# Other Pets > Dogs >  Personal protection dog?

## Daigga

So my husband and I are expecting our first child here near the end of the month which has gotten me thinking lately about home security and ways of keeping our family safe. To be perfectly honest, I'm just really uncomfortable with the idea of mixing guns and infants at this point and the more I consider it the more I would prefer a well trained dog. I've owned protective dogs before, but never an actual personal protection dog, so I have lots of questions about if this is a valid option for our lifestyle or not.

First thing is that we live in an apartment at the moment. I'd like to make a move into a house, but the earliest that could happen would be July of this year and there's no guarantee that it will happen then at all, so it may be apartment living for a good deal into the future. Second is that we have a dog right now already and he is definitely a permanent fixture in our lives. Odin is a sheltie border collie mix who likes to bark and is crazy smart, but he's no guard dog and I really doubt anything can change that. He gets along great with other dogs, kids, cats, and everything else, but should I expect problems with adding a personal protection dog into the house? I had honestly considered another dog anyway just so Odin could have a playmate whike my husband and I were occupied with our newborn (he's the spoiled rotten center of attention at this point). With my current dog, a newborn on the way, and apartment living, is a personal protection dog a good choice for me?

If so, what would I be looking for? I'm not picky about breed and wouldn't mind a mix. Should I just keep an eye on what the local shelters have up for adoption, or should I be looking into breeders? What about age? Do I absolutely want a puppy to raise up with a close attachment to my newborn and my family, or would I be just fine getting something around a year or two old, because I would love to skip the potty training/teething stage! Are there certain personality aspects I should be keeping an eye out for, and what would those look like on an untrained dog? Lastly, what can I expect a good trainer to charge? If I pursue this price wouldn't be a deciding factor, but I would still like to know about what to expect.

Any advice is appreciated!

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_Albert Clark_ (12-26-2016)

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## Mephibosheth1

Greetings!

While I'm far from a Dog Training Expert, The main things I would encourage you to consider are breed characteristics and time you can spend with the dog.  

From my experience in the veterinary field, many breeds that are synonymous with protection are large and require proper attention to ensure that they bond properly with their owner and that they are safe around other dogs/people.  Rottweilers, Dobermans, and Alsatians make amazing guard dogs, and (in spite of what some people say to the contrary) can be raised to interact well with children and other dogs.  The main key is the time spent with them as a puppy (until they're around 6 months of age).  Almost all of the bad behavior that people complain about with their dogs (barking, whining, inability to interact with other dogs/new people) can be traced to improper socialization at a young age.

In addition, dogs do not automatically respect you just because you purchase them; you must demonstrate to the dog that you are the boss.  The amount of time you are able to spend with your dog and the attitude you show towards it will determine if they feel you are in charge or not.  I have personally seen a lot of success with Cesar Milan's style of dog training; the clients who implemented his non-aggressive but firm style of training always had dogs that would listen to them and were comfortable with other people that their owners were comfortable with.

Breed characteristics will also influence the choice; being in an apartment will make it more difficult to select a dog that can adequately protect your family.  Great Danes are good apartment dogs (believe it or not) and are good with families.  I would be cautious about cattle/herding dogs (they can be nippy with kids) and Golden Retrievers (number one culprit for dog bites in children).  I'd talk with your veterinarian to see if they know some good dog trainers in the area, and then talk with them about your concerns and situations.  

TL;DR–most dogs can be good guard dogs; picking a good trainer and taking time to help the dog bond with your family are the keys to success.

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Megg (01-03-2016),_Ogre_ (12-26-2016)

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## Jabberwocky Dragons

This is a topic close to home so let me give you a good three prong approach.

Let's be clear up front about one thing. Unless you are armed, you are at an extreme disadvantage. A protection dog is a great addition to, but never a replacement for, a firearm and training. To be blunt, if the intruder is armed and you are not, you're looking at a dead dog and dead family. A young mother in the Tennessee, with a newborn baby and wife of a local preacher, was recently shot dead during a home invasion at 8:30am on Tuesday morning in a good, "safe" neighborhood. A protection dog gives you the warning and time needed to reach for your own protection. They can scare other intruders off but never make the fatal mistake of relying on anyone but yourself for protecting your family. Owning a firearm will not put your infant in any danger. It will on the other hand allow you to protect yourself and your child. 

