Do these enclosures look salvageable?

Been looking around in online classifieds for enclosures to upgrade for my BP, and I've found a couple fixer-uppers that I'm not sure about pursuing further. To quote the ad:

"They are heavy duty steel frame cages with bolt in melamine. They are 4 foot long 22inches wide 18 inches tall. The wood can be replaced and the acrylic can be replaced but it is all fine. Heating pad and light socket are built into each of these cages. some of the wood is splintering and some of the acrylic is cracked but with some simple work these can be very nice cages again."

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...16&oe=6073B2FA
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...13&oe=60726780
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...4a&oe=60736615
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...8e&oe=60754E9F
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...12&oe=6074FD8F
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...e8&oe=6076168E
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...8a&oe=60738B3A

They're asking $150 for both, which will obviously be offset by needed repairs but even still. Plus I have a mother who's very DIY-orientated who'd be able to help with that sort of thing.

I'd sooner start from scratch & build something good- sorry, but I'd run the other way from these.

And not only that, but what I've always said about buying used glass tanks applies here too: you have to wonder what the previous occupants died from, & how on earth are you going to disinfect this?

To me, not worth the risk or the trouble. They remind me of that old movie "The Money Pit" about a couple that buys a huge "bargain" of a house that just needs a few fix-ups- but it turns out to be way more than they bargained for, & not in a good way.

I build all my enclosures with melamine.

For one, it’s insanely heavy. But it’s also insanely cheap.

You could potentially build brand new melamine enclosures from scratch for $150. It wouldn’t have the steel frame, but that part isn’t really necessary.

Agree with all the above. You really are better off buying the material and building it yourself. It's much easier than it seems. You just need time... and, buying these would be equally (if not more) time-consuming.

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I feasibly could build one myself, but it'd require a good amount of help from my mother (my construction skills are poor) and she's already got a lot on her plate with building projects of her own. We just started a redoing of our garden beds to get ready for spring for example.

That and when I was lamenting about my enclosure upgrade issues to her earlier, she asked why don't I just move him to the 55 gallon I have sitting around (used to have fish in it but I recently upgraded to a bigger aquarium so it's sitting derelict). But I REALLY don't want to deal with a tank for him again. Not only would I have to yet another round of retrofitting like getting a screen lid, blocking off 3 sides and try to find a better humidity-retaining top, but the taller height will make it even harder to clean. Not to mention all the vertical space would be wasted. Haven't seen him climb on the branches I set up for him since his first month living here.

Then I'd keep looking for better options if I were you. I'm not exactly in "construction" either, but I've done some furniture modifications (for snakes & other purposes) over the years, as well as building cage tops for all my tanks. The more stuff you try, the more satisfying it is to tinker around with things. I've done some furniture finishing too. It's not that hard, but the amount of work those enclosures need is worse than starting fresh. You might consider hiring a handyman to help you with part of it & still come out better than trying to fix up those things. Once wood starts splintering & acrylic is cracking (etc) it's the equivalent of a car that's been in a wreck bad enough to fire off the air-bags, which is why insurance companies throw in the towel & say they're totaled.

Yeah... Wasn't too hot on them from the get-go honestly, but figured I'd get extra opinions anyway.

There's this 6'x23"x11.5" one for $350 with built-in LEDs, but it'd be something of a drive.
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...08&oe=60733533
https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...a8&oe=607598E7

Unless I'm missing the point and should avoid used enclosures altogether? I don't know, I'm just trying to find a solution that isn't going to take half a year, break the bank, cause my folks too much inconvenience (my mother in particular has been stressed about a number of things as of late so I'm trying my best to not bother her too much), and all without sacrificing quality to give my BP the best home he deserves.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Unless I'm missing the point and should avoid used enclosures altogether? I don't know, I'm just trying to find a solution that isn't going to take half a year, break the bank, cause my folks too much inconvenience (my mother in particular has been stressed about a number of things as of late so I'm trying my best to not bother her too much), and all without sacrificing quality to give my BP the best home he deserves.

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It's totally your decision, but consider that every little crevice (inside & out!) needs a thorough cleaning & disinfection, otherwise if the previous occupant of a used cage died of something like IBD, please realize that (a) the person selling the cage isn't going to volunteer that information, & (b) you're putting your pet's health at risk if you don't do a thorough job of cleaning it. So just the cleaning is a real hassle (see below*) to be safe, not counting repairs you need to make, & hauling it home. Many people do buy used tanks & enclosures to save money, it's your decision. You just have the one BP to house? How big & how old is he? That second one above is 6' long...are you sure that's what you want or need for a BP? The bigger the cage, the harder it is to heat, don't forget (& especially if you live in a colder climate). ;) Your intentions are admirable, but I'd hate to see you rush into a bad choice. Shop around for a while.

