BEWARE!! Allen Exotics, AKA LAWReptiles, AKA Cutting Edge Exotics

The last thing this place needs is someone who posts flames at anyone. You could easily have posted a link to the thread where he was trying to sell the sickly snake, or stated your opinion in a more professional manner. The way you posted it would not have made me believe in your so called gut instinct at all.
It's always better to behave in a professional manner, even when you feel a need to post that someone else may be a scammer. I'm glad that the guy was caught before anyone else was taken advantage of.
For the record, a trade of live animals is a contracted exchange of goods, and as such, you can indeed charge them with theft if they do not uphold their end of the contract. I hope you get him charged!
I think the high post count means nothing too. You can say a lot, while saying nothing of consequance the entire time. Doesn't mean a darned thing.

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Originally Posted by karbogast

Eddie did you see the photo of the dehydrated wrinkled ball python that he was trying to sell a fellow member. That was a shame, and there is no way I could defend someone that tried to sell an animal like that, especially to an obviously inexperienced member of our little community here. That stuff matters, and if it makes you feel better to point a finger at me go ahead man! The people who have bought from me have been extremely happy getting great service and high quality animals because that is what everyone deserves when they spend their hard earned money.

I have been a positve member of this board and made a mistake in calling him a name, but if you think that one little slip defines who I am well your right! I am passionate about reptiles and those that choose this hobby as well. If I feel like someone is bad for the animals and the keepers alike, then there is no way I can not step up and say something even if it may offend someone and drive away a potential customer. The animals come first, period! I have seen many post and people that I didn't agree with but never voiced an opinion 'cause it was just that an opinion. With LAW it was much more than that and so I felt the need to call him out even if it was just a hunch. Sometimes in life if you wait for absolutes then it will be to late to follow your gut. I took a chance in an effort to help others, you are hung up on how I treated the person that was not on the up and up. I still don't get that! Eddie just understand that my intentions were good and although I was just trying to look out for others I respect your opinion to defend LAW even though I don't think he is worthy of you sticking up for him.

Here is a link to the unhealthy looking BP LAW was trying to sell and part of the reason I was "harsh" as Eddie likes to put it.
http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showthread.php?t=73336

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I am in no way saying that you are not a positive member of this community, because I think that you are. All that I was trying to get at was that you were calling him out before there was any proof to back up your allegations. I agree that he is scum, and I also agree that you are right. I just think that you should have waited to call him out until you had some hard evidence.

Yes I did see the pic of the snake he was trying to sell, and I did not agree with that. It looked too thin to me. But that to me did not prove to me that he was a bad guy.

I do respect you for looking out for me and everyone else in this community. Thank you. I just hope that next time you will get proof before calling someone out.

You know as well as I do that the reptile business is all about reputation, and if someone gets a bad rep then their business could go south. I would just hate for a good guy to get a bad rep just because someone had a hunch that they were a bad guy. That is if the hunch turned out to be false.

I am sorry if I offended you. I honestly did not mean too. I just hope that this does not burn any bridges with us.

What a :cens0r:!! Thanks for posting this, and thanks admin for banning where needed! I love you guys! :P

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Originally Posted by Wh00h0069

I am in no way saying that you are not a positive member of this community, because I think that you are. All that I was trying to get at was that you were calling him out before there was any proof to back up your allegations. I agree that he is scum, and I also agree that you are right. I just think that you should have waited to call him out until you had some hard evidence.

Yes I did see the pic of the snake he was trying to sell, and I did not agree with that. It looked too thin to me. But that to me did not prove to me that he was a bad guy.

I do respect you for looking out for me and everyone else in this community. Thank you. I just hope that next time you will get proof before calling someone out.

You know as well as I do that the reptile business is all about reputation, and if someone gets a bad rep then their business could go south. I would just hate for a good guy to get a bad rep just because someone had a hunch that they were a bad guy. That is if the hunch turned out to be false.

I am sorry if I offended you. I honestly did not mean too. I just hope that this does not burn any bridges with us.

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I was not offended, but I just wanted to explain where I was coming from and that I don't wildly flame people. Your response more clearly stated your concerns and they are valid to an extent and I respect that. We are cool as far as I am concerned and no burned bridges here.

