how long does it take to digest?

[dr del]

Hi,

I think the point being missed is that you need something to control whatever heat source you try to use.

I used to use ceramic heaters to heat a large cage - they said on the packaging that unregulated they could reach 700 degrees c. Hopefully yours won't - but they definately will need to be some way of adjusting the heat output if you intend to keep the snakes enclosure right.


dr del

[tizzle89]

Hi,

I think the point being missed is that you need something to control whatever heat source you try to use.

I used to use ceramic heaters to heat a large cage - they said on the packaging that unregulated they could reach 700 degrees c. Hopefully yours won't - but they definately will need to be some way of adjusting the heat output if you intend to keep the snakes enclosure right.


dr del

yep its called a digi thermometer for my snakes cage i have these

1 100 watt basking
1 75 watt basking light
1 100 watt red light
1 60 watt black
1 75 watt black
1 100 watt black
uth

now depending on the time of day and temp outside which lately has been -30 to -40 so the house is 60 to 55 i switched to the 100 watt red and the 75 watt black... and waaaaaaaa pow perfect temps

all in all the temp is no concern for me i can make it w/e temp i want and keep it there

now what im saying is ide rather buy the che then buy the thing i have to drill holes in my glass cage to use it... and then have to buy something else just to make sure that when my snake lays next to it it doesnt cook him (my snake will lay next to the glass)< hes weird i ges

the heat emiters can be hung from my ceiling at w/e height needed to give the cage the perfect temp simple
no buying a diamond bit and a drill and then a heat reg for the pad lol

y make things harder when really its easy


for my skink i have
3 100 watt basking lights
1 75 watt basking red night light
1 100 watt black

note his cage is completely open its a wire cage with a plastic bottom
cage temp 85 in his hide and 90 to 100 in basking temps

pretty much what im saying is humidity and tempature is not my issue im just new at owning a snake and certain things i get worried about... but like alot of you have said... if he is eating drinking and pooping he is fine

ate today 1 adult mouse fiance was ever so kind as to video it lol


so thanks for the help ill post when/if something goes wrong but i dont think it will hes getting his dirt n bark tomorrow hopefully the mite issue is gone

[Kaorte]

A UTH with out a THERMOSTAT (not a thermometer) will cook your snake.

You absolutely need a thermostat to use the UTH.

An unregulated UTH will get well over 100*F which is enough to slowly burn your snake.

To clarify, I am talking about the heat mat that you ALREADY have on your cage which means that it probably is already too hot for him right on the surface. Take your probe and put it under the substrate right on the glass where the UTH is.

No offense but changing all those lamps out during the day sounds like the biggest pain in the butt on the planet... Not to mention it probably does an awesome number on your humidity.


Keep in mind we are only trying to help you find the most successful way to heat your tank safely and effectively. What you are suggesting with the CHE's will work and I have seen people do it, but you will then be struggling with humidity.

Many people have gone through the trial and error of different heat sources and how effective they are. It is the general consensus that a UTH on a thermostat is the best option for a ball python. If you need supplemental heat (if the room is colder than 70*F) then a low wattage heat lamp, CHE, or second UTH will work best.

There is honestly no reason for you to be changing out your lights all the time. As someone else has said before "set it and forget it". It should not be this much work to keep constant temps.

[Egapal]

yep its called a digi thermometer for my snakes cage i have these

1 100 watt basking
1 75 watt basking light
1 100 watt red light
1 60 watt black
1 75 watt black
1 100 watt black
uth

now depending on the time of day and temp outside which lately has been -30 to -40 so the house is 60 to 55 i switched to the 100 watt red and the 75 watt black... and waaaaaaaa pow perfect temps

all in all the temp is no concern for me i can make it w/e temp i want and keep it there

now what im saying is ide rather buy the che then buy the thing i have to drill holes in my glass cage to use it... and then have to buy something else just to make sure that when my snake lays next to it it doesnt cook him (my snake will lay next to the glass)< hes weird i ges

the heat emiters can be hung from my ceiling at w/e height needed to give the cage the perfect temp simple
no buying a diamond bit and a drill and then a heat reg for the pad lol

y make things harder when really its easy


for my skink i have
3 100 watt basking lights
1 75 watt basking red night light
1 100 watt black

note his cage is completely open its a wire cage with a plastic bottom
cage temp 85 in his hide and 90 to 100 in basking temps

pretty much what im saying is humidity and tempature is not my issue im just new at owning a snake and certain things i get worried about... but like alot of you have said... if he is eating drinking and pooping he is fine

ate today 1 adult mouse fiance was ever so kind as to video it lol


so thanks for the help ill post when/if something goes wrong but i dont think it will hes getting his dirt n bark tomorrow hopefully the mite issue is gone