It is a great idea to get a protection dog as a puppy and have it grow up with your child. Each of our children have received their own German Shepherd puppy within a week of being born. These dogs worship our children and are always looking out for them. We have also trained the dogs to locate and seek each child by name which can be very useful (think of it as hide and seek for training purposes). If someone is afraid of their dog being around their own infant then (a) the dog needs to be put down or b) the owner shouldn't own a dog or c) both a and b.)

We have 30 acres of pasture and woodlands so need very active dogs. For apartment living, I think a mastiff would be an excellent choice. They are large but do not require nearly the amount of space as some smaller more energetic dogs. Whichever protection dog you get, it needs to get from a breeder not the shelter, but it does not need to be AKC registered.  If the breeder has kids, see how the parents do with the children. Get a puppy so you have full control over the temperament and training. The Monks of New Skeet have an excellent book on dog training.

The third prong is an alarm system, even though you are in an apartment. There is no need to spend thousands of dollars are on monitored alarm system. Personally, I think it's a little ridiculous people do this when you can do a better job yourself. For $200 or so, you buy your own DIY alarm system from a place like Fortress Security Store. It will send alarms directly to your cell phones so you can respond. You can also put up good quality IP cameras that you can view on your phones anywhere, anytime for $60. Since you rent, everything can be taken down easily and taken with you when you move.

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_Albert Clark_ (12-26-2016),_distaff_ (01-02-2016),Fazer72110 (12-26-2016),_Felidae_ (01-02-2016),KMG (01-02-2016),Megg (01-03-2016),_Mephibosheth1_ (01-02-2016),_Ogre_ (12-26-2016),_Reinz_ (01-02-2016),Stewart_Reptiles (01-02-2016),wolfy-hound (11-05-2016)

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## Reinz

Excellent JD!  

Right between the eyes real world advice!

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_Jabberwocky Dragons_ (01-02-2016)

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## KMG

> This is a topic close to home so let me give you a good three prong approach.
> 
> Let's be clear up front about one thing. Unless you are armed, you are at an extreme disadvantage. A protection dog is a great addition to, but never a replacement for, a firearm and training. To be blunt, if the intruder is armed and you are not, you're looking at a dead dog and dead family. A young mother in the Tennessee, with a newborn baby and wife of a local preacher, was recently shot dead during a home invasion at 8:30am on Tuesday morning in a good, "safe" neighborhood. A protection dog gives you the warning and time needed to reach for your own protection. They can scare other intruders off but never make the fatal mistake of relying on anyone but yourself for protecting your family. Owning a firearm will not put your infant in any danger. It will on the other hand allow you to protect yourself and your child. 
> 
> It is a great idea to get a protection dog as a puppy and have it grow up with your child. Each of our children have received their own German Shepherd puppy within a week of being born. These dogs worship our children and are always looking out for them. We have also trained the dogs to locate and seek each child by name which can be very useful (think of it as hide and seek for training purposes). If someone is afraid of their dog being around their own infant then (a) the dog needs to be put down or b) the owner shouldn't own a dog or c) both a and b.)
> 
> We have 30 acres of pasture and woodlands so need very active dogs. For apartment living, I think a mastiff would be an excellent choice. They are large but do not require nearly the amount of space as some smaller more energetic dogs. Whichever protection dog you get, it needs to get from a breeder not the shelter, but it does not need to be AKC registered.  If the breeder has kids, see how the parents do with the children. Get a puppy so you have full control over the temperament and training. The Monks of New Skeet have an excellent book on dog training.
> 
> The third prong is an alarm system, even though you are in an apartment. There is no need to spend thousands of dollars are on monitored alarm system. Personally, I think it's a little ridiculous people do this when you can do a better job yourself. For $200 or so, you buy your own DIY alarm system from a place like Fortress Security Store. It will send alarms directly to your cell phones so you can respond. You can also put up good quality IP cameras that you can view on your phones anywhere, anytime for $60. Since you rent, everything can be taken down easily and taken with you when you move.


There are many good points here. Nicely said.

A true defense animal is not cheap as they take many hours of training and are breed for the job making them a heavy investment. To me it sounds like you have just the dog you need. Basically your current dog is an alarm system that can alert you to an intruder and allow you needed time to arm yourself and respond properly. 

Im second gen LEO with many LEOs in my family. All have or had kids during their career and all owned guns safely. A gun can be secured and made safe from kids while still being accessible to you, especially now days with the personal safes that are available. I survived childhood without any fancy safe and was taught early that the guns in the house were not toys and were to be left alone. It would honestly be far cheaper for you to buy a quality handgun, safe, and bullets over a trained guard dog.

