# Site General > Site Info >  Recent trends...

## elevatethis

In light of a recent trend - threads going completely off the wall, "new" members throwing around misinformation, etc., I had a couple thoughts that I wanted to share and get feedback and also provide a place for input, should any of you have some.

A lot of "new" users can just pop in here and start doling out advice.  Is it possible to have a period of time after a person signs up before they have free reign to post anywhere in the forums?  This will force new users to do some reading and become oriented with the forums, search functions, and other modules, before they start posting bad info they've learned elsewhere and asking the same questions over and over again.

Ok, so now you are thinking this:  What about new users with an emergency question or new users (like corey woods who signed up today, WELCOME!) who hatch out bumblebees and post up eye candy for everyone?  Answer:  A "new users" forum for those people to introduce themselves, ask those emergency questions, or post pics of cool stuff.  Keep in mind these new users should still be able to view all those forums, just not post in them.  I guarantee that if all these new people spent 5 minutes browsing through the forums, they'd find at least 1 or 2 threads addressing their exact question.

I've never run a forum, so feel free to smack me down if you want, its just an idea that had enough merit to throw out there.

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## jglass38

> In light of a recent trend - threads going completely off the wall, "new" members throwing around misinformation, etc., I had a couple thoughts that I wanted to share and get feedback and also provide a place for input, should any of you have some.
> 
> A lot of "new" users can just pop in here and start doling out advice.  Is it possible to have a period of time after a person signs up before they have free reign to post anywhere in the forums?  This will force new users to do some reading and become oriented with the forums, search functions, and other modules, before they start posting bad info they've learned elsewhere and asking the same questions over and over again.
> 
> Ok, so now you are thinking this:  What about new users with an emergency question or new users (like corey woods who signed up today, WELCOME!) who hatch out bumblebees and post up eye candy for everyone?  Answer:  A "new users" forum for those people to introduce themselves, ask those emergency questions, or post pics of cool stuff.  Keep in mind these new users should still be able to view all those forums, just not post in them.  I guarantee that if all these new people spent 5 minutes browsing through the forums, they'd find at least 1 or 2 threads addressing their exact question.
> 
> I've never run a forum, so feel free to smack me down if you want, its just an idea that had enough merit to throw out there.


I think you are on the right track.  I'd like to see what the admins think and if there is any way to reasonably do this.

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## RockSolid

It's a good suggestion.  I'm new and just about every question I have had has been answered by search.  The only thing is how would someone lose the reputaion of being new?  Hopefully not by the number of posts since it is really easy to pad your post numbers.

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## Freakie_frog

Wow this should be interesting. I think this is going down the right track. Have something like after a certin amount of time or even Rep points or something.

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## jglass38

> It's a good suggestion.  I'm new and just about every question I have had has been answered by search.  The only thing is how would someone lose the reputaion of being new?  Hopefully not by the number of posts since it is really easy to pad your post numbers.


It could be done by time on the site...2 weeks maybe..

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## RockSolid

maybe longer. I still thinlk I have a long way to go since I've only had my BP a week.  But that's just my opinion of myself.

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## Smulkin

Where's my salmon!?!?!?!

J/K Brad.   "Ah feel your pain" as do most.

One potential outcome of that might be that all the misinformation you refer to would be all coralled together in that "new folks" forum or whatever it would be called - and if that is the only place to post then those who are inclined to will.  So the misinformation is then funneled to those most likely to take it as face value or gospel truth.

I agree a lot of good basic info can be found in the forum-specific FAQs or by searching - and also agree as brought up by someone else recently the canned "Read the FAQ / Use the Search function" response can seem a little cold if that is the stock response every time (it is defintely NOT that way here and I love you all for that).  But still  . .  i know what you are getting  at.


Would that proposed forum then become one glut of threads titled things like "How many of you have snakes?" - would it make new people feel too much like second-class citizens?

No smacking down here - just weighing the considerations - have at it!





(EDIT:  wow a lot of posts whiel i was writing that.  In answer to earlier questions the most relaible way to make it happen would be by making it a function solely of # days registered.)

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## Emilio

I agree with you guy's , thing's have been a little different.There's some real bad info being spewed.

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## elevatethis

Like I said, I've never run a board or have any understanding of issues with implementing this or the effects it would have.

I joined an aquarium board some time back that had this policy.  The length of time was 3 days, and during those three days, I learned much more by searching and browsing threads as opposed to wasting my time making redundant posts and waiting for answers.

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## Sputnik

I'd like to see it happen too!

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## elevatethis

Smulkin, you've got good points.  Your right, that forum has the possibility of becoming a glut of random threads- but at least all that "glut" would be concentrated in one area as opposed to being spread out all over the place where it is now.

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## cassandra

I dislike new user forums...the segration, lower-class citizens...bleh...

While I'm all for correcting misinformation, I don't think seperating new people would be a way to do it. The openness and general "nice-ness" of bp.net is what makes bp.net so great. We are a dysfunctional, loving family...but you don't make kids giving bad information sit in the outhouse - you correct them.

Hell, I wanna be corrected as soon as I spew bad information - I would hope everyone here would want to know if they are wrong or coloring information not quite right.

On the other hand, we don't want to encourage know-it-alls who nit-pick on others and teensy weensy mistakes in their advice ("the temperature is supposed to be 82 and 92, not 83 and 93, omg you tool!")...

If someone posts incorrect advice, then be the mature BP.net and herp owner and politely correct them, explaining clearly and kindly where the mistake lies in their information.

If someone flips out, then they will only look like a tool themselves.

And tools belong in the shed....with Cue...which is scary.

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## Smulkin

Twixt a rock and a hard place this is.

I agree with you Cass in that regard - and some good new people might get so fed up with their good legit questions being drowned in a sea of threads like "How many toes does a python have" they might leave for good and never get to feel the lub we hab.

