Serious egg dimpling

These eggs were laid April 19, so its day 50. These eggs have started seriously dimpling for almost 2 weeks, and I don't know what to do. I started out using the substrate-less method ( on a light diffuser ) and when they started dimpling bad, I decided to go ahead and put them in a different tub on the substrate, since the previous years of eggs I have never had a problem like this. I was hoping that moving them onto the substrate might help them bounce back, but they have been slowly getting worse. I have been keeping a damp paper towel on them as well.

Here are a few pics of the eggs. If anybody has any suggestions on what I can do for them, please let me know!!

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...4/IMAG1257.jpg

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...4/IMAG1258.jpg

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...4/IMAG1262.jpg

I haven't had eggs yet, so no ideas. I hope they are ok for you though!! *fingers crossed*

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Thanks, me too. This is my ringer x spider clutch, and I am really looking forward to hatching out my first spider. I know, such a minor milestone to most, but super exciting for me.

They are probably about to hatch:D Since they are on day 50 and that dimpled I would cut them.

Every clutch is super exciting regardless of pairing! I don't know anything about how to help with dimpling, but I really hope they hatch out some fat and healthy little spiders. ;) I also hope someone can help you out with this. At least they don't have much longer to go right?

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Originally Posted by Domepiece

They are probably about to hatch:D Since they are on day 50 and that dimpled I would cut them.

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I, too, have thought about that, but seeing as day 50 is a tad bit early, I wanted to get some suggestions from others :) Thanks!

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Originally Posted by WarriorPrincess90

Every clutch is super exciting regardless of pairing! I don't know anything about how to help with dimpling, but I really hope they hatch out some fat and healthy little spiders. ;) I also hope someone can help you out with this. At least they don't have much longer to go right?

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Thank you! They don't have much longer to go, but I have been concerned with the lack of space in the eggs, if they aren't growing right/well. I hope they will be ok :please:

I don't have any experience myself, but I recently spoke with a local breeder about some of her 'horror' stories and one was when her clutch dimpled badly due to a humidity issue and she lost the whole clutch due to them being confined so tightly in such a small space.

I would seriously begin bumping this up and get some more experienced feedback.

Not trying to scare you, but that story instantly popped into my head as I saw your photos :please:

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Originally Posted by Vasiliki

I don't have any experience myself, but I recently spoke with a local breeder about some of her 'horror' stories and one was when her clutch dimpled badly due to a humidity issue and she lost the whole clutch due to them being confined so tightly in such a small space.

I would seriously begin bumping this up and get some more experienced feedback.

Not trying to scare you, but that story instantly popped into my head as I saw your photos :please:

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Yea, that's what I'm afraid of :(

Thanks for your concern and support. I'm hoping someone with more experience than I can definitely give me some pointers. If I have to cut the eggs, I will. I just want to make sure my babes are gonna be alright :please:

How long have they been this dimpled? You said two weeks, right? :-( That might give a better idea of the 'urgency' of this. I would personally cut early rather than risk the hatchlings being crushed to death. But that is my comfort zone, and might not be the best case given my lack of experience.

I really hope someone else can chime in here for you and get you a quick answer.

Candle the eggs. Look for good veins and movement. If you don't see any movement gently push the side of the egg in hopes it will cause it to move while in the egg. If they move just pip the eggs for them. If they don't move then I personally would cut these now. The Eggs Look ready to cut Day 50 is not early to cut when the eggs are so dimpled like this. Small Flap is all that is needed. Good Luck But I would not wait much longer to take action on these eggs.

Jonathan

Might be a good idea to cut a V shape flap in the eggs and see if they are getting dried out.

Thanks guys. I have candled them recently, but its hard to see anything since they are so deflated. I think I'm going to cut them a little and see how they are doing in there. If they are getting dried out in there, I should mist them with distilled water correct? I feel like such a newbie having to ask, but I've never had this happen before :(

Anyone else before I cut them? I just want to make sure I'm doing the right thing......

If you do cut and they are still alive and the fluid is clear then you should just leave them. If the fluid is not there and or is brown and discolored I would gently rinse with Saline Solution. Any drug store should have it. But only if there is no fluid or major discoloring. Best of Luck to you and you clutch. Quick Question? If what you used before to incubate other eggs worked for you then why did you switch to substrate-less method? Just curious.

Jonathan

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Originally Posted by trivtrivsocal

If you do cut and they are still alive and the fluid is clear then you should just leave them. If the fluid is not there and or is brown and discolored I would gently rinse with Saline Solution. Any drug store should have it. But only if there is no fluid or major discoloring. Best of Luck to you and you clutch. Quick Question? If what you used before to incubate other eggs worked for you then why did you switch to substrate-less method? Just curious.

Jonathan

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I have seen numerous people, and friends, have success with that method, and I thought I would give it a try. Apparently, its not for me. Thank you for all the help, I really appreciate it.

