Heat Tape

Mr. Gilmartin,

Hello and welcome, I believe very firmly that competition improves products for any field. I would be very pleased to see a reptile specific product from Calorique.

Personally and many would agree, that a lower wattage product would be high on the list. very rarely is there any need for a heating product to run at temps beyond 100ºF perhaps as high as 110º. Flexwatt will in many cases run beyond this safe limited temp. Thermostats can and do fail a product that has a lower likely hood of causing damage to the animals it provides heat to the better for everyone. The second issue that has been outstanding with the flexwatt product is the connection. The clips are large and bulky a low profile clip would be very valuable. The electrical ability of the end user is variable and a simple system is clearly needed. The other oddity of the reptile industry is the fact that a plastic object is frequently slide repeatedly over the face of the product. The reptile industry is not typical and often has been forced to adapt equipment to our needs and for my part I am very tired of this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ed gilmartin

@pitontheprowl. You are misreading what I am saying. Reptile basics were more like $70k - $90k per year. It is a small portion of our business and the industry is much larger than we had realized. I am just trying to get the facts straight.

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Actually I did get your point but you missed mine;)
So Reptile Basics was only a couple pennies to you and now there is a new competitor in the market.
Many reptile enthusiasts use belly heat or heat pads for one or more animals in their collections and have used or adapted your product for many years.
This insignificant loss to you now has you opening your eyes to all the monies going into keeping our animals warm and due to this loss you are now going to try and make your product at a cheaper cost to us.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ed gilmartin

Reptile basics were more like $70k - $90k per year.

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Ed from Calorique- Do you have a regular policy of posting your customers' private account figures for public consumption? I have no idea if that number is accurate, but I would never think of posting such a customer account figure online for all to see. That is odd.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Robyn@SYR

Ed from Calorique- Do you have a regular policy of posting your customers' private account figures for public consumption? I have no idea if that number is accurate, but I would never think of posting such a customer account figure online for all to see. That is odd.

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I agree Robyn... Extremely unprofessional.

In fact, once I called Calorique several years ago about buying wholesale direct from them and they quoted me 3x the cost that Rich and Beanfarm charge. I said this is ridiculous, you are the manufacurer and I can buy it cheaper at retail from the bean farm? They said "well, you're not the bean farm" and they divulged to me over the phone how much they spend yearly with them. At that time I thought it was extremely unprofessional... just as Ed did in his post with regards to Rich.

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Not to mention... they didn't even ask what I was looking to purchase LOL

It was as if when you called them they were like "Ughh it's one of those reptile people again" - like we were an annoyance and our money wasn't good enough.

Well, Good for THG for actually appreciating and catering to our community and making a superior product that is FOR our animals in mind.


Calorique is only paying attention now and "caring" because they felt they were untouchable and had a monopoly... and now us annoying little reptile people will be putting a dent in their pocket... but according to Ed... it's not THAT much anyways :weirdface

I applaud a manufacturer willing to exchange ideas with end-users on a public forum, it makes good economic sense for user and manufacturer both. However, I too find it odd and slightly disturbing that a manufacturer would reveal their customer's purchasing levels without the acquiescence of the retailer being mentioned.........no wonder Reptile Basics went elsewhere for their heat tape. I must commend them for experimenting and reporting back to the community on a better, more reptile-specific product soon to be offered for sale. Seems like a class act to me, while it's pretty obvious Calorique isn't a reptile-oriented business with little if any experience in the discipline. They just happened to get lucky enough to have a product made for a completely different purpose which enterprising reptile keepers discovered and adapted for their specific needs. Now all of a sudden Calorique seems to realize that the competition just caught up, and now that "piddling" 90 grand sales figure is quickly evaporating before their eyes. If all of this gives us a better, more useful product at a better price more the better for everyone....let the competition begin!

Robyn

I do apologize for postng the amount of business from reptile basics. I was replying to a post and had not realized it was something I should not be doing. I am not argueing with anyone on here. That is not my place. I just wantewd to correct Richs inncorrect comments about our product. I have agreed that we were not paying attention to this industry. There is no radiant heat film company in the world who could power up the proper equipment just for the reptile industry. That is why I would like to challange you to post who THG actually are. If they are the company yourself and Jeff are raving about you will have no problem posting their real website with phone, address, certifications, inspections etc. You cannot do that because they are a company that willdamage a few reptiles then disappear. I have seen it over and over. That is the great thing about being regulated in the US. There are laws against that. Can you post the approval for the new connectors from UL? Id like to see if UL actually apporved the connectors you are raving about. The opportunity for arching with that connector type is much too high with a cheap copper only bus bar. I have apologized for posting a ball park number for reptile basics now it is time for you to come clean about the THG Heat company that in my eyes does not even exist. I readily admitted that we dropped the ball due to not understanding your industry and that the heat tape was an afterthought and not our primary business. We will fix this in 2013 with better pricing and more finished products. I do want to apologize for our not fully understanding what you guys needs are but I think it is something that commonly happens to your industry by the sounds of things. All the remarks made by you and Rich are bocus. We never had one complaint from Reptile Basics in all the years they bought from us. We never were asked once to change anything whether it be watt density or connector type. If we had been asked one simple question about the connectors it could easily have been addressed. All our other products except the reptile heat and ceiling heat use 3M 2228 tape to seal the connection. So the low profile issue with the plastic connectors could have been put to rest in 2 seconds.

I think you owe it to the people on this forum to disclose who THG are and let them make an educated decision. Afterall they do love their pets and will be very disappointed that one of their own put them in jeopardy trying to make a quick buck. I dont think you will do it! Most importantly how long have THG been doing this? Prove it!