*https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...=1#post2749346

Yeah it's definitely way too big for him... He's 9 months old and 383 grams last I weighed him.

Sorry, I'm probably panicking a bit. It's just from watching him grow it's apparent how soon it'll be that he'll start to get cramped where he is now. I've been saving his shed skins and from his first shed here to the third one he just sloughed off today he's about doubled in size. I get that I have more time than I realize given it's a BP (he's as textbook as they come and barely moves 99% of the time), but I'm nonetheless antsy about finding a solution for his permanent adult home.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Yeah it's definitely way too big for him... He's 9 months old and 383 grams last I weighed him.

Sorry, I'm probably panicking a bit. It's just from watching him grow it's apparent how soon it'll be that he'll start to get cramped where he is now. I've been saving his shed skins and from his first shed here to the third one he just sloughed off today he's about doubled in size. I get that I have more time than I realize given it's a BP (he's as textbook as they come and barely moves 99% of the time), but I'm nonetheless antsy about finding a solution for his permanent adult home.

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So really, take your time- if you still want to consider a used enclosure, you don't want to be buying someone's "train wreck"- be picky! (Might try running a free "want" ad too?)

I'm not a fan of the PVC-acrylic enclosures (I tried a couple in the past, but I keep mostly colubrids & much prefer glass tanks), but anyway, I'm trying to recall, there used to be one or 2 companies that would send you the pieces to assemble the enclosure yourself. That saves a lot of $ on the shipping, & it's faster because they don't have to make it & store it someplace- but I just don't remember which ones did that, nor do I know if anyone still does? -but others here might know, so just ask.

IF for any reason you can't find or afford what you really want & you feel your BP needs more room quickly, you could always do a "tub" conversion as a temporary solution- it's not my personal preference, but many here use tubs one way or another & can advise you on setting one up. That would honestly be better than buying a used enclosure that's in bad shape, risky for your pet, or the wrong size. That would "buy you plenty of time" to shop for just the right thing.

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

So really, take your time- if you still want to consider a used enclosure, you don't want to be buying someone's "train wreck"- be picky! (Might try running a free "want" ad too?)

I'm not a fan of the PVC-acrylic enclosures (I tried a couple in the past, but I keep mostly colubrids & much prefer glass tanks), but anyway, I'm trying to recall, there used to be one or 2 companies that would send you the pieces to assemble the enclosure yourself. That saves a lot of $ on the shipping, & it's faster because they don't have to make it & store it someplace- but I just don't remember which ones did that, nor do I know if anyone still does? -but others here might know, so just ask.

IF for any reason you can't find or afford what you really want & you feel your BP needs more room quickly, you could always do a "tub" conversion as a temporary solution- it's not my personal preference, but many here use tubs one way or another & can advise you on setting one up. That would honestly be better than buying a used enclosure that's in bad shape, risky for your pet, or the wrong size. That would "buy you plenty of time" to shop for just the right thing.

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Something my mother brings up every time I mention tubs, and one I keep forgetting a good answer for, how do you heat those without, well, melting the plastic? Do UTHs not get hot enough (if regulated which of course mine is)? And how do I use the CHE since that would definitely melt the plastic lid? Cut out a hole and cover it with a wire mesh for it to hover over (not sit directly on)?

As an aside though, your comment on colubrids is exactly why I'm going to lowkey try and keep the tanks as they would actually appreciate the verticality of a tank and on average they aren't as picky about humidity. And given my dream snake just happens to be a colubrid (Vietnamese blue beauty rat snake), all the more reason to do so. Though at 7-8 feet it would outgrow even a 55, but they'd make for nice "growing out" enclosures.

Of course, the priority now is to get my current snake's living quarters situation all squared away first. I've always had a problem with thinking too far ahead though, sue me. :P

Some UTH "can" get hot enough to at least warp plastic, but that's why you regulate all heat sources, & follow safety instructions for setting up UTH, ie. leave a little air gap to reduce the chance of them over-heating. ;) Still, it's one more reason I love glass: I cannot melt it, nor does it scratch easily. Also nice visibility, & also easy to insulate if needed.

I've seen some tubs modified for CHE, & yes to your general description. Again, not my favorite thing, but I suppose one can make it work safely.

