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Weird hatchling
Well this girl here is the only survivor from a bad clutch...my 1st clutch this year...7 eggs (6 sluggs,1 bad shaped egg) she was from that bad shaped egg.
She looks like a super cinni to me.
But is it possible,since she came from a super pastel x pewter pairing?
Mom is pewter and a virgin,never been paired before.
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/07...7d37d387ca.jpg
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Re: Weird hatchling
If I am correct, black pastel and cinnamon create the same coloured animal. Very interesting if it just a normal super pastel to a pewter.
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Re: Weird hatchling
It is from a normal super pastel x pewter pairing...i have no black pastel gen in my bp collection.i'll post the sire and dame pics later.
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is this her first season?
with so many slugs and then a Super Cinnamon hatching out, I think she used retained sperm from last year or the year before that even, that could explain the number of slugs and the Super Cinnamon.
Andrew
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Very odd... almost seems like she has some pattern on her left side. Would be interesting to see her after she sheds. Just wondering... does she have a duck bill? Kind of looks like she does even though the super isn't possible in this clutch.
Could you have paired a different snake with her and forgot?
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Re: Weird hatchling
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Re: Weird hatchling
@Penultimate yes she have a duck bill
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Huh... yeah, that sure looks like a super cinny! Are you absolutely positive that you didn't put another male with her at any point in time? Do you have a cinnamon male?
Got to say though, with all those bad eggs, a super cinny is a pretty awesome reward to make up for it.
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Re: Weird hatchling
Yupp positive...i don't have any male with a cinny/black pastel gen...and never put any male with the pewter before this super pastel.
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Re: Weird hatchling
Quote:
Originally Posted by hanz
Yupp positive...i don't have any male with a cinny/black pastel gen...and never put any male with the pewter before this super pastel.
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Weird. How old was the mom when you got her?
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Re: Weird hatchling
Mom was about 5-6 months when i got her...weighing arround 400-500grams.
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Pretty results regardless.
If your are sure of the genetics going in, perhaps she is a new mutation?
Even of the odds are huge, they have to happen sometime don't they, in order to get morphs at all?
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This would be interesting to see a cluch off of.
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Re: Weird hatchling
Did you get her from a breeder or a Craigslist Joe? Could be they thought they could breed her at 500g..
I bought a normal het VPI from a collection sale, and 8 months later she's pregnant without any pairings from me.
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Re: Weird hatchling
I got her from a breeder friend..have asked him too,he is very sure he never paired her with any snake before
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This one is pretty puzzling! Are you going to hold her back? It'd be interesting to see if breeding gives some answers.
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Re: Weird hatchling
I'm thinking dad's also a pewter. If he's a super pastel then all offspring would be at least pastel, which the hatchling does not appear to be. Not seeing much head blushing on dad either.
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Re: Weird hatchling
Quote:
Originally Posted by DennisM
I'm thinking dad's also a pewter. If he's a super pastel then all offspring would be at least pastel, which the hatchling does not appear to be. Not seeing much head blushing on dad either.
Did you see the photo of the dad? Definitely not a pewter. Looks pretty standard for a super pastel, and I can guarantee that he does not have cinnamon or black pastel in him.
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Re: Weird hatchling
Wow, that's quite the mystery. I'd definitely repeat that pairing though.
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Hold on. I don't know much about how this works, but could it have been parthenogenesis? I mean, mom is a cinny. Or do those clutches result in "clones only"?
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Re: Weird hatchling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Penultimate
Hold on. I don't know much about how this works, but could it have been parthenogenesis? I mean, mom is a cinny. Or do those clutches result in "clones only"?
I had that thought, too. I think it's possible if the resulting baby is missing the normal/functional copy of the same gene that produces the cinnie mutation. So, one copy of the cinnie gene, and the other copy, which should be normal, is either not there, or won't work, so the snake is only left with a working cinnamon gene to tell it what appearance to produce.
Cooking dinner right now, so that's probably a terrible explanation. But one of the hypotheses for some paradoxes is quite similar -- just in the case of such paradoxes, the normal gene is only missing or defunct in sections of the snake, where as this baby is the whole body.
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This would be the third case of parthenogenesis I have heard of in the last two weeks......crazy!
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Looks like a super cinny. Hmm, well that is a very cool reward for the lone survivor of the clutch. My favorite morph. Congrats though, hope you can figure it out or replicate the pairing again :gj:
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Re: Weird hatchling
I will absolutely repeat the pairing...and the baby is definitely a hold back.
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Breeding the animal will be able to confirm what happened, cool stuff
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Re: Weird hatchling
Quote:
Originally Posted by MS2
This would be the third case of parthenogenesis I have heard of in the last two weeks......crazy!
seems like an unlikely frequency.
the after shed pics from the OP look like silver bullet maybe. it wouldn't explain a super cinny, but it would at least explain why no pastel from a super dad.
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Re: Weird hatchling
Quote:
Originally Posted by DennisM
seems like an unlikely frequency.
the after shed pics from the OP look like silver bullet maybe. it wouldn't explain a super cinny, but it would at least explain why no pastel from a super dad.
if that was the case, it could just be a malfunctioning normal allele, leaving the cinny allele to be expressed all by itself. The hobby calls it the nuller phenomenon.
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Re: Weird hatchling
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marissa@MKmorphs
Did you see the photo of the dad? Definitely not a pewter. Looks pretty standard for a super pastel, and I can guarantee that he does not have cinnamon or black pastel in him.
I guarantee you that you have a better chance of winning powerball every week for a month than you do of producing a super cinny from a super pastel x pewter pairing. Both our guarantees are worthless! LOL! ;)
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Re: Weird hatchling
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhhWatALoser
if that was the case, it could just be a malfunctioning normal allele, leaving the cinny allele to be expressed all by itself. The hobby calls it the nuller phenomenon.
yup. so I'm wondering how often this happens. I really have no idea, but I feel like it would be rare.
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this is pretty crazy! following this thread for sure! congrats on this amazing baby!
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Re: Weird hatchling
Quote:
Originally Posted by DennisM
yup. so I'm wondering how often this happens. I really have no idea, but I feel like it would be rare.
I've seen 2 posts of BEL coming from Lesser x Normal and a few other random genes. but yes seems to be rare. That would be for the best, malfunctioning genes being common wouldn't make a species last very long.
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Re: Weird hatchling
Are we sure that looks like a super cinny? I'm not an expert, and maybe it's my device, but that snake seems more silver then black/brown like most super cinnys that I'm used to. The color makes me think more of a dark silver bullet which, correct me if I'm wrong, is a super cin x pastel. Still odd though and very cool. Very pretty snake.
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Re: Weird hatchling
This is really cool - can't wait to see what next year's pairing produces (and what the little one produces when she's of age!)
Quote:
Originally Posted by hanz
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