I do think that it might be best if I just keep my gut instincts and opinions to myself and let things be in the future.

One thing I will say though, is that there are many more people out there producing great quality reptiles than there are scumbag rip off artists. The negative ripple effect from the actions of someone like LAW, are that many small hobbiest breeders( most of us ) are unfairly scrutinized because they don't have a "BIG" name despite the fact that they have put their heart and soul into their animals. That is just one more way that people like LAW hurt this hobby and the people that enjoy it.

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Originally Posted by neilgolli

Hello everyone, just catching up on the thread here and over on Fauna. I'd like to state that I don't know who this guy is. I cannot say that I've never sold to him as anyone who knows me knows that I'm terrible with names and could have very easily forgot his name. HOWEVER I would not give anyone a reference that I do not know exceptionally well as those references come back to reflect on me.

I have not been back to my office today as we are still very very busy with the buildout of the new building, thus have not been able to check my email records for anyone of the 12 address that he was apparently using.

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Come on, Neil....the guy has like 4 names and you can't remember any of them? LOL
I'm one of the many who saw ads from this guy and thought "stay far away". Glad folks can see him for what he is now.

Luckily for me, I never actually saw any of his adds, nor was I interested in any of them.

What I think is important right now is to help people who may not have been able to find information about the 'scums' out there.

Maybe, to look to the future on this, we could compile a list.

Not a list of banned, because some of the banned people aren't bad.. just not 100% family friendly.. ;) Rather a list of people as well as their alliances that have scammed or been caught red-handed.
We try to create threads, but those threads die, so maybe a good sticky is in order? A sticky that should live and be contributed as new people come along..

Just a simple idea, so that we can stick together and help each other with this. One of my worst fears is being scammed in real life. (lorsh knows how many times it's happened in online rpgs to me!)
It also worries me, that my sellers may not be trustworthy.
This is a hard trade, and I think we should do our best to make it strong for the good people involved.

Also, to Karbogast. I probably would have spoken up too if I was in your situation and had your thoughts.. however, it is something that we can both learn from, and to avoid in the future so that we don't end up getting the bad end of the chain. :gj:

There already is a resource set up for doing that, The Board of Inquiry on FaunaClassifieds. That's where I originally got my proof that the feeling I was getting about that guy was right.

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Originally Posted by karbogast

We are cool as far as I am concerned and no burned bridges here.

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Great, glad to hear it. :)

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Originally Posted by waltah!

Come on, Neil....the guy has like 4 names and you can't remember any of them? LOL
I'm one of the many who saw ads from this guy and thought "stay far away". Glad folks can see him for what he is now.

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One thing that threw up a flag with me was his in his add about the trade for a camera. He put that he had ... and other higher end morph and hets. Why did he not put in his add what these high end morphs were?

Just an update. I've filed a police report with my local PD who advises me to also file a report with the local PD in New Carlisle, OH as well. On top of this I will also file a report with IC3, Internet Crime Complaint Center. I was also told that based on the evidence I have I could file a civil suit as well. Along with this I can file criminal fraud charges against him if hes tried to sell any of my animals.

If anyone has or was going to do business with this guy for any of my two animals please let me know. Below are some pics of my ghost and mojave.I will need all the proof I can get to file the fraud claim. I would like to do whatever I can to get the attention of the authorities to follow through on this case. Please email me or call me at 773-454-0995. Email: samnangleam@yahoo.com.

Lets rise up against these scammers and make them think twice about doing this type of thing again.

The first 3 pics are from this guys photobucket account now has since been removed.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97...les/ghost2.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97.../ghostmale.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97...les/mojave.jpg


Here are pics that I have of the same animals.

The mojave that was supposedly DOA is the one with the long neck stripe with no breaks. This was the only pics I had of him that showed the same neck stripe as the one he posted on his photobucket account.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97...s/IMG_5409.jpg

Here is a pic of the ghost male that he tried to pass off to another person as a female.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97...s/IMG_5433.jpg

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Originally Posted by karbogast

I wasn't asking for, or expecting the staff to do anything. You guys/gals do a great job and my post was not meant to infer otherwise. I am merley stating that as a community we need to look out for each other and in that respect the "gut feeling" of an experienced individual can be very valuable.