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Robyn

I do apologize for postng the amount of business from reptile basics. I was replying to a post and had not realized it was something I should not be doing. I am not argueing with anyone on here. That is not my place. I just wantewd to correct Richs inncorrect comments about our product. I have agreed that we were not paying attention to this industry. There is no radiant heat film company in the world who could power up the proper equipment just for the reptile industry. That is why I would like to challange you to post who THG actually are. If they are the company yourself and Jeff are raving about you will have no problem posting their real website with phone, address, certifications, inspections etc. You cannot do that because they are a company that willdamage a few reptiles then disappear. I have seen it over and over. That is the great thing about being regulated in the US. There are laws against that. Can you post the approval for the new connectors from UL? Id like to see if UL actually apporved the connectors you are raving about. The opportunity for arching with that connector type is much too high with a cheap copper only bus bar. I have apologized for posting a ball park number for reptile basics now it is time for you to come clean about the THG Heat company that in my eyes does not even exist. I readily admitted that we dropped the ball due to not understanding your industry and that the heat tape was an afterthought and not our primary business. We will fix this in 2013 with better pricing and more finished products. I do want to apologize for our not fully understanding what you guys needs are but I think it is something that commonly happens to your industry by the sounds of things. All the remarks made by you and Rich are bocus. We never had one complaint from Reptile Basics in all the years they bought from us. We never were asked once to change anything whether it be watt density or connector type. If we had been asked one simple question about the connectors it could easily have been addressed. All our other products except the reptile heat and ceiling heat use 3M 2228 tape to seal the connection. So the low profile issue with the plastic connectors could have been put to rest in 2 seconds.

I think you owe it to the people on this forum to disclose who THG are and let them make an educated decision. Afterall they do love their pets and will be very disappointed that one of their own put them in jeopardy trying to make a quick buck. I dont think you will do it! Most importantly how long have THG been doing this? Prove it!

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Robyn

I do apologize for postng the amount of business from reptile basics. I was replying to a post and had not realized it was something I should not be doing. I am not argueing with anyone on here. That is not my place. I just wantewd to correct Richs inncorrect comments about our product. I have agreed that we were not paying attention to this industry. There is no radiant heat film company in the world who could power up the proper equipment just for the reptile industry. That is why I would like to challange you to post who THG actually are. If they are the company yourself and Jeff are raving about you will have no problem posting their real website with phone, address, certifications, inspections etc. You cannot do that because they are a company that willdamage a few reptiles then disappear. I have seen it over and over. That is the great thing about being regulated in the US. There are laws against that. Can you post the approval for the new connectors from UL? Id like to see if UL actually apporved the connectors you are raving about. The opportunity for arching with that connector type is much too high with a cheap copper only bus bar. I have apologized for posting a ball park number for reptile basics now it is time for you to come clean about the THG Heat company that in my eyes does not even exist. I readily admitted that we dropped the ball due to not understanding your industry and that the heat tape was an afterthought and not our primary business. We will fix this in 2013 with better pricing and more finished products. I do want to apologize for our not fully understanding what you guys needs are but I think it is something that commonly happens to your industry by the sounds of things. All the remarks made by you and Rich are bocus. We never had one complaint from Reptile Basics in all the years they bought from us. We never were asked once to change anything whether it be watt density or connector type. If we had been asked one simple question about the connectors it could easily have been addressed. All our other products except the reptile heat and ceiling heat use 3M 2228 tape to seal the connection. So the low profile issue with the plastic connectors could have been put to rest in 2 seconds.

I think you owe it to the people on this forum to disclose who THG are and let them make an educated decision. Afterall they do love their pets and will be very disappointed that one of their own put them in jeopardy trying to make a quick buck. I dont think you will do it! Most importantly how long have THG been doing this? Prove it!

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Robyn

I do apologize for postng the amount of business from reptile basics. I was replying to a post and had not realized it was something I should not be doing. I am not argueing with anyone on here. That is not my place. I just wantewd to correct Richs inncorrect comments about our product. I have agreed that we were not paying attention to this industry. There is no radiant heat film company in the world who could power up the proper equipment just for the reptile industry. That is why I would like to challange you to post who THG actually are. If they are the company yourself and Jeff are raving about you will have no problem posting their real website with phone, address, certifications, inspections etc. You cannot do that because they are a company that willdamage a few reptiles then disappear. I have seen it over and over. That is the great thing about being regulated in the US. There are laws against that. Can you post the approval for the new connectors from UL? Id like to see if UL actually apporved the connectors you are raving about. The opportunity for arching with that connector type is much too high with a cheap copper only bus bar. I have apologized for posting a ball park number for reptile basics now it is time for you to come clean about the THG Heat company that in my eyes does not even exist. I readily admitted that we dropped the ball due to not understanding your industry and that the heat tape was an afterthought and not our primary business. We will fix this in 2013 with better pricing and more finished products. I do want to apologize for our not fully understanding what you guys needs are but I think it is something that commonly happens to your industry by the sounds of things. All the remarks made by you and Rich are bocus. We never had one complaint from Reptile Basics in all the years they bought from us. We never were asked once to change anything whether it be watt density or connector type. If we had been asked one simple question about the connectors it could easily have been addressed. All our other products except the reptile heat and ceiling heat use 3M 2228 tape to seal the connection. So the low profile issue with the plastic connectors could have been put to rest in 2 seconds.

I think you owe it to the people on this forum to disclose who THG are and let them make an educated decision. Afterall they do love their pets and will be very disappointed that one of their own put them in jeopardy trying to make a quick buck. I dont think you will do it! Most importantly how long have THG been doing this? Prove it!

Kitedeamon

I am going to bring this to one of my engineers. tomorrow we have a meeting in the afternoon to discuss how to better serve the reptile industry. You guys have been using our product for years and we have never stopped to understand your industry. Our attitude needs to change "if it is not broken dont fix it" wont cut it any more. We are willing to do that. If you have any other requests that you would love to see change email me and I will get them in front of our engineers. That also goes for anyone else readiing this. Feel free to send me an email with reqeuests and I will get it in front of the right people. I will then be open and honest as to why it can or cannot be done.

e.gilmartin@calorique.com

This pricing has not changed. We do have larger 500' rolls that are lower in cost as well as a discount for 5+ rolls that you can mix and match products to reach. We understand that it needs to be lowered. Why on earth would we assume you were talking about reptile heat tape if that is less than 3% of our business. Come on man. Lets be honest if anything.

