Just bought my first snake, a baby ball python. I have photos and a question.

Monday night I bought a baby ball python from the local pet store. I bought a basic set up for him that night and added a larger water dish and a hide the following day. The night I got him, as I was taking him out of his box to put him in his tank he struck at me...I wasn’t surprised considering the long car ride plus the time spent in the box while I set up the tank. But the following day as I was adding a bit of substrate he popped out of his hide and struck me. Again I’m not surprised he had barely just gone into his new hide and is still getting used to his new tank.

However my concern is that he has established my scent as something worth striking at. Do I simply wait a full week or two before attempting to hold him and go from there? Or should I put a sock or shirt in the tank to establish my scent as neither prey nor predator. Ultimately I want to nip this in the bud before he decides to always nip at me haha.

Any advice is greatly appreciated, I’m new to snake keeping and looking forward to having this BP around. Just don’t want him to develop any undesirable behavior.

Here is his current tank set up, 10g is small I know but he is a baby and I will be upgrading his tank as soon as I figure out this biting behavior.

http://i.imgur.com/chwPx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/KUtcJ.jpg

Welcome to the forum and welcome to the hobby of snake keeping! Were glad to have you.

As far as him striking at you...
I would say he just needs more time to acclimate to his new environment.
In addition, with him being in a fish tank the only way you come at him is from above. His instict would suggest predator. Try not to move at him very fast and try to stick your hand in the opposite end of the tank and come at him from his level, this may seem less threatening to him.
I do not belive they associate your scent something to strike it, IMO it would be the angle at which your hand is coming at him.
Just give him a few days to get used to things, and try feeding him after hes settled.

As a new snake keeper just be sure you have followed a caresheet in his husbandry setup and if everything is right you will have a happy and healthy snake!

I would wait a few days before attempting to handle him, he is probably really stressed out. Baby ball pythons are usually aggressive but as they get older most of them lose their temper. In the mean time check out this video. http://youtu.be/S7DQssbM0uk

While the sock/shirt trick works with dogs it doesn't do anything with snakes.

I wouldn't be worried at all, at this point he is just scared and needing to be left alone for at least a week so he can settle into his new house. (I would also suggest that you wait to try and feed him until then as well)

I see that you are using aspen, but what is the other substrate in there? I would be worried about the aspen molding.

I would also move the heat lamp directly over the hide. you need to get the hot side up to at least 88 degrees, (88-92 is the ideal range for the hot side, 78-82 degrees is ideal for the cool side. What type of bulb are you using? (white, red, blue, backlight?)

You also should really have a second hide on the cool side. this lets them thermoregulate while still being able to hide.

Here is the care sheet. I suggest that you read it: http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...ius)-Caresheet

He's probably just getting used to his new life. Plus he's young. These two factors can lead to him striking. I'd leave him alone for a week to settle in.

I'd also pick up another hide for his cool side, so he doesn't have to choose between hiding and a comfortable temperature.

I'd also aim to get that warm side up to around 90 and maybe move the thermometer farther to the cool side to get a full spectrum of the temps. Do you have a UTH? if so, is it attached to a thermostat or at least some sort of regulator?


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Once again, Aaron (among others) have beat me to it. ;)


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Originally Posted by DavidMundy

In the mean time check out this video. http://youtu.be/S7DQssbM0uk

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Not sure I like this guys angle...a snake is not a dog...you cannot "dominate" or train them to be submissive :confused:...I see this as just stressing out a hatchling that should be just left alone. A hatchling knows its vulnerable, so they can choose to be more strikey.
but this is just IMO

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Originally Posted by mues155

Not sure I like this guys angle...a snake is not a dog...you cannot "dominate" or train them :confused:...I see this as just stressing out a hatchling that should be just left alone. A hatchling knows its vulnerable, so they can choose to be more strikey.
but this is just IMO

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I've personally tried this and for me it worked 100% I got a baby pastel ball python (bought for my brother) about a month ago, he was very nippy at first but I did this about 5 consecutive times and he never struck at me again, it totally tamed him out.

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Originally Posted by DavidMundy

I've personally tried this and for me it worked 100% I got a baby pastel ball python (bought for my brother) about a month ago, he was very nippy at first but I did this about 5 consecutive times and he never struck at me again, it totally tamed him out.

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Well thats great then if that works out!I personally wouldnt choose the phrase that I "dominated" the snake in any way.
I believe they tolerate being handled, but thats a little different then an animal being submissive. again just IMO.
I'm glad if the method works though!

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Originally Posted by mues155

Well thats great then if that works out!I personally wouldnt choose the phrase that I "dominated" the snake in any way.
I believe they tolerate being handled, but thats a little different then an animal being submissive. again just IMO.
I'm glad if the method works though!