Thinking ahead is a GOOD thing, but not if it makes you buy something that's way more trouble than it's worth. Those first enclosures you asked about...they'd have to pay me to take them & I still wouldn't, lol. Also, shopping for used enclosures online is a bit like shopping for a house or a car online- wait until you see it in person, be critical about looking it over, & take your time doing so. Always be prepared to say "sorry, no thank you" & walk away. It's amazing how things look perfect for our needs online, but when you see it in reality, you realize how deceptive those pictures were, & how much they left out. (I think that's because our minds see what they "want" to see- it's easy to assume the best, that it's a great deal you don't want to miss out on, lol. Good sales people know how to use this to their advantage & they rely on doing so.)

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

Some UTH "can" get hot enough to at least warp plastic, but that's why you regulate all heat sources, & follow safety instructions for setting up UTH, ie. leave a little air gap to reduce the chance of them over-heating. ;) Still, it's one more reason I love glass: I cannot melt it, nor does it scratch easily. Also nice visibility, & also easy to insulate if needed.

I've seen some tubs modified for CHE, & yes to your general description. Again, not my favorite thing, but I suppose one can make it work safely.

Thinking ahead is a GOOD thing, but not if it makes you buy something that's way more trouble than it's worth. Those first enclosures you asked about...they'd have to pay me to take them & I still wouldn't, lol. Also, shopping for used enclosures online is a bit like shopping for a house or a car online- wait until you see it in person, be critical about looking it over, & take your time doing so. Always be prepared to say "sorry, no thank you" & walk away. It's amazing how things look perfect for our needs online, but when you see it in reality, you realize how deceptive those pictures were, & how much they left out. (I think that's because our minds see what they "want" to see- it's easy to assume the best, that it's a great deal you don't want to miss out on, lol. Good sales people know how to use this to their advantage & they rely on doing so.)

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Completely valid points, but I was alluding to the whole "Thinking about new snake when current snake's needs should be taken care of first" when I mentioned thinking too far ahead. I'm certain it's far from being a thing exclusive to me though. ;)

Regardless, I must be responsible and ensure the needs of the life I'm already in charge of are fully met before even considering taking on another. Especially one who's species could be considered more advanced in terms of care and handling.

Agreed with everyone else telling you to skip on the ones you were originally looking at, and it sounds like you may have made that choice already.

Just to throw my 2 cents in, I also use glass tanks like Bogertophis for my BP, spotted python, and two hognoses. For the BP I've had a tremendous amount of success making some very cheap modifications to the enclosure and my set up now holds humidity and heat very well. I know you may not want to, but it is the cheaper option just to modify something you already have.

That being said, I have a Animal Plastics T10 on order for the BP because he's gonna need the room eventually. For what you were looking to spend on those first enclosures you posted about, why not take a look at some of the PVC options available? Animal plastics, while it'll take forever to get them, has some good options and their T8 is currently on sale for just a few bucks more than what you were gonna spend on those used ones.

Also to echo what is being said about used enclosures. You have to consider why that enclosure is empty. Is this person just getting out of the hobby and rehomed the animal that was in it? Or did the animal have something wrong with it that may still be present in there for your BP to pick up. Take your time looking and then be sure to do a thorough cleaning before moving your snake into anything new or used. It's up to you, but for the price of some of the used enclosures you've linked, you might as well get yourself something new.

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Originally Posted by Hugsplox

Agreed with everyone else telling you to skip on the ones you were originally looking at, and it sounds like you may have made that choice already.

Just to throw my 2 cents in, I also use glass tanks like Bogertophis for my BP, spotted python, and two hognoses. For the BP I've had a tremendous amount of success making some very cheap modifications to the enclosure and my set up now holds humidity and heat very well. I know you may not want to, but it is the cheaper option just to modify something you already have.

That being said, I have a Animal Plastics T10 on order for the BP because he's gonna need the room eventually. For what you were looking to spend on those first enclosures you posted about, why not take a look at some of the PVC options available? Animal plastics, while it'll take forever to get them, has some good options and their T8 is currently on sale for just a few bucks more than what you were gonna spend on those used ones.

Also to echo what is being said about used enclosures. You have to consider why that enclosure is empty. Is this person just getting out of the hobby and rehomed the animal that was in it? Or did the animal have something wrong with it that may still be present in there for your BP to pick up. Take your time looking and then be sure to do a thorough cleaning before moving your snake into anything new or used. It's up to you, but for the price of some of the used enclosures you've linked, you might as well get yourself something new.

