I've got a moral question

[toyota89]

I know a guy that has a few burms. But they are illegal in NY. Should I call the animal cops? He has pics of them on his fb so its not like he's trying to hide them. What would you do?

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[eatgoodfood]

Have you tried to talk to him about it? How he should turn the animals over because if something happens or he gets caught he will just hurt the hobby and fuel the fire? As for calling someone about it, thats a tough one. Sorry if I was not of much help.

[Rea]

When you say a few, how many do you mean? I guess it depends on how flagrantly he disobeys the law. If he has 20 burms in his home and is working on breeding them, I'd most certainly call the cops. But, if it's just 1 or 2 and there's never been a problem with them, I'd leave the guy alone. If he's good with the animals, takes care of them well, keeps them out of trouble and doesn't act stupid with them, I don't see any reason to call the animal cops. If they've never been a problem for him or anyone he knows, why should they be a problem to you? But if you think there is any danger whatsoever to the man, the snakes, or anyone around him, then alert the authorities. That's just my honest opinion.

[toyota89]

No that's the problem I can't talk to him. If I could I know he wouldn't do anything. I had a high falling out with him and some other people and we haven't spoken in 4 months.

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[toyota89]

I've never seen them but I know he's had one for a few years and he just got a new baby for Xmas. He breeds boas and balls. He takes them outside in the summer. I know he had 2 venomous snakes but I don't know if he still does. We weren't very close more a friend of a friend.

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[eatgoodfood]

Rea, I understand what your saying, but just possessing them illegally is a problem. The laws suck in some states, the laws are extremely strict here in Bayern Germany, I could easily keep burms, retics, anacondas, I know people who have them, legally, and can sell them to me, legally, but with out a school, and a permit, I cannot have them legally. I guess Im saying just because you can get them does not mean you should have them. Suck it up if you live in NY and dont own illegal snakes, wether its constrictors or venomous. It makes reptile owners look irresponsible and lawmakers think that they need to control us. Is there anyway to keep the animals legally, a permit or something?

[toyota89]

If he had it before 2005 and has paperwork proof then its legal but the baby he just got is illegal.

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[olstyn]

I'm unaware of the exact legal situation in that locale, so forgive me if I'm out of line here. Is it possible he could have a permit allowing him to keep them? Presuming that's not possible, is he aware that his actions are illegal? If he's not aware, the correct course of action, IMO, would be to inform him of his legal situation so that he can make an informed choice. Beyond that, I personally wouldn't report him unless you feel he's acting in such a way as to make his snakes a danger to himself or others. I certainly wouldn't do it just because you had a falling out with him...

[Rea]

Rea, I understand what your saying, but just possessing them illegally is a problem. The laws suck in some states, the laws are extremely strict here in Bayern Germany, I could easily keep burms, retics,anacondas, I know people who have them, legally, and can sell them to me, legally, but with out a school, and a permit, I cannot have them legally. I guess Im saying just because you can get them does not mean you should have them. Suck it up if you live in NY and dont own illegal snakes, wether its constrictors or venomous. It makes reptile owners look irresponsible and lawmakers think that they need to control us. Is there anyway to keep the animals legally, a permit or something?

I do understand what you're saying there. I suppose I'm trying to say more that I wouldn't personally get involve in it unless I felt there was danger to anyone. I certainly wouldn't promote letting him buy a new burm if this was the question, and seeing as he just got a baby for xmas, that does make me nervous. But if he already has them, the damage to the hobby could come either way. If you turn him in, he'll look irresponsible and lawmakers will push for stricter laws. If he's caught on his own, the same thing will happen. If he was buying a new one, certainly stop him. And if he's just gotten a new one, perhaps I'll have to change my opinion, as he obviously doesn't plan on cutting burms from his hobby. But if he simply owned a burm or two, I wouldn't call him on it, I guess is all I'm saying.

But Toyoto, if he does look like he plans on extending this hobby, perhaps you should alert someone. I don't want to hear about some guy in New York with a dozen adult burms in his house and have the newspapers go crazy... I'll have to conceed to eatgoodfood on that one.

[eatgoodfood]

I do understand what you're saying there. I suppose I'm trying to say more that I wouldn't personally get involve in it unless I felt there was danger to anyone. I certainly wouldn't promote letting him buy a new burm if this was the question, and seeing as he just got a baby for xmas, that does make me nervous. But if he already has them, the damage to the hobby could come either way. If you turn him in, he'll look irresponsible and lawmakers will push for stricter laws. If he's caught on his own, the same thing will happen. If he was buying a new one, certainly stop him. And if he's just gotten a new one, perhaps I'll have to change my opinion, as he obviously doesn't plan on cutting burms from his hobby. But if he simply owned a burm or two, I wouldn't call him on it, I guess is all I'm saying.

But Toyoto, if he does look like he plans on extending this hobby, perhaps you should alert someone. I don't want to hear about some guy in New York with a dozen adult burms in his house and have the newspapers go crazy... I'll have to conceed to eatgoodfood on that one.

I just spoke with my wife about the issue, and she said pretty much exactly what you just said here, Rea. And when I told her that he just got a new one, she said that thats when something should be done. If he is buying illegal snakes in NY that means someone is producing them illegally or transporting them across state lines illegally. That is bad for the hobby. Do you know where he got the new snake from? I suppose you could look at it similarly to drugs, dont necessarily go after the user, but the dealer, if you know what I mean. I will have to agree with Rea though, that wether something happens due to him, or you turn him in, it could still cause damage to the hobby.