NEED opinions & advice...

If she doesn't want to take advice now I don't think there would be any reason to believe she would later. Giving her more animals to mistreat I think would be a bit irresponsible. From the sounds of it she's been given advice many times and hasn't wanted to take it. Believe it or not I have ran across this before. With a random person it's probably best to keep your distance and steer clear of any animals they might have. You can offer your advice but expect them to take it with a grain of salt. But when someone is a friend it's hard to keep your distance for obvious reasons and in my experience they take it much more personal if you critique their husbandry unless they ask you for advice. This can cause issues in the friendship and it's hard to not say anything when you know the reasons why they are sick or thin when you feel so bad for the animals. It's sad when they are otherwise a really nice person. They just don't have a clue or care to put the time into reasearching the animals and think they know better just because "that's the way I've always done it and it's fine" even if they go through animals like M&Ms. It's sad but ultimately they are not your animals and there's really not much you can do about it.

*edit* I'm not sure where the thumbs down symbol came from but I don't see a way to remove it lol

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Originally Posted by BrandiR

I'm new to this, so forgive me if this is an outlandish suggestion- maybe offer to trade these two for their future offspring? By the time you have to make good on your deal, maybe she'll be in a better position to properly care for snakes. Best case, she'll take the deal and by the time babies come around she won't be interested anymore. Worst case, nothing changes and you saved two snakes from poor care only to thrust two others into it later.

I don't envy you! Having to tell someone they're not a good pet owner goes over about as well as telling someone they're a bad parent.

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I just did what you suggested about the offspring but she's still refusing. She came over the other day & didn't even ask to seen them or anything.

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Originally Posted by FroggyCrazy

If she doesn't want to take advice now I don't think there would be any reason to believe she would later. Giving her more animals to mistreat I think would be a bit irresponsible. From the sounds of it she's been given advice many times and hasn't wanted to take it. Believe it or not I have ran across this before. With a random person it's probably best to keep your distance and steer clear of any animals they might have. You can offer your advice but expect them to take it with a grain of salt. But when someone is a friend it's hard to keep your distance for obvious reasons and in my experience they take it much more personal if you critique their husbandry unless they ask you for advice. This can cause issues in the friendship and it's hard to not say anything when you know the reasons why they are sick or thin when you feel so bad for the animals. It's sad when they are otherwise a really nice person. They just don't have a clue or care to put the time into reasearching the animals and think they know better just because "that's the way I've always done it and it's fine" even if they go through animals like M&Ms. It's sad but ultimately they are not your animals and there's really not much you can do about it.

*edit* I'm not sure where the thumbs down symbol came from but I don't see a way to remove it lol

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I totally agree... why put another animal in a careless owners hands? & you know what's really :cens0r: up is she worked for a big breeder here in TX & that's how she acquired the snakes. So you would think she would know how to properly take care of these animals, she just simply refuses.

Also on a side note check out the rest of of my collection HERE!

Thanks for everyones input & advice! It's very appreciated!

I would keep working on her and try to convince her that by letting you keep them she would be doing you a favor. Sometimes reverse psychology works. I picked up a female spider BP from a distant family member in January. We purchased a clutch mate at the same time from the same person same day. Come January, this little girl only weighed in at 121grams and was severely dehydrated. Now 8 months later, she is doing great has a nice solid weight to her and does not even look the same. My "special" relative said the snake would not eat and that is why it was so little. Since I got her, she has never missed a meal. Good luck in getting them from her, I feel for your situation.

You could try...."What are you talking about? You never left any snakes with me? I don't mind telling you, I'm a little offended by your accusations!" :)

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Originally Posted by S.I.R.

I would keep working on her and try to convince her that by letting you keep them she would be doing you a favor. Sometimes reverse psychology works. I picked up a female spider BP from a distant family member in January. We purchased a clutch mate at the same time from the same person same day. Come January, this little girl only weighed in at 121grams and was severely dehydrated. Now 8 months later, she is doing great has a nice solid weight to her and does not even look the same. My "special" relative said the snake would not eat and that is why it was so little. Since I got her, she has never missed a meal. Good luck in getting them from her, I feel for your situation.

