Why We Are Idiots For Using Kingsnake.com To Price Our Animals

[PythonWallace]

I also completely agree with you, Neil. I'm a small fry, hobbiest, but that is my business model. It takes a little longer, but the demand is out there, and I now only have one male mojave and a couple of normal males left. I set my prices to what I was willing to accept for my animals and I got it with very little advertising. If I end up hatching a greater number of animals this season I will do the same thing, spending a little more money and time advertising and buying tables at shows. It baffles me how so many smaller breeders rob themselves of the money they would easily get if they weren't so scared to hold their animals for a few more weeks.

[Soterios]

I see a lot of "Price manipulation is unfair, unless it's up making the prices go up"

[TheReptileEnthusiast]

I'm not saying that the article is inaccurate, but we shouldn't blame a drop in prices for morphs solely on liars and scammers. There's plenty of those who try to keep prices high as well(I've got a piebald in Nigeria I'd love to sell you )

Most of the Cameroon/Nigerian scammers actually advertise ridiculously low prices. I agree that liars/scammers probably aren't the only to blame, the joe blow seller who underprices his snakes for quick sale are probably more to blame. My advice to newer sellers who aren't sure how to price thier snakes is: produce A grade snakes, take professional quality photos with clean backgrounds, make your ad look every bit as professional as the big guys, and price 'em like the big boys. It worked for me this year in spite of the recession. Let's face it, most of us in the hobby are freaks who want the best and will pay a little extra for it. Leave the low grade stuff for the bargain hunters. They will probably lose interest in thier collection and sell it on craigslist to another bargain hunter anyway. If you fall into the bargain hunter category, keep you stinkin' mouth shut about the bargain you got. I know this goes against your very nature, but you are only driving the value of your own animals down.

[jsmorphs2]

Most of the Cameroon/Nigerian scammers actually advertise ridiculously low prices. I agree that liars/scammers probably aren't the only to blame, the joe blow seller who underprices his snakes for quick sale are probably more to blame. My advice to newer sellers who aren't sure how to price thier snakes is: produce A grade snakes, take professional quality photos with clean backgrounds, make your ad look every bit as professional as the big guys, and price 'em like the big boys. It worked for me this year in spite of the recession. Let's face it, most of us in the hobby are freaks who want the best and will pay a little extra for it. Leave the low grade stuff for the bargain hunters. They will probably lose interest in thier collection and sell it on craigslist to another bargain hunter anyway. If you fall into the bargain hunter category, keep you stinkin' mouth shut about the bargain you got. I know this goes against your very nature, but you are only driving the value of your own animals down.

Totally agree.

I think a lot of people selling at low prices don't plan on keeping any unsold animals so better to sell them at $150 and get rid of them than wait a few weeks/months to sell them for an appropriate price. It seems irresponsible to me. Look at pure breed dogs... everyone knows to find a good breeder and the "bargain hunters" go to back yard breeders for puppies of low quality. You may save $500 on an English Bulldog but what are you going to spend extra at the vet throughout its life. Not saying its exactly the same with BPs but personally I would rather spend more on a great looking morph than less on one thats "ok". There are just people out there that don't care if their pastel is browned out or bright yellow, and thats fine, you love your snake no matter what.

The best solution seems to be the one where breeders hold firm to there prices and the buyers who want great animals from a reputable breeder will eventually buy them. And a record of current FAIR MARKET VALUE would be extremely helpful too.

[wilomn]

They will probably lose interest in thier collection and sell it on craigslist to another bargain hunter anyway. If you fall into the bargain hunter category, keep you stinkin' mouth shut about the bargain you got. I know this goes against your very nature, but you are only driving the value of your own animals down.

Are you selling animals or raising children?

It's all well and good to have a serious care for where your babies go, but seriously, the above is WAY overboard.

If you got a good deal, why should you shut up about it? So someone else doesn't get it? That's a nice way to treat your fellow snake keepers.

Value is what you can get for your snake. If you're happy selling pieds for 500.00 then that's their value to you. Who gives a flippy dip what anyone else says?

A LOT of you folks seem to want to dictate what you can get for YOUR snakes. Good luck with that.

I breed FWCs. I think I'm the originator of the hypo strain in this snake. I've been selling hets and hypos for years and superhypos for a couple of years. I produce a fair number of these snakes as do several other breeders. They sell theirs, which are often related to mine, for half what I do. Crap happens. I usually have babies year round because I don't lower my prices past what I want. You will probably see the same ad on KS week after week but you know what? I'll sell em all for what I want if I'm willing to wait. I could sell them all for less just like the other guys, and quicker too, but I'm not in any hurry so I wait it out.