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Yea I completely understand where your coming from, I was just showing him a technique that worked for me and it might or might not work for him if he wishes to try it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mues155

Not sure I like this guys angle...a snake is not a dog...you cannot "dominate" or train them to be submissive :confused:...I see this as just stressing out a hatchling that should be just left alone. A hatchling knows its vulnerable, so they can choose to be more strikey.
but this is just IMO

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Justin is a great guy, and definitely knows what he is doing... but that video is for a specific situation. I don't think that "dominating" is the right word to describe what he is actually doing (I know that he says it himself...) what he is doing is forcing an animal into a defensive mode vs attack mode. The BP will quickly realize that biting isn't getting anywhere and "ball" up as that is their defense mechanism. This works because it operates on the most basic of all instincts, the fight or flight response. Once an animal realizes that fighting isn't going to work it will shift into flight mode (which in ball pythons is balling up lol) This isn't something that I would suggest for a new BP that is a little nippy, but rather for an established snake that is acting aggressive.

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Originally Posted by DavidMundy

he was very nippy at first but I did this about 5 consecutive times and he never struck at me again, it totally tamed him out.

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5 consecutive times? So 5 times in one sitting? All within how much time?

Also how did you get him out of the tank if he was nippy?

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Originally Posted by DavidMundy

Yea I completely understand where your coming from, I was just showing him a technique that worked for me and it might or might not work for him if he wishes to try it.

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Yes, and thats great I hope it does work for his bp like it did yours. Thats what were all here for! share our experiences and learn from them!

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

Justin is a great guy, and definitely knows what he is doing... but that video is for a specific situation. I don't think that "dominating" is the right word to describe what he is actually doing (I know that he says it himself...) what he is doing is forcing an animal into a defensive mode vs attack mode. The BP will quickly realize that biting isn't getting anywhere and "ball" up as that is their defense mechanism. This works because it operates on the most basic of all instincts, the fight or flight response. Once an animal realizes that fighting isn't going to work it will shift into flight mode (which in ball pythons is balling up lol) This isn't something that I would suggest for a new BP that is a little nippy, but rather for an established snake that is acting aggressive.

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Dont get me wrong I wanst trying to say he doesnt know what hes talking about. like i said its just using the words "dominate" and "submissive" just made me raise an eyebrow.
And yes it does put them in more of a flight mode but I dont believe either one behavior is less stressful on the snake.
If a hatchling is feeling threatened then its going to be until the threat is gone. Either it will fight or flight but I still feel with either behavior the snake will still feel uncomfortable.

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

This isn't something that I would suggest for a new BP that is a little nippy, but rather for an established snake that is acting aggressive.

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I agree

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Originally Posted by SrSkisAlot

5 consecutive times? So 5 times in one sitting? All within how much time?

Also how did you get him out of the tank if he was nippy?

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First I gave him around 10 days/2 feedings to relax and feel less stressed out. Then every day for 5 days or so I picked him up and did it for about 2 minutes and put him back in his cage. By the 6th day he didn't show any signs of aggression toward me whatsoever. If you own a ball python you will eventually get bit, even the nicest ones will sometimes strike at you. You just need to reach in an grab him, don't show any fear, his bark is worse than his bite trust me.


Edit: It is important to give him time before trying this, or even attempting to handle him period. Snakes aren't cats or dogs, they don't like to be held or stroked. While most tolerate it, it is still stressful for them.

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

This isn't something that I would suggest for a new BP that is a little nippy, but rather for an established snake that is acting aggressive.

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Gotcha.

I'm going to wait a least a week before attempting to feed him. Or even handle him for that matter. And then see what happens...

He is currently roaming his tank and whenever I get near the tank...he seems to get scared and heads back to his hide. He goes back in, a few minutes later pokes his head out and slowly comes back out...

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

I see that you are using aspen, but what is the other substrate in there? I would be worried about the aspen molding.

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The other stuff is from petco, is comes in a brick, you add water to it in a bucket and its supposed to help hold moister. I added it the second day because everything was evaporating so quickly I was having a hard time keeping it humid.

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

I would also move the heat lamp directly over the hide. you need to get the hot side up to at least 88 degrees, (88-92 is the ideal range for the hot side, 78-82 degrees is ideal for the cool side. What type of bulb are you using? (white, red, blue, backlight?)

You also should really have a second hide on the cool side. this lets them thermoregulate while still being able to hide.

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Ok, I'll pick up another hide soon. I'm currently using a small under tank heat pad dealy that came with the tank. I bought a dimmer for it so I could control the heat. I leave it at ~50% power. I have a thermometer probe in the substrate under the hide. I also use a 50 watt black bulb.

ok, the brick stuff is probably eco-earth or another brands equivalent. I would keep a close eye on the aspen for mold.

I would strongly suggest that you get a thermostat for the heating pad.

Here are 2 good thermostats. I would stay away from the thermostats sold in pet stores, they are overpriced and not the best.

