Is this snake a blackback?

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Originally Posted by Tosha_Mc

When it's all said and done - a genetic blackback ain't worth any more than a normal anyway.

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So then, according to the tasha plan of discounting snakes, you WILL be looking to pick up black backs as soon as you find someone foolish enough to believe what you say, right?

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Originally Posted by wilomn

So then, according to the tasha plan of discounting snakes, you WILL be looking to pick up black backs as soon as you find someone foolish enough to believe what you say, right?

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I'm not exactly sure what you are saying here - I actually do love the blackback look and most of the "normals" left in my collection are still here because they are blackbacks. But when it's all said and done - they are just normals with a neat look to them - nothing more - even the ones that pass their look onto their offspring - normals - sorry if I don't feel the need to call it a morph and capitalize on it.

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Originally Posted by JASBALLS

Do you even have a clue what you are talking about? 39 people said no, Because they are like you. Havent got a CLUE!

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Really? ...I don't find this remark very professional. I would probably rethink this one.

Anyway....

I may get flamed for this, since I "haven't got a clue" and since I am not ralph davis...people will probably say whatever...but just like Ralph, I put my pants on one leg at a time...

But I feel that the name "black back" is misleading. To [B]me[B], it's like calling an ivory ball a patternless ball? Well ya, they arent called patternless because well, they usually have head pattern and a faint overall pattern of some sort. Sure I may be off my rocker with this...but does anyone else not think that this could be a matter of coming up with a misleading morph name? I don't know if ralph is the originator of the black back...but he is getting much of the credit in this thread. Ralph is awesome and creates awesome animals and I hope to own one of his animals in the near future but....maybe Ralph made a mistake by calling this snake a "black back"
rather than a "reduced saddle back" or something I duno...but like I said, I put my pants on one leg at a time, and I make mistakes as does everyone else.

I hope someone will agree with me...again I go back to the leopard gecko analogy, for years people called patternless leopard geckos leucys....when in reality they werent...so mislabeling of the name has happened in the herp-world.

It is a matter of opinion and I understand that, I am strictly speaking about the name "blackback"...

Why isn't the animals above a Calico?

Thank you for listening, but in the end....the poll speaks volumes. :salute:

Sorry I could not edit my last post, but another thing...

...I think the 'big wig' breeders who read this thread should take note as this thread really shows that people are not buying into the black back name...

...perhaps we (the smaller scale breeders) may "not have a clue" what we are talking about...but most likely we will be the ones purchasing your animals. So those big breeders on this thread that said...ya its a black-back. Well as of now...this thread shows that more people would probably not purchase your animal at a show if you are selling it as a 'black back.'

I don't know if I am making my point...this post is just really beneficial for those big breeders. Look at the poll big breeders...the public...the audience you are targeting arent buying into the morph...

...probably because "we dont have a clue" what the morph is all about...but i guess the poll shows many of us, including myself, are clueless. But no worries...we wont purchase your animals.

So big breeders....take a look at the poll...this is what the public thinks about black backs.

Even if the poll results were flipped, I dont think 60% people saying it IS a black back is a convincing enough percent to persuade me it is a black back?

Throw a poll up with a spider asking if it is a spider or not...and I bet you the results will be very definitive.

I don't get why everyone is so bent out of shape over this...

Does a bumble bee have a stinger and look like a bee....no; is this a misleading name as a result? Killer Bees, are they really killers?

Black Back is a termed coined by the person who started working with them as a means to describe a particular look in a snake. Does it imply being genetic? I never got that impression before.

It would be a different story if you say Genetic Black Back. To me a genetic black back is a morph and a "black back" is another way to describe something; just like "reduced, banded, and ringer" are all terms used to describe normal snakes with different physical appearances.

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Originally Posted by Spaniard

Does a bumble bee have a stinger and look like a bee....no; is this a misleading name as a result? Killer Bees, are they really killers?

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Killer Bees don't look like normals. They are worth the $$.

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

I haven't read this thread in days. Mike, have you ever considered that you might be wrong?