REPTILE HEATING ELEMENTS

Product #	Description	Packaging	Price
IND21P17W120V	21” wide element 17 W/Panel @ 120 Volt (panelized) (maximum length – 56 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$499.00/RL
IND17P10W120V	17” wide element 10 W/Pnl @ 120 Volt (panelized) (maximum length – 48 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$399.00/RL
IND17P16W120V	17” wide element 16 W/Pnl @ 120 Volt (panelized) (maximum length – 29 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$389.00/RL
IND11-20W120V	11” wide element, 20 W/Lin. Ft. @ 120 Volt (continuous) (maximum length – 24 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$320.00/Roll
IND11P20W120V	11” wide element, 20 W/Panel @ 120 Volt (panelized) (maximum length – 24 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$320.00/Roll
IND3-10W120V	3” wide element, 10 W/Lin.Ft. @ 120 Volt (continuous) (maximum length – 48 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$200.00/Roll
IND3-6W120V	3” wide element, 6 W/Lin. Ft. @ 120 Volt (continuous) (maximum length – 80 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$200.00/Roll
IND4-8W120V	4” wide element, 8 W/Lin. Ft. @ 120 Volt (continuous) (maximum length – 60 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$220.00/Roll
IND4-5W120V	4” wide element, 5 W/Lin. Ft. @ 120 Volt (continuous) (maximum length – 96 feet)	Rolls of 100 Feet	$220.00/Roll
FB-1001	Plastic Insulators	Bags to 250 Each	$.50/EACH
FC-1001	Crimp Connectors	Boxes of 500 Each	$.50/EACH
FCT-104	Crimp Tool	Individually Boxed	$50.00/EA

@Pit.......You are correct. We had a by product that you guys could use. Now we realize there is potential to expand the market by producing product specifically for your industry. It is what it is. That is how any business works. I do apologize if you felt ignored but not once did we get any feedback that you could use some changes to the product. I apologize again. The competition will be gone in a couple of years just like the koreans have been exposed in the construction industry. But it is good that it got our attention and will help your industry. The reason this comes to our attention is from our legal team that guard our patents and other IP. agian this will be good for your industry.

Rich, can you get a THG rep to come on here and talk about their product?

THG Heat is a new company formed by Chad and Robyn of Pro Exotics, and Rich of Reptile Basics. It is separate from either PE or RBI.

That is not a secret, it is a company formed by reptile folks through and through : )

I have purchased from reptile basics in the past and the service was great. I have also heard nothing but great reviews. With that said I am not here to bash anyone or say what your doing is wrong but this thread is all over the place. It has become almost a fight similar to Pepsi and coke. The fans on either side will never agree which product is better. Although I feel in this case the producers of flex watt have stepped up and admitted that their product was not fully geared in supporting the herp hobby.

Being a college student, chemistry, I understand that a lot of work needs to go into these statistics being tossed around. Sources are everything, who tests your products, who fabricates them ect....

I'm sitting in an airport so I'm really not able to proof read or further elaborate on some of the topics I brought up. But I posted this because I think the reply below incorrectly answered the question. These are the founders but who are the manufactures and what have they done?

Again I'm not trying to flame anyone here....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Robyn@SYR

THG Heat is a new company formed by Chad and Robyn of Pro Exotics, and Rich of Reptile Basics. It is separate from either PE or RBI.

That is not a secret, it is a company formed by reptile folks through and through : )

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I see that bean farm sells thier flexwatt with the tape like Ed mentioned so that it can be low profile. Wish I had known about that before but at least I can hook it up for my new purchases. I generally prefer to stay with American made products and I am suspiciious of products coming from overseas so I hope a good resolutions comes soon. I don't understand why so many people have been making statements that seem to be from feeling hurt or slighted in some way by flexwatt, calorique or what ever the name is.

so who manufactures it? Can you show your community who they are? How much heat film they have installed? What certifications? What safety audits they have? I got caught up defending calorique here and my original goal was to correct the untrue statements about us. I do however think you owe it to your community to disclose who manufacturers the product. Name, address, pictures, safety proceedures, quality control? Anything? You claim the manufacturers focus is on the reptile community and care about it so that is the least you can do. i readily admitted we failed in fully understanding this industry but are redoubling our efforts now.

Robyn I have been in the thin film technology business for a long time and will be running a lot of tests on your new product. I know that EVERY Korean product changes watt density and they run from it once it fails. I wish you guys had have reached out to us first to discuss what you saw as the down falls of our product but that is history. We will never be as low priced as a cheap imitation knock off but we have a quality product. If I hear another lie about Caloriques film or Calorique in general (and rememeber we have been doing this for 30+ years) I will be posting photos of your product before and after testing. They are not pretty.

I would also like to hear how you you explain the connectors? The Korean buss bars are only 2 mils and if that connection moves (which it will due to the hole punch and exact placement it needs) how do you prevent arching and sparking which is very dangerous? Our amp connectors are rated for 17lbs of pull. the reason they need the teeth is because they cannot continuously come in and out of contact with the buss bar for safety reasons.

How did the resistance change 16% when tested? I can post those pics also if you like?

You are working with another cheap knock off and that is the bottom line. I wish you success and hope no ones pets are harmed but make sure the info you are posting is correct and not lies. That is only fair.

I am pretty curious as to your response on the issues with your product above!

Fellas

I think I am going to get out of your space now. I did get a little upset when the false statements were made about our product. This is no place for me to be getting annoyed. I trust that you guys will be very carefull in trusting your pets with a product that is not stable. In the meantime this has sparked me to make an even bigger push into your space. some things you need may be easy for us to do and some things may be cost prohibitive. Email me with a wish list and I promise it will not be ignored. I think you guys deserve it.

You will at the very least get a reply with a reason we can or cannot do something.

Thanks

e.gilmartin@calorique.com

I'm sure everyone here would like to see the pics.

Is flexwatt the same stuff that they use to do heated floors, like in bathrooms?


I don't mind paying extra as long as I know it's safe. I don't think making a product cheaper should be a main goal here. Even $1 more per foot would only add on $10-15 more on a rack that you are already paying $400-500 on.

I want my animals and house safe. That's my main concern.

Flexwatt is what everyone has used for many years, yes it has been adapted from home heating usage.

The new product from RB is well new, the quality and consistency remains to be seen as it will take a few years to fully determine. (multiple manufacturing runs and batch to batch consistency I suspect we are still in the same batch)

I am unsure when the first time it was available but I think it has been out a few months now? Perhaps Rich or Robin can correct me.

For my part I would like to know where it is made as it is clear rich and robin are not printing it them selves. I would also need to know if it is fully UL approved connectors and tape or just the tape. The Canadian laws for commercial application are quite clear.