At the same time - all those threads (regardless of perceived worth) WILL show up on the latest threads section of the homepage. So no relief for folks who use and enjoy that feature in that case.taff

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## elevatethis

The problem lately is not the old users...its the new users refusal to politely accept the polite corrections that we are making.  They would have a period of down-time to read around and check out the site, and leave the site if they grossly disagree with what we do here and refuse to do any new research.

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## Adam_Wysocki

OR ... if everyone can be a little patient ... school starts back up in less than 2 months ... things *WILL* go back to normal.  :Sweeet: 

To steal a quote from the incredibly intelligent and suave Ryan, "cool ur jets"   :Cool:  

-adam

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## Sputnik

> OR ... if everyone can be a little patient ... school starts back up in less than 2 months ... things *WILL* go back to normal. 
> 
> To steal a quote from the incredibly intelligent and suave Ryan, "cool ur jets"  
> 
> -adam


This person is a classic example of what Jamie (Master of Cats) spoke of in regards to new members giving advice in the disturbing trend thread.

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## elevatethis

There he goes again jumping in with an excellent point.  Damn you Adam how come I didn't think of that.

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## cueball

> ("the temperature is supposed to be 82 and 92, not 83 and 93, omg you tool!")...
> 
> And tools belong in the shed....with Cue...which is scary.


Owned me twice in ONE single post...well played sassypants  :Tip of the Hat:  

I think the waiting period would be frustrating to new members that come here with an urgent question. Granted they can search and probably find a close answer but that might not be close enough or they need more info. To a concerned pet owner patience is not a virtue.

BTW...I am not pretending to not be an off the wall starter  :Embarassed:

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## jglass38

> OR ... if everyone can be a little patient ... school starts back up in less than 2 months ... things *WILL* go back to normal. 
> 
> To steal a quote from the incredibly intelligent and suave Ryan, "cool ur jets"   
> 
> -adam



2 months could be the difference be life and death...Or more accurately, life and a postal shooting spree....

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## Adam_Wysocki

> This person is a classic example of what Jamie (Master of Cats) spoke of in regards to new members giving advice in the disturbing trend thread.


This person? Who me?  :Very Happy: 

Yup. I'm an "instant expert"  :Sweeet: 

-adam

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## Adam_Wysocki

> 2 months could be the difference be life and death...Or more accurately, life and a postal shooting spree....


Knuckle up Sally.  :Sweeet:  We've got Daytona around the corner ... by the time you sober up from that it will be mid October.  :Wink: 

-adam

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## Sputnik

> This person? Who me? 
> 
> Yup. I'm an "instant expert" 
> 
> -adam


Exactly, what the hell would you know about keeping ball pythons... LMAO! 

I meant your buddy Ryan!  :Smile:

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## RockSolid

I would still think the veterans (for lack of a better term) would still be able to post in the new owners/members section as long as we weren't ridden off as incompetent.  The subject could be a way that the veterans can be enticed to answer posts.

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## jglass38

> Knuckle up Sally.  We've got Daytona around the corner ... by the time you sober up from that it will be mid October. 
> 
> -adam


Woohoo!!  I had forgotten all about it  :Smile:

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## Adam_Wysocki

> Exactly, what the hell would you know about keeping ball pythons... LMAO! 
> 
> I meant your buddy Ryan!


Ryan is the new mayor of Bp.Net!

-adam

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## JLC

This is my personal opinion on the topic and does not necessarily reflect the position of Admin as a whole...


I can SO relate to and understand the current frustration with the trends seen in some threads and forums lately.  I find myself wanting to pull my hair out now and then. (and I really don't have that much to spare!)

However...these frustrations are the cost of doing business, so to speak.  The only way to truly avoid them is to start a whole new forum that is "By Invitation Only" and completely closed to the general public.  And even then, if you have more than one person participating, you're gonna have disagreements and drama!  

I am very open to suggestions on how to mitigate the frustration levels, but other than a large order of patience...I don't currently see anything that is feasible within the framework and the mission of BP.net.

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## cueball

> Ryan is the new mayor of Bp.Net!
> 
> -adam


*SWEET*

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## elevatethis

Put me in a ball python forum for 45 seconds, press post, and there you go: "instant expert!"

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## Adam_Wysocki

> *SWEET*


Thanks ... can't help it ... I'm an idea man.  :Wink: 

-adam

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## jglass38

> Ryan is the new mayor of Bp.Net!
> 
> -adam


Why stop there.  I think he eclipses George W. in smarts....

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## tigerlily

Hey school starst back up in a couple weeks here!  Registration August 2nd!!   :Party:

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## jglass38

> I am very open to suggestions on how to mitigate the frustration levels, but other than a large order of patience...I don't currently see anything that is feasible within the framework and the mission of BP.net.


Does this mean there is an unwillingness to do anything about it?  I would be willing to bet it is feasible.  :Confused:

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## cassandra

> OR ... if everyone can be a little patient ... school starts back up in less than 2 months ... things *WILL* go back to normal.


What Adam said...although I still think we should lock tools up in the shed with Cue...

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## jglass38

> What Adam said...although I still think we should lock tools up in the shed with Cue...


Is that like the basement of the store in Pulp Fiction?

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## cassandra

> Is that like the basement of the store in Pulp Fiction?


Feel that sting? That's Cue, frackin' with ya...

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## Sputnik

> Why stop there. I think he eclipses George W. in smarts....


Show me a person that can't do that..  :Smile:

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## cueball

> Feel that sting? That's Cue, frackin' with ya...


Cass........Glass..Cue
......

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## Emilio

Let's leave W'ya alone he's got alot on his plate.

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## Smulkin

> I would still think the veterans (for lack of a better term) would still be able to post in the new owners/members section as long as we weren't ridden off as incompetent.  The subject could be a way that the veterans can be enticed to answer posts.


Anyone would be able to post there - I am just skeptical anyone who did not have to would be inclined to.  I would also anticipate the next step would be to request that anything posted there not show up on the "Active Threads" portion - which would finalize adding insult to injury.