I ask because you tout yourself as if you have, and that you are a Connoisseur of black backed animals.


It's one thing to have an opinion, but when you start parading it as a hard fact in the face of many other more experienced opinions; telling others that your way is the only correct opinion; your going to be told otherwise.

I also find it interesting that whenever someone has a problem with a repeated answer they are getting, they are being "ganged" up on.

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Little, have you ever considered that YOU may be wrong? To this moment the MAJORITY of people when polled about the picture say it should NOT be considered a black back. So tell me, considering this fact, how are you able to determine that I am wrong when I agree with the Majority? Please, answer this question!

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Originally Posted by mcavana

Little, have you ever considered that YOU may be wrong? To this moment the MAJORITY of people when polled about the picture say it should NOT be considered a black back. So tell me, considering this fact, how are you able to determine that I am wrong when I agree with the Majority? Please, answer this question!

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Because we "dont have a clue." ;)

:bow::bow::bow::bow::bow:

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Originally Posted by Tosha_Mc

I'm not exactly sure what you are saying here - I actually do love the blackback look and most of the "normals" left in my collection are still here because they are blackbacks. But when it's all said and done - they are just normals with a neat look to them - nothing more - even the ones that pass their look onto their offspring - normals - sorry if I don't feel the need to call it a morph and capitalize on it.

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:bow::bow::bow::bow::bow:

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Originally Posted by mcavana

Little, have you ever considered that YOU may be wrong? To this moment the MAJORITY of people when polled about the picture say it should NOT be considered a black back. So tell me, considering this fact, how are you able to determine that I am wrong when I agree with the Majority? Please, answer this question!

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Ponder this Pinky....

We have NO clue who most of the voters are. They may well have NEVER seen any blackback than the one you complained about.

Only the people who have commented are known entities.

Also, ONLY 75, appx. people have voted. That's a darn small number of people for you, Pinky, to be making such broad ASSumptions on. In addition to the low number of respondents, you're only ahead by about 15 voters; again, a rather negligable amount.

YOU have an opinion. Others disagree with that opinion. There are NO breed standards therefore, much as YOU would like to be the end guy to say what's what, you ain't.

It's a black back if someone says it is. It's not if someone else says it isn't.

Personally, I figure it's a lowgrade blackback. Personally, if a snake is not 80% black on it's back, it's not a blackback as far as I am concerned. This one is close enough. That's my opinion.

Unless and until you get voted HMFC of all morph names I'll be paying somewhat LESS attention to what you have to say, based on the way you've said it here, than I will to most of the other respondents.

As far as your opening a store, good luck, you're going to need it.

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Originally Posted by Jerhart

Killer Bees don't look like normals. They are worth the $$.

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Are YB's not worth the $$ because they look normal also?

Something being worth the $$ is a matter of opinion and really has nothing to do with this issue about the term used to describe this kind of snake.

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Originally Posted by Tosha_Mc

I'm not exactly sure what you are saying here - I actually do love the blackback look and most of the "normals" left in my collection are still here because they are blackbacks. But when it's all said and done - they are just normals with a neat look to them - nothing more - even the ones that pass their look onto their offspring - normals - sorry if I don't feel the need to call it a morph and capitalize on it.

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Seems I recall someone being ALL over some poor schmuck about how the snakes he had for sale were not worth what he was asking and how she would NEVER pay those prices. This same woman was making all KINDS of noise about the poor schmucks pricing all OVER the internet.

Then, when the poor brow-beaten schmuck lowered his prices, which were actually fine for what he had prior to this loudmouthed deal seaking wench starting her tirade about how over priced he was, she bought them herself.

Yes, after so many complaints, she wound up buying them. Yes, after beating this poor newb up publicly, berating him, his snakes, and his business practices, when the price was lowered, SHE scooped them up.

Ethically bankrupt comes to mind, but that's just me, eh tasha?