While I do agree with part of the above in regards to alarms I personally have one and endorse them. You can get them cheap to fit your personal needs. I like that my home is monitored while Im away as I may not always be able to check my phone when it is triggered and then wait on hold to report the alarm to the police dispatch. I also like knowing that my wife has another level of alert, defense, and protection from an intruder. Many times a barking dog or blaring siren is enough. I also like that in a true home invasion if I or my wife was told to deactivate the alarm we have a secondary code that turns the alarm off while still sending the alert for police to respond.

Plus there are plenty of options that allow for easy installation of wireless alarms that can be packed up and taken with you on a move which is great for apartment living. 

I vote that you keep your dog, get an alarm, buy a handgun, and take training classes with it.

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_distaff_ (01-02-2016),Fazer72110 (12-26-2016),_Jabberwocky Dragons_ (01-02-2016),_Ogre_ (12-26-2016)

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## Jabberwocky Dragons

KMG, you are correct about the alarm system. In hindsight, I tried to edit my post to make it less harsh but time has expired. My wife and I are always able to monitor our cell phones so I mistakenly extrapolated that to others. Certainly a third person monitoring service would be beneficial to those who do not always have access to their cell phones.

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KMG (01-02-2016)

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## Daigga

> This is a topic close to home so let me give you a good three prong approach.
> 
> Let's be clear up front about one thing. Unless you are armed, you are at an extreme disadvantage. A protection dog is a great addition to, but never a replacement for, a firearm and training. To be blunt, if the intruder is armed and you are not, you're looking at a dead dog and dead family. A young mother in the Tennessee, with a newborn baby and wife of a local preacher, was recently shot dead during a home invasion at 8:30am on Tuesday morning in a good, "safe" neighborhood. A protection dog gives you the warning and time needed to reach for your own protection. They can scare other intruders off but never make the fatal mistake of relying on anyone but yourself for protecting your family. Owning a firearm will not put your infant in any danger. It will on the other hand allow you to protect yourself and your child. 
> 
> It is a great idea to get a protection dog as a puppy and have it grow up with your child. Each of our children have received their own German Shepherd puppy within a week of being born. These dogs worship our children and are always looking out for them. We have also trained the dogs to locate and seek each child by name which can be very useful (think of it as hide and seek for training purposes). If someone is afraid of their dog being around their own infant then (a) the dog needs to be put down or b) the owner shouldn't own a dog or c) both a and b.)
> 
> We have 30 acres of pasture and woodlands so need very active dogs. For apartment living, I think a mastiff would be an excellent choice. They are large but do not require nearly the amount of space as some smaller more energetic dogs. Whichever protection dog you get, it needs to get from a breeder not the shelter, but it does not need to be AKC registered.  If the breeder has kids, see how the parents do with the children. Get a puppy so you have full control over the temperament and training. The Monks of New Skeet have an excellent book on dog training.
> 
> The third prong is an alarm system, even though you are in an apartment. There is no need to spend thousands of dollars are on monitored alarm system. Personally, I think it's a little ridiculous people do this when you can do a better job yourself. For $200 or so, you buy your own DIY alarm system from a place like Fortress Security Store. It will send alarms directly to your cell phones so you can respond. You can also put up good quality IP cameras that you can view on your phones anywhere, anytime for $60. Since you rent, everything can be taken down easily and taken with you when you move.


I'm not adverse to owning a gun exactly, only I've always thought that in case of home invasion a gun is only useful if it's close and ready, which I just don't feel mixes well with infants or small children. If having a dog meant I could have a gun tucked away somewhere not accessible to my child I would probably be more comfortable doing so, if you understand my meaning? I wouldn't even mind having a firearm a little more on hand once my son is old enough to understand what that means. I think I just need some adjustment time. 

I'm certainly not afraid of Odin being around the baby, more worried about him being destructive around home if he doesn't adjust well to not being the center of attention. We've gotten good at not leaving anything lying around to tempt him, but he's been known to chew the wall or poop on the carpet out of spite if nothing else is available. One of the reasons I would absolutely go with a professional for training purposes over doing the training myself. He's beautifully behaved at the dog park or as long as someone is home, but he's a proper butthead when he thinks he can get away with it. Which reminds me, do personal protection dogs do well at dog parks? 

A security system is something I probably should have looked into before now and I'll certainly explore those options.