Feasible sure - locking new registratons would also be feasible - as would making all new posts be reviewed before posting - but while that might relieve the recent frustrations I think those things might actually be more derimental in the long run.

(again - these are just my *personal* feelings on the issue and in no way shape or form any sort of site decree - i'd hate to think i couldnt weigh in without that distinction)

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## Sputnik

> Let's leave W'ya alone he's got alot on his plate.


Exactly, is it a paper plate or real?  :Razz:

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## RockSolid

On another message board I am a member of, there are mods for each section.  What if there was a forum moderator who could decide someone was ready for that next step up.  The only problem would be figuring out the criteria that would be needed for the next step up in membership.

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## Sputnik

> On another message board I am a member of, there are mods for each section. What if there was a forum moderator who could decide someone was ready for that next step up. The only problem would be figuring out the criteria that would be needed for the next step up in membership.


That could reduce the number of people who want to join. If they see levels you have to get through and things you have to meet... then it may well have a negative impact. 

Just a thought, straight out of the cookie jar!  :Smile:

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## RockSolid

Good Point

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## SarahMB

When I started looking for a place to find good information, I was looking for a place that seemed welcoming to new owners with questions, not snobbish or cliquish. 
I looked at several forums, never posting, until I found this one. Had it been as unfriendly as what I have seen described in this thread, I would have simply moved on. 
I see no reason to turn this forum into something like that. Even as a new ball owner myself, I can easily spot stupid advice, and am always thankful when people correct misiniformation without getting nasty about it. 

I know, I'm new, I have no right to put in a word on how the place should be run, but I'm really confused by all the controlling suggestions I've seen this week. Making people feel less than welcome, or even second class will not help any snakes. And it would drive many people away. I guess if what you are looking for is a forum of only experts patting each other on the back, it would be nirvana.

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## SatanicIntention

Sure you do! Everyone is entitled to their own response. No one is less a person than any other(unless you're short, but that's ok *giggle*)

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## SarahMB

Haha, I've VERY short. My teen towers 2 inches over me!

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## JLC

> When I started looking for a place to find good information, I was looking for a place that seemed welcoming to new owners with questions, not snobbish or cliquish. 
> I looked at several forums, never posting, until I found this one. Had it been as unfriendly as what I have seen described in this thread, I would have simply moved on. 
> I see no reason to turn this forum into something like that. Even as a new ball owner myself, I can easily spot stupid advice, and am always thankful when people correct misiniformation without getting nasty about it. 
> 
> I know, I'm new, I have no right to put in a word on how the place should be run, but I'm really confused by all the controlling suggestions I've seen this week. Making people feel less than welcome, or even second class will not help any snakes. And it would drive many people away. I guess if what you are looking for is a forum of only experts patting each other on the back, it would be nirvana.


VERY well said!  :Yes:   Thank you!!

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## SarahMB

Thanks for saying that, Judy! I don't want to step on any toes!

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## Sputnik

I think you are right, that is a humbling post!

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## mousch

> Thanks for saying that, Judy! I don't want to step on any toes!


Whose toes? A python's toes? Smulkin, you never DID answer how many toes ball pythons have! I need to know RIGHT AWAY!!!

I would be okay with a bit heaver moderation, but I'm used to being on a heavily moderated forum with many many more users than this site, and it could serve to drive away a lot of users who need genuine help. I think if the mods made themselves heard a bit more, it would help stop the misinformation going around. The rep system is also good though, it helps me tell who I can trust advising me about my snake.
All in all, I love this forum. It's friendly and welcoming, and informative and above all it's POSITIVE. The "Experts" (forget the quotes, you're experts to me!) don't infight at all, and seeing them present a unified front and agree with each other helps me be sure I am giving my snake the best care he can get.

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## Adam_Wysocki

> All in all, I love this forum. It's friendly and welcoming, and informative and above all it's POSITIVE. The "Experts" (forget the quotes, you're experts to me!) don't infight at all, and seeing them present a unified front and agree with each other helps me be sure I am giving my snake the best care he can get.


Now there is a breath of fresh air! ... Bravo!

-adam

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## alexrls

i've gotten a burst of inspiration. possibly a way of dealing wit hour ish. without screwing up our site (that was a non possesive 'our')

what if we had instead of a newbie locked section, a section that was unable to be posted in at all?

it would sorta be like stickies but more obvously located to the new peeps

it would work like the search function but instead of having to search a few key words you could click on a "shedding link" or a "feeding link" and with in these categories  would be lock down old threads of ours where plenty of discussion took place and the good conclusions were drawn. at the end of the thread a quick summary by the mods (or who ever). then if a newbie STILL had problems he/she could quote some stuff from these threads and bring them out to the regular forum.

it needs development but i think its a start....does anyone have any idea what i'm talking about?

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## mousch

I like that idea. It would really help I think, becuase sometimes it's just really hard to find what you need, especially when a thread sstarts as being about one thing and the topic changes - it's hard to tell what's helpful. It would be nice to have an "enclosures" section and shedding, cleaning, feeding etc. I think it would REALLY help. It'd be a goldmine of the most helpful threads.

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## MARCUS ANTONIUS

I agree completely with Mousch.  I've tried to look things up in the past and sometimes I find what I'm looking for and sometimes the threads wander off in a totally different direction.  *Which isn't necessarily bad, considering I like to just read the witty banter posted on here from time to time.*  But, I think it would be a plethora of knowledge and most users, even the veterans, would benefit from the ease of gathering info.

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## alexrls

obviously it would require a large amount of effort to do pull it off but i think it would be benficial to the site!

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## jessie_k_pythons

I was thinking about the whole stickies thing for quite a while now.  and I have an idea but it involves a screen shot of the home page of the forum then another of the "revised look" could I get permission to do this and post it just purly for ideas sake?

