Am I doing something wrong/missing something?

[andrewross8705]

I have a BP who is a few months old, not sure of the exact hatch date since I haven't heard back from the breeder and forgot to ask when I picked up Winston at the show. He was on live mice with the breeder which was no big deal, I have access to live food. Waited a week to let him get settled in before trying to feed him. He struck, coiled but the mouse got free a split second later which spooked him. Took the mouse out, tried again a few days later and he showed no interest at all. I've tried giving him a rat pup that was smaller than what he was eating to see if that would work. Nothing so I've tried F/T as well just to see if I could get some type of response. He's lost 2 grams in the month since I've had him which I know isn't drastic. He's still very active so I'm not too concerned but it's frustrating that I can't get him to eat.

He's in a 6qt tub with a layer of aspen bedding, small hide he can fit in snugly with a water dish.
Heat tape that's set at 88 via thermostat that has a 1 degree drop.
Ambient temps are between 75 and 78F.
Current weight is 69g.

[fireflii]

Firstly, a rat pup is going to be a bit too big for a 69g ball python. I like to switch mine to rats as soon as possible, but if you're having issues, it might be best to stick to what the breeder did and figure out if its your husbandry first (although based on what you've said, it sounds okay). It wouldn't hurt to bump the ambient temperature up a little bit to low 80s (not that you necessarily have to). 75F is okay, but you don't want it to fall below that for long periods of time. You also want the hot spot at 90F, and you need to check it with a temperature gun (whereas the ambient you'll need a digital thermometer if you don't have one; analogs are very inaccurate). What's your humidity? It should be about 55-65% (or 65%+ if he's in shed).

When you say he's active, what do you mean? Is he surfing the side of the tub constantly? If so, something could be off with your husbandry (temp, humidity, etc.). You can also cover the sides with something like dark pieces of paper, if your tub is transparent, so it gives him a sense of safety. Adding in decor like leafy vines is also good to help give some cover. A picture of your enclosure would be helpful. But it sounds like the mouse might have scared him off of eating. Also be sure not to try feeding too soon between feedings (try every 5-7 days, not every 2-3 for example). Try not to interact or handle him while he's off feed for now, too, unless it's to clean the tub.

Otherwise, I would--personally--try a f/t mouse hopper. Just in case if it helps, what I do is put it from the freezer to the refrigerator the morning of feeding day (since I feed at night). When you're ready to feed, put a cup of water in the microwave for about 40-50sec (hot but not boiling). Put the mouse in a plastic bag (like a sandwich bag), then submerge it in the water for about 20min. What I found with mine personally was that he didn't want to take f/t because it didn't smell like food. So, if you can, get some recently used rat or mice bedding and put it in the bag WITH the mouse when you heat it up. After the minutes are up, hit it with a blow dryer for just a few seconds on low (live rats/mice have a body temperature of about 100F), then when you feed it, wiggle it a bit so it looks like it's alive. That's what gets mine to eat.

Obviously there are other methods, but I find that works best for switching to f/t (assuming your husbandry is correct).

Summary: Might not be eating because he got scared, but double check your husbandry: ~90F hot spot, ~80F ambient, ~60% humidity, dark + crowded enclosure. Try f/t mice hoppers or rat fuzzy, not rat pup, and try every ~6 days.

[andrewross8705]

He is surfing the sides of the tub and is out "exploring" checking out the lid, the sides, etc. He's still drinking water. Bumping up the ambient temp has been a challenge because of the house I'm in. A space heater isn't going to work because he's on an upper shelf. A temporary fix has been a piece of heat tape on the side of the tub. It didn't do much but it did help some.

Humidity is between 55-60%. I've kept handling to a minimum and try to feed every 5-7. I'll try that tonight with a hopper mouse. I'll get a picture once I'm back home.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[fireflii]

Is he pushing against the top? If he's surfing the sides/top and appearing like he's trying to get out, then likely it's something wrong with the husbandry and/or hungry (in which case, if he's not eating, there's something wrong with that aspect). Heat tape will raise the ambient like maaaybe one degree, but yeah, it doesn't do much.

• A space heater, I believe, will work even if he's on an upper shelf. The thing is those tend to be more on the expensive side of heating options, and they tend to heat the whole room rather than one small area.
• If you can, raising your house/apartment/etc.'s thermostat by one or two degrees will help (or switch from cold to hot, if it has that setting and will still be tolerable to you). If you can do that, that would be the best solution.
• Otherwise you can rig up a CHE (ceramic heat emitter, like a heat lamp but without the light emission) with a thermostat/dimmer, but it can suck up humidity a lot (though, in my opinion, it's easier to raise humidity than it is to raise temperature).
• RHPs (radiant heat panel) are very good, but not feasible in a 6qt (they generally require a little extra work to put in tubs, and only for the big tubs that can withstand high temperatures since there's enough room to safely have it running; typically they're meant for things like pvcs).