The hydrofarm thermostat runs about $30 and will do what it needs to, but they aren't very accurate compared to better thermostats.

http://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-MTPR.../dp/B000NZZG3S

The Herpstat is the best you can get, they do have a higher price tag though... herpstats run $100+, but are certainly worth it (these are what I use) they are safer, and much more accurate. they also have more capabilities than your standard thermostat.

http://spyderrobotics.com/

The dimmer will work but if the temperature in the room changes the dimmer will have to be adjusted to maintain the proper temperature.

For heating pads to be effective the substrate layer should be no thicker than 1/2"

Another thing I just noticed. Do you have tape inside the tank? It looks like the thermometer/probe is taped to the back wall. That is a ticking time bomb... Ball Pythons are masters at getting themselves stuck to tape if presented the chance. It may seem really well stuck on now, but given time it will start to peal off and your snake will find a way to get stuck to it. If that happens the BP can be seriously injured. I would run the cord either under the substrate, or up and out of the tank, then back in to keep excess out of the tank.

While I am thinking about it, do you have anything securing the lid of the tank? Bp's are very strong and can easily escape. I would either put something heavy (back when I used glass tanks I used bricks) or these: http://www.petsmart.com/product/inde...ductId=3884237

Seconding a few things--absolutely get a controlling device for the heat pad. Absolutely don't use tape inside the enclosure--there's not a snake I have heard of that won't stick itself to tape, lol. It's really difficult to get the snake free of the tape, their skin is delicate.

The stuff in the brick is ground coconut fiber. Eco-earth is one brand name. It's ok for providing humidity, but don't use it everywhere in an enclosure, as ball python bedding should be dry--they are very prone to blister disease and skin infections in a damp environment. Humidity should be 60%.

As for nippy baby ball pythons--just leave them alone until they're older, and the vast majority of them will stop on their own. You can also use a tap stick to gently push the snake's head down and encourage it to ball up instead of striking. No dominating involved. Some hatchlings are so wired that you will need a mini snake hook to get through those first few months, though, lol. (We've had just a few over the years that will throw themselves all over the place trying to bite, and would not calm at all).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

I would keep a close eye on the aspen for mold.

I would strongly suggest that you get a thermostat for the heating pad.

For heating pads to be effective the substrate layer should be no thicker than 1/2"

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Ah, the aspen is about 1.5" and the other stuff is another 1/2". I'll remove lots of both.

If the aspen is pron to molding I might as well just replace it with something better, what do you recommend?

Cool, I'll look into these Herpstat's and hopefully get one soon.

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Originally Posted by The Serpent Merchant

Another thing I just noticed. Do you have tape inside the tank?

While I am thinking about it, do you have anything securing the lid of the tank?

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Yeah, I didn't have anything else to attach it, didn't realize it was a hazard but I'll remove it asap. What should I use to mount it? Velcro?

Also should I attach black paper to the outside of the tank?

And when I do attempt to hold him, should I do so during the day or night?

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Originally Posted by WingedWolfPsion

The stuff in the brick is ground coconut fiber. Eco-earth is one brand name. It's ok for providing humidity, but don't use it everywhere in an enclosure, as ball python bedding should be dry--they are very prone to blister disease and skin infections in a damp environment. Humidity should be 60%.

As for nippy baby ball pythons--just leave them alone until they're older, and the vast majority of them will stop on their own. You can also use a tap stick to gently push the snake's head down and encourage it to ball up instead of striking. No dominating involved. Some hatchlings are so wired that you will need a mini snake hook to get through those first few months, though, lol. (We've had just a few over the years that will throw themselves all over the place trying to bite, and would not calm at all).

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Ok, I'll remove lots of it and move the rest to a corner of the tank

So when I push his head down, do I then attempt to hold him? Or just push his head down every couple days for a while and eventually he stops striking and starts balling up?

I prefer paper based substrates (paper towels, newspaper, butchers paper, construction paper, corrugated wrap...)

but paper based substrates don't help with humidity. If humidity is an issue for you I would use just the brick stuff, or cypress mulch (reptibark is a commercially available mulch sold at pet stores)

it can just sit in the cage free, no need to attach it at all.

If you do want to attach it, I would suggest magnets or hot glue

Covering 3 sides of the tank with black paper is a great idea that will make your BP feel more secure.

I would wait a week then try to feed him. if he eats, then 48 hours after he eats you can handle him. (never handle him right after he eats you need to wait at least 48 hours so he can digest)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mues155

Not sure I like this guys angle...a snake is not a dog...you cannot "dominate" or train them to be submissive :confused:...I see this as just stressing out a hatchling that should be just left alone. A hatchling knows its vulnerable, so they can choose to be more strikey.
but this is just IMO

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Is it just the wording that bothers you? I also find this method to work well. I have a snake that is always in the strike position when I open the tub. I usually just tap him on the nose and he coils up, or I just basically force the snake to "ball up". This doesn't really work with adult snakes, but for babies it sure does save you the trouble of being bit! That being said, you shouldn't be doing this all the time just so you can handle the snake. I only do this if I need to do some cage maintenance.