Has anybody ever used baytril in a nebulizer?

[Bill T]

Ive heard of it but never actually seen this done. I brought one of my big girls in a month or so back when she got really aggressive mouth rot. I was given baytril by my vet he did a culture and gave me 3 weeks worth of needles to be injected in the muscle tissue every 2 days. She recovered but she lost about 250 grams.

[kitedemon]

Baytril is actually a relatively broad spectrum antibiotic, so a culture isn't absolutely required. It also has an extremely rapid onset of activity, something like 20 to 30 min after administration. As for nebulizing it, there shouldn't be a problem. Just about anything that can be injected can also be delivered by inhalation. With a respiratory infection, inhalation is very likely t be more effective than injection. Also, inhalation presents a MUCH lower risk of systemic side effects than injection. I think the only problem you're going to have is with the delivery. I've never actually tried to get a snake to wear an aerosol mask or use a mouthpiece, but I imagine it would be pretty entertaining to watch. Instead, you're going to want to place the snake in a tub that doesn't have a ton of ventilation and fog the tub. Think gas chamber.

With regard to drug resistant organisms and growth cultures, Simply doing a culture is only half the battle. If you're dealing with a resistant organism, doing a culture is going to tell you that you have an infection caused by an organism that is normally susceptible to Baytril. You still have to figure out what's going to kill it. Ordinarily, a vet will just prescribe a different broad spectrum antibiotic.

So is penicillin, like baytril many bacterium are resistant to it. There is also fungal RI and viral RI (respiratory infection is a very loose term for a huge variety of individual disorders) Cultures are very valuable tools and the value should not be taken out of hand. Treating a fungal problem with anti bacterial drugs simply is a waste of time and effort. Causing stress and spending cash for absolutely no reason, it will never work.

[patientz3ro]

So is penicillin, like baytril many bacterium are resistant to it. There is also fungal RI and viral RI (respiratory infection is a very loose term for a huge variety of individual disorders) Cultures are very valuable tools and the value should not be taken out of hand. Treating a fungal problem with anti bacterial drugs simply is a waste of time and effort. Causing stress and spending cash for absolutely no reason, it will never work.

True... However, I never said that cultures are completely worthless. My point was that cultures are not the Holy Grail. The fact of the matter is that the VAST majority of respiratory infections are bacterial, and the VAST majority of those bacteria are not resistant to antibiotics. Granted, I work on people, not pets, but the basics are the same. 95% of the time, if a patient presents with what appears to be a bacterial infection (and most of them are, not just RI's) the prescribed treatment is a course of broad-spectrum antibiotics, AND we run a culture and sensitivity panel. More often than not, that first round kills the bug. Typically the results of the C&S are back in less than 24hrs, so if we discover it's NOT something that's going to respond to the antibiotic we started with, we can make changes as we need to. Regardless, it's better to begin a treatment as early as possible rather than twiddle our thumbs waiting for test results to come back. You also have to understand we're not just making these decisions on a whim. There are a LOT of factors that go into making a diagnosis, even a preliminary one. We're not just going to look at a patient and go, "Yep. He's got SOMETHING. Better get him started on Bactrim," There are tests that can be run in MINUTES that will rule out viruses and/or fungal infections. I can run a combined blood count in just a few minutes and tell you whether you have a bacterial or viral infection based on the number and type of white blood cells present in the specimen. So, are C&S panels valuable? Yes, they are. Can you effectively diagnose and treat an infection without one? Yes, you can.

[Salamander Rising]

I have never seen a vet prescribe the use of a nubulizer on a snake, but a lot of herp keepers do a similar procedure with a mist maker and F10 disinfectant. The diluted f10 is used instead of antibiotics because it kills the RI bacteria. Many snakes have been successfully treated this way. So it's definitely not unheard of.

And I would definitely get a culture done so you're not just searching in the dark blindly trying out different treatments. Baytrill isn't as effective these days as before. A lot of RIs are resistant to it.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

I've used the F10 and a fogger and can say that I got miraculous results with it.

It totally crushed a persistent, reoccurring RI with only three foggings and stopped another developing RI dead in its tracks.

I would never be caught without it again.

[hypnotixdmp]

How is this done exactly? Is it just a reptifogger or what? What's the dilution amount???


0.3 Normals (Coilette, Athena and Mary Jane)
1.0 Pastel (De Sol)
1.0 Spider (Zeus)
1.0 Mojave (Prometheus)

0.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Stella)
0.1 BCI (Kiyoko)

[kitedemon]

Mix 4ml F10 SC in a litre of water (dilution ratio 1:250) and nebulize the reptile for approx 30 - 40 mins every day until the RI is cleared. If its a snake, after nebulizing hold it head down and clean any mucus from the mouth with an ear-bud. If you see no improvement after a week or so, go to a vet. Nebulizing works if you catch RI early however if its severe you may also need antibiotics. You should also check your environment is set up correctly - temps, humidity, etc.


MAKE SURE you are NOT using the F10 SCXD!!!!!

[kitedemon]

patientz3ro all true but Baytril can be bought off the shelf now and has been used as the first 'hammer' for what 20 years? It has been used to treat RI and just about every other infection around. It is so often used and in so many cases when there isn't even an infection at all or for durations that are simply too short to be effective that many bacteria have become resistant to it, my vet in workshops with the big vet names (Jacobsen, madder) has learned some believe more than 50% of ri cases cannot be treated with Baytril. The same way with people, antibiotics are rotated the same broad spectrum being used by 90% of doctors to treat everything for 20 years is not going to be effective. I am assuming you are a practitioner? You know that resistance is a huge issue.

I would suggest that a culture is the best way to discover if antibiotics are needed (not actually a respiratory issue especially as many vets have little to know experience with reptiles so mis diagnoses are very common) and which antibiotics many be the most effective or at least what ones are not.

[Salamander Rising]

Kitedemon nailed and I think was who told me to use it.

Stuff works like a charm.

How is this done exactly? Is it just a reptifogger or what? What's the dilution amount???


0.3 Normals (Coilette, Athena and Mary Jane)
1.0 Pastel (De Sol)
1.0 Spider (Zeus)
1.0 Mojave (Prometheus)

0.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Stella)
0.1 BCI (Kiyoko)

[kitedemon]

That is directly quoted from John Berry.

[Salamander Rising]

patientz3ro all true but Baytril can be bought off the shelf now and has been used as the first 'hammer' for what 20 years? It has been used to treat RI and just about every other infection around. It is so often used and in so many cases when there isn't even an infection at all or for durations that are simply too short to be effective that many bacteria have become resistant to it, my vet in workshops with the big vet names (Jacobsen, madder) has learned some believe more than 50% of ri cases cannot be treated with Baytril. The same way with people, antibiotics are rotated the same broad spectrum being used by 90% of doctors to treat everything for 20 years is not going to be effective. I am assuming you are a practitioner? You know that resistance is a huge issue.

I would suggest that a culture is the best way to discover if antibiotics are needed (not actually a respiratory issue especially as many vets have little to know experience with reptiles so mis diagnoses are very common) and which antibiotics many be the most effective or at least what ones are not.

I went through the Baytril thing and then got switched to Amakacin.

It worked faster and better, IMO but was almost impossible to find, at the time.

That and the F10 was a killer combo.

Also, I was told how to use NIX for mites instead of the PAM and I've never seen anything so fatally satisying in my whole life.

The mites are dead dead dead!

The Boa girls are happy again, eating and both just had perfect sheds.

So, I've got a $30 can of PAM just taking up space, now.