I think its worth mentioning that no one is trying to attack you. You said you are new to keep snakes and had some problems so we are trying to help. I want to try and break this down a different way. You have a BP and 3 big concerns in my book. One is a safe place for them to hide. You should have two one on the warm side one one the cool side. You don't need to get fancy with these, especially if your snake is not an adult. People use the bottoms of ceramic pots with entrances cut in, bowls and small cat litter pans. After that you have proper temps and proper humidity. I mention them both together as your choice of one effects the other.

CHE will suck the humidity out of your tank. So will light bulbs. UTH's are the best that I have seen and I have no experience with radiant heat panels. If you are not going to buy a thermostate (I think you should) Radiant heat panels are the best. You can attach this to the underside of the screen top. The reason they are the best is because their surface has the lowest max temp and your snake can not lay directly on it. It will be able to touch the surface directly but its much less likely to get burned.

I live in Norther New York State and I keep my house in the mid 60's to 70 if we have company over. If you had two UTH's one with a thermostat and one with a rheostat you could keep the warm side on the thermostat and the "cool" side on the rheostat.

At the end of the day its your snake and we are all just trying to help you and your snake. The lower maintenance your snake is the better. Its great that you are willing to adjust its temps and really stay hands on. The problem comes when you have to leave the snake in someone else care. If you get sick or injured. I have great peace of mind knowing that all my snake needs for at least a few weeks is fresh water. Obviously I would rather be able to care for my snake daily but if something happens she will be fine for a while without me or for longer with a person who is not afraid of snakes who can pop in and check on her.

[tizzle89]

A UTH with out a THERMOSTAT (not a thermometer) will cook your snake.

You absolutely need a thermostat to use the UTH.

An unregulated UTH will get well over 100*F which is enough to slowly burn your snake.

To clarify, I am talking about the heat mat that you ALREADY have on your cage which means that it probably is already too hot for him right on the surface. Take your probe and put it under the substrate right on the glass where the UTH is.

No offense but changing all those lamps out during the day sounds like the biggest pain in the butt on the planet... Not to mention it probably does an awesome number on your humidity.


Keep in mind we are only trying to help you find the most successful way to heat your tank safely and effectively. What you are suggesting with the CHE's will work and I have seen people do it, but you will then be struggling with humidity.

Many people have gone through the trial and error of different heat sources and how effective they are. It is the general consensus that a UTH on a thermostat is the best option for a ball python. If you need supplemental heat (if the room is colder than 70*F) then a low wattage heat lamp, CHE, or second UTH will work best.

There is honestly no reason for you to be changing out your lights all the time. As someone else has said before "set it and forget it". It should not be this much work to keep constant temps.

ok look i need you to under stand this... where do you live? let me explain this part ALASKA dry and absolutely the coldest place you will ever go in your life my room temp i am not lying to you 55 to 60 degrees. you think a uth is going to keep my snakes cage warm? lol no i have to use lights it is a must. other ppl may have trial and errord what you are talking about.. but did they live where i live.. the house i live in.. gotta understand each house is a cage in itself lol humidity in my house is very low. i understand you are tying to help but atm you are focussed on heat and i dunno if you seen my pics but its all correct and even better now since i bought 2 more digis to constant reg the temp...

changing the lights is easy i have to do it for my skink anyways

all in all atm im battling to high of humidity since i soaked his dirt in 120 temp water to clean it from the mites...

so all in all alaska=cold=uth wont heat entire cage nore get to the degree u speak of.. using a zoo med uth atm says on packaging as long as my room stays below 80 degrees i dont need the thermostat to use it.. and i have a probe in the substrate lol under both hides now one is 93 1 is 90 and cold side next to water is 84 over all temp in cage about 85 86 but atm i have 80% humidity but that will soon pass... so are my temps right or wrong? if they are wrong then ill do what you say but if they are in range of proper heat for a ball python then i think we can move off the heat subject.. have had the cage setup for 2 weeks like this.. no burns keep in mind i have about an inch and a half of dirt under my snake.. less dirt=more heat.. more dirt =less heat... simple lol

[Kaorte]

I see YOUR point, but you completely missed mine.

