There are ultramels and criders...if they are compatible or not isn't known for sure. There had been a breeding done but it was a visual male of one to a het female of the other which produced no visuals, but there is some question since then about if the het female used was actually a het or not. There is someone who is breeding visual ultramel to visual crider this year so if his female goes, then we will finally have a definite answer about if they are the same or not.