Poss Het Question

Hey guys, I'm relatively new here and had some questions. I have been lurking for a bit and done quite a bit of research. First question is this. Other than buying from a reputable breeder what do you look for when you buy a possible het? Does paperwork mean anything? And if so what paper work are you looking for? It seems it would be easy to just make something up. Also if you bought a Poss Het (say Albino) and tried to prove it out without sucess, would you still consider it as a poss het if you sold it? Thanks. I searched but didnt find anything on the paperwork portion of buying them.

Paperwork is only as good as the breeders reputation is. Paperwork does however give you the ability to take legal action though. I look for pictures of the parents and a picture of them locking up. A reputable breeder is the best as most aren't willing to tarnish the good name they have built for themselves.

As for selling, if I bought a 50% poss het Albino and tried to prove it out but failed to I would sell it as a 50% poss her but disclose that I was unsuccessful in proving it out.

Hi,

The paperwork is simply their word written down.

The reputation and honesty of the seller are king in these situations.

And with poss hets it gets even more complicated - the animal will either be 100% het or not het at all. It's just that neither the seller or the buyer know which.

And if you are selling it on you should mention what you did to try and prove it and the results. If you bred it multiple times to a visual and got nothing visual out there is an increasing likelyhood it just isn't a het and you lost on the gamble.


dr del

The only reason to buy pos hets for breeding is if you have the homozygous version to try to prove them out.

In proving any hets you should try breeding them a second time if they dont prove the first try. This way you have played the odds. As far as proving poss hets it is best to put them to the morph for best chances. Now sometimes you hit the lottery. A buddy of mine produced an albino pied last year on a poss double het breeding. He was in touch with the odds gods that day lol. Working with poss hets is a good way to get started in the breeding game if you dont have alot of money to work with. Worst case scenario you end up with a bjnch of breeder females for your codom stuff in the future if they dont prove

Well I picked up a pair of supposed 100% HET albino. Around 1000g each. I picked them up for a slightly high price for normals but a steal if they are 100% HET. May be two years before I can try to prove though. I was told the paperwork would be emailed to me, but at this point i just thought it wasnt very useful. The guy was getting rid of all of his stock so if I find out in a few years that they arent well then there isnt really anything I could do anyways. I just didnt know what the paperwork was supposed to look like.

Hi,

Check out fauna classifieds to see if he has any positive or negative reputation on there.

Not everyone uses the internet but it never hurts to look.


dr del

If they are already 1000 grams, you could be breeding them next season. That should be a fun project. As other said...Paperwork is only as good as the breeder backing it. Good luck!

P.s. I was always told to breed them at least three seasons with no visual offspring before writing them off as normals. It could take fewer or more seasons to prove them though...it's all an odds game.

possible and 100% are two totally different things.
Either way, if you paid slightly over normal prices then you got a good deal on the female:O

I would likely not buy hets from someone who does not have some good feedback somewhere. Try Fauna, BLBC, here or just Google them. Not foolproof, but better than nothing.

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Originally Posted by gr8gugly

Well I picked up a pair of supposed 100% HET albino. Around 1000g each. I picked them up for a slightly high price for normals but a steal if they are 100% HET. May be two years before I can try to prove though. I was told the paperwork would be emailed to me, but at this point i just thought it wasnt very useful. The guy was getting rid of all of his stock so if I find out in a few years that they arent well then there isnt really anything I could do anyways. I just didnt know what the paperwork was supposed to look like.

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Here are the odds:

99% probability of getting at least one albino in the first 7 babies if one of these is bred to an albino. This could require one or two clutches of eggs.

99% probability of getting at least one albino in the first 17 babies if one of these is bred to a known het albino or if these two are bred together. This may take three clutches of eggs.

If a possible het albino produces an albino baby in one of the above tests, then you are certain that the possible het is a het.

If a possible het albino goes through one of the above tests without producing an albino baby, then the odds are 99% that the possible het is a normal. There is no way to be 100% certain that it is a normal. But if I resold it, I would sell it as a normal.

