Clutch ID help!

[J-Royals]

In 2013 I hatched out a couple of Black Magics.
Black Magics can vary quite a bit. At first glance it seems like all of them are triple genes, but 1 and 2 are incredible. I think the color of these hatchlings will be your deciding factor. I think 1 and 2 are without a doubt triple genes, the rest seem to be the same color as 1 and 2. If any of them are only Black Magics, I'd say number 4 is your best candidate. Maybe only 1 and 2 are the only triple genes. If 3,4, and 5 are not triple genes, they're the best Black Magics I've ever seen. I think once they have a couple meals and shed one or two more times it'll be easier to tell. I'm not 100% about this, so don't hang me out to dry if I'm wrong. Maybe I'd have a different opinion if I saw them in person or in different light. Here's some pics to help you out, if you need me to dig up some more old pics, I will.
Congrats!!! On such an awesome clutch and welcome back.

[J-Royals]

They're listed as Yellowbelly Mojave Black Pastel.

Dave

Keep in mind that there are several mislabeled pics on WOBP.

[AKA Dave]

Well Josh, you just sent me back to the land of "Uh....". These were shot in daylight with a daylight balanced flash so the colors are true. Now, when it comes to color making you think they all might be triples are you looking at the yellow/orange of the stripe compared to the side patterns? If so, that caught my attention as well early on. I dismissed it though believing there was no way that I could be that lucky with this clutch. Now looking at your Black Mojo pics I have to wonder about that again. There is such a difference in that stripe. I'm having to learn a lot on the fly about morphs which is why I am not sure how the YB gene would present in this case. Damn those subtle genetics! And yeah, WOBP was little help with this.

In your opinion, what am I looking for with the color? Am I on target with the stripe compared to the side markings?

Dave

[stickyalvinroll]

Number 1 and 2 are Gorgeous

[J-Royals]

I hatched 3 Black Magics in 2013 and they all looked slightly different in pattern but they were all the same color. All the Black Magics I've seen are the very close in color as well. Their patterns can have a lot of "donuts" on their side, or more of a linear pattern that just looks like squiggly lines on their sides. Your 4 is the only one with relatively any donuts, it also has a slightly different or more defined "eye stripe" that runs down the side of the head and through the eye.

My Black Magics had a much more defined eye stripe than any of yours, but there's even a variety between the two in my pics. The male has the more linear pattern with a less defined eye stripe. The female has a lot of donuts with a more defined eye stripe.

I'd say 1 and 2 are triples, and 3 and 5 don't look that much different than 1 and 2, and 4 doesn't really look different enough from the rest for me to not be the same as 3 and 5.

All your hatchlings look much more extreme than mine, and any other Black Magics I've seen. In the pics they all look to be the same color as each other. Do they all look the same color in person? If they're all very close in color than I'd be led to believe you have 5 triple genes. Take some pics of all 5 of them together, maybe a couple different backgrounds as well.
When you hatch 5 of something, your going to see some variations, and that might be what we're seeing. Again, I'm not 100% about this at the moment, I'd like to see more pics.

Male




Female

[AKA Dave]

OK. So I managed to grab a couple of pictures of all of them together. I thought herding cats was hard, this was ridiculous!

White background. Colors are true. Let me know if you need me to ID each hatchling.



On black PVC. They were having none of it so I apologize for the motion blur. Colors screwed a bit light due to the black background.



Thanks for the assist on this Josh. It's a head scratcher.

Dave

[AKA Dave]

Updated Picture of #3. Had the wrong picture in there.



He's another one without a dot behind the eye stripe. Maybe that's a clue. Josh, if your hunch holds true that 1 and 2 are triples, then it makes sense that 3 and 4 are not and 5 is. I'll wait till you weigh in on the other pics I just posted prior to this.

Dave

[Caspian]

I was just noticing today that my black widow male sort of has that dot - but it's connected to the stripe, rather than being separate. He just a basic Black Widow though, as far as I know - Black Pastel, Pastel, Spider.

Edit - blurry, but a photo.

[Caspian]

I was just noticing today that my black widow male sort of has that dot - but it's connected to the stripe, rather than being separate. He just a basic Black Widow though, as far as I know - Black Pastel, Pastel, Spider.

Actually, after looking at that without my brain being baked in Nevada heat, there's no resemblance whatsoever. I do see that dot on some of the Black Mojos on WoBP, but I wasn't aware that their images aren't always right.

[J-Royals]

Ok, so in your original pics, 3 was another pic of 5.
The only one that looks different than the rest is 4, but they still look the same color, which is what's throwing me off. I'm going to ask you to post one more pic, a pic of the Mojave YB parent. If I cant figure this out, I'll have to get a second opinion from someone with more experience with this combo.
Head scratcher for sure. One thing is for sure, all of them are spectacular!!!