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Originally Posted by mcavana

Little, have you ever considered that YOU may be wrong? To this moment the MAJORITY of people when polled about the picture say it should NOT be considered a black back. So tell me, considering this fact, how are you able to determine that I am wrong when I agree with the Majority? Please, answer this question!

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Surveys are by far one of the most biased and unreliable forms of statistical analysis you could get.

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Originally Posted by Spaniard

Are YB's not worth the $$ because they look normal also?

Something being worth the $$ is a matter of opinion and really has nothing to do with this issue about the term used to describe this kind of snake.

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Your right...it's all a matter of opinion...

...and my opinion is....YB's don't look like normals :gj:

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Originally Posted by Jerhart

Your right...it's all a matter of opinion...

...and my opinion is....YB's don't look like normals :gj:

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Some do and some don't; they vary a lot just like most of the morphs. Fires look normal to some people; its all about the person that's doing the looking, the experience they have and the number of snakes they've seen.

There are many morphs that look normal and produce amazing combos.

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Originally Posted by Spaniard

Surveys are by far one of the most biased and unreliable forms of statistical analysis you could get.

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Huh? :confused:

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Originally Posted by Spaniard

There are many morphs that look normal and produce amazing combos.

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...like recessive traits? :rofl:

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Originally Posted by Jerhart

Huh? :confused:

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Statistics 101

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Originally Posted by Jerhart

...like recessive traits? :rofl:

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Like granites, fires, and some ybs. I've seen many threads about granites and fires with people not seeing how they differ from normals.

Not trying to enter a pee whizzing contest, I have nothing to prove. Spend your $$ on what you feel is worth it.

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Originally Posted by Spaniard

Not trying to enter a pee flinging contest,

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Monkeys 101

One does NOT fling Pee.

One can WHIZ further, faster, in greater quantities or more colours than another, but one cannot FLING Pee.

Now poo, one CAN fling poo. Just ask mcvana, he's been doing it for several days now.....

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Originally Posted by wilomn

Monkeys 101

One does NOT fling Pee.

One can WHIZ further, faster, in greater quantities or more colours than another, but one cannot FLING Pee.

Now poo, one CAN fling poo. Just ask mcvana, he's been doing it for several days now.....

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I fixed it; but technically I could have been flinging pee ice cubes, I never did specify:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Spaniard

Surveys are by far one of the most biased and unreliable forms of statistical analysis you could get.

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LOL!

Maybe you should retake the class.

The debate is on if the snake should be considered a black back or not. The OP posted a clear picture of the snake, and then asked if it should be considered a black back or not.

Seems like a pretty clear cut, reliable form of data to me!

LOL!

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Originally Posted by mcavana

LOL!

Maybe you should retake the class.

The debate is on if the snake should be considered a black back or not. The OP posted a clear picture of the snake, and then asked if it should be considered a black back or not.

Seems like a pretty clear cut, reliable form of data to me!

LOL!

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Riiiiiiight....

Anyway like I said I have nothing to prove I got an A in the class and my statement stays the same. Call the snake what you want; I'm just glad my ego isn't as big as yours, doors would be a major problem.

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Originally Posted by Spaniard

Riiiiiiight....

Anyway like I said I have nothing to prove I got an A in the class and my statement stays the same. Call the snake what you want; I'm just glad my ego isn't as big as yours, doors would be a major problem.

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Why do you feel the need to insult me? Is that all you got?

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...ilies/stop.gif

Seeing as how there is a difference of opinion and not much else, I think there needs to be a time of reflection and of peace.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...ilies/beer.gif

Lets be civil, folks.

Is this snake a black back? :)

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...h/IMG_1008.jpg

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Originally Posted by littleindiangirl

Is this snake a black back? :)

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i2...h/IMG_1008.jpg

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From what I can see in the pic, I would say so... a beautiful one at that! Now will you answer my question?

I think Wes covered my response. :gj:

Jeez, I can't believe this is still an issue. How did 8 pages pop up in a day?? The point is, I think it is a blackback, many others agree. Mcavana disagrees with us, and has plenty that support him. So what? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Agree to disagree and move on...:frustrate