ALL Ball Python breeders, STOP posting photos with no info about what you posted

[John1982]

Please stop this practice, if you are thinking of using this practice, please do not do so. It's not clever it is obnoxious. I mean this even when I have literally no interest in the animal posted, what makes things worse is then the breeder also seems to refuse to answer questions about the animal or even posts inside info that only one or two other people that are privy to the project will understand.

It's VERY poor and confusing advertising. State exactly what you are posting, if it is a teaser you are aiming for, explain the project and that there will be more info forthcoming once the animal or gene is figured out.

After removing jibes and unwarranted demands we're left with

Please stop this practice, if you are thinking of using this practice, please do not do so. It's... confusing...

I think you would have received a more positive response with the second one. Your choice of words has derailed your thread from the start. Almost feels like you were trying to incite a riot against these phantom picture posters only to have the villagers turn their pitchforks on you.

[TheSnakeEye]

Thanks for the reply. I believe they have the right to post as many teaser pictures as they want and be as proud of the animals as they want. What I have been stating the entire time is I know it doesn't cause interest beyond what a few hours or days and makes no sales sense.

Because what are you pushing? I guess if it's just to show off (which is AWESOME if done with some savvy) and your intention is not to spark interest and fresh excitement in the hobby or make sales OK. What head start are you really getting on a co dom combo? What market is there to corner, what if you don't hit on it next season and beyond.

Why not take that opportunity to explain this is the cool animal you produced (be it an uncommon morph or world first) and this is how you did it, here is the story and the pairing and why don't you add the animals to your collection if you already don't have all the genes involved because it is an awesome project with allot of potential

A larger breeder posted an animal as a teaser, I knew exactly what it was (readily available genetics), I complimented the animal profusely asked if the breeder hatched any more or what the clutch consisted of (I had honest sales interest, I was a shopper) and if he thought that other examples of the morph would always look like that or if his opinion was it was an exceptional example (it was a three gene animal)...nothing, no answer. I really wasn't insulted, just vexed. I don't get it.

Basically the teaser picture to me doesn't spark good word of mouth and ultimately confuses more than it excites or informs.

I get what you're saying again. But to me, it seems like you're using your very specific mindset and generalizing it as everyone elses thoughts. While it's ok for you to like more info, it's not the standard we HAVE to go by.

I also agree that the teaser pictures they post up only stay in my mind for a few hours MAAAYYYBBBEEEE a day or two. But here's what it does posting those pictures do for me A) it makes me think this breeder is a serious breeder because he has created this new combo, when in reality he/she may only have two snakes and B) it makes me think of them the next time I either want to see something cool, or want a new snake.

Don't get me wrong I like to know the info on the snakes as well. But I can't get upset if they choose not to give any info out. The only thing that bothers me really is when they ask us to guess the genetics, reply once or twice and then leave everyone hanging. But again, I hold no grudge against them for doing so. Now if I'm pursuing a sale, and get nothing back, then obviously they are crossed off the list.

[Ransack]

I get what you're saying again. But to me, it seems like you're using your very specific mindset and generalizing it as everyone elses thoughts. While it's ok for you to like more info, it's not the standard we HAVE to go by.

I also agree that the teaser pictures they post up only stay in my mind for a few hours MAAAYYYBBBEEEE a day or two. But here's what it does posting those pictures do for me A) it makes me think this breeder is a serious breeder because he has created this new combo, when in reality he/she may only have two snakes and B) it makes me think of them the next time I either want to see something cool, or want a new snake.

Don't get me wrong I like to know the info on the snakes as well. But I can't get upset if they choose not to give any info out. The only thing that bothers me really is when they ask us to guess the genetics, reply once or twice and then leave everyone hanging. But again, I hold no grudge against them for doing so. Now if I'm pursuing a sale, and get nothing back, then obviously they are crossed off the list.

Its not that I’m saying the practice can’t be fun or people can’t like the photos. I am simply stating I don’t see it as a viable marketing solution and I feel that is what it is often used for.

I 100% agree on the 2^nd part of your post. As I stated before something like that actually happened to me and I was baffled why the big breeder…not a home hobbyist, did not reply.

I was asking about the animals that I can acquire to try to reproduce this animal myself someday, this would have undoubtedly driven sales on some of the less expensive maybe harder to sell animals.
I did the same thing you would do, crossed off the list.