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Originally Posted by paulh

Here are the odds:

99% probability of getting at least one albino in the first 7 babies if one of these is bred to an albino. This could require one or two clutches of eggs.

99% probability of getting at least one albino in the first 17 babies if one of these is bred to a known het albino or if these two are bred together. This may take three clutches of eggs.

If a possible het albino produces an albino baby in one of the above tests, then you are certain that the possible het is a het.

If a possible het albino goes through one of the above tests without producing an albino baby, then the odds are 99% that the possible het is a normal. There is no way to be 100% certain that it is a normal. But if I resold it, I would sell it as a normal.

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This doesn't even make sense. If he breeds his Het x Het...There is a 25% chance of getting a visual morph. No 99% anything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by paulh

Here are the odds:

99% probability of getting at least one albino in the first 7 babies if one of these is bred to an albino. This could require one or two clutches of eggs.

99% probability of getting at least one albino in the first 17 babies if one of these is bred to a known het albino or if these two are bred together. This may take three clutches of eggs.

If a possible het albino produces an albino baby in one of the above tests, then you are certain that the possible het is a het.

If a possible het albino goes through one of the above tests without producing an albino baby, then the odds are 99% that the possible het is a normal. There is no way to be 100% certain that it is a normal. But if I resold it, I would sell it as a normal.

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Where did you come up with those numbers...? They all sound wrong to me but please prove me otherwise.
The percentages are per egg. Not per clutch.

I get what he is trying to say....If you had a poss. het albino female and bred it to an albino male (or a het albino male) there is a certain point where you should hit the odds. If not, you probably have a normal.

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Originally Posted by Dave Green

I get what he is trying to say....If you had a poss. het albino female and bred it to an albino male (or a het albino male) there is a certain point where you should hit the odds. If not, you probably have a normal.

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:thumbsup: (looked for an "I agree", this was closet)

It is somewhat like flipping a coin. Every individual flip has a 50% chance of landing heads or tails but there's only a 3.125% chance of landing five "heads" in a row.

Paul's math is dead on. Using just het x het, there is a 13.35% chance that no visual will hatch out using seven eggs. In other words, an 86.65% chance that one will. This is well over 99% for a visual x het.

Thanks for the replies. I get that there is a difference between poss het and 100% het. I just question whether this is 100% het. Hence the possible 100% het. The seller had good feedback on fauna, just didnt have much feedback. Maybe i will know for sure in three years.

my opinion....poss het = normal. i would not buy but i did say it is my opinion

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Originally Posted by Dragoon

my opinion....poss het = normal. i would not buy but i did say it is my opinion

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If I told you how many lavender albinos and spider lavender albinos I produced from 50% poss. het females you'd change your mind...fast. :D

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

Where did you come up with those numbers...? They all sound wrong to me but please prove me otherwise.
The percentages are per egg. Not per clutch.

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I get what you were saying now paulh, after reading what other people said. The way you put it made no sense to me though lol. Sorry didnt mean to sound rude

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dave Green

If I told you how many lavender albinos and spider lavender albinos I produced from 50% poss. het females you'd change your mind...fast. :D

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guess you have better luck than I do

Hi, I’m Randy and I’m a possible het addict…

I’ll admit that as 100% hets are getting less expensive, possible hets are becoming less worth the gamble. However, last summer I produced all three of the following from pairs where BOTH the male and female where hatched as possible hets (I cheated a little since pied and hypo both have co-dominant tendencies):

http://snakemorphs.com/images/20111030204936_albino.jpg

http://snakemorphs.com/images/20111030210743_hypo.jpg

http://snakemorphs.com/images/201107...11_pied_01.jpg

I'm thinking there is something a little sweeter about a homozygous recessive morph from possible hets but I bet I'll still be stoked about any stripes I might hatch from my first 100% het female this year.

To be fair I originally proved the poss het albino pair and the pos het hypo female in previous years but I did first hit on the pos het hypo male and the pos het 1.2 that produced 5 pieds in 2011.