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Originally Posted by Vasiliki

I don't have any experience myself, but I recently spoke with a local breeder about some of her 'horror' stories and one was when her clutch dimpled badly due to a humidity issue and she lost the whole clutch due to them being confined so tightly in such a small space.

I would seriously begin bumping this up and get some more experienced feedback.

Not trying to scare you, but that story instantly popped into my head as I saw your photos :please:

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Same thing happened to me last year, my first time going substrateless too. My clutch ended up all severely deformed as a result of having no room (I assume), and all were culled as I didn't think they would really make it anyways. I would cut them immediately, to give them a chance.

I am REALLY crossing my fingers for you, and I hope your babes are okay. I definitely know first-hand how absolutely heart-wrenching it is to lose babies, so my fingers are crossed real tight!!

I have no experience breeding yet but i would personally follow the advice of what jonathan said, thats similar to what ive read in books.

I would stick with the substrate method from now on Heather, no need for more scares like this lol ;)

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

I have no experience breeding yet but i would personally follow the advice of what jonathan said, thats similar to what ive read in books.

I would stick with the substrate method from now on Heather, no need for more scares like this lol ;)

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Yea my last clutch went right on the substrate. I'll leave the substrate-less method for everyone else, lol.

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Originally Posted by heathers*bps

Thanks, me too. This is my ringer x spider clutch, and I am really looking forward to hatching out my first spider. I know, such a minor milestone to most, but super exciting for me.

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That's not minor! I would love to have a spider. They are still on my wish list. Did you cut?? How do they look???

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Originally Posted by DrDooLittle

That's not minor! I would love to have a spider. They are still on my wish list. Did you cut?? How do they look???

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x2

I would personally cut them. You're only 2 days before when I cut my eggs. They are awfully dimpled, and if they have been like that for two weeks that's not great. They do get really deflated near the end, but not that far away. My eggs are dimpling and just barely starting to get a little wrinkled and I'm two weeks away from day 52.

This is what my eggs looked like on day 52 (from last year), I pinched the top one because I cut them right after I took the picture.
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t...eeding/009.jpg

I forgot to say, you will be cutting them pretty early so you have to keep a close eye on them. I mist mine once or twice a day depending on how they look. If they are that dry it might even be more than that. I don't like my babies to get dry, and misting them cleans out all the gunk that builds up inside the egg.

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Originally Posted by heathers*bps

Yea my last clutch went right on the substrate. I'll leave the substrate-less method for everyone else, lol.

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I tried substrate-less this year and it's not for me either. After 2 weeks the eggs were already dimpling so I buried them in vermiculite. The dimpling has since filled back out except 2 eggs that are keeping a couple minor depressions each. I'm glad I at least tried it and I know people have much success with this method, it's just not for me. Just knowing those eggs are nestled safely down in that substrate helps me rest easy at night. Anyway, best of luck with the clutch, I'm keeping my fingers crossed for some healthy spiders!

So I cut them and they look great!! I think one was going to pip soon because its head isn't in any fluid. I'm super relieved that they are ok! I saw 2 spiders and 2 super nice normals :gj:

I will say that hubby is giving me a bunch of slack for cutting them. He says it was way too early and I'll be lucky if they live :rolleyes:

I just want to thank everybody that helped me. I really really appreciate it :D

Yay!! May we have pictures, please? :D

Have been following the thread and glad to hear the good news Heather!!!

Congrats on the clutch... :gj:

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Originally Posted by heathers*bps

Yea my last clutch went right on the substrate. I'll leave the substrate-less method for everyone else, lol.

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Very good!

Remember the ancient proverb: If it aint broke, dont fix it..... And if it is broke, then go get the duct tape! lol

This was the only one I could get a good pic of

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...4/IMAG1263.jpg

The rest didn't turn out so well, but I'll share

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...4/IMAG1264.jpg

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...4/IMAG1265.jpg

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...4/IMAG1266.jpg

They are all squiggling around so I am very much at ease!

They look good!

And as for what your husband said, imo, if they don't make it, it won't be because you cut them.

Oh, and don't worry about getting the eggs too wet from misting. I got carried away with this clutch and the edges of the eggs got pretty wet. It didn't hurt them any. I like to try and make flaps so I can get a good look and them, and close the egg back up.
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t...ding/001-3.jpg

Nice nails :P Oh and from what we see, beautiful babies. :)

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Originally Posted by SlitherinSisters

They look good!

And as for what your husband said, imo, if they don't make it, it won't be because you cut them.

Oh, and don't worry about getting the eggs too wet from misting. I got carried away with this clutch and the edges of the eggs got pretty wet. It didn't hurt them any. I like to try and make flaps so I can get a good look and them, and close the egg back up.