So as many are defending tooth and nail it is OK , for the breeder to use this practice but now we have two people in this thread stating under certain circumstances they are getting crossed of the list.


How is that ever a good thing in the current market?

[Ransack]

Beautiful snake. I have $700-800 burning a hole in my pocket. I’m building my collection. Did you produce it yourself? I have no idea. Do you have clutch mates available? I have no idea. Any info to get me excited on taking on this project myself? Silence. If you don’t have clutch mates available do you have the other component genes available? I have no idea. I’m forced to cross you off my list, or reach out to you to spend my money instead of you reaching out to me, sadly I’ll go elsewhere.

Am I totally off base?

[JPR]

Beautiful snake. I have $700-800 burning a hole in my pocket. I’m building my collection. Did you produce it yourself? I have no idea. Do you have clutch mates available? I have no idea. Any info to get me excited on taking on this project myself? Silence. If you don’t have clutch mates available do you have the other component genes available? I have no idea. I’m forced to cross you off my list, or reach out to you to spend my money instead of you reaching out to me, sadly I’ll go elsewhere.

Am I totally off base?

Well, considering I didn't produce her, yes. Totally off base here. But I do understand where you are coming from. But I still think the breeder can do pretty much whatever they want. If they don't sell the snake because of poor marketing skills, how does that affect you? Just sit back and enjoy the pics of pretty snakes.

[wilomn]

I won't bother to read the whole thread, but I'll give you my opinion on your opinion.

Yours is great.

Much like a large intestine, everyone has one. Some, like you, seem to have one that is easily irritated. Some, like the majority of the folks I know from this site and other online sites, do not suffer the same affliction.

It is very... democratic, shall we say, for you to share your pain and expect others to fix your intestinal inadequacies, but alas, for your ass, it ain't gonna happen.

IF what you said was universally true, then what is universally seen would be failure. That's not what I see.

Big boy pants, knotted panties, twisted knickers, whatever ails you, I think it's you that may have the problem.

[Ransack]

I won't bother to read the whole thread, but I'll give you my opinion on your opinion.

Yours is great.

Much like a large intestine, everyone has one. Some, like you, seem to have one that is easily irritated. Some, like the majority of the folks I know from this site and other online sites, do not suffer the same affliction.

It is very... democratic, shall we say, for you to share your pain and expect others to fix your intestinal inadequacies, but alas, for your ass, it ain't gonna happen.

IF what you said was universally true, then what is universally seen would be failure. That's not what I see.

Big boy pants, knotted panties, twisted knickers, whatever ails you, I think it's you that may have the problem.

We are past your reply. I see you as an edgy leader, no nonsense dude. Internet hive mind and all that other stuff. There has been some discussion in the past few pages. Do you have a valid opinion or did you also want to put me in my place an you're now good?

[wilomn]

Nope I'm done. I do like your blinders though.

[MarkS]

Okay fine, I'll venture out onto the shaky unpopular limb and say, I agree with the OP's sentiment if not in the way he said it. I also find it irritating when people post teaser pics and then refuse to divulge what's in it. It brings to mind old memories of that snotty little kid on the playground saying in his sing song voice 'I know something you don't know, na na na na nyah nyah' .

Granted, it's the breeders right to divulge anything he wants to or doesn't want to. It's her project, her snakes. She can tell us as much or as little about it as she wants to. BUT, by the same token, it's MY money and I do NOT spend money with people I'm irritated with no matter how much of a 'good investment' it may seem at the time. So in that way I agree with the OP that teaser pics are not a good marketing gimmick, or at least they aren't with me.

Case in point, the 'Inferno'. Kevin created this combo many years ago. It was a very interesting looking ball python and rather exciting at the time. Kevin posted pictures of it on every forum available and then sat back and steadfastly refused to answer any questions about what was in it. That went on for quite a long time. I'm not sure he ever did divulge what mutations went into making it though I may have missed the announcement. Quite frankly I had lost interest in the project due to all the games being played so that could very easily be the case.

To be fair, there are so many genes being flung around in so many projects that I'm sure quite a few new morphs have genes where even the breeder doesn't know exactly what's in it and more breeding will need to take place to work it all out. But you know what? It's okay to say 'I don't know' instead of pretending that it's some big national secret. Using secrecy to cover up ignorance just makes you look bad when that ignorance comes to light.

[Ransack]

I couldn't agree with you more Mark. Thanks for the very well thought out response. So well thought out I have very little to add.