What would you do, as a buyer, in this situation?

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Originally Posted by Kodieh

When dealing on the Internet, you need to act quickly. It's also not like the OP paid for the animal and no shipping has been discussed. Shipping was discussed, it had a set day to ship, and the seller backed off of it and offered a refund. Then backed off of that too.

It's shady, and she's done the right thing despite what your opinion of the situation is.

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What's just as shady is that the buyer immediately wanted a refund...that to me smells of buyers remorse...personally I think the buyer found something she wanted more, can't afford both, and saw this as a way of getting her funds back...

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Originally Posted by Kodieh

In fact! The date today is April 22nd, she paid the first of two payments on April 13th. That's 216 hours by the way I do math.
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Final payment was done yesterday, not on the 13th. Was he supposed to ship after only receiving partial payment?

I'm not quite sure you can read. The seller specifically offered the refund at the point when he "knew" he wouldn't be able to ship on the agreed point.

Please go read the first post, and subsequent posts. It'll help you understand the thread in its entirety.

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Originally Posted by sho220

Final payment was done yesterday, not on the 13th. Was he supposed to ship after only receiving partial payment?

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Originally Posted by Ginevive

If I hypothetically wait until next week and do nothing, that could bring out the date of a potential refund beyond the 20 days that the original transaction occurred, factoring in allowance for shipping delays (let's say the snake was a DOA, or something.) I am wondering if I should just seek to reverse the transactions, if possible. I am really scared of losing my money on this. The seller had pretty good feedback on the BOI, but not much of it.

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This is why she is worried... I'm not too in-the-know on PayPal, but it looks like it goes by the BEGINNING of the transaction, not the end of it. So by that logic, it has been 10 days since the original payment. Yes, the offer to refund happened less than 48 hours ago, but PayPal doesn't care about that because that's not on the TRANSACTION record. So, if she "waited to see what happens" and then contacted PayPal about a refund, they would probably say they can't do anything since it's beyond the timeframe for refunds stated in their ToS or wherever they have those rules.

Like I said, I see nothing wrong with her covering HER behind on it, especially when it's an online transaction. Buyers remorse or not, it's HER money and she can do what she wants with it.

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Originally Posted by Kodieh

I'm not quite sure you can read. The seller specifically offered the refund at the point when he "knew" he wouldn't be able to ship on the agreed point.

Please go read the first post, and subsequent posts. It'll help you understand the thread in its entirety.

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Turning a disagreement into a bunch of insults is not the best way to get your point across...

"I'm not quite sure you can read"...lol...burn...:rolleyes:

That's why I'd be worried. He wants to ship a week from when the original day was. So, that's 8 days more, plus the 9 already based from the original transaction date (April 13th).

That's makes 17. What else might happen to cause another three day delay.

I can't be the only one seeing this.

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Originally Posted by sho220

Turning a disagreement into a bunch of insults is not the best way to get your point across...

"I'm not quite sure you can read"...lol...burn...:rolleyes:

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you've pretty consistently attacked the op, claiming that she suffered from buyer's remorse and acted shady... seems like you started insulting first, bud.

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Originally Posted by sho220

Turning a disagreement into a bunch of insults is not the best way to get your point across...

"I'm not quite sure you can read"...lol...burn...:rolleyes:

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Well, alright, you're deliberately overlooking details clearly outlined since the beginning of the thread.

I haven't said anything different, I just sugar coated it a bit.

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Originally Posted by xFenrir

This is why she is worried... I'm not too in-the-know on PayPal, but it looks like it goes by the BEGINNING of the transaction, not the end of it. So by that logic, it has been 10 days since the original payment. Yes, the offer to refund happened less than 48 hours ago, but PayPal doesn't care about that because that's not on the TRANSACTION record. So, if she "waited to see what happens" and then contacted PayPal about a refund, they would probably say they can't do anything since it's beyond the timeframe for refunds stated in their ToS or wherever they have those rules.

Like I said, I see nothing wrong with her covering HER behind on it, especially when it's an online transaction. Buyers remorse or not, it's HER money and she can do what she wants with it.

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While I agree with most of this, I can't back the bold part. That's just crappy imo...