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## Jabberwocky Dragons

> I'm not adverse to owning a gun exactly, only I've always thought that in case of home invasion a gun is only useful if it's close and ready, which I just don't feel mixes well with infants or small children. If having a dog meant I could have a gun tucked away somewhere not accessible to my child I would probably be more comfortable doing so, if you understand my meaning? I wouldn't even mind having a firearm a little more on hand once my son is old enough to understand what that means. I think I just need some adjustment time. 
> 
> I'm certainly not afraid of Odin being around the baby, more worried about him being destructive around home if he doesn't adjust well to not being the center of attention. We've gotten good at not leaving anything lying around to tempt him, but he's been known to chew the wall or poop on the carpet out of spite if nothing else is available. One of the reasons I would absolutely go with a professional for training purposes over doing the training myself. He's beautifully behaved at the dog park or as long as someone is home, but he's a proper butthead when he thinks he can get away with it. Which reminds me, do personal protection dogs do well at dog parks? 
> 
> A security system is something I probably should have looked into before now and I'll certainly explore those options.



I understand and just being open to the idea is commendable. Not to drag this out so I'll just say you can certainly have a firearm on hand and it be 100% inaccessible to your child. Assuming you do not want to carry, drawer safes provide very quick access to yourself while preventing child access. Understand these will not prevent a determined thief (you need a heavy duty gun safe for that) but they will give rapid access to yourself. Here is a great one. Keep one in the bedroom and one in the living room and that will give you good accessibility. 
http://www.amazon.com/STACK-ON-PDS-1...b_title_sports

Your dog sounds great and please don't think my abc comment about dogs and babies was directed at you. We heard prophecies of doom about our doberman and first child. I've also seen others' dogs harmed and even killed as a result of fear from new baby/dog mixing.

The new security systems are really great and can go beyond just security. You can also link a smoke detector to it which is priceless reassurance for any dog owner who isn't home.

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## distaff

Flippant answer:  An infant is not capable of playing with a gun, so no immediate worries there.

I know people who carry a gun in a holster all the time - yes, even at home.  You can't schedule a home invasion.  If your gun in in a proper holster, on you, then you won't have to worry about your toddler playing with it when you are in a different room.  

Sounds extreme to wear a gun all the time, but some places are getting THAT bad.  I wear a sheathed fixed blade all the time (and we have three dogs, plus locked gates on a fence.)  Yes, our neighbourhood is getting THAT bad.

Get some training, and find the good sites on the net.
If you don't do stupid careless things with your gun, you and yours won't be harmed by it. 
If that pastor's wife had had a gun handy, she would still be alive today.

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Fazer72110 (12-26-2016),PitOnTheProwl (01-02-2016)

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## lorrainesmom

with many of the home alarm systems, you should also be able to get a panic button. Even if your system isn't a monitored one, the loudness of the alarm should alert your neighbors. As far as the dog goes, any dog that alerts you to anything unusual is a good deterrent. As far as guns, well, let me put it this way: I have a gun, I know how to use it, and am a decent shot. I hate the damn thing. I am much more likely to use one of the many sharp swords in my house than I ever am to use a gun. Being a competitive fencer, I know how to use it as well. Would it save my life if someone were determined to harm me, and had already gotten past my fenced in yard, alarm system, and my dog? doubtful. What the  fences, alarms, dogs and guns do,is to add an extra level of protection that may buy you time while dialing 911 and waiting until they get there.

The best defense anyone can buy is to get to know your neighbors, (the sane ones anyway), make sure you are always aware of your surroundings, and lock the doors when you are alone.

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## KMG

From my knowledge and experience a guard dog should not be socialized outside of your family so I believe the dog park would not be a good idea.*



*However I'm not an expert.

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## enginee837

Dogs are more dangerous than guns.  I own both.  Even well trained dogs can have bad days and a dog big enough to protect you is easily big enough to kill an infant.  Guns on the other hand are easy to keep locked up and secure and are 100% predictable.   On top of all that, most breeds suitable for protection  are strong bodied and strong willed requiring an experienced and firm hand.    
If you are not willing or able to handle either, get a security system and keep pepper spray close bye.  It will incapacitate anyone you hit with and is arguably safer than a gun or dog.
Just my 2 cents.

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Fazer72110 (12-26-2016),_GoingPostal_ (01-02-2016),_Mephibosheth1_ (01-03-2016)

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## KMG

I have used and seen OC spray used a ton over the years. 