Ever since i have started my research in keeping ball pythons it seems that everyone has their own methods and ways going about things. Understanding that even basic husbandry is often argued about as well. The way i look at this situation is fairly simple, some one at some point adapted using flexxwatt in rack systems for ball pythons and the news started to spread. Once people understood that this "Heat Tape" was really accommodating for rack and reptile heat it began to catch on. Now we have Ed letting us know that this heat tape was not IDEALLY and PURPOSEFULLY made for the pet trade but did turn some profits as well as satisfy the needs of some hobbyist. The fact that he has come on this thread and is revealing that he is working on better heat tape that is marketed towards our hobby i think is an amazing thing! Lets leave it at that? Literally no one will force your hand to buy the product.

In my opinion it all boils down to what works for me. If my animals are happy, safe, and healthy then the product is 100% perfect for me.

Not to down THG but flexwatt is in 1000s of homes and have been running for years. I remember seeing it years ago for heating bathroom floors, didn't know it was the same company.

As far as testing goes flexwatt has been used over and over again.
Now is it the safest thing for our snakes? I don't know. I'm running both in my home.
Sounds like both products rely on the t-stat not failing.

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Originally Posted by 3skulls

Not to down THG but flexwatt is in 1000s of homes and have been running for years. I remember seeing it years ago for heating bathroom floors, didn't know it was the same company.

As far as testing goes flexwatt has been used over and over again.
Now is it the safest thing for our snakes? I don't know. I'm running both in my home.
Sounds like both products rely on the t-stat not failing.

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Good points. I would like to see heating products that basically will never over heat or at least have a very low possibility of over heating during a failure. Aarons testing he did between them showed the RB tape to run hotter than flexwatt I was shocked by this. I would hope that both will address this and figure out a way to reduce and maintain a max operational temp. That is low enough that in the event of a tstat failure no lasting harm will come to the animals it is heating.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ed gilmartin

Robyn I have been in the thin film technology business for a long time and will be running a lot of tests on your new product. I know that EVERY Korean product changes watt density and they run from it once it fails. I wish you guys had have reached out to us first to discuss what you saw as the down falls of our product but that is history. We will never be as low priced as a cheap imitation knock off but we have a quality product. If I hear another lie about Caloriques film or Calorique in general (and rememeber we have been doing this for 30+ years) I will be posting photos of your product before and after testing. They are not pretty.

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I am sorry I had to throw my 2 cents in on the bolded parts of this comment.
First part says you will be running a lot of tests on their new product. To me this implies that you have yet to run said tests.

Second bolded part sounds so much like a threat. That you will post pics before and after said tests that you have not done yet due to your first comment then saying that they won't be pretty. How would you know that they would not be pretty due to the fact that you have not run any tests as of yet.

I will say that anything and everything can be made to fail if you try hard enough. Your product included.

I will say that I do not know Chad and Robyn from Pro Exotics, or Rich from Reptile Basics. Though I have ordered things from Rich before and would have nothing to say about him but good things. Ed I don't know you either though I have emailed your company a while ago and did not hear any reply back for about a month.

May I point out that Chad and Robyn of Pro Exotics I don't think would ever put out a product that wasn't tested and deemed to be safe after the terrible loss that they had to deal with from the fire that happened at their facility in September of 2011 which no one in this hobby could ever forget.

With all that said having something produced for this hobby by people in this hobby is always a good thing and it is something that I will support until someone gives me a good enough reason not to support them without throwing out things that sound like threats.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ed gilmartin

so who manufactures it??

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Kind of curious who they are.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ed gilmartin

How much heat film they have installed?

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This is just a stupid question in my mind!! How much had you installed in 1980 when you first hit the market??

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ed gilmartin

We will never be as low priced as a cheap imitation knock off but we have a quality product.

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So anyone that tries to make a product to give you competition in automatically a "cheap imitation knock off"?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ed gilmartin

If I hear another lie about Caloriques film or Calorique in general (and rememeber we have been doing this for 30+ years) I will be posting photos of your product before and after testing. They are not pretty.

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Pony up the mouth of that horse you are riding and post VIDEO of your testings just because anyone can do what they want to a product and then fudge the photos however they want. until then you are starting to sound like the southern end of that pony with threats you might not be able to back up.;)


BTW, if everyone uses their brain a little...................... We are talking about an electrical product and anyone can make it fail if you try to. The question is will it fail under normal operations of its maximum normal usage limit?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

Kind of curious who they are.


This is just a stupid question in my mind!! How much had you installed in 1980 when you first hit the market??
I am replying to THG claims that they have millions of installs around the world and in S. Korea. If that is the case I think it would be OK to post info on the manufacturer so you guys can have piece of mind.


So anyone that tries to make a product to give you competition in automatically a "cheap imitation knock off"?
No there is one other company that does it very well also. That is it. the Koreans cut corners and use cheap material. Thay also have no idea how to stabalize the ink.



Pony up the mouth of that horse you are riding and post VIDEO of your testings just because anyone can do what they want to a product and then fudge the photos however they want. until then you are starting to sound like the southern end of that pony with threats you might not be able to back up.;)
We started the testing on 12/10. This is only the first of the tests to check for resistance change. It goes into an oven at 85C as per most listing bodies. After 6 days the ink became untable and the resistance dropped by 16%. it is hard to shoot video of this because it woudl be days of seeing no change. What I think might be the best thing to do is have the guy that posted the results of his test try it in 3 months again to show the difference in the korean product and the same heat levels in ours. It is put in an 85C oven to speed the process up. You can find that test on ULs website. The reason this happens is the cheap bus bars that dont have any reinforcement with silver and a tin plate oxidizes and the product starts to burn up. the ink then becomes very unstable and resistance changes. In a few months we will know exactly who manufacturers this product because we can match it with the resistance change in other korean products.

BTW, if everyone uses their brain a little...................... We are talking about an electrical product and anyone can make it fail if you try to. The question is will it fail under normal operations of its maximum normal usage limit?

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Even though the testing speeds the process up the whole point is to show that over time the product will become too hot or too cold. We have tested Korean products that are ment for floor warming and ended upp being able to melt about 4 inches of snow per hour. this is not safe for anyone let alone reptiles. No electrical tests for arching and sparking have been done yet until we get the new connectors they use.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mattb

I am sorry I had to throw my 2 cents in on the bolded parts of this comment.
First part says you will be running a lot of tests on their new product. To me this implies that you have yet to run said tests.

Second bolded part sounds so much like a threat. That you will post pics before and after said tests that you have not done yet due to your first comment then saying that they won't be pretty. How would you know that they would not be pretty due to the fact that you have not run any tests as of yet.

I will say that anything and everything can be made to fail if you try hard enough. Your product included.

