My rat party lol DU don't even think about it

[SatanicIntention]

I'm going to have to side with Crissy. I've also seen Megacolon litters and if you want to see suffering, and babies starving to death because their intestines are unable to absorb nutrients, then go ahead and breed them. I don't enjoy seeing baby rats at 3 and 4 weeks of age(or older if they have the late onset MC), skin and bones, but bloated from gas buildup because the food they eat is rotting in their gut. Gas buildup is painful, starvation is painful... Why would you wish that on an animal?

www.ratguide.com Search for megacolon.

Hoodeds DO NOT have the predisposition for creating megacolon offspring. They are not high white. Huskies, rats with headspots, blazed rats all DO. It's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when, and when they're placed with that other specific rat who also carries it.

Don't breed the marked or high white rats. Stick with selfs, berkshires, hoodeds, and you'll be fine. Hoodeds(or the "safe" ones I spoke of) that make blazed or high white rats, that's a different story. That is recessive blazing and is considered safer than if you breed high white to high white. Recessive blazing doesn't generally have problems with MC.

[Bettacreek]

I didn't see where she said she was planning to breed her rats. I don't think it's wrong to purchase/adopt a rat with a blaze simply because megacolon can run in the lines. I also don't think you can lay a blanket statement and say that nobody should be breeding blazes or other high whites. Megacolon doesn't automatically appear just because they're high white, it's just that they have a higher chance of it, and if you breed properly and research the lines you're working with, you can avoid it.

[SatanicIntention]

Really... So people with blazed pet store rats, which is dominant blazing, not recessive blazing, who also breed them for feeders, are researching it?

Petsmart and Petco don't give out pedigrees with their rats last time I checked.

Last year, I adopted a blue blazed female rat who was around 4.5-5 weeks of age. After a week of having her in quarantine, she developed horrible smelling diarrhea, started to bloat on her left side, was looking malnourished despite her eating well, and she died within the next two weeks. This was from late onset megacolon. The distributor for Petsmart/Petco/etc breeds for pretty rats because pretty rats sell. They don't care about the conditions the animals are kept in, they don't care about the quality they are churning out, they just care about the money. If animals die in the process, what do they care?

SO YES, MOST pet store high white rats have the propensity of carrying the megacolon gene. Most people who adopt these rats don't breed them, but when you get the feeder breeders buying these "pretty" rats instead of the safe patterned/colored rats, you get megacolon babies and carriers. The rat fancy has been trying to get rid of megacolon for years upon years, but it's not going to happen because people just insist on breeding their "pretty" rats together.

I have a few high whites in my collection, but they are from long generations of safe breedings, and they are the result of recessive high white genes. I bred a Black Berkshire Dumbo Rex female to a Blue Agouti Bareback Harley Dumbo male and got an Agouti Berkshire Dumbo Harley Rex M, a PEW Harley Dumbo M and an Agouti Lightning Blazed Capped Dalmation Harley Rex Dumbo F. These are registered and pedigreed animals with pedigrees longer than some AKC dogs. Their lines are guaranteed free of genetic health problems from long years of selective breeding.

Now, if I were to go get two high white rats from Petsmart or Petco, and bred them together, there would be a very high likelihood for genetic health problems such as megacolon. I've been

I've been breeding and raising rats since 2003...

[Bettacreek]

but when you get the feeder breeders buying these "pretty" rats instead of the safe patterned/colored rats, you get megacolon babies and carriers.

So you're going to sit there and say that anyone who breeds a high white is guaranteed to get megacolon babies and carriers simply because they're feeder breeders? Believe it or not, but it's not a biased gene that automatically appears simply because people aren't being "responsible" breeders. People who're breeding for fancy feeder breeders can in fact luck out and produce healthy lines that aren't carrying megacolon. Actually, some of the feeder breeder rats are healthier than the "common" or more readily available pet rat lines, simply because they cull and cull hard for unhealthy rats. Nobody breeding solely for feeders is going to hold onto rats that die at 8 weeks from megacolon (well, nobody is), and most will ditch the parents that produce weak offspring, simply because it's not good for production.