I hate it! 

When you use it everybody feels it except on the determined turds that it seems to have no effect on at all. I have seen guys open their mouth when sprayed and ask for more. Many LEO'S don't even carry it any more. 

I also dislike the taser but I would recommend that before OC but a handgun is still at the top of the list. A good shotgun being second.

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## footballpythons

I would personally recommend a gun with training of course! And a dog will not do much most of the time! Also yes an alarm!But sure get another loud barking kind dog to make intruders feel like there is a pack of dogs not just one! And a hunting dog i recommend like a catahoula, lab, or a mix! :Smile:  Good luck!

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## Caspian

Everyone else has said it pretty well already. Just a few small notes - Rotties can be amazing with kids, but if you do decide to get one, make sure you look for German bloodlines, rather than American bloodlines. That doesn't mean a dog bred in Germany, just one that can trace its bloodline back to German stock within the last fifty years or so. 

Get a firearm, get the education to use it properly, and when your child is old enough, teach them that it's off limits and how to handle it. My parents taught me how to shoot by the time I was five years old - I learned on a .50 caliber muzzle loader, and the firearms in my household were never locked up back then. By the time I could walk, I knew not to touch. I don't advocate leaving guns on a rack on the wall like that, but with a good safety container, you should be able to lay your hands on a pistol from anywhere in a house within a minute or so. Honestly, if you're getting a dog more for an alarm system than a weapon - I train my dogs to bark, but never to attack someone. They'll mug a person for attention. I'd rather have a robbed house and live dogs than a robbed house and dead dogs. Anyway, if you're looking for an alarm system, get something small and yappy. They're loud, persistent, distracting, hard to catch and hard to hit, usually. The downside is that most small dogs learn to hate kids, because children tend to hurt them. Make sure the child knows what is, and is not, allowable treatment and handling of the dog, and understand that any dog will bite to defend itself if it's being hurt. Some pitbulls will take an amazing amount of abuse without fighting back, and make incredible nannies for small children, but every animal has a limit.

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_Mephibosheth1_ (01-03-2016)

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## Gruba

> Everyone else has said it pretty well already. Just a few small notes - Rotties can be amazing with kids, but if you do decide to get one, make sure you look for German bloodlines, rather than American bloodlines. That doesn't mean a dog bred in Germany, just one that can trace its bloodline back to German stock within the last fifty years or so. 
> 
> Get a firearm, get the education to use it properly, and when your child is old enough, teach them that it's off limits and how to handle it. My parents taught me how to shoot by the time I was five years old - I learned on a .50 caliber muzzle loader, and the firearms in my household were never locked up back then. By the time I could walk, I knew not to touch. I don't advocate leaving guns on a rack on the wall like that, but with a good safety container, you should be able to lay your hands on a pistol from anywhere in a house within a minute or so. Honestly, if you're getting a dog more for an alarm system than a weapon - I train my dogs to bark, but never to attack someone. They'll mug a person for attention. I'd rather have a robbed house and live dogs than a robbed house and dead dogs. Anyway, if you're looking for an alarm system, get something small and yappy. They're loud, persistent, distracting, hard to catch and hard to hit, usually. The downside is that most small dogs learn to hate kids, because children tend to hurt them. Make sure the child knows what is, and is not, allowable treatment and handling of the dog, and understand that any dog will bite to defend itself if it's being hurt. Some pitbulls will take an amazing amount of abuse without fighting back, and make incredible nannies for small children, but every animal has a limit.



I have 3 dobermans. European bloodlines so, they're stickier than the American bloodlines. I also have 2 kids, 1.5 and 3.5, the dobes are amazing with the kids. Super gentle and love laying with my boys. On the flip side, there's 3 of them ranging from 80lbs to 110lbs. Our biggest is a retired breeding female. She has a maternal protection thing going on and even though she LOVE everyone, there's not a doubt in my mind that she'd do whatever needed to protect her family. My other female is the smallest at 80lbs and she can outsmart most people. She got attacked by a rottweiler when she was just over 1 yr old, she ran and hid, which is where my male comes in. He weighs in around 90lbs and wasted no time defending our female. Despite only being 1, he took on the full grown rotti to protect our female and my husband. He's dumb but, he loves his family and would do anything to keep us safe. I love the breed so I'm biased but, its one of my recommendations for a good family dog that will also protect if necessary. 