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Should I cut a better flap on them then, or is what I have sufficient? Your babies are super cute, btw :)

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Originally Posted by Jasonx

Nice nails :P Oh and from what we see, beautiful babies. :)

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Thanks! On my left hand, all my nails are painted pink, but my ring finger is black. And on my right hand, all are black, except my ring finger is pink. My kids thought I was weird :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by heathers*bps

Should I cut a better flap on them then, or is what I have sufficient? Your babies are super cute, btw :)

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you'll be fine with how you cut...good job:gj:. And day 50 isn't too early...it's just too early to cut them and constantly play around with them and poke them and such. I usually cut at 46-48 and haven't had issues yet...and had a girl crawl out of her egg today at day 53 and she's fine. As mentioned before, if you see any residue building up, mist them and dab at it with a tissue or cotton ball to clean the gunk out. Other than that, leave them be.

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Originally Posted by heathers*bps

Should I cut a better flap on them then, or is what I have sufficient? Your babies are super cute, btw :)

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I tried a couple different ways last year, and the one that worked best were those flaps in the last picture, but I didn't cut them big like that until their heads were out. As you can see in your pictures, they are still in the clear sack inside the egg. Once their heads are out of that, you can cut the flaps as big as you like, the veins will start fading as soon as they start breathing air, it will just require a tad more monitoring/misting if you go big.

This is the other way I tried it last year, it was kind of a pain, the babies dried out too quickly, although, it was cool to look at. I cut these on 54 since I was out of town 52 and 53.
http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t...ding/005-3.jpg

A trick I learned is this:

Keep a bottle of distilled water in the incubator with the eggs. Any time the babies look a little dry, or roughly once a day, I took a needle-less syringe and gently filled it with the warm distilled water and dribbled it into the eggs until it dripped out a bit. All my babies came out just fine after 5 or 6 days. The only thing of course is once the baby emerges from the membrane and begins to breathe, you have to be careful not to drown one on accident.

Gale

OMG HEATHER! So glad they are all okay!

Can't wait to see what they look like when they emerge.

Cutting is a very nerve-racking thing. My bf gave me flack for cutting this year too, but they were taking a very long time (I cut on day 57 or day 58, I believe, after incubating at 88.5-89 degrees). I was incredibly worried that I would have a repeat of last year, so that is why I cut. I did the same as you this year, cut with those little tiny curved scissors (I think they came in a manicure kit) just enough that I could see the baby inside, and then poked the outside of the egg a little bit to see if they squirmed. Once they did I was satisfied that my babies would be fine, and I just left them in the 'bator until they came out on their own.

Some people say don't cut them, because if they can't pip on their own, they weren't meant to be and we shouldn't be adding these weak snakes to the gene pool. However, this fails to account for any problems/imperfections due to our *ARTIFICIAL* incubation methods.

I will be eagerly awaiting your update!

Yay Heather!! Glad to hear they are okay! And 2 Spiders?!? Hooray!! Pretty good odds if I do say so myself. :gj: Congrats!

Whew... I can breath now, lol :). Glad your babies are ok. I think I will be so nervous cutting! Happy, happy, that your babies are all good!! Must have pictures when they are out! Nevermind Hubby, you have peace of mind now. :)

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that is awesome, im happy thing are doing good cant wait to see them come out of the eggs.

I am glad everything worked out for you! I personally don't cut before day 55 but those eggs did look pretty shrunk. Hatching any morph is a big deal to me. I am waiting on some Bees which I have wanted since I started with Balls. I could have gone out and bought one but what fun is that! Can't wait to see the pics when they are all out! Good luck!

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Originally Posted by Jasonx

Nice nails :P Oh and from what we see, beautiful babies. :)

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Im glad i wasnt the only guy who noticed that lol.:gj:

Nice babies heather, glad theyre all squirming around for you. Cant wait to see them once theyre outta the eggs!

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...4/IMAG1284.jpg

YAY Happy babies! Looks like someone is ready to explore in that pic! Glad all is well...How are you BTW are you better now? I know playing the waiting and worrying game is hard. But look you got cute babies!! Congrats!

:banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:

I love seeing those little heads. :D

awesome to hear heather cant wait to see them outta the eggs

Congrats! :gj::gj:

The egg to the right is another spider, the one below might be a spider but I'm thinking normal and the one to the left is a normal. I'm hoping someone is gonna be a ringer like their mommy, but I'll still be happy if not :)

Whoohoo! won't be long now!!

Congrats Heather!

As far as substrateless incubating goes, it's the only way I will incubate, I can't see how it would be harder than eggs in the substrate, but that's just me.
We have a 100% hatch rate doing substrateless, and had nothing but misery with eggs in the substrate.
To each their own though, there's a lot of ways to incubate and as long as you figure out a method that works for you, then go with it.
The end result is all that matters :gj:

Congrats again, lets see some baby pics when they emerge!

Yay!!! What a cute little spider head!!! I'm so glad they made it!

Glad to see you had a happy ending Heather it looked a little grim for a little while
Cant wait to see them out of the eggs :P