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## frankykeno

We all want BPNet to settle down, that's a given. Well I don't think segregation of newcomers is the answer. Stronger and more immediate moderation of these threads going nowhere fast is needed. So is Veterans and Members leading by example. We Veterans arse around in a lot of threads and that does set a tone. Threads that don't get locked and tossed or warnings strongly and publically given set a tone.

Sorry folks but for me I always look first to what I'm doing to make or break a situation. It's a bit too easy for me to just "blame the noob". Sure we've had some tools lately and sure we've likely come across as a place to get away with it and a place where long time members can act like tools even if we perceive it to be in good fun. It isn't even about how we perceive it, most of us know each other reasonably well through this board...but how does a newcomer perceive it.

I guess what I'm saying is look at the pre-existing membership and leadership. Can every one of you honestly say that lately we are setting our expectation high and enforcing that expectation so that your average idiot feels that their games are unwelcome and will most likely naturally wander off.

Sorry if any of you feel offended by this post. I'm not out to offend or chastize. I am willing to stand up however and take responsibility for my own part of this problem through either my actions or lack thereof.

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## iceman25

> We all want BPNet to settle down, that's a given. Well I don't think segregation of newcomers is the answer. Stronger and more immediate moderation of these threads going nowhere fast is needed. So is Veterans and Members leading by example. We Veterans arse around in a lot of threads and that does set a tone. Threads that don't get locked and tossed or warnings strongly and publically given set a tone.
> 
> Sorry folks but for me I always look first to what I'm doing to make or break a situation. It's a bit too easy for me to just "blame the noob". Sure we've had some tools lately and sure we've likely come across as a place to get away with it and a place where long time members can act like tools even if we perceive it to be in good fun. It isn't even about how we perceive it, most of us know each other reasonably well through this board...but how does a newcomer perceive it.
> 
> I guess what I'm saying is look at the pre-existing membership and leadership. Can every one of you honestly say that lately we are setting our expectation high and enforcing that expectation so that your average idiot feels that their games are unwelcome and will most likely naturally wander off.
> 
> Sorry if any of you feel offended by this post. I'm not out to offend or chastize. I am willing to stand up however and take responsibility for my own part of this problem through either my actions or lack thereof.


Very well said Jo!   :Clap:

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## elevatethis

Yeah, what Jo said!

I agree that older members can calm things down by making one post for the record and avoid arguing.  There's no point...someone is either going to take what you say and do their own research or just think you're dumb and keep believing what they see as true.  No arguement on a message board is going to change that.

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## Adam_Wysocki

> Stronger and more immediate moderation of these threads going nowhere fast is needed.


I couldn't disagree more ... I feel that one of the things that makes bp.net so much fun is the way it is currently moderated. If you want "strong and immediate moderation" Jo, go take a look at kingsnake, it might be more your style ... they pull threads that get out of hand all day long and the result is that the majority of people posting there are doing so to pump up thier ads in the classifieds ... There is ZERO sense of family there like we have over here.





> We Veterans arse around in a lot of threads and that does set a tone.


That has absolutely NOTHING to do with new people joining the site and commenting on every single thread with horrible information because they think that they know something. 

The fun that WE ALL have on threads is one of the BEST things about this site ...  If threads start getting locked or warnings start going out because WE are goofing around and having fun this site will loose much of it's FAMILY feeling.

I LIKE the feeling that we're all FAMILY here ... I LIKE the feeling that we are a COMMUNITY of people that are passionate about the animals that we keep, are able to help each other out, AND are able to have a good time. 

MORE/HEAVIER moderation will only break down that feeling and steer this site to more of a strict information portal ... and you know what? ... that stinks ... there are TONS of those out there, but only one Ball-Pythons.net.

Leave it the way it is ... and instead of asking the "veterans" to stop "arsing around", how about asking the "veterans" to stop whining about the "tone" around here and instead of arguing with the new users that don't have a clue, just correct them politely and move on?

Jo, just as you ended your post with "Sorry if any of you feel offended by this post", I will do the same.  :Wink:   :Sweeet: 

-adam

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## frankykeno

No offense taken Adam and if you think I posted my thoughts and expected a general "yay what a GREAT post" response, I'm not that naive.

There is no way I want BPNet to lose it's friendly, fun and family atmosphere but Adam even within a family there needs to be limits and consequence. I don't want a slam down on every thread or none of us to have fun, why would you even think I would? I've never participated in kingsnake forums, haven't heard anything worth checking out over there and likely won't...thanks for your suggestion though.  

I just see it getting worse and worse lately and I'm not willing to just shove that off as "noobs being noobs".  For me, and I can only speak for me, that's just too easy an answer.

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## Freakie_frog

> I couldn't disagree more ... I feel that one of the things that makes bp.net so much fun is the way it is currently moderated. If you want "strong and immediate moderation" Jo, go take a look at kingsnake, it might be more your style ... they pull threads that get out of hand all day long and the result is that the majority of people posting there are doing so to pump up thier ads in the classifieds ... There is ZERO sense of family there like we have over here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That has absolutely NOTHING to do with new people joining the site and commenting on every single thread with horrible information because they think that they know something. 
> 
> The fun that WE ALL have on threads is one of the BEST things about this site ...  If threads start getting locked or warnings start going out because WE are goofing around and having fun this site will loose much of it's FAMILY feeling.
> 
> ...


   I agree with Adam that is why I joined years ago. You could talk one on one and on a first name basies. You can joke about who gets pie and who smacked frozen salmon or about how much we all "lub Jimmy". If anything the newbe's just need to understand it aint all found in the "manual to ball pythons book" and time and experiance does play into it. Keep the family feeling.

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## cueball

I think the mods do a great job of settling things down when they get out of hand. Well done mods!!

I think the goofing around is important not only for board moral but also to keep threads alive for more people to see. If the goofing around was not going on I would not read as many threads as I do for sure. 

Hooray for bp.net and all it's goofballs!!

