New Snake Owner... Some Questions

[gotballs?]

First off, let me prefeace by saying that the acquisition of a ball python as a pet is not something I did lightly or on a whim. I debated this over and over in my head for about 6 months, during which time I read as much as I could find. When I finally decided to go ahead and take the plunge, I took the advice of a local breeder for my first set-up, even though everything I have read suggested some things differently. Well, I have since straightened everything out except the temperature/humidity issue. I understand this is the most important issue, so I figured I would ask here instead of the local breeder.

First off, my set-up:

10GAL w/mesh lid, 2 hides, water dish, 2 thermometers, aspen substrate bedding, heat lamp w/red infared 75W bulb.

Ok, I have covered 3 out of the 4 of the sides of the tank with cardboard. I have a thermometer on the cool side and a stick-on (I KNOW!) on the warm side. The water dish is dead center. She has nothing to climb on though, and that concerns me...

Here is what I have noticed, and some questions following...

- She never uses the hide on the heated side, even if I change the side the lamp sits on top of.

- The temps as measured are 78-81 cool side, 88-92 warm side. (Not accurate I know, but the best I can do for now. I am purchasing 2 probe thermometers on Wednesday.)

- She is hardly ever active, except when I take her out. Then it takes her about 5 minutes or so to adjust to being handled, then I can't get her to sit still.

- When I touch her to get her out, she is always almost cold to the touch.

- She ate exactly 1 week after I brought her home, with no issues. She is eating F/T sub-adult mice.

- She pooped the day after I brought her home, but hasn't since, even though she ate on Monday the 22nd. I have not noticed and urates or urine either.

- Her noticable bulge from feeding has been gone since about the 23rd-24th. I weighed her today, the 26th, and her weight is 125g.

- She has not shed since I got her. However, I noticed several extremely dry spots where it looks like there are dead scales(?). Does that make since? The worst spot looks like a scar from a cut or something similar.

- She is not as head shy as what I have read suggests she should be. Not sure if this matters. I take her out and handle her at least everyday except the day after she fed.

Now, the questions...

Besides the thermometer/thermostat problem, is there anything I could/should be doing better habitat wise? Should I cover the mesh with aluminum foil and duct tape to help with humidity? Or perhaps use a moist towel, even though I heard this can cause bacteria and mold?

Can I add/change her tank without freaking her out? I would like to add a piece of driftwood for her to climb on, maybe with some fake greenery to hide in. I was also thinking about possibly using an old tv stand to convert into a custom built cage... any thoughts?

What can I do to make her more comfortable, as in enough so that she will start "coming out to play" as it were?

Ok, sorry about the long post, but I know you guys can help me.

There are some pics of her in my gallery...

Thanks in advance for all the help here!

[gmcclurelssu]

to get the ball rolling, i'll help answer some of your questions first:

If you are using an infared lamp as your primary heat source, i'm going to guess that your humidity is very low. foil or some heavy plastic ( used for window covering) will help retain some moisture. when you buy the new thermometers, make sure you have a digital humidity guage.

you should be able to add some items without bothering her too much. if you are completely gutting the tank and rearranging things often, that could get stressful on her.

lastly, you need to realize that a happy ball python is one you don't see in the day. they are nocturnal by nature, and no matter what kind of environment you set up, you can't fight biology. that being said, there are some snakes out there that seem to be perfectly content to cruse around the tank often, but this is unusual. if she is eating, pooping, shedding and hiding, she is most likley happy.

i'm sure other members will have some valuable input for you also.

[WizzySRT10]

- She is hardly ever active, except when I take her out. Then it takes her about 5 minutes or so to adjust to being handled, then I can't get her to sit still.

- When I touch her to get her out, she is always almost cold to the touch.

Now, the questions...

Besides the thermometer/thermostat problem, is there anything I could/should be doing better habitat wise? Should I cover the mesh with aluminum foil and duct tape to help with humidity? Or perhaps use a moist towel, even though I heard this can cause bacteria and mold?

Can I add/change her tank without freaking her out? I would like to add a piece of driftwood for her to climb on, maybe with some fake greenery to hide in. I was also thinking about possibly using an old tv stand to convert into a custom built cage... any thoughts?

What can I do to make her more comfortable, as in enough so that she will start "coming out to play" as it were?

Ok, sorry about the long post, but I know you guys can help me.

There are some pics of her in my gallery...

Thanks in advance for all the help here!

It takes about 5 mins for my snake to get used to being handled so that's nothing different. If he's been on the cool side of course they're gonna feel a lil cold. They are cold blooded even if I get mine out of the warm side hide he'll be a lil cool to the touch or luke warm. You should really get a Under Tank Heating pad.

