Why We Are Idiots For Using Kingsnake.com To Price Our Animals

The price is dropping for sure, I saw an ADULT male spider ball at a show for only $200 and there were also baby spiders at other booths selling for $400+. I was shocked...

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Originally Posted by ctrlfreq

I'm personally of the opinion that the market has never been as big as we hopefully assume it to be. While I'm sure the state of the economy is having some impact, I think the primary driver is the fact that the supply is already vastly outpacing the demand except in the arena of multiple-morph designer animals (which is what those who make their living on these animals concentrate on).

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Keep in mind, though, that those multiple gene carrying animals are on the same road to the bottom as any other of their predecessors, basically a breeder-to-lesser-breeder type of buying and selling until the price is low enough that non-breeders will buy it. I don't think that this model is sustainable (at least for someone with a building mortgage or kids to put through college) and you can really only throw so many genes into an animal or create only so many combinations that are marketable enough for those kinds of high initial selling prices.

We're seeing the industry develop, and like any other, breeders need to adapt or go out of business. I believe that the long term sustainable product in the market will sell for under $1000 max, similar to a lot of high end birds, fish, or other niche markets. You should see what people pay for some species of saltwater fish and corals - I believe that there are plenty of snake people out there that are just as crazy about their animals as the reef tank guys are. If you think feeding a collection of ball pythons is a money pit - go set up a 75 gallon reef.

To me, the only people I really see complaining about this are the so called "hobbyist" breeders in their basements that think they could put X dollars in and pull XXX dollars out in a couple of years.

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Originally Posted by ctrlfreq

I'm personally of the opinion that the market has never been as big as we hopefully assume it to be. While I'm sure the state of the economy is having some impact, I think the primary driver is the fact that the supply is already vastly outpacing the demand except in the arena of multiple-morph designer animals (which is what those who make their living on these animals concentrate on).

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I think that quite a bit more demand could be generated. In my area pet stores have normal BPs, and maybe pastels. Many potential snake buyers probably don't even know that most morphs exist. Get things like Bumblebees and BELs into the pet shops, and demand should exceed supply pretty quickly.

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Originally Posted by JeffFlanagan

I think that quite a bit more demand could be generated. In my area pet stores have normal BPs, and maybe pastels. Many potential snake buyers probably don't even know that most morphs exist. Get things like Bumblebees and BELs into the pet shops, and demand should exceed supply pretty quickly.

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How much do you think that the average pet store patron, unaware of the morph craze, would be willing to pay for a bumblebee or a BEL?

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Originally Posted by elevatethis

How much do you think that the average pet store patron, unaware of the morph craze, would be willing to pay for a bumblebee or a BEL?

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Not the $1K+ prices we're used to, but I expect you could move a lot of them at $500, while making a nice profit.

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Originally Posted by JeffFlanagan

Not the $1K+ prices we're used to, but I expect you could move a lot of them at $500, while making a nice profit.

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Agree 100%.

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Originally Posted by JeffFlanagan

Not the $1K+ prices we're used to, but I expect you could move a lot of them at $500, while making a nice profit.

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Of course this means the pet stores are buying for $250.00.

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Originally Posted by JeffFlanagan

Not the $1K+ prices we're used to, but I expect you could move a lot of them at $500, while making a nice profit.

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When normals are selling at $50 or less, and other herps are as cheap as $10 or $15?

Pet stores are the worst place for morphs to compete, price wise.

Getting back to Colin's original point which is this industry/hobby uses Kingsnake as a reference of what a certain herp is worth and that is probably not in its best interest. As a just mentioned, the fact that it is a hobby as well as a business, and a niche one at that, it is not going to behave like other markets but obviously is greatly affected by the economic climate.

I like the idea of a reference site for current pricing and value, the only problem is if it isnt popular, properly endorsed or used much, its just a blog on BP prices and wont do much.

I think having some type of organized body that tracks all the genetics and is endorsed by the heads of the industry would be the first step in setting any guideline. Dog breeders have their groups and I grow orchids which also have a centralized organization which tracks hybrids and variations giving credit to those who produced them and setting names and identification markers. This entity could set standards of quality and excellence thus setting a precedent of value to those who appreciate the animals. This could help set a price value from guidelines and genetics/bloodlines and not the Kingsnake get rich quick mentality which currently dominates the majority of reptile pricing.

One always needs to remember that pricing also has to do with the quality of the specimen. A dirty brown pastel is never going to get the price of a clean screamer pastel, so when comparing prices you have to know what to look for other than $ figures.


Unfortunately this hobby is plauged with fueds and ugly $ competition so getting a centralized body organized may not be as easy as it sounds.

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Originally Posted by wilomn

Are you selling animals or raising children?

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Both actually.