Line/Inbreeding

[OhhWatALoser]

NOOOOO!!!!! *falls over* *cries*
This situation is worse than I thought! I may not know huge amounts about ball pythons yet as I am just getting into the industry, but I do know a LOT about genetics! If what I am hearing so far is the going opinion of snake breeders then your industry is going to be short lived! Read some books on genetics people! If careless breeding continues, more and more flaws are going to pop up!

Explain how I am about 6 generation down the line of constant inbreeding in my rats. females are still making lots of babies, everyone is still healthy, im still waiting for it to catch up to me, or the breeder I got the rats from in the first place, which he has been inbreeding the same rats for way longer than I have. he estimates hes about 15 generation down the line now. he started inbreeding just to prove a point to everyone who claims what your claiming.

Now, about the spider gene. Just because "all spiders wobble" does not mean that "the wobble is connected to the spider gene". This is faulty causal reasoning! The faulty gene that causes wobbling may be closely linked to the spider gene, but "spider" is a color gene and "wobble" would have to be something connected to the nervous system. So I can assure you, they are not the "same gene". Same will be true of kinks in caramels. "Caramel" is a color gene, "kinks" are apparently a flaw in spinal development. Again I assure you, from a scientific standpoint, these genes have NOTHING in common.

Any ball python breeder could prove you wrong, when 100% of your spiders wobble and 100% of the normals in the same clutch don't for the past 10 years.... whats that say to you?

The problem with these flaws is that they are not just simple mutations. They do not behave as a basic dominant, co-dominant, or recessive gene would behave. They are far more complex. It is exactly like lines of computer code. Genes in the 'base code' are harder to change. The genes that define what and where eyes go, or how many vertebrae make up a spine are an example of base code. But there are other genes that are variables. These are built in to allow adaptation. COLOR and PATTERN are great examples of these variable genes. These are easily changed to allow for changes in the environment. The problem with repeated line or inbreeding is that it causes 'copy errors' in the base code. In spiders, the pattern is a variable gene, but the wobble is a copy error in the base code.
With responsible breeding to snakes that have correct base code, the error can be fixed while retaining the variable pattern gene. Same for caramels. With proper breeding, the kinks can be bred out while retaining the color morph. -This is of course being done. There are more and more kinkless caramels out there being bred by responsible out-crossing.

I have yet to see proof of kinks being bred out other than luck of the draw. out-crossing has nothing to do with it. feel free to find info to prove me wrong, I wish outcrossing was the answer.

And there ARE spiders out there that do not wobble.

Sure there are, I own one, now I do not know if it wobbled as a baby because I got her around 400 grams. and for all the people going to jump on me for that statement, YES i can identify a wobble, I've seen more than enough examples, I know how normals snakes act, I own a jag carpet and she has a wobble, im not joking this spider shows nothing.

problem is everyone thats had a wobbleless spider, the offspring have it. I expect my spider to throw wobbling offspring. people have been trying for a long time to bred it out of them, I mean its a dominant morph, just because of that fact it get outcrossed alot. Now add the fact that you can't make a homozygous form. People almost never inbreed the spiders. It gets outcrossed by design.

IMO the spider gene is proof of everything your saying is wrong.