Narrow minded or am I asking too much?

[PsychD_Student]

Sooo...you think Burms and African Rocks were targeted for a reason other than being snakes? And that, when the "reasons" are sensationalized on TV, BPs will be immune...due to logic and facts? Is the destruction of ecosystems why there are government-sponsored and televised "stray cat round-ups" now, just like with rattlesnakes? Ignorance (or is it arrogance?) in the guise of a search for knowledge is a dangerous thing.

To the OP - I don't have an issue with research or investigation for the sake of learning firsthand, UNLESS it has an obvious detriment to something I care about, and can potentially and in all likelihood add fuel to the fear-mongering that is already a very dangerous political tool for the HSUS and PETA.

"Under a rule that has been the subject of five years of lobbying and debate in Washington, the United States intends to declare the Burmese python an “injurious’’ species, which would make it illegal to import or sell the snakes across state lines. At least one other species that has been found in the Glades, the African rock python, also is expected to be included on the “injurious’’ list that originally included nine large constrictors."

I don't see the possibility of banning ball pythons and milksnakes. Its just not gonna happen people; although I'm glad to see so many individuals supporting USARK-- an organization that is greatly needed to protect our rights. However, I'm pretty sure everyone's leopard geckos are secure.

[mackynz]

Or how to sex rhamphiophis rubropunctatus. Find me that one on the interwebs...........

Oddly enough, Google yields more results for this...

[PsychD_Student]

YES YES YES YES YES YES YES HOLY FREAKING CRAP YES

They were absolutely targeted for other reasons than being snakes. Do you understand what an invasive species is? What they do? Are Asian carp being targeted because they are fish? Are zebra muscles being targeted for being muscles? NO. Invasive species are targeted because they are a threat to local ecosystems. This doesn't apply in places they can't survive, but they ABSOLUTELY were targeted for reasons other than being snakes.

Do I agree with the ban? No I don't, I don't think that a few crappy keepers should be able to ruin it for everyone.

Agreed. However, the animals were also targeted because their large sizes pose a threat to unexperienced handlers and other citizens. BUT the other animals they listed would also be prime candidates for invasion. I always wondered why the retics weren't targeted... that still puzzles me.

[mackynz]

However, I'm pretty sure everyone's leopard geckos are secure.

I don't know man. I heard they have like claws and stuff. And so do bears, so geckos should be illegal.

[PsychD_Student]

I don't know man. I heard they have like claws and stuff. And so do bears, so geckos should be illegal.

bahahaha

[Skiploder]

Oddly enough, Google yields more results for this...

.........but none are right.......the counting of the subcaudals has proven to be bunk and probing is unreliable.

Chris Harper and I have had this conversation on the phone..............there is a definitive answer to this question, but you won't find it on the web.

Exercise #2 in proving the web does not have all the answers:

Where does the word "cribo" come from and what does it mean?

[OmNomNom]

I would just like to say.....

That every scientist I know, were they to propose something similar (although I sincerely doubt anything as basic as 'snakes have bacteria in their mouths' would ever get published, would be very grateful for the feedback and advice from the community at large. And would take into careful consideration your concerns about the regulation and mis-information surrounding pythons and reptiles, and ensure their data was presented in such a way as to not be misconstrued. And would be more than happy to sit down with you and explain any questions you might have about their work, even if it was as basic as describing the pathogenesis of e.coli. Many of us make science-outreach a priority, and actively participate in fairs and festivals and media requests and spend hours upon hours just talking with "the general public", and are genuinely excited to be able to do so.

Anytime I hear something like "those scientists", it makes me sad.

[mackynz]

.........but none are right.......the counting of the subcaudals has proven to be bunk and probing is unreliable.

Chris Harper and I have had this conversation on the phone..............there is a definitive answer to this question, but you won't find it on the web.

Interesting since popping isn't reliable either, the hemipenes don't always invert. So I guess I can answer the question of how to sex them without a need for Google.

Breed them.

[wolfy-hound]

If the reason for burmese pythons to be banned was "they are an invasive species" then explain why lionfish aren't banned? Or cats? Pigs? Because the money behind those are larger than the AR can target right now. Burmese are NOT invasive to any place other than South Florida. So what was that reason for banned import and transport across state lines again? Please... tell me all about how Florida doesn't have laws about burmese, retics and anacondas on the books. Since it's a FLORIDA only problem. I may not be a big headed scientist like ya'll are.. but I know all about this, I live here and I've been involved with all this garbage since before Florida even passed the regulations that required you to get a permit to own the giants, much less banned them, much less the national ban work.

If you don't think that Congress will easily pass the ban to include "all pythons" after HSUS starts saying "Well, ball pythons are still pythons, just like the ones in the Everglades..." you're ignorant of how they work. All it takes is the facts that people who USED to own/breed/sell burmese are now turning to the non-banned smaller species and you'll see the USFW add them in. Geckos will probably get another 5-10 years maybe. All "exotics" are on the chopping blocks. They'll get them eventually. Burmese owners thought "They'll never pass it...." too.

- - - Updated - - -

........

Exercise #2 in proving the web does not have all the answers:

Where does the word "cribo" come from and what does it mean?

Because the snakes are so cool, they're always saying to the ladies "Girl, you should totally come up to my cribo, I'll show you my caudal scaling, baby..."

[Skiploder]

Interesting since popping isn't reliable either, the hemipenes don't always invert. So I guess I can answer the question of how to sex them without a need for Google.

Breed them.

Cool.

Find someone who captive breeds them and hasn't been proven a liar......................good luck with that search as well.

And popping is reliable when they are very young. But it doesn't help with adults.

Point is, those of us who know, know.