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At least with AP products in particular (who seem to be the best bang for your buck that I've seen), the issue hasn't been so much price as it is the potential waiting time. The idea of waiting MONTHS for something you paid a good amount of money for is admittedly a little daunting. And the idea of it taking so long that he might outgrow his current home so I have to make a second temporary enclosure until his true permanent one arrives feels a little silly for lack of a better word.

But, that may be my best option at this point anyway. I guess one way to look at it is if getting a T8 really does take so long to the point of needing to modify my 55 gallon to accommodate his growing size, then at least it will already be set for something else in the future (as I've already alluded to) once his permanent home does arrive.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

... I guess one way to look at it is if getting a T8 really does take so long to the point of needing to modify my 55 gallon to accommodate his growing size, then at least it will already be set for something else in the future (as I've already alluded to) once his permanent home does arrive.

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In my experience, good tanks or enclosures rarely go to waste...something always seems to move in? :rofl:

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

At least with AP products in particular (who seem to be the best bang for your buck that I've seen), the issue hasn't been so much price as it is the potential waiting time. The idea of waiting MONTHS for something you paid a good amount of money for is admittedly a little daunting. And the idea of it taking so long that he might outgrow his current home so I have to make a second temporary enclosure until his true permanent one arrives feels a little silly for lack of a better word.

But, that may be my best option at this point anyway. I guess one way to look at it is if getting a T8 really does take so long to the point of needing to modify my 55 gallon to accommodate his growing size, then at least it will already be set for something else in the future (as I've already alluded to) once his permanent home does arrive.

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I won't lie I was a little hesitant ordering from them too. I've been waiting on mine since September, so I can understand the frustration of spending money and then not seeing the result for months and months. I've made a few comments on here, whether right or wrong, I think if you have to put as big of a disclaimer on recommending something as we all do AP products than there's an issue. Don't get me wrong, they are arguably some of the best enclosures on the market, but if they can only be the best if you can get your hands on one.

That being said, there some other highly recommended PVC vendors that you could take a look at if you're interested. All at varying prices, but some of them have much shorter lead times than AP does.

Worst case though, you end up having to wait and set that 55 up as a temporary house, then you have it ready to go for a new friend down the road!

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Originally Posted by Bogertophis

I'd sooner start from scratch & build something good- sorry, but I'd run the other way from these.

And not only that, but what I've always said about buying used glass tanks applies here too: you have to wonder what the previous occupants died from, & how on earth are you going to disinfect this?

To me, not worth the risk or the trouble. They remind me of that old movie "The Money Pit" about a couple that buys a huge "bargain" of a house that just needs a few fix-ups- but it turns out to be way more than they bargained for, & not in a good way.

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I bought the townhouse version of that house from the movie, I’d laugh, but it hurts....Lmfao

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Originally Posted by Sonny1318

I bought the townhouse version of that house from the movie, I’d laugh, but it hurts....Lmfao

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I once bought the 1994 Chevrolet Monte Carlo version of that house, don't feel bad. :rofl:

I'm so glad I could dredge up such fond memories for you both. :rofl: (sorry!)

Be it ever so humble, there’s no place like home. Big Love young lady!

I’d go with the AP T10 as well. Excellent enclosure and worth the wait. There are other really good companies out there too that should have shorter lead times.

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Originally Posted by Sonny1318

Be it ever so humble, there’s no place like home...

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Except those first "homes" were a little TOO 'humble'. ;)

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Originally Posted by EL-Ziggy

I’d go with the AP T10 as well. Excellent enclosure and worth the wait. There are other really good companies out there too that should have shorter lead times.

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What difference does the extra 3 inches in height offer? Easier cleaning? It's a BP we're talking about here so I don't think he'd care either way but I'm curious.

As an aside, anybody have experience with Boamaster cages? They have prices similar to AP but with quicker shipping rates of a few weeks or so (well, allegedly anyway, not naive enough to think they're not also swamped with orders). But even then, it's still probably be a faster turnaround.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

What difference does the extra 3 inches in height offer? Easier cleaning? It's a BP we're talking about here so I don't think he'd care either way but I'm curious.

As an aside, anybody have experience with Boamaster cages? They have prices similar to AP but with quicker shipping rates of a few weeks or so (well, allegedly anyway, not naive enough to think they're not also swamped with orders). But even then, it's still probably be a faster turnaround.

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The extra height was recommended to me for cleaning, makes it easier getting in there to tidy up. That being said, my BP loves to climb at night, and I often find him curled up on one of the branches I have in his enclosure just hanging out.

I’ve never purchased from Boamasters, but they are one of the other vendors that I’ve been recommended several times. Hopefully one of the guys that have some will drop their opinions in for you.


