this there'd be nothing left on AM  :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic): ]. That was nearly a hundred years ago and went on all throughout the 20s-early 30s. The only time licenses aren't a big deal is when it's something that society generally accepts that the masses should "normally" be able to do, like driving a car. Snakes, especially big snakes does not fall into that category. Most of the public probably thinks "why can't you just get a cat or a dog like a normal person?" likewise the only reason why having kids doesn't require licensing is because people generally believe that people should be able to produce as many as they want without government regulation regardless the consequences or how badly they're treated. At most the kids are taken away some  time after the fact and put into foster home [and even that is pretty controversial]. There's more red tape in _owning a dog_.

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## kellysballs

> I think they should require a license to own burms and retics and other large constrictors, that way we reduce the number of times morons get a hold of animals they can't handle.


At the time of this incident in the state of Florida a permit was required to own burms, retics, nile moniters, amethystine pythons and green anacondas. Now they are banned in the state for private owners that did not previously go through with their required licenses.

A couple of people already beat me to this info.  :Smile:

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## GoFride

It took the jury about two hours of deliberations to find the mom and mom's boyfriend guilty on all counts against them. Each was found guilty of manslaughter, third degree murder and child neglect. With the guilty verdicts, the couple now faces up to 35 years in prison. They had previously turned down a plea bargain that would have sent them to prison for ten years, because they felt they should not be held accountable for an accident. Not sure when they go before the judge for final sentencing.

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_Aes_Sidhe_ (07-14-2011),_Annarose15_ (07-15-2011)

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## Highline Reptiles South

These dirtbags should have never been allowed to have a burm, much less a child.  Not to mention the jerk had not 1 or 2 but SIX!!!! prior felonies!!!

My wife is asking me questions about my snakes (balls and redtail) reading this story today. They got what they deserved. Poor child.

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## llovelace

What about charges of animal neglect/cruelty?!

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## tcutting

> Couple of questions; 
> At the time this happened, the snake was 8 1/2 feet long and weighed 13 1/2 pounds. Since I know next to nothing about Burmese pythons, what would a normal weight be for this size? Would a Burm this size and weight be weak?


ok so in my pic you see that i had a Burm of almost that exact size... and no it is not weak by any means.  HOWEVER... i choose not to say anything on this topic for a bit but it just boggles my mind that a snake would hunt down track the kid down in their crib and "try to eat them"  a 2 year old is WAY out of size range of that big of a snake.  and from my experience a snake doesnt attack something it cant eat unless it feels threatened and cant escape.  I always thought with this story that there was foul play by the parents and they use the snake to not get murder charges.  

With that said is it impossible no, but the story as a whole just ticked me off big time.  either way it comes down crappy people shouldnt own big snakes or any animals, let alone be parents.

But at least they will now pay the price for being terrible people.

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## llovelace

Exactly!

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## SneakySnake

This makes me ill. If you can't give your snake the attention, care, and respect it needs and deserves then get it to someone who can. Research needs to be done before owning any animal...especially more exotic animals.

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