A Friendship Dilemma

[revxus]

People can learn from this thread IMO. It's always good to remind yourself that when purchasing reptiles for really good deals, you need to ask as many questions as possible, and get things in writing/e-mails.

Good point, but what if you have known this individual for many, many years?! That's hard to swallow, wouldn't you say?

And I never seemed to have received a reply to proving the sale of such snakes, and proving the fact that they were illegally obtained by the shipper?
It was a verbal sale!

The price paid was $335, he could simply deny the fact that he sold me the Rosy's because there is no receipt, or he could just deny the whole thing and still get away with it, no? I mean, the real issue here is how can I prove that they were illegally obtained?

[dr del]

Hi,

I NEVER promoted the "illegal ownership and trafficking of species." If I am correct, the English dictionary defines the word PROMOTING as follows:

to help or encourage to exist or flourish; further:

And the deffinition of traffiking is;

1. To pass goods and commodities from one person to another for an equivalent in goods or money; to buy or sell goods; to barter; to trade. [1913 Webster]

So when he gives you a refund and you ship him back the snakes you would be........

The report has been made. Therefore, I am not promoting anything against the site's rules.

So now a report has been made? Only you failed to mention this at any earlier point and I seem to have left my telepathy in my other pants.

Would this be independantly verifiable at all? Wes?

But even so you still expressed an intention or at least a willingness to consider traffiking the animals.

Ok, so he's offered me a refund, without the shipping, of course. That's just a loss we both take. I accept that.

But... I'm afraid the rosie's in particular may not make it. We're both in California though, so they wouldn't be traveling far, just from SoCal to NorCal on one overnight trip.

And of course you are without doubt currently in ownership of illegally collected animals by your own admition.

This is exactly what's wrong with the herp community! Instead of making judgment calls, and layin' out the law you should be advising and encouraging!

No sir.

We are not what is wrong with the herp copmmunity.

But since you asked.

I advise you to stop breaking herp related laws before you damage anyone elses ability to own or ship animals.

And I encourage you to live a useful and productive life that doesn't result in you being in the newspaper giving the HSUS and their cronies more ammunition to fire at us.

And I never said I was going to ship them back, I simply stated that I was offered to ship them back.

Covered above.

I've made the report. What now?!

I'm hoping your friend gets arrested and you surrender the animals and give evidence against him.


dr del

[Patrick Long]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to revxus again.

Damn!!!!!!!!

[Jay_Bunny]

I highly doubt his "friend" would "dispatch" him for reporting illegal activity. He may lose this "friend" though. Of course I would not want to be "friends" with someone who knowingly breaks the law like this.

[Elise.m]

Any "Friend" that would put me or my beloved hobby in jeopardy like this is not a friend. They are a person who is looking to make money by any means, and that's not a trait I look for in friends.

[BPelizabeth]

I'm hoping your friend gets arrested and you surrender the animals and give evidence against him.


dr del

I am NOT condoning anything....I buy from very reliable sources that have been in business for quite a while. If I was going to buy from a new source...I would totally check him out. There are soooooooo many avenues

I do have a question regarding this statement. When you surrender the animals what happens to them. That would be my only concern? Do they let send them back to Africa and let them go? Are they put down? Just wondering......I hate to think that it would be the demise of the animals because of a ....hmmm...can't say that word unless I want an infraction.

Mind you I do think that person needs to be caught....that is a terrible thing to do to the snakes. Not to sound like a whimp but it makes me really sad

[revxus]

So when he gives you a refund and you ship him back the snakes you would be........

I haven't shipped them, nor plan to. I'm assuming F&G will pick them up, since they asked for my address? I've done my part.

So now a report has been made? Only you failed to mention this at any earlier point and I seem to have left my telepathy in my other pants.

I did state this before. Please read.

Would this be independantly verifiable at all? Wes?

Who is he do verify?

But even so you still expressed an intention or at least a willingness to consider traffiking the animals.

This is incorrect, I simply asked what I should do, and as most advised I did so. And that was to make that report.

And of course you are without doubt currently in ownership of illegally collected animals by your own admition.

Do I have any other choice? Am I to release them out in some field as if nothing happened?! That's illegal! Am I to ship them back?! That's illegal, too. So there is no other way but to keep them, and wait for F&G to do as they see fit. Which again... I have.

I advise you to stop breaking herp related laws before you damage anyone elses ability to own or ship animals.

I don't know how many times I have to repeat myself, but apparently I must. I did not INTENTIONALLY break the law in obtaining these animals. And since I was the unfortunate receiver of these snakes, the only thing I can do is follow through with reporting it, which again... and again... I have.

And I encourage you to live a useful and productive life that doesn't result in you being in the newspaper giving the HSUS and their cronies more ammunition to fire at us.

I'm trying to, but it's nearly impossible with all the bashing and attitutudes here. I'm simply asking, and I get bashed over and over as if I'm the one who collected these animals and sold them!

[nixer]

just a few questions here
why was this thread not locked at post 6 or 7?
why was it posted under bp general?

[dr del]

Hi,

I haven't shipped them, nor plan to. I'm assuming F&G will pick them up, since they asked for my address? I've done my part.

Good.

I did state this before. Please read.

Actually my reading comprehension is really quite good. This post is the only post before the one I made (the one the discussion about the reporting issue stems from ) that you mentioned reporting anything to anyone as something you intended to do.

Good point.

I'll go ahead and report WES POLLOCK immediately to the authorities at Fish & Game.

Who is he do verify?

The only person I know in the same state that definately has the phone number needed to do so.

Do I have any other choice? Am I to release them out in some field as if nothing happened?! That's illegal! Am I to ship them back?! That's illegal, too. So there is no other way but to keep them, and wait for F&G to do as they see fit. Which again... I have.

Yes I understand this to be the case but that was not the case when I quoted the rule to you and stated you were in breach of it. Once you reported their existence to F&G I ceased to have a problem with it.


dr del

[revxus]

I'm shrugging my shoulders.

Why?

Because there is no winning here, and yes history does repeat itself.

There are a lot of vets around here that hide behind their little computers arguing about what's right and wrong (in their own mind).

I may not be the most-liked individual in this "community" and I know that, and I accept that. But like I have said before, I really don't care whether I am liked or not. That's just the nature of the beast!

I'm not looking to make a quick buck in this hobby, I'm just having fun with it. If you buy from me a year or two down the line, great! If not, then oh well someone else will!

But here's my problem... because they're giving away infractions as if they're candy!

First, quit the whining!

Second, stop layin' down the law like you're some kind of perfect law-abiding citizen, haven't you ever got a parking ticket, ran a red light or done a rolling stop?

And lastly, but most importantly - just be more supportive than you are critical. It's a learning process here!

I'm just sayin'...