OVERALL, if you can, I'd see if raising your household heat a little bit works.

[andrewross8705]

Is he pushing against the top? If he's surfing the sides/top and appearing like he's trying to get out, then likely it's something wrong with the husbandry and/or hungry (in which case, if he's not eating, there's something wrong with that aspect). Heat tape will raise the ambient like maaaybe one degree, but yeah, it doesn't do much.

• A space heater, I believe, will work even if he's on an upper shelf. The thing is those tend to be more on the expensive side of heating options, and they tend to heat the whole room rather than one small area.
• If you can, raising your house/apartment/etc.'s thermostat by one or two degrees will help (or switch from cold to hot, if it has that setting and will still be tolerable to you). If you can do that, that would be the best solution.
• Otherwise you can rig up a CHE (ceramic heat emitter, like a heat lamp but without the light emission) with a thermostat/dimmer, but it can suck up humidity a lot (though, in my opinion, it's easier to raise humidity than it is to raise temperature).
• RHPs (radiant heat panel) are very good, but not feasible in a 6qt (they generally require a little extra work to put in tubs, and only for the big tubs that can withstand high temperatures since there's enough room to safely have it running; typically they're meant for things like pvcs).

OVERALL, if you can, I'd see if raising your household heat a little bit works.

I've thought about a CHE but wasn't sure if it would do much since he has a lid but it might be worth the investment. Per the breeder at the show he had no issues eating at all and didn't refuse a meal. I'll try feeding him tonight and see if he takes it. Going to the vet won't do a lot of good since I don't have a fecal sample to give. I'll have a picture of his tub in a moment.

[fireflii]

I poked some holes in the lid and set up the CHE on a reptile lamp stand above it. And with a dimmer all the way up (so its on the lowest heat emission), it raises the ambient about 5F.

Lamp stand - $20
CHE bulb - $18
lamp cage + clamp - $16
= approx. $54

And if he had no issues eating at the breeder, it could still be husbandry, the feeder, etc.

Anyway, for your set up, I'd definitely recommend getting some leafy decor like these. It'll make the enclosure feel more enclosed, so he'll feel more hidden and safe. If you have the resources, it wouldn't hurt to get two small hides (the one you haven't isn't bad, but with how small he is, there's likely quite a bit of space left over still). Reptile basics has some very small hides.

[andrewross8705]

I've got extra leaves of different types. I'll put that in his tub now. I'll pick up a CHE and cage when I get paid on Friday. As for the hide, I've got a small hide from RB which I thought may have been too small but I'll put it in and see what he thinks. I'll put the water bowl in the middle so I have a hide on either side. Thanks for the help. Now it's just a matter of getting him to eat...

[andrewross8705]

I poked some holes in the lid and set up the CHE on a reptile lamp stand above it. And with a dimmer all the way up (so its on the lowest heat emission), it raises the ambient about 5F.

When you say dimmer all the way up do you mean all the way down so it's putting out as little heat as possible while still being on? I was thinking of something like this for the CHE.

[Regius_049]

I had a similar problem with a hatchling ball python slightly larger than yours (I think she was like 90-ish grams at the time). While they could be slightly better, I doubt your problem is temperature. 75-78 ambient and an 88 hot spot is unlikely be sufficient deviation from "ideal" conditions to cause a feeding issue. If your snake is surfing the walls, it is likely (as others have suggested):

(1) Stressed and not feeling secure
(2) Your prey size is too large

I changed these two things for my small snake and viola, takes double hoppers no problem. You can remedy this by simply buying smaller hoppers and your snake is likely to feel the odds are more in his favor. Also, crowd the enclosure a little. You mention using leaves, which is fine. An easy solution is to ball up paper towels or newspaper and just scatter it about. It gives the appearance of terrain to hide in.

[fireflii]

Yeah, I completely agree with what Regius said. It's more likely one of those which is why I mentioned the leaves, covering the outside, hides, and trying the mouse hopper. If you really wanted, you could wait on the CHE to see if any of those issues is the problem. But it also doesn't hurt (unless money is a concern, but that's a whole different thing). Especially since it's only October, the temperatures are likely to get cooler during the winter (though that's also dependent on things like where the tub is in the house, how good the AC is, etc.). I don't need my CHE in the spring, summer, and some of fall, but I definitely need it in the winter. But for your snake, it could also be that it was scared off from the live feeding, in which case, you just gotta keep trying.

And yes, that dimmer will work. I just set it so my CHE is emitting the lowest amount of heat while being on.