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Right on Kevin- I totally get where you're coming from. I go by my feelings a lot and really don't care much that there is nothing empirical about them... My feelings typically do not lead me astray.

Thanks for sharing your feelings with the forum and going out on a limb to protect us all.

"I neither can nor will make any retraction since it is neither safe nor honorable to go against conscience." Martin Luther

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Originally Posted by dsirkle

"I neither can nor will make any retraction since it is neither safe nor honorable to go against conscience." Martin Luther

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I don't know what the context was to which MLK was speaking, but I firmly and unwaveringly and whole-heartily agree with "...it is neither safe nor honorable to go against conscience."

I'm big on personal integrity and personal honor and being true to one's Self even when it is not the most comfortable thing to do. That's what Kevin did. I approve and am thankful for his courage.

I guess we now know where he got the name AllenExotics, AKA Allen Williamson from. This is his son's middle name. Thats just low. My wife feels bad for his wife and son and want me to just forgot about it all this mess. I'm not so sure what to do as I feel strongly that I have a responsibility to report this guy to the necessary authorities so that he doesn't try this on other people. Plus I feel no remorse for someone like this. Only for their family. What do you guys think?

This was taken from his myspace page.

http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/ind...endID=165425898

Cute kid.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97...les/landon.jpg

Most all criminals have love interests and children. Should they all be able to commit crimes without any consequence? This guy gave some real thought to setting up these aliases and giving himself a rep on the BOI. He had a big shell game going on with all these snakes and victims and potential victims. If he gets away with it he will do it again to others maybe using something other than ball pythons. I think that you should pursue it to the fullest extent and at least make him live with the worry as to whether he will be successfully prosecuted or not.

I think you should do what you think you should do.
Nobody can make this choice but yourself.
Deep peace to you my friend.

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Originally Posted by StickyTongues

I guess we now know where he got the name AllenExotics, AKA Allen Williamson from. This is his son's middle name. Thats just low. My wife feels bad for his wife and son and want me to just forgot about it all this mess. I'm not so sure what to do as I feel strongly that I have a responsibility to report this guy to the necessary authorities so that he doesn't try this on other people. Plus I feel no remorse for someone like this. Only for their family. What do you guys think?

This was taken from his myspace page.

http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/ind...endID=165425898

Cute kid.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y97...les/landon.jpg

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I need to say that if the link and/or image from this post had not already been "broken" they would have been removed. I don't care how scummy an individual is, there is absolutely no reason to bring his or her children into the mix. It's fine to mention that he has a son and you're concerned for the child's welfare....but please do not post pictures of innocent children in a mess like this. There is simply no place for it.

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Originally Posted by JLC

I need to say that if the link and/or image from this post had not already been "broken" they would have been removed. I don't care how scummy an individual is, there is absolutely no reason to bring his or her children into the mix. It's fine to mention that he has a son and you're concerned for the child's welfare....but please do not post pictures of innocent children in a mess like this. There is simply no place for it.

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:gj: I agree with Judy. The idiot has already damaged his family. There is no need for us to drag his family further into the mix. And I think it is out of line to even post his kids name here. A link to his Myspace page would have been plenty of info. And if people were so inclined to go look at the info, that he himself had put on the web, then so be it. But let's not take it upon ourselves to do further harm to innocent people. :colbert:

In my opinion, you should file the reports. If he gets away with this he is just going to scam other people.

Upon further review and discussion, the staff felt it also wise to remove the child's actual name from the discussion. While we realize the information is already out there on other forums, that does not mean WE need to participate in dragging innocent children into the mud with their parents.

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Originally Posted by JLC

Upon further review and discussion, the staff felt it also wise to remove the child's actual name from the discussion. While we realize the information is already out there on other forums, that does not mean WE need to participate in dragging innocent children into the mud with their parents.

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Awesome and responsible and ethical decision. Gosh, I love this site!

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Originally Posted by JLC

I need to say that if the link and/or image from this post had not already been "broken" they would have been removed. I don't care how scummy an individual is, there is absolutely no reason to bring his or her children into the mix. It's fine to mention that he has a son and you're concerned for the child's welfare....but please do not post pictures of innocent children in a mess like this. There is simply no place for it.

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Judy,

That was my mistake and I took the pic off immediately. I do apologize. Just a momentary lapse of judgment.