Half ball python Half blood python

[Ben Biscy]

Two problems with your argument.

First off, the original spider came from the wild with the wobbling that you see in some of them. So there goes that argument.

actually, it helps back my idea. mutations can lead to defects as well as pretty colors or patterns. proof that this happens can be found in a wild caught specimen. thinking about natural selection, do you think the spider trait would thrive in the wild? i don't....

Secondly, dog breeds are still the same species. They weren't created by breeding a dog and say, a fox. As far as I know, they were line bred to create the different breeds.

so was the wolf the ONLY dog in the world then? and all dogs are bred from that one line? no, i'm sorry. that's not accurate. breeds are created by "hybridizing" this breed with that, back crossing to this, outcrossing to that, stabilizing for traits, and inbreeding for stability.

Breeding a ball python with a blood does NOT create a new "breed", it creates a mutt, plain and simple.

after six generations of inbred hybridization you have a new "strain". so yes, man CAN create new things by selective breeding.

if you REALLY want to see how it works, try breeding beans, peppers or tomatoes.

my point here is if someone really wanted to spend the time, they could create a true breeding line of hybrid ball/blood. after so many gererations (usually six, sometimes more), you have a stable line of hybrid that will produce offspring identical to the parents.

as much breeding that goes on around here, one would think arguments like this would never occur.

to those who think you shouldn't play god by breeding mutts, sell your bp morphs and get out of the hobby.

[Wh00h0069]

to those who think you shouldn't play god by breeding mutts, sell your bp morphs and get out of the hobby.

Your argument does not hold water. A ball python bred to a ball python does not create mutts. A ball python bred to any other species does. Just because a ball python has a genetic mutation (color / pattern) does not mean that it is not a ball python, therefore, breeding it to another ball python does not create mutts.

My thought on hybrids is that they muddy bloodlines. I do not want an animal with muddy bloodline in my breeding stock. Anyone that sells hybrids increases the chance that breeders who feel the same way I do will end up with animals with muddy bloodlines.

[Soterios]

so was the wolf the ONLY dog in the world then? and all dogs are bred from that one line? no, i'm sorry. that's not accurate. breeds are created by "hybridizing" this breed with that, back crossing to this, outcrossing to that, stabilizing for traits, and inbreeding for stability.

Actually yes, the wolf was/is the only dog. All dogs are just different variants of the same animal. That IS accurate.

[MarkS]

Actually yes, the wolf was/is the only dog. All dogs are just different variants of the same animal. That IS accurate.

I saw an interesting show a few years back about wild dogs. It seems that where ever in the world that there are feral dog populations where people do NOT control their breeding, they all start looking the same after a while. They eventually all are medium-large bodied dogs with long muzzles, pointed ears and curly tails. It's as if nature has a default look in mind. In short, they start looking more and more like wolves.

[muddoc]

I saw an interesting show a few years back about wild dogs. It seems that where ever in the world that there are feral dog populations where people do NOT control their breeding, they all start looking the same after a while. They eventually all are medium-large bodied dogs with long muzzles, pointed ears and curly tails. It's as if nature has a default look in mind. In short, they start looking more and more like wolves.

I'll attest to that. I spent many days in Afghanistan hunting and killing feral dogs that were casunig problems to food stores, and general safety. They almost all look exactly as Mark described. Funny how nature works isn't it.

[littleindiangirl]

actually, it helps back my idea. mutations can lead to defects as well as pretty colors or patterns. proof that this happens can be found in a wild caught specimen. thinking about natural selection, do you think the spider trait would thrive in the wild? i don't....

How can you even fathom how the spider morph thrives, or doesn't, in the wild. Just the fact that it was found and brought to captivity should be proof enough that this gene has been successful enough to be not only a dominant gene, but found by humans and bred for.

so was the wolf the ONLY dog in the world then? and all dogs are bred from that one line? no, i'm sorry. that's not accurate. breeds are created by "hybridizing" this breed with that, back crossing to this, outcrossing to that, stabilizing for traits, and inbreeding for stability.

YES, the wolf was domesticated by humans, and is the SOLE ancestor for our traditional dog breeds! They were NOT hybridized. You are completely wrong on that one...

after six generations of inbred hybridization you have a new "strain". so yes, man CAN create new things by selective breeding.

Plants are a lot easier to "hybridize" than animals. However, a lot of genes are just plain incompatible. Look it up!

if you REALLY want to see how it works, try breeding beans, peppers or tomatoes.

Plants and animals can barely even be used in the same context. Plants are much easier to hybridize and cross than animals. Even then, it can be very difficult from within the same family.

my point here is if someone really wanted to spend the time, they could create a true breeding line of hybrid ball/blood. after so many gererations (usually six, sometimes more), you have a stable line of hybrid that will produce offspring identical to the parents.

Name one other animal hybrid that has successfully been bred down 6 times to create a new species entirely. Oh, and by humans.

as much breeding that goes on around here, one would think arguments like this would never occur.

to those who think you shouldn't play god by breeding mutts, sell your bp morphs and get out of the hobby.

Again, morphs are the same species!

You really don't understand biology??

[stormwulf133]

Two problems with your argument.


Secondly, dog breeds are still the same species. They weren't created by breeding a dog and say, a fox. As far as I know, they were line bred to create the different breeds.

You do not know that. We actually don't know what the domestic dog is in total.

[stormwulf133]

Actually yes, the wolf was/is the only dog. All dogs are just different variants of the same animal. That IS accurate.

There are several scientists that dispute this.

[harm286]

How can you even fathom how the spider morph thrives, or doesn't, in the wild. Just the fact that it was found and brought to captivity should be proof enough that this gene has been successful enough to be not only a dominant gene, but found by humans and bred for.




YES, the wolf was domesticated by humans, and is the SOLE ancestor for our traditional dog breeds! They were NOT hybridized. You are completely wrong on that one...


Plants are a lot easier to "hybridize" than animals. However, a lot of genes are just plain incompatible. Look it up!

Plants and animals can barely even be used in the same context. Plants are much easier to hybridize and cross than animals. Even then, it can be very difficult from within the same family.



Name one other animal hybrid that has successfully been bred down 6 times to create a new species entirely. Oh, and by humans.



Again, morphs are the same species!

You really don't understand biology??

i think a butterfly and sum black kite bird but not 6 times

[mainbutter]

My thought on hybrids is that they muddy bloodlines. I do not want an animal with muddy bloodline in my breeding stock.

Racist.