Unfair bias due to visiting a sick reptile breeder

[FloridaHogs]

In a recent post from Jen on a different forum, she did end up euthinizing the two kings (mind you this virus only ever affected the BP's, never other species). The racks went to a mechanic that wanted to use them for storage. All the tubs went to be recycled. Spoon, her first snake ever was kept, and the Gstripe, at the request of the owner. He did not want it put down. Jen stated that she is out of the reptile hobby, and is simply keeping these two as pets only. The BP she kept was her first snake that got her started in the hobby. She could not afford to keep the other animals, and couldn't give them away if she tried, so what else would you have her do?

[Tosha_Mc]

She also mentions she was tight on money (ex-husband and phone bills, call Judge Joe Brown) and she went over 2 weeks without feeding her collection, even the babies, she had them on a “maintenance” diet.

Cry me a river.

Sadly I think that was the main reason behind the big freeze -- she realized that she could no longer make any money off snakes and they were getting too expensive to keep around. She could have saved herself a lot of grief if she'd a done it 10 months ago when she realized the situation was out of hand - as was suggested but I think the $$$ got in the way of rational thought.

Of the three that she didn't freeze - one apparently got sick so she froze it as well - the other was the G-stripe on loan that the guy told her she could keep or freeze (IMO he shouldn't have given her the choice but at least he's done kinda right) and the third she is keeping. So she could still have two potential carriers -- or a year from now the Dr. could tell her the virus can't hang around that long and she'll have a nice big breeder G-stripe and a female to start over with.

[FloridaHogs]

Spoon is a male, so she will have 2 males. My understanding is that the breeder asked her not to kill the g stripe, and the two kings were not getting sick, but she thought better of keeping that many animals. The only BP she was planning on keeping was Spoon.

[Sonya610]

She could not afford to keep the other animals, and couldn't give them away if she tried, so what else would you have her do?

Okay then, we got to the point. It was a business decision. Too expensive to feed them. Anyone that has ever faced euthanasia knows its all about business, yuppers. Now that we have gotten to the point there is no fuss huh?

Anyone want to place odds on when she reappears with a "clean" batch? I bet it is less than a year. Maybe a new nick, maybe on craigslist, I do predict it won't take long.

[wilomn]

As confusing and contradictory as it can be, it would be best to let Jen speak for herself instead of relaying what you think she wrote someplace else.

By the way, have you heard about the retic that at the kid all the way to his knees in Az? It was a bit over ten years ago.

I never heard of it either.

Oh well, it's possible.....

[Sonya610]

[QUOTE=wilomn;860113]As confusing and contradictory as it can be, it would be best to let Jen speak for herself instead of relaying what you think she wrote someplace else.
[QUOTE]

Perhaps someone stole her login and password from other forums, and she was unable to address the false info posted under her name. How many was it? 60? 80? More? Put in a freezer? Dumped on a friends farmland and burned and buried (God please let them have been gone before that part) because they were a disease risk? Yet harboring others that were an equal risk because they meant something to her and her child?

Have you ever euthanized an animal that could have lived many years, and if so, did it take a little bit of your soul? If you have a soul it probably did.

Yes I realize I am being harsh and judgemental, and it seems very appropriate. No apologies. Last post in this thread.

[Montessa Python]

Okay Original Poster here...
I have been emailing Jen on occasion, and it is truly a sad thing that happened to her.

But why should I have to be marked OR stigmatized because I went to her house ONCE.

And a virus does not live on a person for 6 months. I can understand being cautious and paranoid about wanting to protect your investments, pets, and business/babies..
But we live in the age of science, and reason and enlightenment. Lets try to keep the heebie jeebies, "boy" germs, and fake cooties as child hood games.
I could submit cultures from my snakes, the building, and things from my home.
But I shouldn't have to.
Can any one here say they have NEVER been in casual contact with some one who had something bad happen to their collection? IBD, RI, or other even mites..
Just saying I empathise with her, and with the fellow who suddenly said "I can't take that chance."
But I and others should not be stigmatized for something that happened to another person and I was in her home once.

Carol

[frankykeno]

This is typical jenn from day one.

I never sold any snakes at all....except for the two.....

I never had a sick snake.....except for the ones.....

I put them all down....except for .........

It is a damn shame it happened. It's also a damn shame she continued to get more snakes while she KNEW she had this problem. It's a damn shame that she KNEW she didn't have proper quarantine proceedures yet continued to aquire new snakes.

I like jenn. I feel bad for her.

She also brought 90% of this on herself.

That keeps getting swept aside in all the emotional turmoil involved with her. I think it bears further thought.