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## elevatethis

Alright so new rules:

1.  Don't argue with retards.
2.  Jimmy lubs pie.

Thanks for the input everyone!  Gave me some fresh perspectives, I'm glad I started this, and yeah, I do feel a lot better.  I think yesterday was just a complete poopfest- this thread was a reaction to that.

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## frankykeno

Let me try to clarify my thoughts (why did I get involved in this thread...I know better).

I'm not saying don't have fun, I'm not saying that the Mods and Admins aren't doing their job. For heaven's sakes I was one of them...I know how hard that job is! What I am trying and obviously not managing to do is ask all of us, Mod, Admins, Veterans and Members to look first to ourselves.

If the step in to settle a thread is slightly faster or slightly more firm...not heavy handed but firm and quick before it escalates...isn't that a good thing? If a newcomer is being an ass or giving out bad info and the step in with good advice w/o the sarcasm and back and forth stuff happens, isn't that a good thing? Won't that settle it down faster and not drag it on endlessly page after page. It might not but I can't see that the current methods are working at the moment or we wouldn't all be in this discussion.

Goofing around Cue is great, it's fun and has it's place.  In a thread that's going bad, I just don't know if that is the right place or if we go to far sometimes.  That's not my judgement to call, just something I wonder about.

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## tigerlily

I don't think it would be fair to blame any one party.  It takes two to tango, and in a couple cases it's be a downright free for all.  

I can't agree more, that the best part of this site is the FAMILY feel to it.  There's only so many times you can answer the same question, and without the tight community many would have left by now.  We all have seemed to have the need to vent a bit more lately, but as long as it toes the line I believe it's good.  

Heavier moderation just leads to bitter feelings, and an exhausted staff.  That is NOT to say no moderation would be good in the slightest.

This site has always been open and welcoming, and a fountain of information.  With help from this site my son is now swimming on his own.  Now who would have thought the information that helped me would have come from a snake site?   :Surprised:   This community is awesome!! 

 :Group Hug:

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## Adam_Wysocki

> even within a family there needs to be limits and consequence.


Well, the good news is that this is ONLY THE INTERNET  :Sweeet:  ... It's not life and death and 30 years from now, no one will care.

I like the idea of having a site that I can go to and have fun away from the daily grind of life that sometimes can be a real drag ... if that site suddenly starts to have the same limits and consequences that life does, why would I waste my time? I'd rather turn the computer off and get some work done.

If you take a minute to put emotion aside, you'd see that the site is really not "getting worse lately" ... this site rocks, always has, always will! ... we've been hit with a ton of odd ball posts in the last week or so, but ... SO WHAT? ... Those morons will be gone in 2 weeks and we'll still be here doing what we do. I really don't understand why everyones panties/boxers are all wadded up??? ... it's happened before and we've recovered ... and no matter what anyone does, it WILL happen again. 

Judy, Matt, and the rest of the admin/mod crew are good eggs and wicked smart ... I think they're doing an EXCELLENT job of running things "AS IS" ... asking them to do more/faster only makes thier lives harder and this site less fun. I say poo poo to that. I'd rather just let it roll off me and keep the site the way it is ... PERFECT!  :Love: 

-adam

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## Jeanne

What I am about to say comes from the fact that I am the eldest surviving Admin that is still around since this sites birth... I certainly dont mean to offend,just "speaking" my mind on this.




> Leave it the way it is ... and instead of asking the "veterans" to stop "arsing around", how about asking the "veterans" to stop whining about the "tone" around here and instead of arguing with the new users that don't have a clue, just correct them politely and move on?
> 
> 
> 
> -adam


Adam is right on target here... Thanks Adam.

I think it is important to realise that noobs need a place to learn, by putting them in thier own forum cause they are new, only serves to act as segration.  bottom line, it is not right and only serves to create hard feelings. 

I understand everyones frustration, as I too have felt it on many occassions. But the bottom line is, we all need to learn more tolerance for eachother. Not all teens or younger members are causing an issue, just a select few. It is not fair to make all pay the consequences for the action of a select few. If you have an issue with a noob, learn to ignore and not waste your time by posting and argueing.. or just post info and leave it at that.

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## Adam_Wysocki

> not heavy handed but firm and quick before it escalates...isn't that a good thing?


No. Restriction of the freedoms of a majority by a minority is NEVER a good thing.

I'd rather give an idiot 100 gallons of water to drown themselves in than see everyone else be given "just enough" to make it through a drought.

-adam

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## Freakie_frog

> This site has always been open and welcoming, and a fountain of information.  With help from this site my son is now swimming on his own.  Now who would have thought the information that helped me would have come from a snake site?    This community is awesome!!


 :Group Hug: 

Bingo

This group is so willing to help with anything and there are so many people from all walks of life the wealth of general knowledge is out standing. The moderators do a great job!  :Very Happy:  

I think people have just needed to blow off some steem. I know it can get frustrating to see 2 posts a week on "Help Low humidity" or "my new snake from the petstore isn't eating". But having been there I also know it is scary and we should feel good that they come to us for help. But as far as answering questions. New comers can tell who has the time and experiance to answer questions. If nothing else by the way a vet answers a question and by who the new comer is refered to i.e Adam, Gen, Cue, JLC and so on. Thanks to all the mods and admin and vets for all your help and patients.

 :Group Hug:

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## brainman1000

It appears that this issue has come to a resolution, but I just wanted to put in my 2 cents.  What I like about this site is that it allows everyone to read and write posts.  It is a very open forum to all users even if they have only been here for a few days.  I think it is essential to a new owner to be able to ask questions and have access to all of the forums.  Restricting us new users would make us feel inferior and unwanted, and would ultimately lead to noobs abandoning this site altogether.  I really don't see any problem with this site the way it is, and I say that if it aint broke, don't fix it.

