Culture differences

[frankykeno]

So I would then assume it would be illegal in your country for human beings to eat chicken, beef or pork?

[Andoneus]

So I would then assume it would be illegal in your country for human beings to eat chicken, beef or pork?

Unfortunately it isn't.

But heyy it's a law, I haven't made it.

I've never really understood the argument of the rodent not having a chance to escape the snake. Does it have a chance of escaping when the rodent breeder gases it? Seems contradictory to me. (Not an attack against you, just thinking out loud.)

I think here are also some rules how the rodent should be killed. I don't think it's okay to constrict them to death.

[frankykeno]

Unfortunately it isn't.

But heyy it's a law, I haven't made it.

Kind of figured that. So it's perfectly acceptable to be a meat eater if your meat comes nicely packaged in plastic at the supermarket but it's not okay to be a meat eater if your meat comes packaged in fur with a beating heart?

Sadly these laws continue to reflect the absolute disconnection and disrespect human beings have for the natural process of predator and prey. We've forgotten we are the ultimate predator, so enforce that on the animal kingdom. How sad.

I think every keeper has to make choices for their collection. What I choose to feed and how I choose to feed is a well thought out, well researched decision. I would never want some government official who can't tell a cornsnake from a burmese python making those decisions for me.

[dacalio]

How is it wrong for the rodent? Isn't that what their function is in nature? To be eaten by a snake?

Sure is.


It really stinks that we have to feed rodents to snakes in the first place. On the other hand, I can say I'm sure happy I don't live in Finland. I hate to even attempt to argue how humane feeding frozen vs. live is. Have you seen how some of our "meat products" are raised? One could argue that those animals very existence is inhumane.

If your a hunter your methods of dispatching prey may be considered extremely cruel by some. Not every shot is a clean kill. Sometimes there are gut shots or you may even blow a limb off.

It sickens me that any government takes it upon themselves to tell you not to feed live for humane reasons. Excuse me for being culturally biased but it sounds like your government is full of morons. Not that ours is much better. Who is to decide when a snake should be fed live? Is it not cruel to the snake to starve them? Is there some agency that spends your tax dollars regulating pointless legislation like this. With all the problems our world faces it amazes me that people feel the need to spend any thought on rediculous laws such as these.

Live for life

David

[bigballs]

i think that just because it seems ok and everyone is housing multiple, similar sized snakes in a single enclosure doesnt mean that it is right. it means that those keepers either do not know any better or refuse to understand whats best for the animal while thinking only of whats best for themselves.

i dont know how different a ball python's needs become between cultures but i would think that whether the snake is housed in a tub in the U.S or in a tank in Finland, they dont change.

they should change the law to make it legal to feed live and illegal to house multiple snakes in the same enclosure.(except for breeding purposes of course! )

[Freakie_frog]

Ok Wow where to begin... Lets see
Keeping the animals in a rack set up is typically for a breeder that has neither the time or money to set up and clean glass tanks for every adult - hatchling animal. Its impractical and not very cost efficient. For a keeper with only a few animals tanks are a great way to enjoy them and properly house them.

As for feeding live many laws when it comes to pets and the pet trade are "Feeling" base i.e "I feel so bad for the rat it really doesn't have a chance to escape". Bottom line the rat isn't meant to escape and keep breeding to repopulate the species as they would in the wild. Its whole reason for existing is to provide my snakes with nutation that's why it was brought into this world. Again we come to cost effectiveness if I feed F/T or P/K and the snake doesn't eat then that rat was wasted and has to be thrown out it did not serve its purpose for being bred and raise and put down. In a scene its life was wasted. Now if I feed Live and the snake doesn't eat then the rat goes back in the rack and it lives on till it serves it propose. No wasted money, no wasted life every one is happy.

What happens when you get an animal that will not eat F/T or P/K is it better to have that animal slowly starve itself to death for the sake of our "connection" with furry things. Where then is the balance of who's chance for life was cut short by our decisions.

[frankykeno]

This so reminds me of a life long debate my parents had. My father was a hunter, and a darned good one. He didn't take his shot unless it was a kill shot and it was extremely rare for that deer to run more than a couple of steps. A fast, very clean and humane ending to his (and my) mind. He never supported shooting for trophies or shooting at something not intended for the table.

My mother would cook that venison beautifully but always refused to eat it, instead choosing to cook herself a porkchop. She "felt bad" for the "poor deer".

His point to her was this....

That deer lived it's life, it bred, it ran around, it ate well. It was dispatched quickly and for a specific reason - to provide food. It wasn't wasted or disrespected. It served it's purpose. That pig her porkchop came from also served it's purpose but it never knew anything but a crowded feed lot, never was allowed to breed, went off to a crowded, stressful killing floor where it likely was driven in with many other pigs waiting for slaughter (granted slaughter houses are run better than in his day). He was always astounded that her pork chop didn't make her "feel bad" for the "poor pig".

Growing up listening to this parental discussion every hunting season formed my view on responsible hunting and on the respect we meat eaters do owe those animals - wild or domesticated - that grace our dinner table. I never knew a time where there was a disconnect from a living creature to the Sunday roast on the table.

Taking that into snakekeeping, the rats I raise are a respected part of things here. They live, for a rat, a darned good existance. They never know hunger or thirst. They live in quite spacious enclosures that are cleaned very regularily. They have other rats to socialize with. Their end comes very quickly from one of the fastest, cleanest killing predators ever seen on this world of ours. Not a bad deal if you're a rat and naturally pretty low on that food chain Mother Nature figured out long ago.

[Sonya610]

Excuse me for being culturally biased but it sounds like your government is full of morons. Not that ours is much better.

Keep in mind our government sanctions the death penalty, but then will spend millions debating whether lethal injection is too "stressful" for the condemned killer. We have our own issues.

I respect the posters that feed live, but I didn't get a BP for many years because I was concerned about having to feed live, I would have a big problem with it. I would get far too attached to the mice/rats. It was only after I was convinced that I could successfully feed f/t that I succumbed to the desire to have one.

[Jyson]

How is it wrong for the rodent? Isn't that what their function is in nature? To be eaten by a snake?

I should have said understand, but that is my fault for overly multi-tasking. I feed both live and f/t but I try my best to euthanize my feeders since it is just more humane, for some I am unable to due to the fact that it has just become too inconvient to thaw all those feeders for all my snakes, especially the larger snakes.

[frankykeno]

I respect the posters that feed live, but I didn't get a BP for many years because I was concerned about having to feed live, I would have a big problem with it. I would get far too attached to the mice/rats. It was only after I was convinced that I could successfully feed f/t that I succumbed to the desire to have one.

Exactly! This is why people getting snakes need to define their thoughts first, decide what is and isn't acceptable to them BEFORE they get that snake. Good for you!

Now the only issue with that does remain, if you could not have gotten the snake to eat f/t, or didn't buy it already eating f/t - would you have been able to settle yourself to feeding live for the benefit of the snake?

These are part of the questions people should be asking themselves prior to purchasing a snake.