Help identify my leo

I bought this guy from a local pet store for 80 bucks. They said he is a patternless albino. Thats all they said. What do yall think?http://s1257.photobucket.com/albums/...rniakingsnake/

Picture doesn't seem to work.

No picture. But I have had issues with tapatalk. Not sure what you are using.

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dang it. What do you use to upload photos? I tried to upload with photobucket

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Originally Posted by californiakingsnake

dang it. What do you use to upload photos? I tried to upload with photobucket

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You could just post an image code from photobucket.

http://i1257.photobucket.com/albums/...gsnake/leo.jpg

didnt think of that.... fleedle deedle. Now yeah please help identify this haha

Looks like a yellowed out Murphy's patternless to me. A larger photo would be more ideal.


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I cant make the image bigger without blurring it :/

Well, until can get a larger and clearer picture, I'll leave it at a yellowed Murphy's patternless. Not an albino in my opinion. :)


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http://i1257.photobucket.com/albums/...e/b35b2b50.jpg
try this one

I'll say that it is a patternless albino. I've had patternless het albino leos and albino leos but never a patternless albino. Again, pretty sure they had it labeled correctly. The question now is whether it is a Las Vegas, Tremper or Bell albino! Of course if you don't intend to breed it is irrelevant. Nice looking animal!

Thats the thing though, I am interested in breeding him. Say I wanted to breed him to a patternless mack snow, what i label the offspring as?

The offspring would all be patternless het albino. Half of them would be also be mack snow (and it would be obvious which ones were). You won't be able to tell which albino strain she is unless you buy an albino animal with known genetics (which strain of albino) from each strain and prove her out.

I really recommend learning a lot more about Leo's, their genetics, and morphology before breeding. Also purchasing genetically known animals too. Without knowing which strain of albino, you risk making normals het for both strains you end up mixing.

A good rule of thumb I follow is if you're unable to identify a Leo that is of the common morphs, then it's not yet time for you to breed anything but common morphs. Mack snows would be a good and fun choice, but make sure you get definite proof that it's a Mack because as adults they look like normals. You can only tell by looks that it's Mack when it's a baby. That pairing would make more Mack's and possibly supers. But never breed supers together because you'll get still births and major deformities.




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Originally Posted by Kodieh

But never breed supers together because you'll get still births and major deformities.

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I've never heard that and am not quite sure how it is possible. Care to elaborat? You've piqued my curiousity...

alright ill probably just keep him as a pet then, Ill get a pair of mack snows or something to breed.

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Originally Posted by californiakingsnake

alright ill probably just keep him as a pet then, Ill get a pair of mack snows or something to breed.

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What!? No way!! Don't let someone else spoil your fun because you don't know as much about morphs as they do! :colbert:

Anyway, all that it would take to learn the leopard gecko morphs is to go to VMSHerp.com and look at all their pictures of adults and for sale hatchlings and you'll be a pro in no time. Don't ever let someone make you think that you can't do something, and that is the worst excuse for not breeding that I have ever heard. I think that a case could be made for the assumption that most people with leopard geckos don't know what morph (if any) they have and, more impartantly, don't care, as they only have one or two and have no intention of ever breeding. We all had to start somewhere and you can breed WHATEVER animals you want, not that you need me to give you premission. Good luck finding that patternless mack snow. :)

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Originally Posted by gsarchie

I've never heard that and am not quite sure how it is possible. Care to elaborat? You've piqued my curiousity...

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Super snows, like their name, are a super form of the snow gene. As a result of that (something similar to super cinnys) they grow at a slower rate than other gecko morphs, and thus when mixed it intensifies the slow growth resulting in said still births and deformities. ;)

As for the breeding, it's one of those things that theres so many people breeding without knowledge of what they're doing (like mixing strains of albino) with "mutts" going around that it hampers some larger operations. It's not like ball pythons, where you can throw two together and make something, some times you end up (in Leo's) with normal double hets that won't produce something containing both genes (specifically the albinos again haha).


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Originally Posted by Kodieh

Super snows, like their name, are a super form of the snow gene. As a result of that (something similar to super cinnys) they grow at a slower rate than other gecko morphs, and thus when mixed it intensifies the slow growth resulting in said still births and deformities. ;)

As for the breeding, it's one of those things that theres so many people breeding without knowledge of what they're doing (like mixing strains of albino) with "mutts" going around that it hampers some larger operations. It's not like ball pythons, where you can throw two together and make something, some times you end up (in Leo's) with normal double hets that won't produce something containing both genes (specifically the albinos again haha).