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## xdeus

My thoughts on this subject:  Personally, I don't mind the noobs and tools that come on this site seeking help/attention/arguments.  I think this forum is cohesive enough to withstand the petty issues that come up, yet open enough for people to have fun and voice their opinions without offending too many people.  The trolls that post and try to stir s#@t or look for a fight typically lose interest and will eventually find another forum to harass.  There will always be annoying people that join especially on a popular forum, but that's no reason to try and change the forum-ula.  :Wink:  

One nice thing about this forum is that it has become a place for new people to seek personal help from a lot of experienced people.  Sure, there's tons of information out there and there seems to be an endless stream of "Why won't my Ball eat?" questions that have been answered umpteen-million times, but I actually enjoy answering those questions even though there are countless threads with that same topic or tons of stickies covering every every aspect this cool hobby.  New Ball owners care a lot about their pet and want to feel like they are getting personal attention to their problem instead of just some generic post, and this forum allows people to get that personal attention in a non-threatening environment.  Of course a lot of the old-timers here answer the same questions over and over so that might lead to a little bit of joking around in the thread, but what's the harm if nobody gets offended and people are having fun giving advice or going off-topic?  

Once again, I think things work great around here and the mods are doing an excellent job!  Keep up the good work!   :Sunny:

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## Emilio

> Well, the good news is that this is ONLY THE INTERNET  ... It's not life and death and 30 years from now, no one will care.
> 
> I like the idea of having a site that I can go to and have fun away from the daily grind of life that sometimes can be a real drag ... if that site suddenly starts to have the same limits and consequences that life does, why would I waste my time? I'd rather turn the computer off and get some work done.
> 
> If you take a minute to put emotion aside, you'd see that the site is really not "getting worse lately" ... this site rocks, always has, always will! ... we've been hit with a ton of odd ball posts in the last week or so, but ... SO WHAT? ... Those morons will be gone in 2 weeks and we'll still be here doing what we do. I really don't understand why everyones panties/boxers are all wadded up??? ... it's happened before and we've recovered ... and no matter what anyone does, it WILL happen again. 
> 
> Judy, Matt, and the rest of the admin/mod crew are good eggs and wicked smart ... I think they're doing an EXCELLENT job of running things "AS IS" ... asking them to do more/faster only makes thier lives harder and this site less fun. I say poo poo to that. I'd rather just let it roll off me and keep the site the way it is ... PERFECT! 
> 
> -adam


 Bang , I agree 100%

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## mousch

I think a lot of the reason there are so many repeat threads is because people want to make sure they didn't miss something. I could tell my snake was dehydrated but would have had no idea he was skinny and underfed as well had I not posted his picture and had input from two members whose posts I have respected a lot since joining BP.net. 
So please excuse the noob repeat threads... I know mine was posted to make sure I wan't missing something that an expert's eye obviously saw right away.

Though, it may be a good idea to make a "post formula - use this when asking for help!" sticky thread that has a questionnaire like feel. It could go like this:

If you are posting a thread because your snake has a problem, please answer all of these questions in your first post. You could copy/paste these questions, even!
Remember, BP.net is NOT the same as a vet! If this is an emergency please *call your vet*!

When did you get your snake?
Was it from a breeder or a pet store?
Is this your first snake? Do you have any others?
How old is he/she?
Is he or she housed with any other snakes?
Was he captive bred (his parents were also in captivity), captive hatched (an egg taken from the wild), or wild caught (caught in the wild, already hatched)?
When was his last feed?
What size is he eating? 
Is he eating live, pre-killed or frozen?
When was his last shed?
What are your warm and cool side temperatures?
What is the humidity in your cage?
What is the volume (10 gal, 20 gal, etc)?
Is your enclosure glass or plastic or something else?
What is the problem?
What have you done about it so far?

With something like this, there will be more threads with ALL the info needed in the first post, instead of "my bpw ont eat plz help right away" and then everyone asking for different information, which makes reading the thread and understanding the problem like pulling teeth.

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## Smulkin

> The trolls that post and try to stir s#@t or look for a fight typically lose interest and will eventually find another forum to harass. There will always be annoying people that join especially on a popular forum, but that's no reason to try and change the forum-ula.


The old addage "Don't feed the trolls" goes a long way - whether blatant or subtle it's the attention that fuels them.  When there is no resistance, no fight they get bored and move on - just as you've said.  If you suspect that is the case it has likely occured to staff as well - we are proud of how the site has evolved over the years and invest ourselves in keeping it open and friendly regardless of the effort that sometimes requires and are eyeballing potential issues.

I am glad we have folks who all share that common desire to help/educate whether it means sharing basic info over or pointing the folks in the right direction _without_ hostile or canned responses which seem to be in no shortage on the interweb.  I am also glad we have folks who care enough to bring these concerns up.

What can I say, we rock.  Collectively - for all you do this 'rita's for you members/staff and everyone.  Fresh strawberry/kiwi ritas on me - my house tonight.  Be there or don't be impaired  :Wink:

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## iceman25

> What can I say, we rock.  Collectively - for all you do this 'rita's for you members/staff and everyone.  Fresh strawberry/kiwi ritas on me - my house tonight.  Be there or don't be impaired


I'm in!  :Dancing Carrot:

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## cueball

> Collectively - for all you do this 'rita's for you members/staff and everyone. Fresh strawberry/kiwi ritas on me - my house tonight. Be there or don't be impaired


May we watch Army of Darkness on your plasma screen  :Wuv:

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## Smulkin

Change of lineup, cue m'boy.

Big Trouble In Little China!


Sadly no plasma.

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## cueball

> Change of lineup, cue m'boy.
> 
> Big Trouble In Little China!


Man, I am so four minutes ago  :Tears:

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## elevatethis

You should get one...my brother just did....50" Samsung.  I know where I'll be for football, march madness, last season of the sopranos, etc!

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## Smulkin

> You should get one...my brother just did....50" Samsung.  I know where I'll be for football, march madness, last season of the sopranos, etc!


As soon as they let you trade your 16 year old in for one it's all mine, man.




