multiple snakes in same tank

[missi182]

I have noticed that many of the new members to this site, including myself, go through a "phase" where they feel they are at a point that they would love to give advice and help people, but aren't clear on the general rules of giving advice. I have made this mistake myself and felt "attacked" when really other members were voicing their opinions enthusiastically because something that has been said is indeed very, very wrong.

KJlegend: When you are giving advice to new members, you must assume they know very little, not because they are stupid, but because giving advanced advice to someone who doesn't know the basics is dangerous. They can easily misinterpret what you have said and put their animal in a dangerous situation.

Giving advice on what you 'think' can happen is not always needed. If you are giving an opinion that is not from personal experience, a newbie to bp's or reptiles may not take that into account.

Also, keep an eye on who you are contradicting, not because this is a popularity contest, but because admins and moderators have those titles because they are well learned and respected here, and NEVER give dangerous advice. Many of our bp.net veterans fall into this category as well.

I am still new here myself and I am learning everyday, just like you will. Please don't feel we are mad at you, we in no way are. We just would like to clarify how you should be careful about giving advice.

[rabernet]

Also, keep an eye on who you are contradicting, not because this is a popularity contest, but because admins and moderators have those titles because they are well learned and respected here, and NEVER give dangerous advice. Many of our bp.net veterans fall into this category as well.

Missi, thank you for your post, but I DO want to point out something. Any member is welcome to respectfully disagree with any member of staff just as they are with any other member of this community.

To say that we NEVER give dangerous advice would depend on your point of view. I happen to feed live, as do many of our staff members. I know it to be safe if done correctly, but someone else may not believe this, and may believe this to be dangerous advice. Does that make sense?

Also, just because we are staff doesn't mean that we aren't also human and aren't also learning along with the rest of you.

Yes, staff and bp.net veterans may have more hands on experience than a brand new member (although we also have brand new members with loads of experience as well), but I don't think any one of us would say that we are experts, as hopefully we're all open to learning new things.

However - there are general guidelines that are considered "basic" care for new users, and those we tend to stick pretty hard and fast to (and when someone is asking basic husbandry questions, then we're not going to recommend that they run out and get a huge 55 gallon tank for their baby when they haven't even mastered getting a smaller enclosure to be stable yet), but as a keeper gains more hands on experience, they are encouraged to open their minds and try new things as long as they don't put their animals at risk.

I know I'm rambling, but I hope that makes sense.

[wilomn]

Several of the posters on this thread have spoken about dominance of one snake over another if more than one is kept in a single enclosure. They have spoken of one taking the best heat spot and the best hide spot. They have spoken of many of what they say is detrimental but I have one question for all of you who have made such statements.

How do you know?

Have YOU ever kept more than one snake in a cage? Have YOU ever seen one snake "dominate" another when kept in the same cage? Have YOU ever seen one snake not go to the warm spot because another snake was already there?

I believe it was littleindiangirl who said ball pythons were NOT social. Aren't they found in large numbers inside termite mounds and anthills? How could a non-social animal live in such a way?

Where are all the facts you guys are giving out coming from?

And yes, calcisand is BAD.

However, I don't see how sand can be too abrasive for a snakes scales when it is also part of their native habitat. As far as clogging heat pits, have you ever seen it happen? Impaction? Do you have any idea the amount of sand it would take to impact any snake larger than a hatchling?

Again, I am simply looking for sources for the facts that so many seem to be in possession of.

[Hotshot]

No, ppl are NOT out to get you here BUT there are *clicks*, and you just gotta know who not to talk to trust me . Real easy just keep you're mouth shut and you're fine just read them attacking some one els like putting a snake in QT is a great idea but did you hear the way she said it? IT MUST BE DONE !! why not just say Putting a snake in QT should be done for less blah blah blah but ok whatever
P.S dont bother neg repping me I really dont care.

[KJLegend]

Well thank you all for the information. I will just sit back and collect all the information before I start to ramble on with my opinion and advice. SOME of the points made have helped me decide I might be best off listening to that instead of going with what is convienient for me, and stick with whats best for my animals. I will delete the advice I gave so that new comers do not skim over what I have said and use my advice when it is incorrect. Again if I offended anyone sorry, and as for the admins I am not trying to downplay your advice/experience because like I said I'm no expert, just trying to help and educate myself.

[starmom]

Missi, thank you for your post, but I DO want to point out something. Any member is welcome to respectfully disagree with any member of staff just as they are with any other member of this community.

To say that we NEVER give dangerous advice would depend on your point of view. I happen to feed live, as do many of our staff members. I know it to be safe if done correctly, but someone else may not believe this, and may believe this to be dangerous advice. Does that make sense?

Ummm, can I respectfully disagree here?!