[frankykeno]

First off, let me prefeace by saying that the acquisition of a ball python as a pet is not something I did lightly or on a whim. I debated this over and over in my head for about 6 months, during which time I read as much as I could find.

Welcome to BPNet! It's really wonderful to see someone who took the time to really think about whether a snake, specifically a ball python, was the right animal to purchase prior to putting down there money. Good for you.

10GAL w/mesh lid, 2 hides, water dish, 2 thermometers, aspen substrate bedding, heat lamp w/red infared 75W bulb.

Ok, I have covered 3 out of the 4 of the sides of the tank with cardboard. I have a thermometer on the cool side and a stick-on (I KNOW!) on the warm side. The water dish is dead center. She has nothing to climb on though, and that concerns me...

The 10 gallon is a nice starter home for a small bp. Since she's only 125 grams she'd be an 08 hatchling and likely no more than 3 to 6 months old or thereabouts. You didn't mention where you purchased her so I'm unsure if she's actually a she or if you have an actual hatchdate.

The only issues with your enclosure would be the way you measure your temps and the issue of things to climb on. Ball pythons aren't really much for climbing. The younger ones might climb a bit but really they basically suck at it and tend to tumble off stuff. They are ground snakes and tend to be quite happy if they have hides to tuck up in to. If you do add in any branches from the pet store, make sure they are the kind designed low and very sturdy so they don't tip under a bp's weight.

To monitor temps and humidity you might want to consider picking up an Acu-Rite (WalMart $10.00 or thereabouts plus one AAA battery). This is what it looks like....



Place the actual unit on your cool side, standing or secured (not with tape) at substrate level, run the thin probe cord over to the warm side and tuck the probe just inside the warm side hide, bury the probe cord or run it out and back into the tank to keep it out of the way. Push a few buttons until you get the reading that says...IN, OUT, HUMIDITY.

IN is what the actual unit is reading (your cool side, substrate level temp reading)

OUT is what the probe is reading (your warm side, inside the hide at substratre level temp reading)

HUMIDITY, again read by the actual unit and is your ambient enclosure humidity

Aim for 80-82 cool side, 90-92 warm side, 50% humidity

Acu-Rites aren't perfect but for $10.00 they are a decent option.

- She never uses the hide on the heated side, even if I change the side the lamp sits on top of.

The temps may be too great under the lamp. Are the hides the same construction and size or are they significantly different? Does she use the other hide at all?

- The temps as measured are 78-81 cool side, 88-92 warm side. (Not accurate I know, but the best I can do for now. I am purchasing 2 probe thermometers on Wednesday.)

See my suggestions about an Acu-Rite.

- She is hardly ever active, except when I take her out. Then it takes her about 5 minutes or so to adjust to being handled, then I can't get her to sit still.

They aren't a very active snake. We've got over 40 ball pythons in the house from small 08 hatchlings up to large adult female breeders. During the daytime it's pretty rare to see any of them outside their hides. Even at night some of them just come out for a slither than go back to lazing in their hides and occasionally looking out the "doorway".

Remember to allow this little bp lots of time to adjust to you and her new home. She's a nervous baby snake so be slow with her and don't overhandle.

- When I touch her to get her out, she is always almost cold to the touch.

If she's not utilizing her warm side, that's not surprising. She does need to thermoregulate properly though so that needs addressed.

- She ate exactly 1 week after I brought her home, with no issues. She is eating F/T sub-adult mice.

- She pooped the day after I brought her home, but hasn't since, even though she ate on Monday the 22nd. I have not noticed and urates or urine either.

She'll poop when she's ready and if she has enough food and water in her to create feces. What did she eat as far as prey (size and type)?

- Her noticable bulge from feeding has been gone since about the 23rd-24th. I weighed her today, the 26th, and her weight is 125g.

You don't want a huge bulge from feeding but even the normal thicker just fed look should disappear within 24 to 48 hours.

- She has not shed since I got her. However, I noticed several extremely dry spots where it looks like there are dead scales(?). Does that make since? The worst spot looks like a scar from a cut or something similar.

She may have some stuck shed. Hopefully not a scarred up baby (poor thing). Here's a couple of fantastic threads to help understand and deal with the shed cycle. Snakes of this age generally shed about every 4 to 6 weeks or thereabouts.

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=74289

http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...ad.php?t=43403

Besides the thermometer/thermostat problem, is there anything I could/should be doing better habitat wise? Should I cover the mesh with aluminum foil and duct tape to help with humidity? Or perhaps use a moist towel, even though I heard this can cause bacteria and mold?