For the op, my suggestion would be to get a family dog. While a protection dog is highly trained, they may not be ideal for a family situation. 2 of my dobes grew up with my oldest son and I've seen my boy growl at a strange dog for getting too close to my kids without my permission. Just something to think about!

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## Timelugia

> From my knowledge and experience a guard dog should not be socialized outside of your family so I believe the dog park would not be a good idea.*
> 
> 
> 
> *However I'm not an expert.


Having worked at a dog train facility I'm going to interject here. If you don't socialize your dog outside of the family it will likely become aggressive to strangers. This may sound like a good thing until you consider that you need to be able to walk this dog, take this dog to vets and groomers, and you need to be able to let appliance workers and friends into your house. If you do not properly socialize the dog you will not be able to control the dog around strangers. This would be putting your family at risk for being sued when the dog mauls your neighbor's kid. It is also unfair to the dog, since it will likely end up being put down. For a guard dog you want a dog that is well-trained, so the more socialization and experience it has the better.

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## KMG

> Having worked at a dog train facility I'm going to interject here. If you don't socialize your dog outside of the family it will likely become aggressive to strangers. This may sound like a good thing until you consider that you need to be able to walk this dog, take this dog to vets and groomers, and you need to be able to let appliance workers and friends into your house. If you do not properly socialize the dog you will not be able to control the dog around strangers. This would be putting your family at risk for being sued when the dog mauls your neighbor's kid. It is also unfair to the dog, since it will likely end up being put down. For a guard dog you want a dog that is well-trained, so the more socialization and experience it has the better.


Perhaps "overly socialized" would have been better word usage. 

Socialization and training are two different things. My dogs do not like strangers and that is how I like it. Yet, I can take them on walks (off leash) and have complete control, because of training. I can take them anywhere without issue and they have never been to a dog park. That is because of training. I can also take them to the vet and they never give them any issues, which is again training. They are also always the best behaved dogs there. There is socialization that goes into this but it is learned by training them from early on.

My friends come in without issue and my dogs are friendly because I am. I do tell everybody that comes over to ignore my dogs until they come to them. This allows them time to read the person and me and decide how to act. My breeds are known for being stand offish so this puts them at ease.

I have never had an issue with a service person entering my home either. I can leave them out but usually choose to put them outside or in their crate, which is done by a simple command, training again. I don't do this for the person's safety. I do it because I don't want them to be friends with a person I don't trust, I don't want them socialized with them. Not overly socializing a dog will not make them aggressive, balanced socialization is what is needed. Having a dog that will lick a burglar is no good. 

As a LEO I have been around a ton of bite dogs. They are not overly socialized and yet their handler is able to control them and take them to the vet as well... Again, because of training. You won't find them at a dog park.

As for the neighbor kid getting mauled. Why did this happen? The dog was irresponsibly left or let out? The kid jumped the fence? What? I can tell you right now my dogs would never do such a thing. They are not overly socialized but the are socialized. But more importantly they are trained with a good balance of socialization. They are not killers, not aggressive, not let out to run loose. They are protective, loyal, trained, and responsibly owned. They are not wild street dogs.

Everywhere is different but down here it takes more than a single bite incident to destroy a dog. It may be taken but can usually always be returned. Overall, imho it is a larger liability taking an attack trained dog to a dog park. My dogs are not attack trained and I know I could take them to a dog park, Petco, or wherever without issue. I don't because they have a purpose to me and that is to be a reliable alarm system and family protector. I have no use for a dog that will allow their property intruded on and then show them where the silver is.

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## KMG

I have been to a dog park before. It was with my 120lb OEB I had previously. That ended with her being attacked by a small dog. She didn't bite it or even snap at it. She simply ran it over and knocked it silly. It went running back to mom who called me and my dog a monster and left crying. I haven't been back. I don't need some frivolous lawsuit because my dog did something, even if it was provoked. 

In general people don't know how to train their dog and think them "being a dog" is acceptable. Small, medium, or large all dogs should have a basic level of training. When you call your dog it should come. It amazes me how many don't and won't.