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Originally Posted by sho220

Turning a disagreement into a bunch of insults is not the best way to get your point across...

"I'm not quite sure you can read"...lol...burn...:rolleyes:

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You're the one slamming the OP because you're assuming she has "buyers remorse". I think that's pretty insulting to just jump to conclusions like that like you're saying she's doing to the seller. How is it buyers remorse if the only reason she's getting her money back is because the SELLER offered her a refund? She never said anything about changing her mind on the animal on her own, and has apparently been following through with her payments. Two payments: one on 4/13, the other one a few days ago=she already paid for the snake; it WAS owned by her technically, she was waiting for it to be shipped. The seller indicated a problem and offered her TWO solutions: wait until next week to ship the snake to her, or get her refund. Just because she chose to get the refund means buyers remorse? :confusd:


I know it sounds mean, but people return things all the time. When you're the buyer, you spend your money how you want. Maybe she got into a fenderbender and the money that would've been free to purchase a snake with will be better used for fixing her car? Nobody knows. Other peoples' money is their business, not mine.

It is unfortunate that PayPal protects buyers remorse, however I'm convinced thus far that's not what this is.

If she requested a refund, that's one thing. Being offered one, and accepting it, changes things.

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Originally Posted by ChaosAffect

you've pretty consistently attacked the op, claiming that she suffered from buyer's remorse and acted shady... seems like you started insulting first, bud.

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I was suggesting it was buyers remorse...I would hardly call that attacking or insulting...

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Originally Posted by xFenrir

I think that's pretty insulting to just jump to conclusions

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Wow...this entire thread is people jumping to conclusion...from the OP's very first post...

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Originally Posted by sho220

Wow...this entire thread is people jumping to conclusion...from the OP's very first post...

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No, I'm trying to simply state that pointing fingers at people when you have no idea about anything in their life is counterproductive, and has nothing to do with the original OP's post.

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Originally Posted by xFenrir

I know it sounds mean, but people return things all the time. When you're the buyer, you spend your money how you want. Maybe she got into a fenderbender and the money that would've been free to purchase a snake with will be better used for fixing her car? Nobody knows. Other peoples' money is their business, not mine.

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Everything else aside, ball python breeders are not WalMart with return policies that allow for returning something if someone changes their mind. If I ever sell a snake online and, after receiving the money but before sending the snake, the buyer tries to back out, then I have to think that I would say sorry, no deal. This is making me think of putting a clause in my TOS that says that once I receive payment that the sale is then final and the snake will be shipped at my nearest convenience. If someone spent money that they couldn't afford, then I'm sorry (no I'm not) but that isn't my problem.

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Originally Posted by gsarchie

Everything else aside, ball python breeders are not WalMart with return policies that allow for returning something if someone changes their mind. If I ever sell a snake online and, after receiving the money but before sending the snake, the buyer tries to back out, then I have to think that I would say sorry, no deal. This is making me think of putting a clause in my TOS that says that once I receive payment that the sale is then final and the snake will be shipped at my nearest convenience. If someone spent money that they couldn't afford, then I'm sorry (no I'm not) but that isn't my problem.

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Yes, but she didn't ask for her money back, the seller offered it. At that point there should be no problem.


I just wanted to say that jumping on her for supposed "buyers remorse" wasn't relevant, and just was an ASSumption that started a complete derailment of the entire thread...

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Originally Posted by xFenrir

Yes, but she didn't ask for her money back, the seller offered it. At that point there should be no problem.


I just wanted to say that jumping on her for supposed "buyers remorse" wasn't relevant, and just was an ASSumption that started a complete derailment of the entire thread...

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So it's okay to jump on the seller as being a liar like so many have insinuated in this thread, but not question the OP's motives? Just want to make sure I have this right...

I don't think that anyone is saying that it is okay to jump on anyone for anything that isn't certain (i.e. - the motives behind wanting the refund, insinuating that someone is a liar, etc.). I'll be following this to see how the whole thing turns out.

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Originally Posted by sho220

So it's okay to jump on the seller as being a liar like so many have insinuated in this thread, but not question the OP's motives? Just want to make sure I have this right...

