Ideas for open floor design for Hanging Rat Cages?

[Jabberwocky Dragons]

I'm gearing up to install some hanging cages in our barn for rabbits. They have open mesh floors so all the excrement falls through to the barn floor where it can be composted. This makes cleaning much easier and I think provides a better environment for the animals.

I would really like to do something like this with my rats too instead of keeping them in a rack, if possible. You can't keep rats in a rabbit cage because the mesh floor is way too big for their feet. I think if I used mesh that would support rat feet then the opening would be too small to pass the rat excrement through.

So I wanted to throw this out here and see if anyone has done this before and what your set up looked like???

[blubudgie]

Rabbits actually do better on non-wire flooring. The wire is harsh on their feet and can eventually hurt them if they stay on long enough. You can keep the wire floor if you really have to, but give them some flat places to rest. Maybe large pieces of cardboard, towel/fabric, plastic? It'll help them keep warm too.

I imagine it is the same with rats. Being on wire isn't super comfortable or as enriching as being on bedding. With bedding they can dig around, chew on, pick through it, etc. Bedding also helps them keep warm/thermoregulate. I think if you can keep them on a solid floor with bedding it's probably better.

I work in a lab and I've seen some rats (especially the smaller/younger ones) fail on the wire mesh cages we sometimes have to keep them on.

[Fraido]

Rats living on wire mesh type floors would likely lead to bumblefoot. I can't imagine that would be comfortable to live on, anyways.

[Jabberwocky Dragons]

Rabbits actually do better on non-wire flooring. The wire is harsh on their feet and can eventually hurt them if they stay on long enough. You can keep the wire floor if you really have to, but give them some flat places to rest. Maybe large pieces of cardboard, towel/fabric, plastic? It'll help them keep warm too.

I imagine it is the same with rats. Being on wire isn't super comfortable or as enriching as being on bedding. With bedding they can dig around, chew on, pick through it, etc. Bedding also helps them keep warm/thermoregulate. I think if you can keep them on a solid floor with bedding it's probably better.

I work in a lab and I've seen some rats (especially the smaller/younger ones) fail on the wire mesh cages we sometimes have to keep them on.

I appreciate your input but rabbits can do very well on wire flooring. Though there are exceptions for certain breeds and individual rabbits. My rabbit enclosure layout comes from breeders who've been keeping generations of happy and healthy rabbits on wire flooring for decades. Rabbits that are $200-300 each so they care very much for their rabbits' health and well-being. Many species also thrive down to -40 degrees without any heat source so warmth isn't really an issue for outside rabbits. Adequate protection from elements is necessary of course, especially wind and rain.

It's certainly debatable but I think constant fresh outside air and sunshine, in addition to cage objects for interaction, is far more healthful and enriching for rats than being inside a cement tub inside a rack inside a building. Nothing wrong with the tub and rack though either... that's what I'm using now.

I too am having a hard time seeing how rats could be safely kept on a mesh floor large enough to pass their excrement (we do agree here) but that doesn't mean someone hasn't come up with a system that works and keeps them happy and healthy too. I'm hoping someone has and could share their method.

[Jeanne]

I bred rats for show for many years, rats dont do well on wire or mesh floors at all. They will get painful bumblefeet. And their feet wld also be in constant contact w urine, which can burn skin. I dont reccomend keeping rats in that manner at all.

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[Fraido]

I appreciate your input but rabbits can do very well on wire flooring. Though there are exceptions for certain breeds and individual rabbits. My rabbit enclosure layout comes from breeders who've been keeping generations of happy and healthy rabbits on wire flooring for decades. Rabbits that are $200-300 each so they care very much for their rabbits' health and well-being. Many species also thrive down to -40 degrees without any heat source so warmth isn't really an issue for outside rabbits. Adequate protection from elements is necessary of course, especially wind and rain.

It's certainly debatable but I think constant fresh outside air and sunshine, in addition to cage objects for interaction, is far more healthful and enriching for rats than being inside a cement tub inside a rack inside a building. Nothing wrong with the tub and rack though either... that's what I'm using now.

I too am having a hard time seeing how rats could be safely kept on a mesh floor large enough to pass their excrement (we do agree here) but that doesn't mean someone hasn't come up with a system that works and keeps them happy and healthy too. I'm hoping someone has and could share their method.

Do you live in an area that gets low in temps? That would be an issue for the rats, they would get URIs. Which is, of course, no good. Rats definitely don't thrive in the cold, or really hot, temps. I assume you probably know that already, though.

Perhaps it could be possible if there was an abundance of soft hammocks and hides in the cage, and maybe a shelf with a solid ground, that way they wouldn't be forced to be on the mesh all the time. If I noticed they felt more inclined to sit on the mesh, I would go back to the rack system. No point in risking pain and discomfort when there's already a system that works.

[Jabberwocky Dragons]

Do you live in an area that gets low in temps? That would be an issue for the rats, they would get URIs. Which is, of course, no good. Rats definitely don't thrive in the cold, or really hot, temps. I assume you probably know that already, though.

Perhaps it could be possible if there was an abundance of soft hammocks and hides in the cage, and maybe a shelf with a solid ground, that way they wouldn't be forced to be on the mesh all the time. If I noticed they felt more inclined to sit on the mesh, I would go back to the rack system. No point in risking pain and discomfort when there's already a system that works.

I live in Zone 7 so it doesn't get very cold here. The barn would be filled with other animals... donkeys, goats, rabbits, etc. so lots of body heat. I would use some sort of supplemental heating on the rare truly cold night.

I've been reading more about bumblefeet and it seems like the rat community is divided on it's cause. Lots of reports of rats being kept on wire floors for years with zero issues and bumblefeet found on rats living on solid floors frequently enough too. The cause may be genetic and due to poor circulation. I'm not advocating keeping rats on wire floors but apparently the cause of bumblefeet is a contentious issue on the forums I browsed.

That is a good cage design suggestion, thank you. I'm now thinking of designing a hanging cage with solid floors but with either a pullout tray or trapdoors so the bedding can be quickly dumped.

[Fraido]

I've never heard of places being referred to as Zones, haha. I'll take your word on the temps. though.

I haven't done a bunch on research on bumblefoot, but my understanding was that the wire flooring gets soaked in urine and the wires themselves could eventually cause some kind of lacerations on the feet in which urine would go in and cause an infection after prolonged exposure. As I said though, I haven't really done any research! I think it's just the urine soaking into an open wound, no matter how small, which leads to the bumblefoot, so of course it could happen to a rat on solid floors, the wire floors are just more abrasive, so more likely to cause it. I could be all wrong though! I do remember reading about the possibilities of genetics playing a role.

A pull out tray sounds like a good idea, if you do that my only suggestion would be to somehow secure the tray in between dumpings, you never know what they're capable of! Lol I'd also be wary of using plastic for the tray, I feel like a pull out tray might provide some better opportunities for chewing depending on the design, so maybe go for metal if you do that.