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## Calider

We had a few PPD over the years that we bought from a K9 training center in Minneapolis, and two imported from Canada, the most memorable being a czech shepherd named Nitro, and while I loved him dearly, he was not at all like having a normal dog. There were times when he would "protect" us when we didn't ask him to and family and friends were afraid of him. He would not bite, but barked and lunged very threateningly. He stopped INSTANTLY when we told him to, but he would scare people without being asked. This is the norm for PPD, there are very, very few who will not automatically try to protect their owners, regardless of how they are trained. Some of them won't play with you, some of them are easily startled when woken up, some of them bond so strongly to 1 person that they are intimidating to everyone else, and some of them will go after anyone who isn't their handler. Some sites have several "classes" of dogs advertized, from just a well-trained family pet to a multi-purpose police dog. I'd strongly recommend going with a lower class, as most of these dogs aren't trained to actually attack someone, but just to frighten someone by barking and baring teeth. That reduces your liability considerably if someone gets bitten, who was not intended to get bitten. The "sentry" type dogs are by far the most dangerous to have, because they are literally just looking for any unusual disturbance in their area, and they are going to bite first and ask questions later. Granny comes over to drop off a basket of strawberries? Granny is hamburger now.

When I was tiny, like a toddler, we had just a very well-trained female black lab that knew every single dog trick known to man. She was the best family dog ever, because she was still a normal dog who would play and be nice, but when you told her "Watch 'em, Bonnie." she would hold someone where they were by standing and growling, herding them kind of like a sheep. If you told her "Get 'em, Bonnie!" she would snarl and nip and chase them out of the yard. Once they were gone, she'd go 100% back to normal, and she never attacked anyone out of the blue because she wasn't a guard dog, she was just a pet. She was raised and trained and treated like a normal dog, she wasn't like a canine soldier. Different training facilities have different training methods, and anything that raises their dogs like a soldier, where the dog is not allowed to be a dog, is probably best to stay away from.

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KMG (12-26-2016)

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## Spiritserpents

I also wouldn't necessarily count out your every day friendly family dog from being a good deterrent. I am likely literally alive today because of plain old, large, family dogs that I grew up with. I had a stalker when I was 17 and he tried to break into the house one day while my mom was out getting groceries. I woke up to hear *both* my dogs going ballistic, which caught me by surprise. My catahoula/lab was a sweetheart, but protective. If I was unsure of someone, he'd hackle and growl until we got away from whomever was making me nervous, but otherwise was loving to every adult he ever encountered and could *not* get enough love from kids. It was the second dog that was the surprise. That was Shelby, our golden retriever/border collie mix. 75lbs of jet black fur with white toes. Everything about her looked like a pure golden except the color. The gentlest and most unassuming dog to ever exist. Mom and I used to joke that she'd help any burglars tote stuff away.  But no, when this guy invaded her territory, she was going to do her damndest to take him out. I could hear her great roaring bark (both dogs were inside), while Aussie was leaping at the sliding glass door trying to bite this guy in the face. 

Stalker couldn't find a way in that wouldn't include meeting a combined 125lbs of angry teeth and that was sufficient to make him leave. 

I think part of why that worked well was we also didn't yell at them ever for barking. If they alarm barked, we'd try to figure out why and they'd hush themselves once we had a look-see.

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Marzipan (01-18-2017)

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## Ratikal

A great pet and even greater deterrent! APBT's aren't for everybody but they are low maintenance, loyal, and historically known as the "Best nanny k-9"! This is my 4yr old red nose Tank. You just parade him around the backyard, let the neighborhood see whos in the house and instant deterrent...

Alarms and cameras are ok for insurance and investigations but by the time 1st responders get there...well...the damage is done and intruders are inside your domain. A gun is only as good as the person behind the trigger. By the time you unhide, unlock, load...you're most likely gonna choose flight rather than protect without proper training...

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## Ratikal

A great pet and even greater deterrent! APBT's aren't for everybody but they are low maintenance, loyal, and historically known as the "Best nanny k-9"! This is my 4yr old red nose Tank. You just parade him around the backyard, let the neighborhood see whos in the house and instant deterrent...

Alarms and cameras are ok for insurance and investigations but by the time 1st responders get there...well...the damage is done and intruders are inside your domain. A gun is only as good as the person behind the trigger. By the time you unhide, unlock, load...you're most likely gonna choose flight rather than protect without proper training...

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Fazer72110 (12-27-2016)

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## predatorkeeper87

> A great pet and even greater deterrent! APBT's aren't for everybody but they are low maintenance, loyal, and historically known as the "Best nanny k-9"! This is my 4yr old red nose Tank. You just parade him around the backyard, let the neighborhood see whos in the house and instant deterrent...
> 
> Alarms and cameras are ok for insurance and investigations but by the time 1st responders get there...well...the damage is done and intruders are inside your domain. A gun is only as good as the person behind the trigger. By the time you unhide, unlock, load...you're most likely gonna choose flight rather than protect without proper training...


