IF there was a vegan diet option for BPs...

[blackcrystal22]

I'm wondering how many people here are really speaking from any actual experience with a vegan/vegetarian diet? I'm going to go out on a limb here and say not that many. I've been vegetarian for 8 years and mostly-vegan (living with a vegan wife) for 3 years of that time.

It's not the diet for everyone admittedly, but we did fine on it. We switched back to eating dairy and eggs when my wife became pregnant, and we decided that it was far, far easier to ensure a completely rounded diet for my daughter if we included these products. The combination of fat and protein in these products are hard to match with vegan foods that kids will actually eat!

The point is that we, and all the vegetarian friends we have, accept the fact that although these diets are healthy for adult humans, they may not be healthy for children or animals. Both my snakes eat F/T rodents and I never second guess it, that is what they need to survive, and it's my job as a responsible pet owner to ensure that they are healthy. In the same way, my fish get foods that contain fish meal and or shrimp meal since they contain vital nutrients that they need to be healthy.

So, to answer to original question, would I consider it? Sure, and as ethical vegetarian I'd even prefer it, but only if there was absolutely NO question that it was every bit as healthy for my snakes. Period.

p.s. I promise that I am not a 'preachy' vegetarian. I hate those people. I eat what I want to eat, and you eat what you want to eat. Fine by me.

I am. And no, it is not ethical for the snake. Snakes are carnivores, humans are omnivores. We can survive off of eating only non-meat sources. Snakes can NOT.
It is almost impossible to assume that any snake would be healthy and thriving on a diet that was made from plant matter. Even though it has the same nutrients, it does not come in the same package. Snakes have a different type of digestive system that is meant to only digest meat. If you put plants in that system, they will not digest and it will not receive any of those 'identical nutrients' that you see in it.
The animal will suffer of malnutrition before you could even realize it. It would start to die because it would not get as much energy in return for the huge amount of energy it takes for a snake to digest food in general.

Humans have taken animals as pets for our enjoyment. If you support PETA, you should not have pets, or a seeing eye dog if your blind. We have already put animals under our care when it was unrequited, the least we could do is feed them their natural source.

Also, I'm a vegetarian because of the way the animals are treated before they die. I don't believe death is a negative thing at all. If I know my mice are going peacefully in a CO2 chamber, then why would I be against that for the needs of my snakes?

I'm glad that you see that it may not be healthy, but I'm just trying to show, how it probably could never work. :]

[icygirl]

These threads should just be closed. Vegan diets do not, and will never, work for bp's. End of story.

Now who wants a nice spinach smoothie?

[Bruce Whitehead]

who wants a nice spinach smoothie?

Now you`re just vegan-baiting.

B

[Slim]

Now you`re just vegan-baiting

That quote is just begging for a joke, but since it's a family Forum........

[blackcrystal22]

these threads should just be closed. Vegan diets do not, and will never, work for bp's. End of story.

Now who wants a nice spinach smoothie?

om nom nom.

[FlowRock]

Just got a message from Dr.del because i have used an censored term in my recent post and I want to say sorry, honestly...
But this theme just makes me angry!
Of course it is wrong and inhumane how cattle is raised, transported and slaughtered for human consumption today (I say this, even though I ate just a couple of burgers...)
But as concious snake keepers we have the choice to provide our little darlings with proper and "lovefull" raised rodents, these little creatures deserve to be well treated and handled till they meet their master, or in other terms our snakes and that is the point. If someone is not willing or able to feed living or prekilled rodents to a snake, he or she should not own one. To feed f/t or even worse snake sausages, just because someone thinks it is more humane, is like eating a steak from the freezer and expecting it has grown there and never has been a cow.

[Indigo]

...Wow, never expected to get so many people riled up!

I must apologize! This was spawned from a random thought I had about people owning snakes only because they liked watching them eat. I didn't mean to stir up so much!

[FlowRock]

Warning, long and little off topic!
...I just read my post and again, and got the feeling it sounds like I am against feeding f/t, but that was not what I wanted to say.
F/t is a practical and for some people the only way to feed their snakes, cause they are not able to get their hands on living food all the time, I am also using f/t pinkies for my corn until my mice start breeding and petshops dont sell living pinkies in my place.
I am just against that hypocritical argumentation of some people (not here in this forum), who are saying it would be cruel and wrong to feed live because of ethical reasons, and then using f/t for their snakes. The mice in the freezer surely had no suicidal tendencies or died of old age before they were frozen, they had to be killed too and so I see no difference, from an ethical point of view.
I will use living mice, wich I kept for some time and fed with good food to improve their nutrional value, as long as I see my Ball kills and eats them quick and without problems. When i switch him to rats i will have to see, if it turns out to be too dangerous for him I will try prekilled..... sorry for the long post but I just went through an similar discussion in an german forum and still had some anger in me. (Okay, it was a fancy mouse lover forum and I asked how to breed feeder mice... I am convinced they would use vegan snake food...)
But back to topic: I made that point earlier, but again, I would never even consider using an artifically produced, highly processed and probably less valueable piece of food, instead of the naturally grown, healthy and nutrionally perfect balanced alternative. Neither for me, nor for my snakes.
Thanx for reading...

[TheKingInYellow]

I am. And no, it is not ethical for the snake. Snakes are carnivores, humans are omnivores. We can survive off of eating only non-meat sources. Snakes can NOT.

I agree completely, but I was answering following the assumption that this 'vegan option' was somehow magically perfectly able to allow your snakes to survive and thrive.

In reality, no, I would never trust and off-the-shelf vegan snake food.

[nixer]

sure i would feed my snakes every vegan i can catch and carry home