FWS Files Final Rule/ Constrictor Ban

[dr del]

Hi,

Not wrong - just redundant and a year or so late.

If you want to use the animal care argument then start working for a ban on cats and dogs - far more of them feature in reports of animal abuse after all.

They also kill far more wildlife and therefore have a greater negative impact on the environment than the snakes in the everglades. They even have a much greater negative impact in the everglades.

Which, for the record, is an artifically created environment that has been repeatedly modified and redefined by humans for more generations than I would like to count.

These same humans have now arbitrarily chosen a point in time and called it "natural" and seek to restore the environment to that state. Despite the fact there is no such thing as a stable or static state in nature.

To be blunt there isn't a single part of the argument for this legislation that isn't absurd with even the most cursory glance.


dr del

[Freakie_frog]

I didn't see that one on the list. Here is the list I saw:

1. Python molurus
2. Broghammeras reticulatus
3. Python sebae
4. Python natalensis
5. Boa constrictor
6. Eunectes notaeus
7. Eunectes deschauenseei
8. Eunectes murinus
9. Eunectes beniensis

Of course, my Latin could be off.

Notice they say "Boa Constrictor".. there are more than 20 different subspecies and locality species of "Boa Constrictor" so that list jumps to almost 30 different types of snakes you can't keep..

[knox]

I believe an age limit and license could be an answer... Along with PROOF of being able to house such a large snake.

Guys and gals, I am NOT siding with the government. Just trying to figure this all out.

We are regulated in nearly everything we do, whether we like it or not. We can't drive on the sidewalk. Why? Because there is a ban on that. We can't buy goods without paying taxes on them. We can't enter a movie theatre legally without purchasing a ticket.

America is NOT about doing whatever you please. Freedom is very limited. It is not anarchy. It is regulated and policed.

[knox]

And why should that affect me? If I want to keep a burmese and have the proper enclosure size, complete with locks on the cage to prevent escape and I take all the necessary precautions when handling said snake, why should the mistakes of the mother you mention (because obviously in the end, it is her fault for not telling her child no to an animal she knows nothing about) affect my ability to keep the snake I want?

You are comparing things that are not related. You can keep these large snakes in very small enclosures in comparison to keeping a wolf or tiger. Now if someone wants to set aside a few acres of land and build a secure enclosure for the tiger and has all the proper permits from the given state (if applicable) and has the necessary training, then I think that person should be allowed to keep what they want to keep.

If you can provide a correct enclosure for a 17 foot snake to the proper authorities, and your parents sign a wavier for you to own one, I have absolutely no issue with that.

[knox]

I am sorry that some of you are offended by this being brought up again, but you don't have to get involved if you said your peace a year ago.

I answer questions all the time on forums that have been asked a thousand times before by newbies. It is part of it.

Soon, all the questions that could ever be asked about husbandry and issues in general will have been answered at one time or another. But then along comes a new generation that needs to have them answered again...

[knox]

Dr. Del, you stated a sad, sad fact.

More dogs and cats ARE abused, exponentially, than snakes. Yet, people are free to obtain them at will.

You, my friend, just demolished my argument about legislating animals based on proper housing... Unfortunately - and I mean that for the animals that suffer.

[mainbutter]

Should everyone be allowed to own anything, just because I own a Corn or Milksnake? What about Rhinos? Should they be free to own them as well?

Should everyone be allowed to drive whatever vehicle they want, just because I drive a chevy impala?

Should they be able to drive ferraris or vehicles with terrible crash ratings?

Or what about SUVS and PICKUPS?? Those things cause more deaths to the OTHER VEHICLE'S passengers/drivers that they impact!

I'm ok with my neighbor driving an aveo or prius, but if they brought home a Ram 1500 hemi or an escalade, that's not ok. Fear is going to drive me to stomp on their personal freedoms and ban their vehicles.

lol.

In all seriousness, do you understand just HOW LOW the risks are of a neighbor owning large constrictors or venomous snakes is?

With the ONE MILLION plus giant constrictors in this country, and the currently unkown (by me) number of venomous snakes in this country kept by private keepers (but certainly thousands upon thousands), there has NEVER been a death attributed to any of those animals to anyone except a person working directly with them. There has NEVER been one instance of a neighbor or bystander being killed by a "rampaging" loose cobra or burmese python.

Never.

[mainbutter]

my bad about the earlier post for amethystine pythons, they were on a proposed list some time ago and I thought that this was the same.

[knox]

Should everyone be allowed to drive whatever vehicle they want, just because I drive a chevy impala?

Should they be able to drive ferraris or vehicles with terrible crash ratings?

Or what about SUVS and PICKUPS?? Those things cause more deaths to the OTHER VEHICLE'S passengers/drivers that they impact!

I'm ok with my neighbor driving an aveo or prius, but if they brought home a Ram 1500 hemi or an escalade, that's not ok. Fear is going to drive me to stomp on their personal freedoms and ban their vehicles.

lol.

In all seriousness, do you understand just HOW LOW the risks are of a neighbor owning large constrictors or venomous snakes is?

With the ONE MILLION plus giant constrictors in this country, and the currently unkown (by me) number of venomous snakes in this country kept by private keepers (but certainly thousands upon thousands), there has NEVER been a death attributed to any of those animals to anyone except a person working directly with them. There has NEVER been one instance of a neighbor or bystander being killed by a "rampaging" loose cobra or burmese python.

Never.

This is true. And it is also true that dogs cause far more injuries, and have even mauled people to death - much more traumatic, I would think, than being suffocated by a large snake.

I won't give in on people owning Tigers or Lions, but I am starting to see the relative safety of owning a large snake in relation to dogs that have caused far more injuries.

As I said, I wasn't set in my views either way. You all make very valid points. I WILL say this - I would rather my next door neighbor own an Anaconda than a Ridgeback with a history of biting people.

[knox]

Please don't let me make enemies of anyone here. I don't own any Ball Pythons, but I was drawn here by the excellent racks in the DIY section.

I don't want to wear out my welcome. There is a lot we can all learn, and I would love to stay around gain from the experience of everyone here.