One hide should be 80-82* and the other should be 90-92*. You shouldn't have two that are in the 90's.

Do me a favor and move all the substrate except for 1/4" off the UTH and place your probe right on the glass over the UTH. Not in the middle of the substrate, right on the glass.

Your snake will eventually figure out that it can move the substrate around to get warmer and it will do this. You need to measure the hottest point in the enclosure that the snake can possibly get to.

I have seen people make these mistakes before and end up with belly burns. I understand living in a cold house, I am in Chicago and I grew up in Michigan. I know how cold it can get inside. That being said, you do not need a crap load of lamps. One correct wattage light on the cool side of the tank should be enough to keep the ambient temp of the tank above 75*F.

[cweimer4]

I see YOUR point, but you completely missed mine.

One hide should be 80-82* and the other should be 90-92*. You shouldn't have two that are in the 90's.

Do me a favor and move all the substrate except for 1/4" off the UTH and place your probe right on the glass over the UTH. Not in the middle of the substrate, right on the glass.

Your snake will eventually figure out that it can move the substrate around to get warmer and it will do this. You need to measure the hottest point in the enclosure that the snake can possibly get to.

I have seen people make these mistakes before and end up with belly burns. I understand living in a cold house, I am in Chicago and I grew up in Michigan. I know how cold it can get inside. That being said, you do not need a crap load of lamps. One correct wattage light on the cool side of the tank should be enough to keep the ambient temp of the tank above 75*F.

He said its -30 out. I live in Ohio so I know what Michigan and Chicago cold is, however, -30 makes Michigan and Chicago seem like a tropical getaway. If he feels comfortable with changing lamps for both of his animals thats fine. More power to him. And as for the snake burrowing under subtrate, I have a ball python and a number of my friends have ball pythons. I have never ever seen one mess with the substrate to try and get underneath it. NOT ONCE, EVER. He read the back of the box of the UTH and he seems to know what hes doing. I believe he is doing fine. I know someone who heats his tank with a huge ass heat lamp and thats it. His snake seems just as fine and healthy as Ive ever seen them. Everyone does it differently. Seems like everyone is criticizing the guy for not doing anything wrong if his snake is healthy and does everything like your snake or my snake. I think hes just doing fine.

Just my .02.. Please dont hate me for stickin up for the guy! I just dont see a problem if his snake seems happy and healthy.

[tizzle89]

I think its worth mentioning that no one is trying to attack you. You said you are new to keep snakes and had some problems so we are trying to help. I want to try and break this down a different way. You have a BP and 3 big concerns in my book. One is a safe place for them to hide. You should have two one on the warm side one one the cool side. You don't need to get fancy with these, especially if your snake is not an adult. People use the bottoms of ceramic pots with entrances cut in, bowls and small cat litter pans. After that you have proper temps and proper humidity. I mention them both together as your choice of one effects the other.

CHE will suck the humidity out of your tank. So will light bulbs. UTH's are the best that I have seen and I have no experience with radiant heat panels. If you are not going to buy a thermostate (I think you should) Radiant heat panels are the best. You can attach this to the underside of the screen top. The reason they are the best is because their surface has the lowest max temp and your snake can not lay directly on it. It will be able to touch the surface directly but its much less likely to get burned.

I live in Norther New York State and I keep my house in the mid 60's to 70 if we have company over. If you had two UTH's one with a thermostat and one with a rheostat you could keep the warm side on the thermostat and the "cool" side on the rheostat.