> Man, I am so four minutes ago


And I am so two decades ago!


(forgive the derailment/fallout from my call to the blender - please resume discussion)

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## alexrls

discussion resumation underway.

i hear what ur saying adam, that the site isn't deteriorating. in my opinion it hasnt done anything worse than happen to gather two or three temporary 'tards (i say temporary b/c sometimes the biggest tards turn out to be really nice helpful people when they settle down a bit) at once instead of one which happens on ocassion.

i don't think heavy moderation is the way to go and i like Mousch's idea of the  "checklists for snake upkeep thingy" (although there should be a misclaneous category for unsure questions)

however i personally think my idea with the sticky thingy is a good one. it doesn't limit newbies whatsoever they can still participate in all of the threads fully put it shows the conversations/ argument/ foodfights we've had in the past and is specifically geared towards helping them. not limiting them.

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## aaajohnson

> I understand everyones frustration, as I too have felt it on many occassions. But the bottom line is, we all need to learn more tolerance for eachother. Not all teens or younger members are causing an issue, just a select few. It is not fair to make all pay the consequences for the action of a select few. If you have an issue with a noob, learn to ignore and not waste your time by posting and argueing.. or just post info and leave it at that.


I have stayed out of this one so far, but Jeanne is 100% right. I have managed to stop myself about 10 times from posting what I want to say in response to obviously ridiculous posts. I saw one yesterday that finally broke the "Camels Back", but the thread dissapeard before I finished my response (thank you admins, because it might have gone somewhere that it did not need to go). 

I also agree with Adam though, this is a great site and I think it is moderated wonderfully. I have looked and joined several others, but do not post. I like it here, and even though I am fairly new here people have been great to me. My 12 year old daughter has an account, and I feel she is safe and in good hands when I am not looking over her shoulder. She has been reluctant to post because of not wanting to get treated as a "noob", but I think she is feeling more comfortable all the time. I have tried explaining to her that if she posts, just use common sense.

Bottom line, I would hate to see things change.

Neil

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## Sputnik

After thinking about it, sure there will be things we don't like seeing, but that is a part of an ever increasing membership. You take the good with the bad. I don't think anything should change. 

The fact we are all enjoying our time here is enough for me to say don't change a thing.

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## tigerlily

You know we are all going to be complaining in a couple months when everything slows down.   :Wink:   :Giggle:

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## jotay

I think when schools starts things will even out. People have alot of time on their hands right now. ( well some people, not all of us)

I tend to agree w/ Adam's take.

 This is an awesome site w/ great folks who really care about the animals and spreading the word on the best way to do things or handle situations when it come to the care of our pets.

In my time on here I have noticed things on here seem to go in cycles, so I think as always things will settle down and even out. Since 2003 when I came on here this site has gone thru a ton of changes and members but the core seems to stay and new ones come aboard and all in all this is not only one of the best message boards on herps but one of the best messages boards I have been on or am currently on, period.

I just love me some bp-net  :Smile: 
It rocks!

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## Boarder4l154

I am THE expert.  This is a mandate from the master, not a suggestion or my opinion;  

The first thing that needs to be done is a screen that comes up when a person first registers.  This screen will show how to properly use the forum (i.e. this thing called a search function, these things called stickies etc.)  that way new members don't go posting right away the first question that pops into their head.  

The second thing needed to be done is an option when starting a thread to have only veterans reply.  This will eliminate much of the dispute over information.  This also gives everyone the ability to just "ask the experts". no "instant experts" in this thread, just straight up experts who earned it through time and experience.  This is all for now.

P.S I hope everyone can tell the seriousness in my tone

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## Jeanne

> I am THE expert.  This is a mandate from the master, not a suggestion or my opinion;  
> 
> The first thing that needs to be done is a screen that comes up when a person first registers.  This screen will show how to properly use the forum (i.e. this thing called a search function, these things called stickies etc.)  that way new members don't go posting right away the first question that pops into their head.  
> 
> The second thing needed to be done is an option when starting a thread to have only veterans reply.  This will eliminate much of the dispute over information.  This also gives everyone the ability to just "ask the experts". no "instant experts" in this thread, just straight up experts who earned it through time and experience.  This is all for now.
> 
> P.S I hope everyone can tell the seriousness in my tone


Good thing you are not admin or master of anything here then!   :Raspberries:

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## Sputnik

> I am THE expert. This is a mandate from the master, not a suggestion or my opinion; 
> 
> The first thing that needs to be done is a screen that comes up when a person first registers. This screen will show how to properly use the forum (i.e. this thing called a search function, these things called stickies etc.) that way new members don't go posting right away the first question that pops into their head. 
> 
> The second thing needed to be done is an option when starting a thread to have only veterans reply. This will eliminate much of the dispute over information. This also gives everyone the ability to just "ask the experts". no "instant experts" in this thread, just straight up experts who earned it through time and experience. This is all for now.
> 
> P.S I hope everyone can tell the seriousness in my tone


Our problems are solved....LOL

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## jotay

Leave it to a student of Radford  :Smile:

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## Smulkin

> Leave it to a student of Radford


No one throws trippier Halloween parties!

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## cueball

> Leave it to a student of Radford


Is that bar still around on main st that serves oysters on the half shell on wed nights or something???

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## Boarder4l154

> Is that bar still around on main st that serves oysters on the half shell on wed nights or something???


it is, but under new management so no more oysters on the half shell....

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## cueball

Giddie up  :Cowboy:

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## elevatethis

Raw oysters and binge drinking?

That doesn't sound like a good combination... :Puke:

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## cueball

> Raw oysters and binge drinking?