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Nice idea on the reverse psychology! That didn't run through my mind but you have a solid point. Congrats on getting your little girl back to being healthy! I'm so glad there are such good hearted people in this twisted world that take in animals that are in need of TLC. I offered both an adult mouse on the second day I had them (on top of having a husbandry change) & they took them with NO hesitation. Poor things were starving to death. In the pics I provided, both snakes were not "empty"... they each had an adult mouse in their system & they still look that skinny. It's just going to take some time & both will be up to weight & 100% health. blessings & good luck with your rescue!

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Originally Posted by BrandiR

You could try...."What are you talking about? You never left any snakes with me? I don't mind telling you, I'm a little offended by your accusations!" :)

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Lmao! Too funny... I would totally do this if I could get away with it :)

I had a problem like this with my boyfriend's co-worker. She was neglecting her animals as well, despite telling me how much she loves them. She would even go so far as to tell ME how to take care of MY animals. Such beautiful quotes that can be recalled are:

"You're feeding your crested gecko Repashy Crested Gecko Diet?! You should be feeding it baby food!! Wow you should really read up on things."

"You know your crested gecko doesn't have a heat lamp. It's probably going to die without it. Just saying."

"Your leopard gecko is cute, but really fat. Look at that tail! You are feeding it just waaaay too much. You need to stop that."


Ahhhh yes. Those were the days. Until I got a call at 3am with her crying because her bearded dragon was having a seizure. I calmly informed her that it was because she had never provided him with a UVB light, or anything but crickets for his entire life. Only when the animal was on the cusp of death did she ask me for help. And even then, I told her I would only help her if she did everything I said, and didn't give me flack about it. Otherwise, she could figure it out herself.

She did. She listened. We got the beardie stable, got his diet better, his seizures stopped, vet agreed with everything I had told her, etc etc.

Two months later, she was dropping the ball again, not listening, and picked up even more animals. My last resort was taking her to our local reptile society and having complete strangers critique her animals and set-ups. Only then did she listen. Why? An outside source gains NOTHING. An outside source can judge you all they want and it's not personal. An outside source doesn't care who you are, but cares what the animals look like.

She did switch after that. And then realized reptiles weren't for her and sold the rest of them.

So perhaps you could have her bring her snakes to someone 'outside' of the situation to get some unbiased feedback? Although, you said she worked with a big name breeder, so maybe that might not work.

Sometimes, telling someone to change doesn't help. And sometimes, we need to be super blunt.

Personally, I couldn't be friends with someone who treated their animals like that. If you don't care about your animals, then are you really going to be a good friend to me? Are you going to care about our friendship? Or is it just there until you get bored and stop putting effort into the friendship?

I would keep trying to keep them. That reverse psychology seems like it would be a good idea. I mean if you say something along the lines of, "Ya know, I do like the way these look, I could probably get some good babies off of them, can I keep them until they mature?" Might get you somewhere, The girl clearly isn't capable of giving them proper care as of now... And worst case scenario is that in the mean time you can educate her on what she SHOULD be doing so that she can care or them properly in the future (if she will listen)... But to be completely honest with you... If you were forced to give them back because she refused all offers I would go to the person she worked for previously and let him know what is going on... And if things didn't improve from there I might honestly consider getting the authorities involved... The whole lack of care thing does not go over well in many places when it comes to animals. But that is just me. Most of my friends and family don't have pets and the only other person I would trust with my animals is my boyfriend simply for the fact that I know he would take spectacular care of my little one. And I don't always care about friendship when it comes at the expense of innocent lives...

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Originally Posted by Vasiliki

I had a problem like this with my boyfriend's co-worker. She was neglecting her animals as well, despite telling me how much she loves them. She would even go so far as to tell ME how to take care of MY animals. Such beautiful quotes that can be recalled are:

"You're feeding your crested gecko Repashy Crested Gecko Diet?! You should be feeding it baby food!! Wow you should really read up on things."

"You know your crested gecko doesn't have a heat lamp. It's probably going to die without it. Just saying."

"Your leopard gecko is cute, but really fat. Look at that tail! You are feeding it just waaaay too much. You need to stop that."