At the end of the day its your snake and we are all just trying to help you and your snake. The lower maintenance your snake is the better. Its great that you are willing to adjust its temps and really stay hands on. The problem comes when you have to leave the snake in someone else care. If you get sick or injured. I have great peace of mind knowing that all my snake needs for at least a few weeks is fresh water. Obviously I would rather be able to care for my snake daily but if something happens she will be fine for a while without me or for longer with a person who is not afraid of snakes who can pop in and check on her.

i know your all not attacking its just its always about the temp.. lol i dunno if this thread has the pics of my cage but the temp is hot/mid hot/cold

the reason for the third temp is simple.. i have a water dish pretty much the size of the cold side there isnt enough room for the snake to have a hide.. and if i down grade the size the humidity will need to be tweaked.. i cannot mount the thing you all are talking about because......... i have a sliding screen top.. i wouldnt be able to open the cage if i mounted on the top of the cage.. and im not drilling through my glass.... so as of now i cannot use the best of the best.... lol my skink alone was 200 the bp 90 his cage 150 extra hide 10 3 digi therms 30 uth 27 water dish 20 beding 30 < bought alot lol
lights each basking light was 15 i have 3 100s 1 75

it all adds up... not to mention the 400 dollar light bill i gotta pay.. so for now im tryn to make the best of what i can afford
scraped up 80 bucks over the week and bought him his real UTH instead of a human heating pad lol along with his other 2 digis and his extra hide...


but really what works for you all doesnt mean it works for me becuase in order for it to work for me i would have to buy another cage.. and atm my wallet cannot take that blow... someone is always with him and my skink lol my fiance stays home and i work... lol

but atm im way frustrated since now i cant run my lights without the humidity getting to 90... the substrate is in the oven once again trying to dry it out ... izzy is in a plastic crate with a space heater and a human heating pad under him... i know how important the temp and humidity is so its the first thing i make sure is perfect.. and right now i cant get it perfect and its pissing me off... nothing that worked before is working now... theres either not enough heat or theres to much heat and not enough humidity <cage top open is y no humidity

put it this way there is so much humidity when i finnaly got tired of fighting with it in the cage.. i lifted one of his hides on the hot side and there was watre droplets on the roof of it... 1.40am no sleep again taken care of him

[tizzle89]

I see YOUR point, but you completely missed mine.

One hide should be 80-82* and the other should be 90-92*. You shouldn't have two that are in the 90's.

Do me a favor and move all the substrate except for 1/4" off the UTH and place your probe right on the glass over the UTH. Not in the middle of the substrate, right on the glass.

Your snake will eventually figure out that it can move the substrate around to get warmer and it will do this. You need to measure the hottest point in the enclosure that the snake can possibly get to.

I have seen people make these mistakes before and end up with belly burns. I understand living in a cold house, I am in Chicago and I grew up in Michigan. I know how cold it can get inside. That being said, you do not need a crap load of lamps. One correct wattage light on the cool side of the tank should be enough to keep the ambient temp of the tank above 75*F.

it gets to 93 ... its a zoo med 10 to 20 gallon uth that sticks to the tank.. lol i have done this and i know he digs does it all the time... i even held my hand right on the bottom of the cage over the uth... it was hot but i could hold my hand on it all day.. and i am very sensitive to heat lol i prefer cold over heat anyday... so belly burns they might be possible if i have a light on right over where the uth is.... but it made it clear never to do this... so i dont plan to... lol anyways ima go check the dirt see if it dry yet...

not tryn to argue with u guys just tryn to make it clear that i check all the possible angels on this that i know of.... but atm nothing working and my snake is out of his cage like i sed next to a space heater and on a human heating pad.... <<<worst place for him imo sides the freezer

[dr del]

Hi,

Why can't you put the waterbowl in the middle to allow him to have a cool end hide?

Incidently what causes burns on you has no bearing on what will cause a burn on your snake.

I get the whole lamp swapping thing is your method of controling the temps ( human thermostat approach ) but would like to suggest you think about buying a proportional thermostat that would allow you to use one red or blue or ceramic heat lamp and save you all that work. In fact if you use the ceramic heater option you will be able to make it work fine with an on/ off type as well.

I do have one solution you might want to think of long term.

Are you good at DIY?

You could think about building a melamine or plastic enclosure with front opening that would give you a greater range of heating and lighting options.

And to the other poster BP's move the substrate all the time if they choose to - I know you have never seen it but they can and will on occasion.


dr del