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I've said multiple times that the thing I support is her covering her butt on this, regardless.

The general, level headed advice given is to file a dispute and contact the seller telling him it is a precautionary measure. Never once did anyone actually vocalize "the seller is scamming you" or "get out while you can". I've implied it, but we're talking generalities not specifics. I do not know who the seller is, nor do I want to.

I've said to simply file a claim, and if he intends to refund he will. If he tries to back out like he has indicated, PayPal will handle it.

She was offered a refund and accepted. No two ways about it.

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Originally Posted by ChaosAffect

If you used Paypal I'd go ahead and file a claim to get the process started. It won't hurt him in any way as long as it's resolved amicably, but it'll protect you in case he does try to cut and run.

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Bam. Exactly what i would have done/recommended. Paypal leans in favor of the buyer. If the seller cannot make good, or resolve the situation that is satisfactory to the buyer, Paypal will get you your money back. It happened once to me.

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I'd like to see emails of the exchange to see if the seller is someone I want to avoid in the future. Like on the BOI I like coming to my own conclusions based on actual facts given (ie emails with headers) over 'he said, she said'. Though there's a lot of trustworthy people in this hobby there's also a lot who I will forever avoid unfortunately. :(

Sigh... Ok, Newb time. What's 'BOI'?

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Originally Posted by ChaosAffect

Sigh... Ok, Newb time. What's 'BOI'?

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Fauna's Board of Inquiry

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Originally Posted by ChaosAffect

Sigh... Ok, Newb time. What's 'BOI'?

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The BOI, or Board of Inquiry, is a reputation system. People make threads in the form of inquiry, bad guy, or good guy. Inquiry to gain information about a buyer/seller, bad guy for a deal going or gone bad, and good guy for a successful and satisfactory transaction. It's a place for a seller to research their buyer or a buyer to research their seller.

For me, the BOI is the greatest resource we have when it come to online sales. You don't want a bad, or poor, seller or scammer and you don't want to be selling to bad buyer. People have refused sells to people because their BOI history was construed with sellers who had a complicated transaction with that buyer.

What I'm trying to get at is that the BOI goes both ways, and no one is above scrutiny.

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I got a refund from the seller this evening. I am satisfied with this, and very relieved. I was feeling down today, and ended up buying a morph from a local seller to cheer myself up, and came home to the money having been refunded by the seller referred to in this thread; I would say that all is well now.

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Originally Posted by sho220

What's just as shady is that the buyer immediately wanted a refund...that to me smells of buyers remorse...personally I think the buyer found something she wanted more, can't afford both, and saw this as a way of getting her funds back...

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No; I just wanted to take advantage of the refund that the seller offered. I did buy another snake today, in person. This literally was before I had any knowledge of the refund being done. I would not lie about that. I just used my husband's financing some $ for a motorcycle on a credit card (rather than cash in hand) as a means to buy the snake using cash, in hand. I got home to find the refund was done. The snake was really one that I would have liked to have in my collection, but the retraction of the offered refund made my hackles rise, and made me grow mistrustful and alert. All is well that ends well, though, and I really do wish the seller sympathy no matter what his situation is. Neither of us is out anything now, and life can go on.

Glad he kept his word.

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And I never tried to "back out" of the agreement. I was advised that shipping would not be possible this week as agreed to, and if that was a problem, did I want a refund? I advised that yes, I would like the refund, since it was offered and since the seller was under stress and could (pretty understandably) be under more duress in the coming weeks, and offered me the refund based on their apparent desire to refund. If I really put myself into the position of losing someone close to me, I would really just want to refund the buyer the money, and avoid needing to worry about shipping a snake during that time. I think that this illustrates the good business practice of not spending paid money until a buyer receives their goods and it arrives safely and soundly. Even when I sell trinkets on ebay, I leave the buyer's money in paypal until everything is shipped safely as agreed. If I offered a buyer a refund, and they wanted it, I could then immediately refund the money and no one would be out anything other than some minutes of time. It is not like I spent money that I did not have; I sold some valued goods of my own and saved up money to be able to afford a few snakes, and this would have been one had circumstances gone differently. But things are what they are now, and I have been refunded.