I will say that I do not know Chad and Robyn from Pro Exotics, or Rich from Reptile Basics. Though I have ordered things from Rich before and would have nothing to say about him but good things. Ed I don't know you either though I have emailed your company a while ago and did not hear any reply back for about a month.

May I point out that Chad and Robyn of Pro Exotics I don't think would ever put out a product that wasn't tested and deemed to be safe after the terrible loss that they had to deal with from the fire that happened at their facility in September of 2011 which no one in this hobby could ever forget.

With all that said having something produced for this hobby by people in this hobby is always a good thing and it is something that I will support until someone gives me a good enough reason not to support them without throwing out things that sound like threats.

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I just want to start by saying my original reason for coming on here was to correct the lies about Calorique. I have now gotten way too involved but will not allow any lies to be spread about us. We never had an issue or a complaint from Reptile basics so I agree they are a reputable company. I would not have worried about their "new" product until I read the original post on this thread and had to correct it. We have run the fisrt oven test that is done by testing bodies. It failed miserably. I would recomend the guy who posted his own results try again in a few months and post the changes side by side because I agree I could make their product fail if I wanted to very easily. that is not my goal. I have no issue with competition when all sides are being honest. It wont be long until you hear something bad about the new heat tape. I just hope you guys will blame the product that fails and not all radiant heat films. It happened to us in Canada and I dont want that to repeat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kitedemon

Good points. I would like to see heating products that basically will never over heat or at least have a very low possibility of over heating during a failure. Aarons testing he did between them showed the RB tape to run hotter than flexwatt I was shocked by this. I would hope that both will address this and figure out a way to reduce and maintain a max operational temp. That is low enough that in the event of a tstat failure no lasting harm will come to the animals it is heating.

---

We are working very hard on a self regulating ink. this came about due to the japanese market using futons as opposed to couches causing over heating problems. We have been working on it for a couple of years and it is close to being ready for UL. As soon as it is good to go we will make an announcment and make sure your industry is included as opposed to an aftertought. We already have a product but it would be way to expensive right now unless we can tweek the manufacturing process whcih we are working on. Dont count on the new SRI coming out this year. We put it to an internal test that is as long as ULs test for full listings. That means at a bare minimum it is probabaly 400 days out. If the other product that is already listed can be made at a lower cost I will let you guys know. We hope to have a dedicated reptile rep soon.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 3skulls

I'm sure everyone here would like to see the pics.

Is flexwatt the same stuff that they use to do heated floors, like in bathrooms?


I don't mind paying extra as long as I know it's safe. I don't think making a product cheaper should be a main goal here. Even $1 more per foot would only add on $10-15 more on a rack that you are already paying $400-500 on.

I want my animals and house safe. That's my main concern.

---

Yes it is used for:

Floor heat
Tile heat with built in anti fracture membrane
United States military targets (thermal vision)
Primary home heat (in ceiling)
Driveway/walkway/stair snow melt and deicing
Portable deicing mats
Reptile heat tape
Truck roof deicing and snow melting
Airplane wing deicing (in development)
Agriculture root zone quick grow (allow greenhouses to grow year round regardless of temp)
etc

Some if these are primary business' and some are a by product of what we manufacture. reptile heat tape is being elevated to the primary catagory not that we have a slightly better understanding of your needs.

Kudos for standing up to the heat of internet forum debate. I'm surprised nobody has been flinging poo over spelling and grammar errors yet.

At the end of the day, I'll be using a thermostat that fails in the OFF position and replacing my tape every few years since it's quite cheap, all things considered. What will likely make the difference to me is which product is easier for me to source.

1. There are only a few places to purchase this kind of heat tape by the foot, the way we prefer in this application of the product. What would help me out as a consumer is having it more available through more vendors. In some cases shipping can cost more than the tape itself.

2. I think the vast majority of keepers run their tape at 96 - 100 degrees on their T-stat. Thermostats are one of the most expensive pieces of equipment for anyone pursuing herpetoculture. A tape or line of tapes that max out at different temps would revolutionize the industry.

3. The strength of the laminate is the only quality of interest.

Ed,
Can you give us tips or insight on the best possible way we can use your product?

Probe placement, how to attach the probe, when stacking cages is it best to leave an air gap? The best clips to use, is soldering better?

As we wait maybe you guys can take a look on how we use your product. Give us steps on the best and safest way we can use it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 3skulls

Ed,
Can you give us tips or insight on the best possible way we can use your product?

Probe placement, how to attach the probe, when stacking cages is it best to leave an air gap? The best clips to use, is soldering better?

As we wait maybe you guys can take a look on how we use your product. Give us steps on the best and safest way we can use it.

---

Is it possible to email me or post a pic of your set up as well as the thermostat and probe you use? I dont want to guess and not fully understand yoru set up or even a typical set up. I am not that familiar with your industry but once we have a dedicated rep we can be proactive and post all the best practices. Thanks

Thanks Ed for discussing your product on this forum. I for one have heard enough that I will be planning on staying with Flexwatt for my own use and I look forward to you having a dedicated reptile rep. I will stick with Reptile basics for the majority of my products but I think I am going to stay away from the heat tape for now. I imagine it would take quite some time to test hundreds of strips of heat tape in varying conditions, and not just the ideal use conditions, before we could have a reasonable expectation of the product's safety and I would not be willing to jeapordize my home for a couple of dollars or because of un-needed bulky clips.

I can try to get some pics up but you might be able to find better pics from the people making the racks and cages.

Boaphile
Animal Plastics

Pretty much all the cages are set as follows.

PVC cage
Flexwatt taped to the bottom.
PVC cage
Flexwatt taped to the bottom

So your product is sandwiched in-between the PVC caging. Would it be better to have an air gap between the caging?


I guess the questions about the probes would be best for the T-stat company.

But how about the connections . Does your company provide the clips or are they an aftermarket item? What's best to seal those connections, electrical tape, liquid tape?
I read a lot of people say that soldering is way better than the clips. Is that true?
How about the other end, where the cut is. What's the best way to seal those ends?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 3skulls

I read a lot of people say that soldering is way better than the clips. Is that true?
How about the other end, where the cut is. What's the best way to seal those ends?

