Is there a "special" way to...

So I bought a ball python recently on a longterm payment plan (about 3 months). I had been hoping to breed her for the '10 season considering I breed very late in the year. Anyway, when she arrived today she weighed less than the advertised weight three months ago. I contacted the breeder and she said she had started brumating her. *Side note, I am not happy about this at all*

So I never brumate and I really dont want to. Is there any specific way I could bring her out of it? Especially because Im waking her up early?

Ball pythons don't brumate...

Someone is using the wrong term here.

The breeder was COOLING the animal, whether to breed, or because it was in the same room as the others and unavoidable.

I would imagine just normal temps and offer food until she eats.

According to the breeder she was put in the brumation rack. Ok, wrong term but that what she used.

Another question, how much weight is normally lost during cooling? She is about 100g less than she was 3 months ago, but she was only cooled at the beginning of October. Is it normal to lose 100g+ per month when cooling?

Also, is it common practice that a breeder does this without telling the buyer? Like I said, Im slightly upset because I was expecting an animal near 1000g, not 700g.

Wait, so she lost 100g over a 3 month time?

If the perveous owner wasn't feeding her during cooling then that is entirely normal. Heck my snakes take poo poos bigger than that.

If this snake is around breeding weight than I would not say that is a significant weight loss at all. One or two meals in her and she will be back up to the weight she was at.

Yes, but she was only being cooled for 1 month (over the payment plan she was supposedly fed for the first two months). So she lost a minimum of 100g in one month assuming she had not grown at all over two months.

Bottom line is I was expecting a 1000g snake, not a 700g one which to me is a huge difference.

This is total BS, IMO. You can't breed a 1000 gram female ball python, so why would anyone cool one? I would ask for at least some compensation for this--the breeder did not FEED the snake! 700 grams when you were expecting a 1000 gram animal? Ridiculous!
When my snakes are off feed, they usually only lose about 1 or 2 ounces per month--more like 60 grams, rather than 100.

I would say the breeder didn't feel like feeding the snake. And no, there is NOTHING normal about this at all.

That makes more sense.

Well, as far as getting the snake out of cooling, just keep the temps normal and offer food weekly is all I can suggest.

I would think about contacting the previous owner and asking them what they were thinking when they started cooling an animal that was being sold.

I have talked to her. The first email I got back was:

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I'm so sorry, I actually had her in my brumation rack. :-( I started brumation at the beginning of October. I totally apologize for that. :-(

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I emailed back telling her I probably wouldnt have bought her knowing that (I paid the price for a breeder or at least soon to be breeder) but I havent heard back yet. Unfortunately her guarantee only covers DOA.

I'm going to be the oddman out, but you shouldn't have paid the price for a breeder unless it was a breeder. "Don't count your chickens before they hatch." If she was so close to 1K g's then she might have stopped eating around this time regardless of being cooled or not. It should have been something you were prepared for.

I think the breeder was wrong not to feed her, but you shouldn't have assumed the bp was going to gain so much weight. They all gain at different intervals anyway.

As I said, I paid the price for a breeder or at least soon to be breeder and I dont mind that at all. You take the same risk paying for a breeder animal that it might take a year off, is paying the extra money for that counting chickens?

If the snake had stopped feeding on its own that would be a completely different matter that would have been fine. However I do not feel like this is something the snake did on her own, which is why I feel ripped off.

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Originally Posted by aalomon

I have talked to her. The first email I got back was:



I emailed back telling her I probably wouldnt have bought her knowing that (I paid the price for a breeder or at least soon to be breeder) but I havent heard back yet. Unfortunately her guarantee only covers DOA.

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you might want to inform her that while her policy only covers doa im sure false advertising is covered by the courts!

whats this "breeders" name?

Thanks, Im probably going to try and get my money back. Considering this only happened this morning Im going to give the seller a little time to see if we can work this out. She actually has a good rep on fauna so Im hoping for the best.

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Originally Posted by aalomon

As I said, I paid the price for a breeder or at least soon to be breeder and I dont mind that at all. You take the same risk paying for a breeder animal that it might take a year off, is paying the extra money for that counting chickens?

If the snake had stopped feeding on its own that would be a completely different matter that would have been fine. However I do not feel like this is something the snake did on her own, which is why I feel ripped off.

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You said she weighed 700g's and she had lost 100g's, which means an 800g snake. Depending if you are going by the 1500g rule, that is barely half of a breeders weight.

Yes, buying a snake to breed, assuming it is going to be breeding weight in 3 months, is "counting your chickens before they hatch."

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Originally Posted by stratus_020202

You said she weighed 700g's and she had lost 100g's, which means an 800g snake. Depending if you are going by the 1500g rule, that is barely half of a breeders weight.

Yes, buying a snake to breed, assuming it is going to be breeding weight in 3 months, is "counting your chickens before they hatch."

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As I said in my first post, I was hoping for her to breed very late in the year. I normally dont start breeding until April-May. 9-10 months seemed like an acceptable time to me.

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Originally Posted by stratus_020202

You said she weighed 700g's and she had lost 100g's, which means an 800g snake. Depending if you are going by the 1500g rule, that is barely half of a breeders weight.

Yes, buying a snake to breed, assuming it is going to be breeding weight in 3 months, is "counting your chickens before they hatch."

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I think it is fair to expect that a snake would GAIN weight rather than loose weight in a three month period if cared for correctly.

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Originally Posted by Kaorte

I think it is fair to expect that a snake would GAIN weight rather than loose weight in a three month period if cared for correctly.

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typically yes but in this case i think someone just stopped feeding it

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Originally Posted by nixer

typically yes but in this case i think someone just stopped feeding it

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Unfortunately, that seems to be the case. :/

What was the exact weight the snake was advertised as and what was the exact weight she arrived at?

I went back and looked at me emails with her and she was 780g, so a little less than 800g. Here is a pic of her today

http://iherp.com/Gallery/88170/32674...R4jnDEy5lD.jpg

So she is 93g less than advertised as on July 21st.

Wow, I would try to talk to her and see if she would be willing to knock down the price. If you paid for a breeder, that means she marked the price up a few hundred dollars. That snake isn't going to breed for a while. That's bull that she pulled this on you. This is not a typical thing that happens, but sometimes people just get sloppy.

Shes offered me a $500 rebate. Hopefully Ill have the money this afternoon.

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Originally Posted by aalomon

Shes offered me a $500 rebate. Hopefully Ill have the money this afternoon.

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Glad you guys came to an agreement :)