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I'm aware of the different strains of albinos not being allelic and am familiar with a majority of the different morps found in leopard geckos. What made me ask about the mack snow comment is that by breeding a mack super snow to a mack super snow you will only produce more mack super snows, not some sort of mack super super snow, and if the parents were healthy then I see no reason why their progeny wouldn't be as well. The one leo egg that I incubated from a mack snow het tremp X patternless het tremper developed fully and thenn died in the egg before hatching. Maybe it was a result of what you mentioned?

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Originally Posted by gsarchie

I'm aware of the different strains of albinos not being allelic and am familiar with a majority of the different morps found in leopard geckos. What made me ask about the mack snow comment is that by breeding a mack super snow to a mack super snow you will only produce more mack super snows, not some sort of mack super super snow, and if the parents were healthy then I see no reason why their progeny wouldn't be as well. The one leo egg that I incubated from a mack snow het tremp X patternless het tremper developed fully and thenn died in the egg before hatching. Maybe it was a result of what you mentioned?

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It's possible. The slow growth feature is pretty prevalent when it comes to involving the super snow gene. But I couldn't say "yes" because there could be a million other things as well.


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He's very pretty. His body condition looks good but his tail looks all gibbled to me in that last photo, like it's kinked or he's losing weight and his tail is getting thinner.

Looks like a rainwater albino to me.

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He's very pretty. His body condition looks good but his tail looks all gibbled to me in that last photo, like it's kinked or he's losing weight and his tail is getting thinner.

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I agree actually, I have only had him for two days now though. He was like that when I bought him. Would you say lack of food? Lack of calcium? What would you recommend doing? The people at the store had absolutely no knowledge, and I even had to show them how to sex a leopard gecko haha.

Does it look all kinked in person or does it just look like it's thinning out?? If it is thinning I might take him to the vet to get checked for parasites and just make sure you feed him regularly. :)

It doesnt appear to be thinning

Alrighty, if it looks kinked then it could have been broken before and healed funny, or he could have MBD, or he could be born that way. You won't know unless you took him to the vet. If he's healthy otherwise I wouldn't worry... MBD is serious but it doesn't look like that to me.

Alright. Can they break off just the tip of the tail? Because the end of the tail does look very weird.

Yes, they can drop any part of their tail, they don't have to drop the whole thing. I've seen Leos who've dropped half or less of their tails.

One more question, how often and how much do you feed your leos? The pet shop told me two large crickets everyother day... I dont know if I should trust their word...

My one year old female can put away 8 large crickets a day if I let her. I usually do about 8 every other day for adults. Depending on how you want to go about it, a constant bowl full of meal worms in the cage wouldn't be a bad idea either. Variety is the key.


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I feed Gaia every 2nd day and she usually eats a few Superworms and then like 6-10 Mealworms. Sometimes I give her Crickets but not often because I hate them, and she gets Silkworms and Butterworms when I can get ahold of them.

2 Crickets every couple days is definitely not enough, especially for your big fella! That's probably why his tail looks like it's thinning to me.

Gaia eats that much and when it's feeding time she gets SUPER predatory and starts trying to get to the worms through the glass of the tank when I'm getting them ready, LOL. She has bitten me a couple of times because she was hungry and thought my finger was a worm.

I usually just give her as many as she wants.

I got a tub of superworms, but he refuses to eat them! He also has a hard time catching the crickets. But any ideas on how to switch him to worms?

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Oh!!! Do you dust your food with calcium every meal or what?

Not sure how to switch him to Superworms, just keep offering them, and make sure they are properly gutloaded.
As for the calcium thing... I dust my feeders every time with the Calcium with D3 except for once a week I use a Multivitamin instead and dust them with that. Then I leave a dish of plain calcium (no D3) in her tank at all times. :)

Alright, I will have to go find some calcium without D3, my local petsmart didnt carry it.

It's not a huge deal for Male Leos to have it in their tanks unless they are still growing, but if you don't know for 100% sure it's Male I would put it in. It's just an issue for growing Leos and Females as a precautionary measure incase they decide to lay eggs.

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Originally Posted by KTyne

Not sure how to switch him to Superworms, just keep offering them, and make sure they are properly gutloaded.
As for the calcium thing... I dust my feeders every time with the Calcium with D3 except for once a week I use a Multivitamin instead and dust them with that. Then I leave a dish of plain calcium (no D3) in her tank at all times. :)

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From my understanding, calcium WITHOUT D3 is what should be given to leos, as they get plenty of D3 from their prey items, and they can overdose on the vitamin. How long have you had your Leo?