---

I thinkt he soldering is in addition to the clips increase the connection, and here is the tape sold by bean farm to replace the clips, probably sold at home depot or another hardware store.

http://beanfarm.com/product_info.php...oducts_id=5958

Ed-

First let me say that the posting of sales information like that is about the least professional thing I have ever seen a professional do in a public forum. That is a completely separate issue from any product disagreements we may have. It is also yet another symptom of a greater issue with Calorique that I have had building for some time now and why you have yourself a new competitor.

That being said- I am not going to bother adding up my purchases from you but it at least that. I would not have shared it for the above reasons either way but since you seem to run pretty loose with this information I don't really mind it. In fact since you brought a few things up lets put some of them to bed.

I do not at all care where your laminate comes from. The David guy seemed all excited about such things. Kathy has numerous times over the years told me that we were waiting on laminate from China to arrive. I will go on the assumption that all materials in your product are USA from here on out. Problem solved.

We- THG- has decided there is not a compelling reason to tell our competitor much of anything. We spent a lot of time and energy selecting a manufacturer that could do a great job for us. They do not have experience in the reptile field per se but that is where we come in. They have 10+ years experience and some very sexy equipment. They have been ultra responsive to our needs, questions and concerns during this process and we are very happy with the results. The country of origin was not considered since USA was out right from the start (there is no other that I am aware of in the USA) and price, though obviously has an impact, was not a consideration. The quality, appearance and function as well as service and willingness to work in a new market were the primary drivers. As it turned out pricing was pretty similar all around anyhow but the other factors listed were very different from company to company. Just like in the USA or anywhere else.

Speaking as RBI now- You guys are out of your minds. Your loose care of confidential info is just the last nail in that coffin. I directly TOLD Mike Collins at Calorique a few years ago this very thing would happen if a few things did not change. He made all sorts of promises to look into things, change things and possibly change things. He wanted to know what other products we could expand into. He approached me. I spent a fair amount of my time with him trying to do just that with him. I was blown off or B.S.'ed every step of the way. I did not expect most of it to come to pass but some pretend follow up would have been nice as it was his idea to start with. While your staff there has always been polite to me but same thing. One time I am told there is a 10 roll price then when I ask about it 3 or 4 more times to follow up I get double talk and I gave up and the list goes on. I tried having Calorique produce the element for my radiant panels, blown off. You guys blew it. I have spent countless hours answering customer emails, forum questions and the like selling your product. I have been instrumental in developing your market for you. You had countless opportunities to work with me on ways to improve, change and expand your product. You have at every turn failed. I have always very politely been treated as an after thought by everyone there. That is all the help you are getting from me on fixing what I consider to be the problems there. Based on your replies here I don't see that changing any time soon either. Sure is funny how the insignificant money got all

Now THG and RBI- We see no point in continuing what will inevitably degrade into a pissing contest in a public forum. This started with a pretty blatant attack on us, though not from Calorique, put us in a position of defending ourselves. As far as we are concerned we will have to respectfully disagree with Calorique on a number of points and they will have to do the same. We can test and they can test, round and round. Frankly if I want to create a test to get a rat turd to heat a cage I could probably come up with one. Lets just say there are now two players on the field and leave it at that.

So lets get back to positive- What we can tell you for those that do not already know us- All of the members of the THG group have 20+ years in the reptile field. We have kept it all and used it all to do so over the years. I (RBI) have extensive experience in the field of heating and controlling and also a track record with designing, manufacturing and using products like this. We are here to answer your reptile related heating questions and will be for a long time to come. Our product is new and there is no way to give you a long term track record with it for that reason but I have also been down this road with radiant panels and thermostats and have been quite successful. We (all of us) will be with you for a very long time to come and those that have seen our product, touched our product and used our product have all been very pleased. The website will be updated as new manuals, information, pictures and products become available in the coming couple of weeks. We were forced on our release date by other factors and would have preferred a couple of more weeks to get all of this up for you guys but we will get it done!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reptilebasics

Now THG and RBI- We see no point in continuing what will inevitably degrade into a pissing contest in a public forum. This started with a pretty blatant attack on us, though not from Calorique, put us in a position of defending ourselves. As far as we are concerned we will have to respectfully disagree with Calorique on a number of points and they will have to do the same. We can test and they can test, round and round. Frankly if I want to create a test to get a rat turd to heat a cage I could probably come up with one. Lets just say there are now two players on the field and leave it at that.

---

I can respect that.:cool:

not that my $.02 counts for much but this is where I stand on the subject. Rich... Hands down man you have the best customer service via internet sales that i personally have ever had the pleasure to deal with. Reptile related or any other for that mattter. That alone is enough of a reason that I will continue to do business with Reptile Basics in the years to come. I truely appreciate the effort you go through to satisfy your customers! Love of the game or just a good business sense either way keep up the great work! :gj: As for Ed at Flexx watt or Calorique what ever the name is.... You coming into our community to comment and your willingness to try and help says a lot for you also. We as a community don't know you. You are an outsider to us. That said it will take a lot to gain our trust. You may in fact have a supierior product but until THG has the chance to prove themselves or not most of us will continue to follow the path of well known and respected members of this community such as PE, SYR, and RBI. I hope that you suceed in finding a suitable reptile person to spear head your foot hold back into this hobby. Competition between business is a good thing for the public. It will do nothing but improve products and keep pricing competitive. Errors have been made on both parts in this debate. Lets not have a pissing match. after all everything that has or not happened is purely hearsay to everyone reading this thread other than to the 2 that are leading the discussion. Good Luck to both bussiness' and may the best product win.

Rich straight question, is the connection system you have developed UL approved or not?

I take no sides, and have only a single loyalty, my animals, period. I respect your reputation, and what you are trying to do. The simple fact is easy if the connector is not UL approved I cannot use it in Canada legally. I hate the clips. They frankly suck. I paid an electrician to wire my flexwatt so I could remain on the correct side of criminal liability. I am looking in the near future to building a new rack and again, need heating. I had planned on ultratherm panels as it meets all my criteria and ultimately is far cheaper. I would love to try the new tape and connector assuming it does not place me on the wrong side of the law. has it been approved for use by UL?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kitedemon

I take no sides, and have only a single loyalty, my animals, period.

---

X2

I have an order from RBI in the mail as I type this.



***edit. Sorry, misread it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reptilebasics

Ed-

First let me say that the posting of sales information like that is about the least professional thing I have ever seen a professional do in a public forum. That is a completely separate issue from any product disagreements we may have. It is also yet another symptom of a greater issue with Calorique that I have had building for some time now and why you have yourself a new competitor.

