Spotnose I think?

Bred a dinker suspected spotnose "normal" to a great pastel and got 2 that are at least pastel, 2 possible spotnose, and one pretty normal looking one. These pics are pre-shed after hatching. Could they be spotnose?

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...6/dscn2100.jpg

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...6/dscn2116.jpg

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...6/dscn2119.jpg

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...6/dscn2104.jpg

The first and fourth pic look like pastel to me, the second and third pics look most likely luke spotnose.

Can we get a pic of the suspected spotnose parent?

I agree with chris^
2nd and third pic definetly have the head marking of a spotnose imo
1st and 4th look like just pastel to me, although i have not seen very many spotnose combos so my knowledge of recognizing them is very limited. Someone with more experience with them will hopefully chime in.

This is the only pic I have of the mom to the clutch. It's a bad pic in bad lighting. She has the "boogers" that a lot of spotnose have and a definite headprint although it doesn't show up really well in this pic. I'll see if the guy who owns her can send me some better ones. Thanks for the replies!

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...lair_large.jpg

Not seeing spotnose in her pattern, but she and her babies are definitely interesting. If one of those is male, I'd hold him back to breed to her next season and see what pops out.

Hmm she has the stamp but not the color IMO. I also though would hold one of the male babies back and breed back. She's very nice though and so are the youngins.


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Thanks for all the replies! I'm planning on breeding one of the males back to her just to see what comes of it.

I was hoping one of the pastels, especially the first one might have spotnose in it since it is so bright and the head stamp seems to have more than just the usual pastel blushing. Any other comments or observations would be helpful.

Thanks!

I would say she IS a spotnose (i'm not sure how anyone could actually make a positive or negative ID from that terrible picture) based entirely on the fact the 2 "normal" hatchlings look 100% spotnose.

The pastels look like pastels so looks like you missed out on the combo this time.

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Originally Posted by fishboyUK

I would say she IS a spotnose (i'm not sure how anyone could actually make a positive or negative ID from that terrible picture) based entirely on the fact the 2 "normal" hatchlings look 100% spotnose.

The pastels look like pastels so looks like you missed out on the combo this time.

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I tend to agree with you based simply on the fact that out of 5 babies, two are pastels, two show spotnose signs, and one looks COMPLETELY normal. It seems to me that if them mom was normal, all of the normals would have a completely normal pattern or all would have the spotnose-ish look. At least that's the way it's worked for me in the past with other species. I guess I'll know for sure after future breedings. Thanks again!

Mom doesnt look like a spotnose to me. But again, it may only because of the picture. Pictures number 2 and 3 are very interesting. And yes, I admit that Im also having difficulty determining if they are indeed spotnose. Regardless, they are both dinker worthy to me.

The questionable "normal" babies definitely look Spotnose to me. The pastel's appear to be just regular pastels (to my untrained eye, anyway).... and the mom doesn't SCREAM spotnose, but it's hard to tell with that picture.

Interesting.

While we're at it, how about a picture of the father too? :D

As requested, here are some pictures of the male pastel dad along with another bad pic of the mom. Wish I had some better ones of her. I feel that his colors really pop so that makes up for the lack of pic quality of the female.:D

You can still tell that her blacks are really black and lights are really light which I have read is one of the trademarks of the spotnose.

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file....23_medium.jpg

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0302_small.jpg

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...0300_small.jpg

This is interesting. I am seeing Spotnose in Baby #3 but the rest not really. Also the mother doesn't look like a Spotnose. I think further breeding may be needed here! Very cool. :)

Here is a picture of my female Spotnose for comparison. She is a little over 1000g.

http://i910.photobucket.com/albums/a...Lyons/3245.png

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sarin

This is interesting. I am seeing Spotnose in Baby #3 but the rest not really. Also the mother doesn't look like a Spotnose. I think further breeding may be needed here! Very cool. :)

Here is a picture of my female Spotnose for comparison. She is a little over 1000g.

http://i910.photobucket.com/albums/a...Lyons/3245.png

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Thanks for the reply, you have quite the beauty there!

I don't know exactly what genetics are at play, but there is def. something going on there. Are there many other morphs that have such a head print? I know many have light prints or blushing but this seems pretty distinct especially since they hadn't shed yet. Today they are in deep blue so I can't wait to see their color in a couple of days!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sab49

This is the only pic I have of the mom to the clutch. It's a bad pic in bad lighting. She has the "boogers" that a lot of spotnose have and a definite headprint although it doesn't show up really well in this pic. I'll see if the guy who owns her can send me some better ones. Thanks for the replies!

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...lair_large.jpg

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The part in Bold has me a little confused...

What's the history on this female, did you not actually breed her at your place?

Could she have been with a Spotnose too or maybe retained sperm from a Spotnose at some point?

My guess is also:

Pic 1: pastel
Pic 2: spot
Pic 3: spot
Pic 4: pastel

Great looking snakes btw :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by coldbloodaddict

The part in Bold has me a little confused...

What's the history on this female, did you not actually breed her at your place?

Could she have been with a Spotnose too or maybe retained sperm from a Spotnose at some point?

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Great question! This snake actually belongs to my brother-in-law who just got a job in another state. We always have swapped snakes for breeding loans when he lived in the same city. This girl was bought as a normal a couple of years ago as a female of about 300g. Until this year she was never even in the same building as another ball python as he didn't have anything other than corns and rat snakes.

I received her in September to begin cooling her and preparing for breeding season. She was paired with my male pastel and only him off and on throughout the season. After laying, my brother-in-law took her home after one of his visits to town. I incubated the eggs since it was my project.

She really is different and I wish I had some better pics. We noticed her contrast and color mostly, but even her pattern seems a little different than most normals. My brother-in-law wanted something a little unique for his first BP and it looks like he may have found it...lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by coldbloodaddict

The part in Bold has me a little confused...

What's the history on this female, did you not actually breed her at your place?

Could she have been with a Spotnose too or maybe retained sperm from a Spotnose at some point?

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This^^^

Because having now seen a better picture of her she doesn't look at all like a spotnose

Single-gene Spotnose tend to have lots of black belly scales. Something else to look for...

Paul

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PiedPeddler

Single-gene Spotnose tend to have lots of black belly scales. Something else to look for...

Paul

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Thanks, I have noticed that on many photos I've seen. These questionable babies have a different belly pattern that I've only seen in photos a couple of times. Both have a line of dots down the middle of the belly and other than that it is clear. The pastels have a clear belly and the normal has a normal looking belly.

The head stamp, dots on the jaw, jagged neck pattern, and belly lines really have me wondering. These pics were taken quickly with my cell phone the day they hatched. Once again not great pics but they are in deep blue now so it wouldn't do any good to try for better ones for a few days.

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...6/imag0080.jpg

http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...6/imag0081.jpg