# Other Pythons > General Pythons >  Woma, Granite IJ, and more - DUW

## reptileexperts

Been a busy week for me, so I haven't spent much time on the forums. I got a call from Nick Mutton saying my snakes were finally ready to ship after nearly 3 months of anxiety, holds, and deposits! Two days before that, I jumped on a deal for a Lesser male that seemed pretty unique in his own right, and then on the way home from a few days away today, I stopped and picked up an insane Mojave female that was picked up by another local breeder at Repticon this last weekend, yeah! So here we go. . . 


New Lesser Male, bred by Clockwork Reptiles, if you haven't dealt with Ryan before, great guy and spectacular service. 


Real quick snap of the new Mojave female that was picked up from Repticon in BR, Louisiana


After photographing balls, I think the Granite got the wrong or maybe right idea . . . should made him easier to photograph! This was after donating my blood for the cause.


Of course, we became the best of friends . . . 


And the adult female Woma, a breeder from Nick Mutton who is going to be a pet now and do some shows on the road. She needs quite a bit of work though, this is officially the most dangerous snake in my collection, highly aggressive! 

I also picked up a wild blood line 100% het granite female Irian Jaya Carpet python to compliment my new Male, both are outcrossed from the original batch of German wild caught lines by 25% in different directions, giving my genetic workup a lot better vigor. 

All in all a busy time here, no more snakes coming in for the foreseeable future . . .  at least till I get some more racks  :Good Job:

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## ChrisS

Very nice, I really like that woma.

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_reptileexperts_ (08-23-2012)

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## reptileexperts

I'd like her more if she wasn't currently attempting to kill me. . . in time . . . in time. . .

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## Evenstar

That is seriously one spectacularly sweet lesser.  You are feaking lucky you spotted that critter an hour before I did.....   :Wink: 

Awesome snakes!  Big congrats!!   :Bowdown:

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## Tim Mead

Nice assortment of snakes.. You spoke of outbreeding and added vigor in regards to the granite Ijs, has there been a problem that dictated such ? In and or line breeding is the norm when fixing types..To your knowledge has the jaguar wobble been remedied by outcrossing ?

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## ballpythonluvr

Beautiful snakes!  Love that Granite IJ!

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## 1nstinct

Beautiful collection you got there the IJ is amazing!!

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## reptileexperts

> Nice assortment of snakes.. You spoke of outbreeding and added vigor in regards to the granite Ijs, has there been a problem that dictated such ? In and or line breeding is the norm when fixing types..To your knowledge has the jaguar wobble been remedied by outcrossing ?


Jaguar Syndrome has not been associated in line breeding to my knowledge. The Jag Neuro syndrome is a condition directly linked to the gene itself. It's not a matter of if the animal has it, but rather how bad will it display the condition. Most Jaguars do not show any signs of the syndrome untill the age of 2. Other factors have been attributed to the heighthend condition of it however, such as: Stress, parasites, and external chemicals (including PAM [source: ACreptiles per Morelia Forums]). 

The Vigor of outcrossed line breeding in granites is simply because there are few lines in the US. Most people have lines from the same exact breeders making it difficult to add new blood into the mix. When I worked on this purchase with Nick Mutton, part of the goal was to achieve as distant related a pair as I possibly could. Thanks to efforts on his part, and his alone, I now have a well seperated pair (granite to het) that has been outcrossed 25% with both 25% being outcrossed in different lines themselves! Recessive genes always seem to cause genetic depressions because of the amount of line breeding required to reproduce them. Granites were no exception, and in a lot of places are still no exception, but again, thanks to efforts like that of Nick, and now of I, future generations of IJ Granites will be able to start recovering from their initial depressions from line breeding efforts to reproduce these traits. 

And thanks guys, I plan to do a "collection video" for fun in the next few weeks showcasing all of my australian pythons, balls, and colubrids including a new trio of Albino Hognose that will be joining me as of Tuesday . . . and the new addition train pushes forward  :sploosh:  :Very Happy:

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## Tim Mead

[QUOTE=reptileexperts;1903272]Jaguar Syndrome has not been associated in line breeding to my knowledge. The Jag Neuro syndrome is a condition directly linked to the gene itself. It's not a matter of if the animal has it, but rather how bad will it display the condition. Most Jaguars do not show any signs of the syndrome untill the age of 2. Other factors have been attributed to the heighthend condition of it however, such as: Stress, parasites, and external chemicals (including PAM [source: ACreptiles per Morelia Forums]). 

Thank you, upon introduction of the jag gene this wasn't known..Time and energy provided the answer as with so much of a herpers endeavors..Your answer is as I knew it but wondered if progress had been made..Again thank you and happy trails.. :Salute:

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_reptileexperts_ (08-26-2012)

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## el8ch

Great photos and snakes! Congrats on the new pick-ups too, that Mojave should give you some nice reduced babies one day.

Woma's are growing on me, a friend has one that I have had the opportunity to handle from time to time. She's mean, but it's all good!  :Wink:

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## reptileexperts

The woma has calmed down since last night, I was able to finally get in her cage without an attack and change out water and check for feces. Still needed a hook to keep her away from my quickly moving hands, but I think she just needed some break in time! 

Loving my Mojave! Can not wait for her next shed so I can see what she looks like with fresh new scales

- - - Updated - - -

[QUOTE=Tim Mead;1903973]


> Jaguar Syndrome has not been associated in line breeding to my knowledge. The Jag Neuro syndrome is a condition directly linked to the gene itself. It's not a matter of if the animal has it, but rather how bad will it display the condition. Most Jaguars do not show any signs of the syndrome untill the age of 2. Other factors have been attributed to the heighthend condition of it however, such as: Stress, parasites, and external chemicals (including PAM [source: ACreptiles per Morelia Forums]). 
> 
> Thank you, upon introduction of the jag gene this wasn't known..Time and energy provided the answer as with so much of a herpers endeavors..Your answer is as I knew it but wondered if progress had been made..Again thank you and happy trails..


No worries, I have consulted with a few people directly on the matter in relation to Jag to Jag breeding and so forth, aside from the Jag Neuro issues, we do know that it seems that Jag is a form of Het lucy basically, and whenever a "super jag" is born, it dies during developement. A few have made it out of the egg, but every single one that has progressed that far into the maturing process, they come out severly deformed, with the main issue of their heart developing outside their body. . . a lucy carpet would be AMAZING but it appears at this time, the genes we have to work with proove it to be lethal.

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## reptileexperts

*Update* 
Woma has calmed down significantly since I have acquired her. She still decides to throw mood swings, but last night I had her completely out of the tub and she was cruising around the floor while I cleaned. I picked her up for some TLC handling, and things went pretty well up to the point she decided my arm smelt like food (probably another snake) and slowly but surely reached over and latched on followed by a series of intense constrictions. Posted a little video "during bite" on my facebook, not sure if it's blocked as far as accessing the video goes, but you can check it out (or try to) here - www.facebook.com/caconway I think anyway . . .

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## sissysnakes

When we first got our Woma he was nippy, but once we got to know him he calmed down a lot, but still stayed very curios.  He is one of my favorite snakes now, as long as you dont wake him up then he doesnt have a problem.. That is a very pretty girl you got there!

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_reptileexperts_ (08-27-2012)

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