[anendeloflorien]

Actually these are all breeders and we've currently had 6 litters with no megacolon. I got all but the siamese from Kara up at NERD and she's been breeding these lines (with new blood from time to time) for years with no problems so I feel pretty safe in saying that we won't have any major issues. I understand that there are issues with certain lines especially the black blaze and the high white but like I've said all of the females have had litters already with both of the males and we haven't seen any problems. I'm not saying that it will never happen but if it does that rat will be retired as a breeder.

[littleindiangirl]

Actually, some of the feeder breeder rats are healthier than the "common" or more readily available pet rat lines, simply because they cull and cull hard for unhealthy rats.

It has been my experience that readily available feeder rats are extremely poor quality and will need intensive concentration for generations to get to a stable, high producing rat that just doesn't crap out and die for no reason.

I have seen a young rat, clearly affected by the extreme bloating of megacolon in a feeder tank in my local pet store chain that buys from a large producer down in the south of the state.

That does not scream "hard culling". Most stores or producers put two animals together just to sell, and it's quite obvious in their feeders health and production.

That's why so many people come and ask that question, "Why did my feeder Breeder just die?", or "My Feeder rat only had 4 in a litter, is this normal?", "My rat came with mites! Help!"

Generally, we call them crap rats and that it will take some selective breeding on their part to get past the initial crap petstore feeder rats until they get large litters of healthy feeders.

Just my $0.2

[anendeloflorien]

The Odd Eyed Black Dalmatian is also high risk for megacolon.

In general, most high whites are at risk for carrying megacolon and almost all odd eyes carry megacolon. However, there are breeder lines of high whites that do not carry the high white, megacolon gene.

I'm not sure I understand what an "Odd eyed" rat is? Is it just the way his eyes are set? Because if so that seems to be the way that all of my rats eyes are in pictures. Or is it because he has a patch of color over one eye? Also he is not really black more of an agouti/wild type color not that I think that makes much of a difference.

I've rescued a few megacolon litters and it is one of the most horrifying illness I've seen in an animal. I've watched dozens of litters die very slowly because the owner thought their rats would have pretty, fancy babies.

With that being said, very nice and healthy looking crew you have! [/I]

Thanks they are all very healthy happy rats! All of my breeders are my pets and I love each and every one of them. They get plenty of time to come out of their cages and play, they get plenty of good food and their cages are always clean .

As far as megacolon goes if that ever popped up in my rats I would immediately retire the breeders and get some from an unrelated line, probably some of the lower risk types. I keep extremely detailed records on all my animals, rats included. Everything from who is breeding with whom, to when I clean their cages or change their water. When I picked these guys up I didn't go in looking for the "pretty" rats. Actually I didn't even pick them out at all, Kara did that for me. All I told her is that I didn't want just albino rats even though she had some lines that produce 18-20 babies each litter lol.

Thanks for all the comments guys and I just want you to know that I do take any health problems with my rats very seriously even if they are just going to be fed, I would never want to cause undue pain to any animal.

Becky I appreciate your comments most of all, I really do respect your opinion and I promise (like I said before) if there is even a hint of genetic problems with any of my breeders that pair would be retired and most likely spayed or neutered immediately.

[Michelle.C]

I'm not sure I understand what an "Odd eyed" rat is? Is it just the way his eyes are set? Because if so that seems to be the way that all of my rats eyes are in pictures. Or is it because he has a patch of color over one eye? Also he is not really black more of an agouti/wild type color not that I think that makes much of a difference.

The picture you took makes it look like one eye is Ruby, and the other is black. That's what "odd eye" means.

[anendeloflorien]

The picture you took makes it look like one eye is Ruby, and the other is black. That's what "odd eye" means.

Oh no they're both the same color. That's just the way the picture was taken, cuz I had to use flash because my room is too dang dark lol.