That being said- I am not going to bother adding up my purchases from you but it at least that. I would not have shared it for the above reasons either way but since you seem to run pretty loose with this information I don't really mind it. In fact since you brought a few things up lets put some of them to bed.

I do not at all care where your laminate comes from. The David guy seemed all excited about such things. Kathy has numerous times over the years told me that we were waiting on laminate from China to arrive. I will go on the assumption that all materials in your product are USA from here on out. Problem solved.

We- THG- has decided there is not a compelling reason to tell our competitor much of anything. We spent a lot of time and energy selecting a manufacturer that could do a great job for us. They do not have experience in the reptile field per se but that is where we come in. They have 10+ years experience and some very sexy equipment. They have been ultra responsive to our needs, questions and concerns during this process and we are very happy with the results. The country of origin was not considered since USA was out right from the start (there is no other that I am aware of in the USA) and price, though obviously has an impact, was not a consideration. The quality, appearance and function as well as service and willingness to work in a new market were the primary drivers. As it turned out pricing was pretty similar all around anyhow but the other factors listed were very different from company to company. Just like in the USA or anywhere else.

Speaking as RBI now- You guys are out of your minds. Your loose care of confidential info is just the last nail in that coffin. I directly TOLD Mike Collins at Calorique a few years ago this very thing would happen if a few things did not change. He made all sorts of promises to look into things, change things and possibly change things. He wanted to know what other products we could expand into. He approached me. I spent a fair amount of my time with him trying to do just that with him. I was blown off or B.S.'ed every step of the way. I did not expect most of it to come to pass but some pretend follow up would have been nice as it was his idea to start with. While your staff there has always been polite to me but same thing. One time I am told there is a 10 roll price then when I ask about it 3 or 4 more times to follow up I get double talk and I gave up and the list goes on. I tried having Calorique produce the element for my radiant panels, blown off. You guys blew it. I have spent countless hours answering customer emails, forum questions and the like selling your product. I have been instrumental in developing your market for you. You had countless opportunities to work with me on ways to improve, change and expand your product. You have at every turn failed. I have always very politely been treated as an after thought by everyone there. That is all the help you are getting from me on fixing what I consider to be the problems there. Based on your replies here I don't see that changing any time soon either. Sure is funny how the insignificant money got all

Now THG and RBI- We see no point in continuing what will inevitably degrade into a pissing contest in a public forum. This started with a pretty blatant attack on us, though not from Calorique, put us in a position of defending ourselves. As far as we are concerned we will have to respectfully disagree with Calorique on a number of points and they will have to do the same. We can test and they can test, round and round. Frankly if I want to create a test to get a rat turd to heat a cage I could probably come up with one. Lets just say there are now two players on the field and leave it at that.

So lets get back to positive- What we can tell you for those that do not already know us- All of the members of the THG group have 20+ years in the reptile field. We have kept it all and used it all to do so over the years. I (RBI) have extensive experience in the field of heating and controlling and also a track record with designing, manufacturing and using products like this. We are here to answer your reptile related heating questions and will be for a long time to come. Our product is new and there is no way to give you a long term track record with it for that reason but I have also been down this road with radiant panels and thermostats and have been quite successful. We (all of us) will be with you for a very long time to come and those that have seen our product, touched our product and used our product have all been very pleased. The website will be updated as new manuals, information, pictures and products become available in the coming couple of weeks. We were forced on our release date by other factors and would have preferred a couple of more weeks to get all of this up for you guys but we will get it done!

---

Rich
First and foremost I do want to apologize for the numbers I put up there. it was an accident. I am not familiar with using these forums and it probably shows with my posts repeating multiple times. I cant even work the spell check and it shows. I did not mean to post that publicly. I was addressing a comment and it should not have happened. I apologize again.

What you spoke about with an independant sales agent, Mike, I am not aware of. He had no business making any promises to anyone. Yes I have admitted that your industry was treated as an afterthought and that we dont really understand it. We never got any complaints so we thought if it is not broken dont fix it. I would never have got involved until you posted inncorrect and misleading info about Calorique. Kathy never once said we were waiting for laminate from China. We have always been loyal to the US supply chain and never once bought anything from outside the US. I just spoke with Kathy and she is shocked that this is going on. She said you and her had nothing but a good relationship and never any issues over the years.

I wish you all the best wiht your business but I know you are making a serious mistake with the Korean product. The connectors alone are a danger without even mentioning the inks instability. I am not sure who makes this product for you and what testing you did to determine this was a safe product but I would be careful. Everyone in your industry seems to love your company and it would be a shame to let a Korean product ruin your name. I will fight any korean versions of our product that tries to come to the US. They jeopardize our whole business. When they fail and cause safety concerns people think all thin film radiant heat is to blame. I have a lot of good workers here and I will NOT let a cheap foreign product put their jobs in jeopardy by getting our product a bad name. If you did detailed testing and this manufacturer is a reputible company then I encourage you to be transparrant about who they are. it will only benefit everyone. I will continue to post on all forums the differences of our products as well as videos of our plant etc. I want this to be open and clear. i highly recomend you do the same for your new product so we can compare products and manufacturers and let everyone decide what they feel most comfortable with. You attacked Calorique because a breader from your industry called a spade a spade. that was not right and I encourage you to be open about what your product actually is and who is making it. Again I apologize for the mistake I made.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kitedemon

Rich straight question, is the connection system you have developed UL approved or not?

---

Sure glade I am not in Canada LOL, you cant just solder the connections and have them done right the first time?
I am not a huge fan of the crimp connectors but I do like the rivet a lot more.:gj:
I personally think the rivet will last longer and is stronger than the crimp on IF done right.;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ed gilmartin

Rich
First and foremost I do want to apologize for the numbers I put up there. it was an accident

---

How do you "accidentally" post someone's sales figures? You tripped and opened Rich's customer file and copied and pasted it into the forum and then explained it while you had a concussion?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 3skulls

Ed,
Can you give us tips or insight on the best possible way we can use your product?

Probe placement, how to attach the probe, when stacking cages is it best to leave an air gap? The best clips to use, is soldering better?

As we wait maybe you guys can take a look on how we use your product. Give us steps on the best and safest way we can use it.

---

How can Eddie advise you on how to place a probe and how to place heat tape between enclosures when he hasn't the foggiest idea about the Reptile Industry? He has openly expressed that in his very own posts, so he would be the last person I would be taking advice from on how to set up my enclosures, probe placement, gradients etc.