It's all for the ladies  :Very Happy:

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## jglass38

> We all want BPNet to settle down, that's a given. Well I don't think segregation of newcomers is the answer. Stronger and more immediate moderation of these threads going nowhere fast is needed. So is Veterans and Members leading by example. We Veterans arse around in a lot of threads and that does set a tone. Threads that don't get locked and tossed or warnings strongly and publically given set a tone.
> 
> Sorry folks but for me I always look first to what I'm doing to make or break a situation. It's a bit too easy for me to just "blame the noob". Sure we've had some tools lately and sure we've likely come across as a place to get away with it and a place where long time members can act like tools even if we perceive it to be in good fun. It isn't even about how we perceive it, most of us know each other reasonably well through this board...but how does a newcomer perceive it.
> 
> I guess what I'm saying is look at the pre-existing membership and leadership. Can every one of you honestly say that lately we are setting our expectation high and enforcing that expectation so that your average idiot feels that their games are unwelcome and will most likely naturally wander off.
> 
> Sorry if any of you feel offended by this post. I'm not out to offend or chastize. I am willing to stand up however and take responsibility for my own part of this problem through either my actions or lack thereof.


While I don't take offense, even if I should, I think you are way off on this one.  The veterans here didn't create the problem and the joking around and off topic behavior isn't furthering the problem.  That is my opinion, take it as you like  :Cool:

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## jglass38

Boy, I missed this whole thread by having to do some hard work today.  I guess by some magic the problem has been solved.  :Smile:   You guys rock!

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## Sputnik

> Boy, I missed this whole thread by having to do some hard work today. I guess by some magic the problem has been solved.  You guys rock!


And life rolls on...  :Smile:

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## alexrls

> Boy...You guys rock!





> And life rolls on...


ROCK???

and

ROLL????

Hey!! this could lead somewhere!!!

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## jglass38

> While I don't take offense, even if I should, I think you are way off on this one.  The veterans here didn't create the problem and the joking around and off topic behavior isn't furthering the problem.  That is my opinion, take it as you like


I just reread this and realized that it may not come off as it was intended. I apologize if it was offensive to you Jo.  Its been a long day!!

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## xdeus

> I just reread this and realized that it may not come off as it was intended. I apologize if it was offensive to you Jo.  Its been a long day!!


I wouldn't accept that if I were you, Jo.  Long day or not, we still want to see Jamie get the flogging he deserves.  :Saber duel:   (even if he was right)  :Razz:

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## jglass38

> I wouldn't accept that if I were you, Jo.  Long day or not, we still want to see Jamie get the flogging he deserves.   (even if he was right)


After today a good flogging would be sweeeeet!

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## xdeus

> After today a good flogging would be sweeeeet!



I hear you.  Friday couldn't come fast enough this week, but when it came it decided to kick me in the @$$ for good measure.   :Rochambeaux:     At least it made the margaritas extra tasty.    :Yes:

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## jglass38

> I hear you.  Friday couldn't come fast enough this week, but when it came it decided to kick me in the @$$ for good measure.      At least it eventually made the margaritas extra tasty.


We had a transformer blow at 9AM.  We were down until 1:30PM (and had to stay in the hot building the whole time) and when the power came on I had to spend the balance of the day getting all the servers back up and functioning and replacing equipment that got fried.  Good stuff!

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## xdeus

> We had a transformer blow at 9AM.  We were down until 1:30PM (and had to stay in the hot building the whole time) and when the power came on I had to spend the balance of the day getting all the servers back up and functioning and replacing equipment that got fried.  Good stuff!


Okay, you win.  I just had to deal with lots of petty stuff like old, failing backup tapes and annoying users complaining because their system booted up too slow.  At least I got my VPN problems worked out so I can start logging OT from home.   :Roll Eyes (Sarcastic):

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## sweety314

I'm a little behind the times, because I don't have access at home, and I work nights, but as a not-so-fresh newbie, I'd like to comment.....


I lurked...I read.....I signed on here. From here I found links to other forum sites, and many, many MANY breeder, vendor, product, yadda yadda sites to add to the "favorites" collection. (now how am I gonna xfer them to my HOME PC????  :Sigh2:  )

Yeah, there are some dinks, and I know I asked some of the same questions as others in the past...but in admission, I did TRY the search and couldn't find enough info on the topics, so I posted. Then someone was kind enough to either tell, and/or give me the link to the previous thread(s) so that I could read some more.........I've had the care and feeding of snakes before, but it's been some years, so I needed additional information and other, newer skills.

I'm one who has to have two or three different ideas, to see what would work for me and my pets. Like La Leche, what works for one mom (insert "snake") doesn't always work for another mom ( :Snake2:  ). Even after reading posts and searching some of the stuff just doesn't make sense to me. Even after these months of reading and listening to all the vets and different ideas, I'm still needing to ask the "usual".

I enjoy it here. Adam, Cass, Jo, everyone had good points, but personally, if < I > was locked into a beginners forum, I wouldn't be stopping here 3, 4, 6x a night getting my fix of the caring and HUMOR from Cue's, Adam's, Jamie's, etc........comments. There are nights when you guys/gals are the bomb and JUST what I need to make my day better and my nights here at work at least tolerable.

Yeah, there's some things/ppl that need to be changed, but for every public internet forum, you're going to have to answer the same questions. Maybe just politely and lovingly? let the newbie know that there are now FAQs and stickies and then if there isn't clarity, to ask again. (BTW, the FAQs happened after I signed on, but being more detail oriented, I would have just skimmed and tried to get to the meatier sides of things.)

As for rep points, I would like to give 'em but don't feel worthy or know WHO to give them to. So....thx to those who felt my contributions were worthy of the rep points.

*Whew* All done now.....thx for listening.

RuLyn

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## frankykeno

> After today a good flogging would be sweeeeet!


And that's why I wouldn't administer one Jamie, you'd enjoy it too much and that's not the point of it (well not in my little world but hey....whatever rocks ya boat LOL). No offense intended from my side of this, none taken from yours. Open and reasonable discussion is what it's all about.  :Smile:  I hope my point wasn't missed and anyone took what I said as a blame game, it was meant as more a personal responsibility check thing but obviously it came off differently.

----------

