Dominant or incomplete dominant?????

Okay this site says that butter is dominant and lesser is co dominant! I thought they were the same. SO which is it????


http://ballpythonmorphgallery.com/

I'm no expert by any means but it is my understanding that butter and lesser are one and the same and also dominant not co-dom

their both co-dom, the description is also wrong lol "Dominant mutation that produces a snake with high blushing in varying shades of yellow and cream. Similar to the Lesser in color, these animals are slightly brighter in color." brighter in color? where the heck did he get this info from?

Both are co-dom..... they act upon the same allele, but are not the same. Very similar like cinnamon and black pastel. Small differences can be seen but (in my opinion) they are mistaken for one another on a regular this is the reason I would never produce a butter x lesser lucy... Identifying offspring would be difficult

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jjmitchell

Both are co-dom..... they act upon the same allele, but are not the same. Very similar like cinnamon and black pastel. Small differences can be seen but (in my opinion) they are mistaken for one another on a regular this is the reason I would never produce a butter x lesser lucy... Identifying offspring would be difficult

---

show me the differences

Ok sorry for the misinfo but can someone explain the difference between Dom and co-Dom? I'm still fuzzy on that.

Both butter and lesser are Co-dominant, both their supers being BEL (Blue Eyed Leucistic)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ScottNBecky

Ok sorry for the misinfo but can someone explain the difference between Dom and co-Dom? I'm still fuzzy on that.

---

co-dom the heterozygous and homozygous form look different, for the lesser, heterozygous is the lesser and BEL is the homozygous

dom means the heterozygous and homozygous look the same, like the pinstripe, het or homo. it looks exactly the same. only difference being the homo. pin will throw all pin offspring, no normals.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ScottNBecky

Ok sorry for the misinfo but can someone explain the difference between Dom and co-Dom? I'm still fuzzy on that.

---

Quote:

---

Co-Dominant – A visible mutation appears when a single gene at an allele is different than normal. A matched pair of this gene brings about a “super” form that looks different than the single.

---

Quote:

---

Dominant – A visible mutation appears when a single gene at an allele is different than normal. However, there is no known “super” form of the morph.

---

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...Basic-Genetics

I just posted a topic on their forum about it. http://ballpythonmorphgallery.com/fo...iewtopic&t=4.0

Thanks guys!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deborah

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...Basic-Genetics

---

Definition of super could make this correct or incorrect.

If by super they mean homozygous, then it is incorrect.

something being recessive, co-dom, or dom has to do with the phenotype (the observable trait)

Recessive = heterozygous - No change in phenotype
Co-dom = both homozygous and heterozygous have a change in phenotype
dom = both homozygous and heterozygous have the same change in phenotype.

i might as go in depth about why

"aa" or normal is still a set of genes. genes dominate or partially dominate over other genes, we classify them by what we can observe, its not just looks, like with blood type they can run tests and observe whats different.

for recessive trait, the heterozygous form "Aa" the "a" or normal gene dominates over the "A" thats why we don't see any difference in the het albinos or any recessive morph, we have to get an "AA" or homozygous to express the albino trait. there is no "a" to dominate over it.

for a co-dom, the heterozygous form "Aa" the"A" gene only partially expresses, it interacts with the "a" gene. while it still needs to be "AA" to fully express. we all know snakes but an example outside of that would be some flowers, white is normal "aa" the heterozygous "Aa" is pink and the homozygous "AA" is red. they the white and red genes both interact with each other, that what goes on in every co-dom we know, its interacting with the normal. lesser-BEL pastel-Super pastel ect. the heterozygous version is always interacting with a normal gene.

Dominate gene expresses the same way no matter if it heterozygous or homozygous. it does not interact with the normal gene it just dominates over it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OhhWatALoser

show me the differences

---

I'd love to see that too...:D

I have a Butter/Lesser BEL and I asked him and he said there's no difference...

Incomplete Dominance is red + white = pink. Incomplete dominance is a form of intermediate inheritance in which one allele for a specific trait is not completely dominant over the other allele. This results in a combined phenotype.

codominance is red + white = red and white striped. Codominance is quite similar to incomplete dominance in that neither parental trait is dominant nor recessive. However, with codominance, the two traits both appear in the offspring, often showing up in different parts of the plant or animal.

We call ball pythons that produce a "super" homo form a codom and ones that don't we call dominant.

I also think Butter and Lesser are similar but not the same, for instance, A kingpin pastel and an emperor pin should have the exact same markings if they are the same, and, I'll give you that some of them are similar. But I've never seen a kingpin pastel with the awesome desert camo kind of look that I love about a good Emperor Pin.

Now if you bred a lemon blast female to both lesser and butter males and ended up with a yellowish tan snake with brown slightly blushed pinstripe markings and dashed lines on the back and sides... I'll admit you've have a hard time identifiying exactly what you've got.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NewParadigms

I also think Butter and Lesser are similar but not the same, for instance, A kingpin pastel and an emperor pin should have the exact same markings if they are the same, and, I'll give you that some of them are similar. But I've never seen a kingpin pastel with the awesome desert camo kind of look that I love about a good Emperor Pin.

Now if you bred a lemon blast female to both lesser and butter males and ended up with a yellowish tan snake with brown slightly blushed pinstripe markings and dashed lines on the back and sides... I'll admit you've have a hard time identifiying exactly what you've got.

---

With the huge variations that just the Butters/Lessers show, using three-gene animals as a reference is not a very convincing argument...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NewParadigms

I also think Butter and Lesser are similar but not the same, for instance, A kingpin pastel and an emperor pin should have the exact same markings if they are the same, and, I'll give you that some of them are similar. But I've never seen a kingpin pastel with the awesome desert camo kind of look that I love about a good Emperor Pin.

Now if you bred a lemon blast female to both lesser and butter males and ended up with a yellowish tan snake with brown slightly blushed pinstripe markings and dashed lines on the back and sides... I'll admit you've have a hard time identifiying exactly what you've got.

---

and the pastel or pin used plays no effect? come on...