He can't even determine where to place confidential sales figures lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robin@Exclusive

How can Eddie advise you on how to place a probe and how to place heat tape between enclosures when he hasn't the foggiest idea about the Reptile Industry? He has openly expressed that in his very own posts, so he would be the last person I would be taking advice from on how to set up my enclosures, probe placement, gradients etc.

He can't even determine where to place confidential sales figures lol

---

Well I said never mind about the probe, I was more just thinking aloud through my thumbs. I meant more along the lines of what would be better to attach a probe.
I used to work construction and I know flexwatt has been around forever and very trusted in home building.
I would hope he knew (or could find out) if it was best to leave a small air gap between cages. I never asked him how to set up enclosures or anything about gradients.

I have nothing to do with sales figures and I never thought that was the right thing to post.

Are you saying we shouldn't ask a rep from a company, that we all have used for years, the best way we should use their product? If someone from that company has no idea the best way their product should be used, none of us should have ever been using it.

I want what's best for my animals, that's it.

Oh definately I would ask a rep about how to use their product... for which it's original use was intended for... where they are educated at.

I would never dream of asking a computer fan company how to install one of their fans in my incubators to achieve best results in hatch rates... they would look at me like I was from the moon. I would ask a fellow Reptile Enthusiast who has also done the same thing.

Thats all I was saying :)

If you want to know how to heat your ceramic tiles - then Ed is your man (probably)
If I want to know the best way to heat my reptile enclosures - I'll stick with the experts.

P.S Judging by Ed's posts if I was to contact Calorique this is not the guy I would want to speak to either... He obviously lacks professionalism and the ability to keep private information private IE customer sales figures.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robin@Exclusive

If I want to know the best way to heat my reptile enclosures - I'll stick with the experts.

---

are you kidding me, just because you have used a manufactured product and adapted it to use with reptiles does not make you an expert in manufacturing heating elements. The question was posed directly, have you sought UL certification for this product. You do not make the element you are using and I have not seen a defense or support of thier UL either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ewaldrep

are you kidding me, just because you have used a manufactured product and adapted it to use with reptiles does not make you an expert in manufacturing heating elements.

---

I don't recall saying that it does :confusd:

I said that someone that keeps reptiles knows more on how to utilize that product in that situation.

exaclty, how to use a UL certified product in a given situation. What I have seen is that you have taken another heating element, no UL provided, attached wires with a rivet, no UL provided, and are selling it to gain a lower profile without the connector clips, a non-existent problem since a specialized tape can be used to seal the connection. I do not pretend to know all of the ins and outs of the factors that led to the current dispute but from I have observed, Ed knows what he is talking about when it comes to this product, given that he could use some iimproved tact. I have RB on quick link and plan to order from the company often, but when it comes to heating elements, I will go with UL certified products. I have ordered flexwatt with the bulky clips just recently from RB and would do it again, just without the clips. I would prefer to support a company within the industry but my home and family (pets included of course) come first.

They are UL certified!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 3skulls

Well I said never mind about the probe, I was more just thinking aloud through my thumbs. I meant more along the lines of what would be better to attach a probe.
I used to work construction and I know flexwatt has been around forever and very trusted in home building.
I would hope he knew (or could find out) if it was best to leave a small air gap between cages. I never asked him how to set up enclosures or anything about gradients.

I have nothing to do with sales figures and I never thought that was the right thing to post.

Are you saying we shouldn't ask a rep from a company, that we all have used for years, the best way we should use their product? If someone from that company has no idea the best way their product should be used, none of us should have ever been using it.

I want what's best for my animals, that's it.

---

I have reached out to guy that is big into your hobby. He will be coming to our facility with his products and we will shoot a video. As far as Robin he is obviosly trying to stir up a fight. Very impressive over the internet. We have heat engineers that know this product and how the heat dicatpates. They have took a home heating film and been able to engineer it for the US military with the militarys help so with the help of someone familiar with your products and needs we will show the best and safest way to get the most from our heat tape. He is 100% right. I would not have a clue how to set up racks or other equipment just like he would have no idea how heat works. He probably still thinks heat rises which is the basic mistake made when talking about heat. I hope to acheive this in the next couple of weeks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Robin@Exclusive

Oh definately I would ask a rep about how to use their product... for which it's original use was intended for... where they are educated at.

I would never dream of asking a computer fan company how to install one of their fans in my incubators to achieve best results in hatch rates... they would look at me like I was from the moon. I would ask a fellow Reptile Enthusiast who has also done the same thing.

Thats all I was saying :)

If you want to know how to heat your ceramic tiles - then Ed is your man (probably)
If I want to know the best way to heat my reptile enclosures - I'll stick with the experts.

P.S Judging by Ed's posts if I was to contact Calorique this is not the guy I would want to speak to either... He obviously lacks professionalism and the ability to keep private information private IE customer sales figures.

---

COngratulations Robin on never having made a mistake in your life. That is some accomplishment. I have apologized at least 6 times and that is all I can do. It was a mistake that will go by the way side in a short time. The mistake you are about to make will harm your pets and your home. Maybe you can shed some light on who manufactures the THG tape? How long they have been doing it? The benefits and safety measures they have? the build up of the product etc? Why it is a superior product to ours. I have said 10 times I am not from your industry but I know thin film radiant heat a lot more than most people. I know how the new connectors on THG will move and not be snug and any electrician (I am sure you know at least one that could educate you on this at least for you own safety) will tell you that causes arching which creates sparks when they come in and our of contact. We all know sparks is what causes fires. Give me a shout when you join the rest of us and make your first mistake. I congratulate you on making it so long without doing it so far. Well done.

I want to reiterate that this is not sour grapes because we lost a distributor. That happens in business its unavoidable. What prompted me to get on here was to correct the misleading statements about our company and product. The bigger picture is that when cheap Korean knockoffs that think they can pull the wool over Americans eyes and come here and cause issues harming the reputation of our product. Try going after a company that does not exist or you cant find and if you do try sueing them for causing harm to you and your pets and see how quickly they disappear. I also want to state that this is nothing to do with Reptile basics or Pro Exotics. I have seen it happen for years. They have a good sales pitch and even show photos of other manufacturing plants so you get that warm and fuzzy feeling. It has happened to many companies and will continue to happen.