Ahhhh yes. Those were the days. Until I got a call at 3am with her crying because her bearded dragon was having a seizure. I calmly informed her that it was because she had never provided him with a UVB light, or anything but crickets for his entire life. Only when the animal was on the cusp of death did she ask me for help. And even then, I told her I would only help her if she did everything I said, and didn't give me flack about it. Otherwise, she could figure it out herself.

She did. She listened. We got the beardie stable, got his diet better, his seizures stopped, vet agreed with everything I had told her, etc etc.

Two months later, she was dropping the ball again, not listening, and picked up even more animals. My last resort was taking her to our local reptile society and having complete strangers critique her animals and set-ups. Only then did she listen. Why? An outside source gains NOTHING. An outside source can judge you all they want and it's not personal. An outside source doesn't care who you are, but cares what the animals look like.

She did switch after that. And then realized reptiles weren't for her and sold the rest of them.

So perhaps you could have her bring her snakes to someone 'outside' of the situation to get some unbiased feedback? Although, you said she worked with a big name breeder, so maybe that might not work.

Sometimes, telling someone to change doesn't help. And sometimes, we need to be super blunt.

Personally, I couldn't be friends with someone who treated their animals like that. If you don't care about your animals, then are you really going to be a good friend to me? Are you going to care about our friendship? Or is it just there until you get bored and stop putting effort into the friendship?

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Wow Danielle thank you for sharing & the advice. Everything you said described exactly how she treats her animals, however she's never called me with a 911 emergency. & she also knows better to critique the way I treat my animals :colbert: hehe. She knows in her heart that I am more capable of properly taking care of these snakes & I'm going to do everything in my power to not let them get back in the wrong hands.
She actually watches me at least once a week "making my rounds", checking cage temps & humidity, cleaning cages, changing out the water bowls, & even feeding. I mean... she actually sees this, so it just tells me that she likes the IDEA of owning snakes, she just flat out doesn't have the motivation or compassion to properly take care of them.
On top of all this she worked for a breeder & took care of snakes so it's not like she is misinformed. I honestly think she had more "important" expenses that were used for other things instead for food that's a mere $4 every 5 days. So sad.
I have a feeling the will eventually be in my permanent collection. Thank you for your input, it was extremely helpful! :D

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Originally Posted by alpine

I would keep trying to keep them. That reverse psychology seems like it would be a good idea. I mean if you say something along the lines of, "Ya know, I do like the way these look, I could probably get some good babies off of them, can I keep them until they mature?" Might get you somewhere, The girl clearly isn't capable of giving them proper care as of now... And worst case scenario is that in the mean time you can educate her on what she SHOULD be doing so that she can care or them properly in the future (if she will listen)... But to be completely honest with you... If you were forced to give them back because she refused all offers I would go to the person she worked for previously and let him know what is going on... And if things didn't improve from there I might honestly consider getting the authorities involved... The whole lack of care thing does not go over well in many places when it comes to animals. But that is just me. Most of my friends and family don't have pets and the only other person I would trust with my animals is my boyfriend simply for the fact that I know he would take spectacular care of my little one. And I don't always care about friendship when it comes at the expense of innocent lives...

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I totally agree, I will try the reverse psychology approach & hopefully will get through to her. She was actually planning on breeding them in the future to "make a lot of money with bumblebees" which is hysterical & pathetic at the same time. See, I have plans on breeding but most definitely NOT for money... but for the pleasure of bringing life forth & putting it into hands of people who actually appreciate the beauty & mystery of snakes. :)
I'm keeping feeding records just in case she does eventually ask for them back when they are healthy. I'm also taking plenty of pictures just in case I do have to call the breeder (who is a family friend of mine anyways) or if I need to take it to the authorities, which of course is last resort.
I'm just like you when it comes to my animals (& I've got a mini zoo- 2 pitbulls, a beagle, 8 snakes, 1 leopard gecko, 3 aquariums, & 2 blue Indian ringneck parakeets. Whew. Lol.) & I only trust myself & also my boyfriend with my babies. Blessings, thanks for the great advice! :D