Need some help with putting a value on these snakes. I am new to the BP game

So i am negotiating a trade (i am trading bearded dragons) he is trading the snakes pictured. What do you guys n gals value these snakes at. Both are female. One is a 2 week old Firefly (he is saying 300) the other is a 5 month old lesser bee enchi(he is saying 500). would like a good estimate and range prices are fine. They look amazing to me but then again I am new ..

The two week old firefly is too young to be going anywhere so I would hope the actual trade will be happening in a few weeks after it's eating reliably. A reputable seller will make sure that a hatchling has taken at least 3 (I prefer 5) meals before going to a new home. At two weeks old it may not have even taken a meal yet.

The price on that one seems high to me, BHB has a 2015 on his site for $300 BUT he's a big name seller so he gets premium prices. There are 2 ads on Fauna now for other females, one is a 2015 for $200 and a 2013 for $325.

The lesser bee enchi will be harder to value as there are not many four-gene animals on the market, especially females. I would expect to see a higher price than $500 for one, even with the declining prices. I would also post a pic here to verify it is a four-banger rather than just a lesser bee or enchi bee.

http://i570.photobucket.com/albums/s...psnynrulya.jpghttp://i570.photobucket.com/albums/s...psnynrulya.jpg

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Originally Posted by newtothegame

http://i570.photobucket.com/albums/s...psnynrulya.jpghttp://i570.photobucket.com/albums/s...psnynrulya.jpg

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Lovely !

What is it ?

Any signs of wobble ??

That looks like a regular lesserbee, not enchi. I'd value a lesserbee like that at ~$250, give or take 50 bucks.

It is pretty but based on WoBP pics I'm not convinced it's a lesser bee enchi (lesser spider pastel enchi) or even a stingless bee (lesser spider enchi).

I'm also thinking it's a lesser bee (lesser spider). Not a $500 snake, maybe half that.

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Originally Posted by bcr229

The lesser bee enchi will be harder to value as there are not many four-gene animals on the market

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Lesser Bee sir not Queen Bee

Im with hooblah, not seeing and Enchi there either.
Not finding any females L/Bs either but males are in the $150ish range so you can figure a female would be around $300ish

As far as the Firefly, for $300 she better be smoking hot.
At a couole weeks out of the egg she probably hasnt eaten either. Are you comfortable with the headaches that can come with getting a hatchling to eat?

not sure why he would lie to me. said it took him 3 years to make this snake. Now if you trusted the guy selling what would you think? anyone have a picture of lesser bee enchi. i went to world of pythons didnt see one.

http://i570.photobucket.com/albums/s...pspj3ikgvz.jpg

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he said she has eaten twice.

pretty much only way to determine the morph is by looking at it correct? so if it doesnt look like it ....it isnt it. lol...even if it technically might be what he is saying the value just isnt there? He swears it wont produce any regular BPs. But i guess until you breed it you just dont know. So lets say it is what he says it is. whats the value? i might take a gamble on this. I have delt with this guy before and i dont think he would intentionally try to pull one over me

pretty much only way to determine the morph is by looking at it correct? so if it doesnt look like it ....it isnt it. lol...even if it technically might be what he is saying the value just isnt there? He swears it wont produce any regular BPs. But i guess until you breed it you just dont know. So lets say it is what he says it is. whats the value? i might take a gamble on this. I have delt with this guy before and i dont think he would intentionally try to pull one over me. enchi just looks like more orange right? in the picture the colors are washed out bit

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Originally Posted by newtothegame

pretty much only way to determine the morph is by looking at it correct? so if it doesnt look like it ....it isnt it. lol...even if it technically might be what he is saying the value just isnt there? He swears it wont produce any regular BPs. But i guess until you breed it you just dont know. So lets say it is what he says it is. whats the value? i might take a gamble on this. I have delt with this guy before and i dont think he would intentionally try to pull one over me. enchi just looks like more orange right? in the picture the colors are washed out bit

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Either by visually identifying the morph or by proving it out (which takes YEARS).

Lots of people get a little too excited and claim they have ALL genes in their snakes despite others trying to correct them. Some people just will not change their minds, regardless of the evidence. To them, they produced what they said they produced. It's not necessarily them trying to pull a fast one or to be deceptive, but they just don't like it when people correct them...

Value is not only determined by the number of genes squeezed into the snake, but also the quality. If that were in fact an Enchi Lesser Spider (which I don't believe it is), then it's a low expression enchi, and I would try to advertise it for around $300, especially since I'd have to convince people who know what they're looking for that Enchi exists in that combo.. Just keep in mind, quality in = quality out. The price might be great for you, but don't complain when you can't identify the enchis or spiders in your clutches, or if you do photo updates and people will constantly point out that they don't think you have Enchi in your snake. To me, it's not worth the gamble. But if you don't really mind, then that's all you :gj:!

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Originally Posted by newtothegame

pretty much only way to determine the morph is by looking at it correct? so if it doesnt look like it ....it isnt it. lol...even if it technically might be what he is saying the value just isnt there? He swears it wont produce any regular BPs. But i guess until you breed it you just dont know. So lets say it is what he says it is. whats the value? i might take a gamble on this. I have delt with this guy before and i dont think he would intentionally try to pull one over me

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With standard incomplete dominant morphs like these (Lesser, Spider, and Enchi), yes - they're either there or they're not.

Whoever this guy is, he's losing a bit of credibility IMO. A Lesser Bee Enchi (IF it has Enchi, which I don't see either) is only a 3 gene animal and not a Super form of anything. This guy is either blowing smoke, doesn't know what he's talking about, or both if he's telling you it won't produce any normals. There's a 12.5% chance that a 3-gene animal (again, no Super) won't pass along any of those genes when paired, meaning that there's a 12.5% chance at producing a normal. For a 2-gene animal, those odds double.

Ultimately though, if you like the looks of these animals and agree on what you believe to be a fair price, then go ahead and make a deal with him. Just try to educate yourself a bit about what you are getting into, just like you're already doing by asking these questions in the first place. :)

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

Lesser Bee sir not Queen Bee

Im with hooblah, not seeing and Enchi there either.

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Pssss, I'm not a sir. :P

I don't see enchi in that snake either.

yeah Im pulling out on that one. i think all you guys make super valid points and I will agree with you. Would be unwise not to. So hows that firefly look? $200 snake at the min right? when i compare to other pictures she is pretty bright what would you rate the quality on her?

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Originally Posted by newtothegame

yeah Im pulling out on that one. i think all you guys make super valid points and I will agree with you. Would be unwise not to. So hows that firefly look? $200 snake at the min right? when i compare to other pictures she is pretty bright what would you rate the quality on her?

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FWIW, look up Stingless Bee on WOBP to see pics of what it should look like. That is the "fun name" for an Enchi Lesser Spider.

aww yeah i just dont see the resemblance at all. very washed orange if any on this one. great job people you saved me some coin or at least frustration down the road. oh what did we ever do without the internet years ago. lol I do like the firefly tho. anyone want to trade me any type of pied? i really am just looking for a pet maybe breed down the road.

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Originally Posted by bcr229

Pssss, I'm not a sir. :P

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:oops: In my old defense.....I only see your fingerprints. LoL

Here is a link to a site advertising a lesser stinger bee. http://nicebalz.com/lesser-stinger-bee-ball-python

Big difference from the one in the picture you provided. Draw your own conclusion.