Personally I'd ditch the lamp because they just suck the humidity up and with a glass tank/mesh lid you are already fighting that issue. Contact Rich at Reptiles Basics (tell him BPNet sent you) www.reptilebasics.com (there's a phone number there or email him). Tell him what your setup is, the rooms temps this tank is exposed to and so forth, he'll set you up. Even with shipping you'll be far better off than those stick on undertank heat pad things most pet stores sell.

You can cover some of that mesh (leave room for your lamp and some ventilation) with a piece of plexiglass or just some of that self-sticky Glad wrap. Just make sure that anything you use never has tape that gets inside the enclosure. Snakes and tape never mix well.

Can I add/change her tank without freaking her out? I would like to add a piece of driftwood for her to climb on, maybe with some fake greenery to hide in. I was also thinking about possibly using an old tv stand to convert into a custom built cage... any thoughts?

Make changes that she needs, not you need. At this point you want her to settle in, be happy and eat for you. If you fiddle too much with doodads you may freak her out (babies are more easily stressed). I'd say focus for now on changing only what must be changed in order to make her enclosure right for her.

What can I do to make her more comfortable, as in enough so that she will start "coming out to play" as it were?

Make her enclosure setup as right for her as you can. Feed her well (what is she eating by the way), give her time to settle in. You've only had this very young snake a relatively short time. These snakes require tons of patience, everything is slow with them so just give it time. You have a good 20 years or more of friendship with this animal. For now remember she is a baby really so just go slow, set down simple habits and patterns she can learn to recognize and you'll both do just fine.

[Abby_The_Python]

What can I do to make her more comfortable, as in enough so that she will start "coming out to play" as it were?

I adopted my bp on Thanksgiving 2007, 11 months later I have yet to see her out in the daytime. Sometimes I think the upside down bowls I use for hides are really my pets, I mean she never comes out during the day.

I handle her once a week & enjoy it the most I can, it makes it all worth it to me. But she goes right back in her hide after that.

Between 1am-4am she is very active tho, I cram that viewing time for all its worth.

[gotballs?]

OK... time to clarify... Her hides are different. She has no preference that I can discern. She is an equal hide user. LOL... just depends which one is not on the warm side. However, she was using the warm side hide for about 15 minutes, which leads me to believe that the temps are WAY WRONG, and that is being corrected in a couple of days. Sometimes, she won't even use the hides at all, just lays around in the front of the tank. As far as her sex, the seller "popped" her... She never really ever comes out, and I wonder if it is because of the heat lamp?

[Sonya610]

She never really ever comes out, and I wonder if it is because of the heat lamp?

If she was constantly out and roaming around her tank that would be cause for concern. I was suprised at how little they are out and about too. I have an 08 and I hardly EVER see her. She occasionally moves from one hide to the other, but that is about it unless I just fed her or handled her (sometimes she gets a bit active and explores her tank after something exciting happens).

Get used to it! It is disappointing but it is reality.

[gotballs?]

Ok... Got the acu-rite from wal-mart---> Man was I surprised at the difference. The humidity is running around 63-68%. I have changed substrate to coconut husk with sphagnum moss mixed in. I also changed out one of her hides from the ceramic half log to a hollowed out coconut shell. She is still using the plastic cereal bowl though, for some reason it is her favorite. I added a piece of driftwood wrapped with some plastic vine I picked up from wal-mart out of their craft section. I also added an XS(about 4") UTH, and dropped the infared red bulb down to 60W.

I am using about 2 inches of substrate. The out probe of the acu-rite is taped down to the bottom of the tank, right in the middle of the UTH (which is attached to the underside of the tank, covered with aluminum foil and black duct taped into place). The actual acu-rite meter is sitting in the far opposite front corner of the tank. I spray painted some cardboard black, and taped it to the back and sides of the tank. I also made a cover insert out of aluminum foil (4 layers) and black duct tape, to place between the cover and the tank top opening. I cut a hole in it for air and to place the heat lamp on.

The tank is currently reading around 78* on the cool side, and 95* on the warm side. As I said, the humidity is sitting around 63-68%. I am misting the cage with warm water 2-3 times a day as well. The water dish is sitting in the middle, closer to the warm side.

Now... some more questions-

How much heat does the substrate actually absorb? If the probe is reading 95*, about what would the temp be on top of the substrate?

Why can't I keep the humidity higher? I think she is getting ready to shed, and I want the humidity up to help her as best as possible.

Should I put the 75W bulb back in, in an attempt to try to raise humidity, and also bring up the cool side temp closer to 80-82*?

I will try to get pictures of the tank tonight or tomorrow.

[gotballs?]

anyone?

[snakecharmer3638]

I have always heard that overhead heat sucks the humidity out of the enclosure. And maybe try covering the top with a damp towel, of course leaving some air flow, to help raise humidity for shedding.