Culture differences

[Sonya610]

Now the only issue with that does remain, if you could not have gotten the snake to eat f/t, or didn't buy it already eating f/t - would you have been able to settle yourself to feeding live for the benefit of the snake?

When I bought her they said she had eaten f/t so I felt pretty confident that she would continue. But yeah it was a concern, and I realize if she ever goes on a long fast I may have to try live.

Fortunately she is a good eater, and I just lay the mouse down, no zombie dance or anything so hopefully since that is all she has ever known she will never expect her food to move.

[RandyRemington]

Here is something I wrote up years ago for some friends dealing with potential local regulations on caging. If I update it I'll probably increase the size recommendations now that I have experience with bigger/older ball pythons. I actually found some huge (nearly 2 ft X well over 3 foot) boxes that seem fine for large adult ball pythons. I do have a couple exceptionally large females that I'm considering moving to 4 ft. Neodesha with tree potter hides if I can solve the humidity issue. I’ve kept them in that before and had trouble with sheds. I do think there are some real benefits to sweater box housing, especially in my particular cool and very dry climate.

http://snakemorphs.home.comcast.net/...phs/caging.htm

On the feeding, I just hope it doesn’t get to that point here. While I did feed frozen back when I had corn snakes in my experience feeding any number of ball pythons almost requires live feeding. I’m all for treating feeders humanely but don’t really see how feeding live violates that. I did see a study once that only primates seem to have an extreme fear response to snakes and I must agree that the rats I feed don’t seem to “see it coming” and it’s all over very quickly, at least as quick as the CO2.

But it’s great that we have the world wide herp community to discuss new ideas. Some day I might make a display terrarium (although not likely with my wife’s hatred of all things snake). Maybe with my humidity issues I could turn a glass topped coffee table into a sand boa enclosure. Guests wouldn’t even have to know what lies under the sandscape, lol.

[dacalio]

Keep in mind our government sanctions the death penalty, but then will spend millions debating whether lethal injection is too "stressful" for the condemned killer. We have our own issues.

I couldn't agree with you more. There is no shortage of hypocritical ignorant elected officials on this planet. I'm just glad our government has not passed this particular piece of legislation.

When these discussions come up it makes me think about religion. People believe what they believe because their family and society convinced them of it. Most people are sheep. A lot of us hear things over and over again and eventually we believe it. I will probably get a lot of flack for saying this but I really don't care. I was raised in a rural environment and by a family of hunters. My father taught me respect for animals. He also taught me where that delicious homemade chicken soup came from.
Human beings have this complex where we feel it is our responsibility to decide if something is morally correct. Not all cultures have the same set of morals.

The only reason that crazy laws like these are passed is because some special interest group lobbies for it. In the end it is our responsibilty as a community to make sure that we keep our rights.

David

[dacalio]

Exactly! This is why people getting snakes need to define their thoughts first, decide what is and isn't acceptable to them BEFORE they get that snake. Good for you!

Now the only issue with that does remain, if you could not have gotten the snake to eat f/t, or didn't buy it already eating f/t - would you have been able to settle yourself to feeding live for the benefit of the snake?

These are part of the questions people should be asking themselves prior to purchasing a snake.

Excellent post!

A seller can tell you that your prospective purchase is eating frozen thawed. This may or may not be true. Also, a snake may decide it no longer wants to eat dead. Stranger things have happened. If your not willing to feed live maybe you shouldn't own a snake.

[m00kfu]

Human beings have this complex where we feel it is our responsibility to decide if something is morally correct. Not all cultures have the same set of morals.

Totally off-topic, and I'm sure it was just a mistype, but I found the idea that not all cultures are human beings amusing.

[JoMo]

But it’s great that we have the world wide herp community to discuss new ideas.

Amen to that, Randy. That´s the spirit, instead of starting to argue which are the better laws or confuse the best with the most practical way of doing the same thing: keeping healthy snakes.

I could give you the Southern Europe view (since you already have the Northern one).

Live feeding vs F/T or pre-killed: in some areas it´s illegal (also happens in the UK); in others it´s not and depends on the owner. People tend to avoid and justify the option with the safety of the snake (usually confusing "live feeding" with "unassisted live feeding"...);


Racks vs display terrariums: It has mostly to do with practical issues. If you have a "collection" it´s not practical to keep it in display terrariums (although some people do); if you only have a few snakes (say, up to 10) it´s easier to opt for display terrariums. I would say that in the US private keepers tend to have collections (huge market; huge offer; lots of snakes), where in Europe we usually have a few pet snakes.

The argument that the snakes are happier or better acommodated in one or the other is always reversible. If you compare a bad display with a good rack or a good display with a bad rack... the result is the same: the good wins. So you have to compare comparable situations.
Of course, having a good display terrarium is much more expensive and requires much more work than having a good rack system and so, we´re back to the number of snakes.

I feed f/t and am more of a display guy. And I do my best to balance the looks of the terrarium with the needs of the particular snake (that comes first). If you can achieve that, the snake is kept in a good condition (with the extra of having room for exercise) and the result is pleasant for your eyes.

In the end, it´s a matter of option, as long as you don´t put your personal taste/needs before the needs of the snakes.

(btw, this is my living-room display terrarium of my JCP; I´m working on the BP´s terrariums and will show them off later )

[dacalio]

Totally off-topic, and I'm sure it was just a mistype, but I found the idea that not all cultures are human beings amusing.

Lets not go there lol.

You guys are right I should just ignore threads like these and focus on the more helpful threads. With all the recent legislation it's a little scary to think what the government will (not may) try to regulate next.

David

[crystal]

my question is doesnt this finnish government have anything else better to do that worry about the feeding of captive pets?

diease?
famine?
war?
poverty?
britney spears?


just a question.

[m00kfu]

my question is doesnt this finnish government have anything else better to do that worry about the feeding of captive pets?

diease?
famine?
war?
poverty?
britney spears?


just a question.

I don't see Britney Spears moving to Finland anytime soon, so they should be ok on that front.

[crystal]

I don't see Britney Spears moving to Finland anytime soon, so they should be ok on that front.

its just everytime she does something here it makes front page news. maybe finland should worry about her more than poor hungry snakes.