I'm glad someone finally named a pit as a great guard dog and a nanny.  Best dang animal I've ever owned was a pit.  Loved everyone but instantly knew if I had an issue with someone, I'm talking eyes locked on that person until they were gone or something sparked off.  I think out of all all of the dogs I've been around pits are the most attuned to their owners feelings towards anything going on.  They are not for a family who won't take the time to prove they are the alpha over the animal but you train them right and no one is walking into your house.  That combined with either a good quality hand gun or home defense variant shotgun and you couldn't be safer.

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Calider (12-27-2016),Marzipan (01-18-2017),Ratikal (12-27-2016)

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## Calider

Bully breeds are excellent family dogs because, contrary to popular (uneducated) belief, they are among the gentlest dogs on the planet, but their appearance is extremely intimidating, and they have a loud, deep bark. A bully type dog that spends enough time with its owner can become to attuned to its owners body language that it can almost read their minds. There have been several well-documented incidents of unusually friendly, sociable, easy-going dogs suddenly turning incredibly violent when "their person" was being threatened, and then calming down just as quickly once the threat had been neutralized. I don't think I know of anyone with an Am.Staff or a boxer who would worry about leaving them alone with kids either... Some of them are better parents than the actual parents...

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Marzipan (01-18-2017),Ratikal (12-27-2016)

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## predatorkeeper87

100% agree.

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## Ratikal

I agree also...
Although I'm the Alpha, when my daughters are home, he's attached to them! My male is very passive until he senses tension then he becomes ultimately attuned to the surroundings. 
He was a 3 month old rescue and I don't know if I'll own a different breed again. After having Rottweilers, Dobermans, and Shepherds, my APBT,  is hands down, the best companion I've ever had the pleasure of owning. 
I did have a Jack Russel Terrier that was a bit smarter but the meanest damn dog on the planet...lol

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## Calider

Jack russels were given to us by the devil because he couldn't handle how evil they are.... LOL

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Ratikal (12-27-2016)

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## Zincubus

> Jack russels were given to us by the devil because he couldn't handle how evil they are.... LOL


Well .....there are five near us and three are beautiful little things but  the other two are pure evil ..... 


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## EmilyandArlo

> Bully breeds are excellent family dogs because, contrary to popular (uneducated) belief, they are among the gentlest dogs on the planet, but their appearance is extremely intimidating, and they have a loud, deep bark. A bully type dog that spends enough time with its owner can become to attuned to its owners body language that it can almost read their minds. There have been several well-documented incidents of unusually friendly, sociable, easy-going dogs suddenly turning incredibly violent when "their person" was being threatened, and then calming down just as quickly once the threat had been neutralized. I don't think I know of anyone with an Am.Staff or a boxer who would worry about leaving them alone with kids either... Some of them are better parents than the actual parents...


I agree with this 100%. They make wonderful family dogs. They can be a bit stubborn so the proper training is important. Either way, my APBT is incredibly intuitive when it comes to how I am feeling and if I am uncomfortable around certain people. Even though he is a huge love bug, he is very intimidating to anyone who doesn't know him. He has a very deep, loud bark. 
I hate the misconceptions out there about bully breeds, but I do think their reputations really do deter people from causing trouble when they know there is a pitbull in the house/yard/etc. I know that if I am out in the evening by myself walking my dog, no one is going to mess with me 
Plus you get greeted by that pit bull smile....




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Marzipan (01-18-2017),Ratikal (12-28-2016)

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## Ratikal

Great looking pup...can tell he's a happy boy!

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## predatorkeeper87

> I agree with this 100%. They make wonderful family dogs. They can be a bit stubborn so the proper training is important. Either way, my APBT is incredibly intuitive when it comes to how I am feeling and if I am uncomfortable around certain people. Even though he is a huge love bug, he is very intimidating to anyone who doesn't know him. He has a very deep, loud bark. 
> I hate the misconceptions out there about bully breeds, but I do think their reputations really do deter people from causing trouble when they know there is a pitbull in the house/yard/etc. I know that if I am out in the evening by myself walking my dog, no one is going to mess with me 
> Plus you get greeted by that pit bull smile....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


the rep they have is a blessing and a curse.  People intending to do harm think twice, but unfortunately so does everyone else around until they get to know the animal.

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