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Originally Posted by Hugsplox

The extra height was recommended to me for cleaning, makes it easier getting in there to tidy up. That being said, my BP loves to climb at night, and I often find him curled up on one of the branches I have in his enclosure just hanging out...

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The 2 HDPE-plastic enclosures I had were 12" high & I hated that. As you said, it makes cleaning very awkward, & a little more height never hurts for the occupants either. :gj:

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

What difference does the extra 3 inches in height offer? Easier cleaning? It's a BP we're talking about here so I don't think he'd care either way but I'm curious.

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If you add the shelf and use larger hides that extra 3” makes a world of difference. If you don’t have the shelf then the T8 will be fine for a BP.

Not about to jump to a decision just yet, but if I go with AP, a sliding glass door T10 with LEDs (I've heard they carve a groove for them plus an exit point for the electrical wire which sounds very nice), door locks and maybe a basking shelf, still debating if it's worth adding that. Suppose it would make adding climbing material easier plus give him an extra elevation if he so chooses, but I never see him climb anything these days so I'm not sure if he'd even appreciate the extra commodity. :confuzd:

Also, how does the whole heat panel thing work? It says you have to purchase it separately on the other linked website (Pro Products) and have it shipped to their facility to install it for you.

As something of a preliminary measure, bought a screen lid for the 55 gallon. It even has a hinge down the middle so I don't necessarily have to take the entire thing off to access the tank.

And I think I'm going to place an order by the end of this week, we'll see. Still need to figure out how that heat panel installment thing works.

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

As something of a preliminary measure, bought a screen lid for the 55 gallon. It even has a hinge down the middle so I don't necessarily have to take the entire thing off to access the tank.

And I think I'm going to place an order by the end of this week, we'll see. Still need to figure out how that heat panel installment thing works.

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So the heat panel deal is super easy, and super fast. Pro Products is by far the easiest company I've ever worked with and not just when it comes to reptiles but just in general. You can do everything over the phone, just give them a call. The owner answers, let him know what size enclosure you're ordering (I just told him a AP T10 and he was good to go), what you're keeping in the enclosure, and what your ambient temps are in the room the enclosure will be in, and he'll recommend the best panel for you.

He'll ship the panel to AP who will install it for you in your new enclosure. Then you just have to wait for the enclosure to ship. Super easy process, it's the wait that'll get you.

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Originally Posted by Hugsplox

So the heat panel deal is super easy, and super fast. Pro Products is by far the easiest company I've ever worked with and not just when it comes to reptiles but just in general. You can do everything over the phone, just give them a call. The owner answers, let him know what size enclosure you're ordering (I just told him a AP T10 and he was good to go), what you're keeping in the enclosure, and what your ambient temps are in the room the enclosure will be in, and he'll recommend the best panel for you.

He'll ship the panel to AP who will install it for you in your new enclosure. Then you just have to wait for the enclosure to ship. Super easy process, it's the wait that'll get you.

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Should I call to place an order for the heat pack before or after I submit the order for the T10?

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Originally Posted by Snagrio

Should I call to place an order for the heat pack before or after I submit the order for the T10?

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I ordered my T10 first and then called Pro Products to order the heat panel. Bob will ship your heat panel probably within a week so it'll be at AP well before your enclosure is even close to be ready for it.

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Originally Posted by Hugsplox

I ordered my T10 first and then called Pro Products to order the heat panel. Bob will ship your heat panel probably within a week so it'll be at AP well before your enclosure is even close to be ready for it.

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I see. Thanks for the info. :gj:

Call Animal Platics first and place your order. That way you're put into queue. Then order from Pro Products. I spoke to Bob a few weeks ago, and they are behind about a month on lead times, due to COVID, and staff being I think infected, and quarantines. But, it won't matter because that T10 is gonna take awhile anyways. But... well worth the wait. Really is!

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Originally Posted by Charles8088

Call Animal Platics first and place your order. That way you're put into queue. Then order from Pro Products. I spoke to Bob a few weeks ago, and they are behind about a month on lead times, due to COVID, and staff being I think infected, and quarantines. But, it won't matter because that T10 is gonna take awhile anyways. But... well worth the wait. Really is!

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I repeated pretty much everything said above. Sorry. Responding quickly, without fully reading. We need a "smack myself" emoji for times like this.

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Originally Posted by Charles8088

I repeated pretty much everything said above. Sorry. Responding quickly, without fully reading. We need a "smack myself" emoji for times like this.

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Like this? :frustrate LOL