However - there are general guidelines that are considered "basic" care for new users, and those we tend to stick pretty hard and fast to (and when someone is asking basic husbandry questions, then we're not going to recommend that they run out and get a huge 55 gallon tank for their baby when they haven't even mastered getting a smaller enclosure to be stable yet), but as a keeper gains more hands on experience, they are encouraged to open their minds and try new things as long as they don't put their animals at risk...

Hey Robin~ How bout an intermediate section of the forum for an exchange of methods and ideas for the intermediate snake keeper? Just my thought du jour!

[littleindiangirl]

No, ppl are NOT out to get you here BUT there are *clicks*, and you just gotta know who not to talk to trust me . Real easy just keep you're mouth shut and you're fine just read them attacking some one els like putting a snake in QT is a great idea but did you hear the way she said it? IT MUST BE DONE !! why not just say Putting a snake in QT should be done for less blah blah blah but ok whatever
P.S dont bother neg repping me I really dont care.

Good to know your stance on quarantine. Just an fyi, many keepers do take quarantine very seriously, and it's something that must be done IMHO, regardless of if you have 2 snakes or 30,000.

[missi182]

Missi, thank you for your post, but I DO want to point out something. Any member is welcome to respectfully disagree with any member of staff just as they are with any other member of this community.

To say that we NEVER give dangerous advice would depend on your point of view. I happen to feed live, as do many of our staff members. I know it to be safe if done correctly, but someone else may not believe this, and may believe this to be dangerous advice. Does that make sense?

Also, just because we are staff doesn't mean that we aren't also human and aren't also learning along with the rest of you.

Yes, staff and bp.net veterans may have more hands on experience than a brand new member (although we also have brand new members with loads of experience as well), but I don't think any one of us would say that we are experts, as hopefully we're all open to learning new things.

However - there are general guidelines that are considered "basic" care for new users, and those we tend to stick pretty hard and fast to (and when someone is asking basic husbandry questions, then we're not going to recommend that they run out and get a huge 55 gallon tank for their baby when they haven't even mastered getting a smaller enclosure to be stable yet), but as a keeper gains more hands on experience, they are encouraged to open their minds and try new things as long as they don't put their animals at risk.

I know I'm rambling, but I hope that makes sense.

I appreciate you adding to my comment and pointing out other important information on my post. I guess it is a matter of opinion. I was under the impression that staff give out tested and safe advice, unless stated otherwise. But there is nothing in the site info that says staff will NEVER give out potentially dangerous advice, so I accept that criticism.

For bp.net veterans, I did say some of them fall into this category, but not all. It is true that anyone can have a respectful disagreement with any member, staff or not but I was trying to point out just to be careful about it, not saying that you cannot disagree. I just find if you think and observe before you jump in and speak, discussions go a lot smoother than jumping the gun especially on an admin or moderator without thinking it through. But then again this should apply to anyone a member speaks with.

Once again I do always appreciate when something I have said can be better clarified.
Thanks Robin

[Hotshot]

Good to know your stance on quarantine. Just an fyi, many keepers do take quarantine very seriously, and it's something that must be done IMHO, regardless of if you have 2 snakes or 30,000.

No, I just think she over did it a bit. I QT my snakes I think it should be done but the way she comes off saying it just over the top IMO.

[starmom]

No, ppl are NOT out to get you here BUT there are *clicks*, and you just gotta know who not to talk to trust me . Real easy just keep you're mouth shut and you're fine just read them attacking some one els like putting a snake in QT is a great idea but did you hear the way she said it? IT MUST BE DONE !! why not just say Putting a snake in QT should be done for less blah blah blah but ok whatever
P.S dont bother neg repping me I really dont care.

Hey Hotshot~ you're sounding pretty defensive!
I have a thought about what you said and your example with the quarantine scenario.... I believe that the answer "It must be done" is a very appropriate one!
That said, I understand you scratching your head over why the necessity for QT procedure wasn't fully explained. Here's my thought on that: a person receiving this reply has 3 choices. Firstly, he/she can just follow the advice. Second, the poster can ask why. Third, the poster can choose to be an independent learner and use the search bar to check it out. There have been umpteen-million threads on QT and the why's of it- use the search feature!!
I disagree with your summation that their are 'clicks' going on; so sophmoric... and I believe that the attacking you perceive might be stemming from your own defensive posture.... maybe I'm wrong, but you might want to check that out within yourself.
I don't know what your comment about negative repping is all about; maybe that is just an irrational response again stemming from your defensive space. Anyway, I don't even know how to give a negative rep, nor would I ever do so to anybody! We're here to share and learn and be openly joyful for the amazing opportunity to care for snakes!
It's all good Hotshot.... and you are too!!!