You can't control, nor should you be able to, what anyone else sells their stock for.

You can, however, quit complaining about how unfair it is that joe-nobody sold his babies for half what you, YOU, think he should have and is now happily vacationing in Vegas while you shovel snake poop and people tell you you're over charging. Welcome to Life 101, sometimes it sucks.

BUT, when you get over it, it feels good to get what YOU know your babies are worth, even if you did have to wait 6 months to get it.

Heck, those calkings you see at every show for 20 bucks or less.... back when I first started breeding them big time I was getting more than 100.00 each.

Times change, people grow their babies up, prices go down.

A bunch of you talk about not breeding for the money but for the love of your snakes and seeing them do what they do. If you are not lying through your pants, then what, if ANYTHING, you get for your babies is irrelevant and you should politely excuse yourself from any conversation regarding prices since they don't matter to you. If you don't care about the money, why does it matter what they sell for?

I think is sucks that my many generations of work calkings are sold so cheaply by so many, but such is life. I'm not real fond of the fact that I help cheap FWC breeders sell but I'm not a discount house, and, such is life.

If you can't handle the ups and down down downs of this market, perhaps stamps or coins would be of more interest and less stress. Give it consideration.

[wilomn]

Totally agree.

I think a lot of people selling at low prices don't plan on keeping any unsold animals so better to sell them at $150 and get rid of them than wait a few weeks/months to sell them for an appropriate price. It seems irresponsible to me. Look at pure breed dogs... everyone knows to find a good breeder and the "bargain hunters" go to back yard breeders for puppies of low quality. You may save $500 on an English Bulldog but what are you going to spend extra at the vet throughout its life. Not saying its exactly the same with BPs but personally I would rather spend more on a great looking morph than less on one thats "ok". There are just people out there that don't care if their pastel is browned out or bright yellow, and thats fine, you love your snake no matter what.

The best solution seems to be the one where breeders hold firm to there prices and the buyers who want great animals from a reputable breeder will eventually buy them. And a record of current FAIR MARKET VALUE would be extremely helpful too.

Do you breed for money or fun?

[Freakie_frog]

Heres where the love of the animals comes in. I'm with Wes on this. If I never sale another snake guess what..I'm happy. I don't mind the feeding/cleaning/biteing/hissing. Ok I lied the biteing I mind.

Like Wes said

You can, however, quit complaining about how unfair it is that joe-nobody sold his babies for half what you, YOU, think he should have and is now happily vacationing in Vegas while you shovel snake poop and people tell you you're over charging.

If your more worried about the money..as a hobbiest breeder..Your in it for the wrong reasons. No if you got to sale snakes to put food on the table..then by all means whine about prices..I'm just not to that point in this venture.....YET.

[stratus_020202]

Value is what you can get for your snake. If you're happy selling pieds for 500.00 then that's their value to you. Who gives a flippy dip what anyone else says?

A LOT of you folks seem to want to dictate what you can get for YOUR snakes. Good luck with that.

Agreed. In this time, I think you get what you pay for. An expensive morph from a breeder you trust is most likely going to be well worth it. Rather than a cheap one off KS.

[wilomn]

Agreed. In this time, I think you get what you pay for. An expensive morph from a breeder you trust is most likely going to be well worth it. Rather that a cheap one of KS.

No, that's not my point, though it is a sometimes valid one.

Who the breeder is isn't so important anymore.

As was mentioned, no one has an exclusive on genes for long. The hets go, the visuals go and though it may be a while, the very same snake the orginator produces and sells for 1000.00 can also be produced by joe-nobody, who bought that bloodline, for 500.00.

If the babies are healthy, it doesn't matter who you get them from.

Does Brian B, or ian or any of those other guys know more than members here? I know Brian is a swell guy, but are his snakes any better because he's Brian?

IF it's just the snake you want and not the privilege of bragging about WHO you got it from, then any snake that was healthy and had the looks and genetics you wanted SHOULD suffice for your needs, whether it comes from one of the big guys or not.

With Ball Pythons, unless you're getting in on something very very, like first or second generation new, there is no need to buy from a big name and pay big money.

There is NOTHING WRONG with buying for less IF you're happy with the purchase.

[jsmorphs2]

Do you breed for money or fun?

I totally breed for the fun of it!!! I love my animals and plan my breeding projects very carefully. I am 100% committed to keeping every animal I breed if I am not able to sell them.

Why do you ask?