Annoyed with tank size debate...

Hello everyone! I know I have not been active in quite a while, but I just had to vent here and get some opinions from others.

So, I belong to a pit bull forum and in the miscellaneous section a topic came up about BPs. The OP had just gotten one from a friend and needed advice. I informed them of what I had learned on here when I was researching to get my BP (which still hasn't happened, hence my inactivity :( ), which was to have them in a 30gal tank (it's a full grown adult), as any bigger could stress them out, and to have two identical hides on both sides, as well as an UTH with a thermostat. Well, the other info was fine with the other members, except my tank statement. This one member (among many others, but she's the prominent one), who has multiple ball pythons (and she's been into them for a long time, and on forums, etc) says that the size of tank is adequate perhaps, but not ideal. She says it's not right to have a snake in a tank size that they can't stretch out their body their entire length. When I came back with them feeling more secure in a tank that size, she argued that she has a BP in a 100gal tank, and that he eats just fine. She said if BP owners could see how active they can be in a larger tank, we'd be surprised.

I then asked what she would expect an owner of a 18ft+ burmese python/anaconda/other large constrictor to do in terms of tank size, since she expects their entire bodies to stretch out. She says that if you can't build them a zoo-like enclosure by the time they are 4 yrs old, you shouldn't own one. I mean, this is getting a little out of hand, no? There's just nothing I can say that can make sense to them! I'm about to just walk away from the thread completely, because I'm really getting annoyed with it all. Has anyone else ever heard of this? Everything I have ever read says that BPs are most comfortable in a smaller sized tank, but she swears otherwise. In fact, she says it's inappropriate. And another member told me that a BP in that size tank may be living, but they are not thriving. Never mind the fact that tons of BP owners keep their snakes in these tanks, and they eat without issue, and appear to be perfectly content. But, she says that alone doesn't show that they are happy. Ugh...

Sorry, just had to vent. :oops:

Inform her that she's projecting what "she" thinks makes the snake happy. A ball python is more than content with a smaller enclosure. In the wild they only venture out to find food which is usually in the next burrow they are going to occupy. Her bp's running around the tank are no better off or "happier" than one kept in a 41q plastic tub in a rack.

Tell her that her bp is most likely stressed out and can't find a good place to hide lol.

I have a 5'6" 3000g+ BP in a 40G breeder. That's plenty big. Anything bigger is overkill. Nothing wrong with having bigger if it's set up right. But bigger is not better.

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Originally Posted by Jessica Loesch

Tell her that her bp is most likely stressed out and can't find a good place to hide lol.

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I completely agree.
From what you are saying all the activity sounds like the snake may be stressed and trying to find somewhere it feels comfortable to hide.
Why not invite them to check out this forum that is dedicated to bp's; where there are alot of keepers with years and some even with decades of experience in keeping bp's.

Explain that ball pythons are all individuals, and that while some animals may be fine in a very large cage, MANY of them will not be. The advice is meant for the majority of ball pythons, and not for her specific animal. If her animal is good in a 100 gallon, that's great...but it definitely doesn't mean that most ball pythons will do well in a tank that size.

Also mention that ball pythons should spend all day sleeping in their hide, and roam around a bit at night. If they are roaming during the day, this is a sign of stress--they're attempting to find a more suitable habitat.

Ball pythons are adaptable animals, and have extremely variable personalities. What works for one will not necessarily work for all of them.

I've "rescued" a few BPs that were kept in big tanks and refused to eat...the majority of them started eating the minute I stuck them in a rack. Some will absolutely not do well in glass tanks.

For the record, I find that larger tanks don't stress CB adults, as long as you provide adequate hides. It's really just a pain for us as caretakers, cleaning a big tank and all that furniture.

Loonunit, it depends on the adult--which is the entire point.

Exactly - each snake is different, but MOST BPs will not do well in large enclosures. I had a full grown female normal who did well in a huge tank and probably would have been ok in even larger ones as long as she had her nice hides. On the flip side, my pastel fella only relaxes and eats well in his 20gal long tank. That's it. No tubs, and nothing larger. :)

I've run into people like that person with the 100gal many times and they're all very frustrating because they are SURE they're right and that any and all snakes MUST be the same. Therefore they are stubborn, and unfortunately very vocal. All you can do about those people is just try not to let them get to you and keep on peddling the RIGHT information. :)

Thanks, everyone! That's what I thought. I told her pretty much everything that was said here, and nothing seemed to matter. Of course, there were many other people as well telling me that keeping a BP in a 30gal or a tub was 'bad husbandry', and they didn't think it was right. I think only one person was on my side, and she breeds BPs and uses tubs. But, unfortunately, she stayed out of most of the conversation. :( Could have used her help, but oh well...

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Originally Posted by AZmorphedballs

I completely agree.
From what you are saying all the activity sounds like the snake may be stressed and trying to find somewhere it feels comfortable to hide.
Why not invite them to check out this forum that is dedicated to bp's; where there are alot of keepers with years and some even with decades of experience in keeping bp's.

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I already told her I'd send her the forum where I got all of my information from, and she denied. She said she knows what is out their and deemed acceptable by most, but 'that doesn't mean they are right'. I don't want to state the name of the forum in case it's against the rules, but she did say she's a member of this other reptile forum (synonymous with 'giggling duck'), and I guess that's where she's getting her information from. All I know is, I know what I've learned on here, and it makes perfect sense to me. I just wanted to come here for others opinions, as I got tired of the people there telling me I was wrong, lol.

Thanks for your input, everyone! :)

I have always gone by the 2 side guide the length of the two connecting sides should be about the length of the animal. I have a just over five foot female she is in a 3x2 enclosure and just looking at sizes she seems just about right. That has always been my loose guideline. I don't know how big a 100g is but it is about 6 foot long isn't it?

I believe that almost every snake can be provided with a stress free enclosure of very large stature but it takes increasing diligence and effort to do so in terms of the set up. I know guys whom have a very large planted enclosures but they look like savanna, bioactive substrate system, it is crazy balance to get right. It can be done but it doesn't NEED to be done.