For me, Wes, in the end it was her lack of QT that just got me. I'm sorry but there is just no damn reason in the world to not QT especially when you take in rescues. It's not rocket science, it's not even that hard to do - it's QT. Just something you do, you make it a part of the routine of things, I can't imagine not doing it. Why you'd put your collection at risk in some willy nilly rush to get more snakes I cannot imagine.

I feel sorry for the snakes, I do not feel sorry for her. She's supposed to be the thinking, reasoning, responsible human being in this situation. She had enough experience to know how to do QT properly. If her living situation wasn't such that she could do QT then sorry but she should not have been bringing in any new snakes (especially someone else's morph!). Just because we humans want something, doesn't mean we should get it all the time.

Carol, as much as you don't like this one person's response to your having visited Jen's home, the fact is anyone for any reason can call off a breeding loan. That's their decision and yours to accept it. It's not likely to mean you'll have a big red A imprinted on your forehead dear, it's one person's decision about what they feel is in the best interests of their collection. I've made that call when a snake owning friend came over to visit. I knew he had a snake at home with a simple RI. He knew that due to that he would not be allowed contact with any of our snakes while his was sick and was fine with that. It's not to be rude to anyone but in the end Mike and I make decisions based on what we feel is the most prudent and responsible course of action for our snakes.

[littleindiangirl]

Okay Original Poster here...
I have been emailing Jen on occasion, and it is truly a sad thing that happened to her.

But why should I have to be marked OR stigmatized because I went to her house ONCE.

And a virus does not live on a person for 6 months. I can understand being cautious and paranoid about wanting to protect your investments, pets, and business/babies..
But we live in the age of science, and reason and enlightenment. Lets try to keep the heebie jeebies, "boy" germs, and fake cooties as child hood games.
I could submit cultures from my snakes, the building, and things from my home.
But I shouldn't have to.
Can any one here say they have NEVER been in casual contact with some one who had something bad happen to their collection? IBD, RI, or other even mites..
Just saying I empathise with her, and with the fellow who suddenly said "I can't take that chance."
But I and others should not be stigmatized for something that happened to another person and I was in her home once.

Carol

You ask the same question over and over, when most here have said pretty much, Yea, your marked for visiting with her.

It's not fun, no one likes to admit that, but everyone has been saying it in a very nice way with "It's his decision"

Now, just because it's public knowledge of where you been doesn't mean everyone is going to consider you an outcast. I don't know where you got the idea from.

One guy, ONE guy you didn't even know, ONE guy that jumps at the idea of a breeding loan tells you he doesn't want to take the chance, and you all of a sudden consider yourself a pariah of this community? Come one now, does that sound reasonable?

Your the one that made this post, so you really couldn't have been too worried about it, because usually if someone is outcast for one reason or another, they'd most likely want to keep that reason on the down low. At least I would!

In my opinion, you've jumped to conclusions. But now a lot of people know you've been to Jen Harrisons house. People are scared of the virus, there is no denying that. Her story is well known, as you can tell by this thread. NO ONE wants to destroy any of their own animals because of the spread of this virus.

So yea, as much as it sucks, in some peoples eyes your potentially dangerous. In other people's eyes, your just another hobbyist.

6 months isn't that long, if I remember correctly, Jen's virus didn't appear for months. People in this community are scared, this is an unknown virus, with an unknown shedding time, unknown dormancy, unknown carrier state, unknown everything.

6 months is a drop in the bucket, when were you at her house? Didn't this virus infection happen about 6 months ago? People will be thinking about things like that....

[MeMe]

Okay Original Poster here...
I have been emailing Jen on occasion, and it is truly a sad thing that happened to her.

But why should I have to be marked OR stigmatized because I went to her house ONCE.

And a virus does not live on a person for 6 months. I can understand being cautious and paranoid about wanting to protect your investments, pets, and business/babies..
But we live in the age of science, and reason and enlightenment. Lets try to keep the heebie jeebies, "boy" germs, and fake cooties as child hood games.
I could submit cultures from my snakes, the building, and things from my home.
But I shouldn't have to.
Can any one here say they have NEVER been in casual contact with some one who had something bad happen to their collection? IBD, RI, or other even mites..
Just saying I empathise with her, and with the fellow who suddenly said "I can't take that chance."
But I and others should not be stigmatized for something that happened to another person and I was in her home once.

Carol

First I would like to address this question...

Can any one here say they have NEVER been in casual contact with some one who had something bad happen to their collection? IBD, RI, or other even mites..

yes.

I have NEVER.

however...this was not an RI...IBD..or even mites.

secondly...yes we do live in the age of science...but even science has not been able to determine what the virus was, so how can you expect anyone to take a chance?

I don't believe this is a matter of "cooties"...cooties won't kill your whole ball python collection. I know this cause Jeff has cooties and all mine are just fine.

In the end...it is up to the person who is doing business with you weather or not to let this situation..or any other...affect your dealings.


just sayin'