Beef about some morphs

[waltah!]

I just received my YB from VPI last week and a Cinnamon from BHB today and while they are not "amazing crazy looking" they are much different from normals. You just need to put them all next to each other and you will see there is nothing normal about them. I think a lot of people see that they are not crazy colors and say they look normal. Pics tend to not do these morphs justice either. I got them for the supers they produce and with the pastel i'm getting i'll see pewters eventually

[Bill Buchman]

Michael,

I've always been a big critic of the naming trends in ball pythons and I own all the morphs you mentioned, (except for the russo het BEL)

While a Yellow Belly may look a lot like a normal to many people they scream out "I'm AWESOME" to those of us who are bp fanatics.

It wouldn't be a good idea to call a mojave a het BEL simply because then we would lose all distinction between russos, butters, phantoms, lessers, mochas and mojaves... none of which look alike.

My biggest beef with morph name is not the names of the base morph but the names of the combos. I think its awesome to call a spider pastel a bumble bee but it has to stop somewhere! You can 't make up a new name for every new combo and it also makes it a LOT harder for the bp newbie to learn the combos.

I say call the combos by what they are. super pastel spider pied or whatever. Otherwise we'll all eventually require massive IQ's to breed morphs

Justin

Justin,

This subject is something I have been struggling with on a number of different levels.

I have a new dominant morph I have proven(last fall) that is still under wraps. I am making 2-3 combos with him from known morphs this season. I also may hatch a new combo morph or two as well -- depending on hatch dates. What do I name them? Do I stick with the Pastel-Yellowbelly format or come up with a new cute, witty, insightful, original, etc...name. It is a little stressful trying to find a name in the color/food genres -- many are taken.

I have been thinking way outside the box in naming concept!!!! Nothing to do with colors, foods, insects, gemstones, or any other earth science. Something so out there that whether you thought loved the name, or thought absurd -- you would know "I" named it.

The "naming thing" should be discussed considering the number of new morphs coming in the next few years coupled with the many new people coming into the hobby/business. I would like to hear the opinions from new folks to veterans. Insights from those of you who have been around more than my 16 months in the hobby would certainly be of great value to me and maybe others?

Justin, you would be one of those people along with many others on this forum. As with many things ball python, there seems to be no clear answer to this one. It seems that whichever way you go someone will take issue or just plain will make the other valid choice. I guess a poll would give us some raw numbers, but would not allow for discourse. Ideas EVERYONE!!

[Monty]

my question on this thread is why if the mojo the butter and the lesser have the same identical type patterining why the diffrent names just because one is lighter then the other they all produce blue eyeds

[jkobylka]

Justin,

This subject is something I have been struggling with on a number of different levels.

I have a new dominant morph I have proven(last fall) that is still under wraps. I am making 2-3 combos with him from known morphs this season. I also may hatch a new combo morph or two as well -- depending on hatch dates. What do I name them? Do I stick with the Pastel-Yellowbelly format or come up with a new cute, witty, insightful, original, etc...name. It is a little stressful trying to find a name in the color/food genres -- many are taken.

I have been thinking way outside the box in naming concept!!!! Nothing to do with colors, foods, insects, gemstones, or any other earth science. Something so out there that whether you thought loved the name, or thought absurd -- you would know "I" named it.

The "naming thing" should be discussed considering the number of new morphs coming in the next few years coupled with the many new people coming into the hobby/business. I would like to hear the opinions from new folks to veterans. Insights from those of you who have been around more than my 16 months in the hobby would certainly be of great value to me and maybe others?

Justin, you would be one of those people along with many others on this forum. As with many things ball python, there seems to be no clear answer to this one. It seems that whichever way you go someone will take issue or just plain will make the other valid choice. I guess a poll would give us some raw numbers, but would not allow for discourse. Ideas EVERYONE!!

I appreciate that you're taking the whole naming thing so responsibly. I also have the chance at a new combo this year so

I'm just going to call it what it is. (if I hit the LONG odds it would be the super pastel pied.) The only problem I have with that is that the next guy to produce one might go ahead and name it...

I like the fact that all the base morphs have cool names. I think that's awesome. The name should have some clue as so the look of the animal IMO. Most base morph names really do fit the animal they belong to. After the base morphs I've resolved to call things by their ingredients.

It would be really interesting to have a set naming system kind of like chemical compounds in chemistry or latin naming of medical stuff... but i don't want to ppl to have to take a college course in order to understand bp combos!!!!!

Justin

[West Coast Jungle]

my question on this thread is why if the mojo the butter and the lesser have the same identical type patterining why the diffrent names just because one is lighter then the other they all produce blue eyeds

Pattern is not identical. Mojaves have a very distinct pattern while lessers and butters vary. The lessers all come from Ralph Davis's original, so anything named lesser came from that line. Butters are from a different line but if anyone wanted to make the arguement that butters and lessers are the same they would have a good point.

mojaves though are very different, maybe not to the untrained eye but still they are. Even the BEL's they produce are different with coloration on the head.

The main thing is it has been proven that there are genetic differences that are reproduced in the offspring. In theory if you produced a BEL from a lesser/mojave and then bred that to a normal it would make lessers and mojaves. Just like a cinny and black pastel would do if you had a super of the two.

Ralph Davis also proved that a pied and lesser combo make a white snake but you wouldn't say they were the same because they also produce a white snake now would you.

The fact that they produce BEL's means they have genetic similarities but doesn't make them the same morph.

[Monty]

thank you for the clarification that was one thing that was bugging me i knew they were diffrent lines i dont know i guess i havent seen enough lessers or butters in person to really tell. but from what i seen that the vendors had of them they looked like mojos just a lot lighter in color

[muddoc]

What do you think of Spiders? They only produce spiders, no supers - but they are great in combos - so they also hold value as combo potential. Ever seen the Super Stripe? Got to have a yellow belly to make one. Ever seen the Crystal ball python? Got to have a mojave to make one.

Don't look at just the animal, but the potential and power behind that animal in combos as well.

Just to clarify on the above bold statement. Brian (BHB) made a Crystal with a Lesser last year.

[Bill Buchman]

I appreciate that you're taking the whole naming thing so responsibly. I also have the chance at a new combo this year so

I'm just going to call it what it is. (if I hit the LONG odds it would be the super pastel pied.) The only problem I have with that is that the next guy to produce one might go ahead and name it...

I like the fact that all the base morphs have cool names. I think that's awesome. The name should have some clue as so the look of the animal IMO. Most base morph names really do fit the animal they belong to. After the base morphs I've resolved to call things by their ingredients.

It would be really interesting to have a set naming system kind of like chemical compounds in chemistry or latin naming of medical stuff... but i don't want to ppl to have to take a college course in order to understand bp combos!!!!!

Justin

YES! Somebody makes it after the person who named said combo what it is --"Super Pastel Pied" -- Nice Justin!!! Hope you hit it. I digress. The second maker decides he wants more "BLING" attached to this new combo -- so he names it. And let's say most would agree it is a GREAT name. That is not the point!!!

If someone makes a combo from an ESTABLISHED LINE (captive-hatched and wild-caught are a completly different argument) of base morphs 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc. -- he "should" follow suit and respect WHATEVER the primary-maker named it -- even if that name does not "float his boat".

With that in mind, I am not sure I will be able to show the resolve as you. I would rather a snake I produced carry my absurd name rather than take the chance that it will become known by someone else's absurd name! The possibility of someone naming something I, or anyone else, produced FIRST just "burns my butt". It is rude IMO.

For those of you who read this post and are thinking why is this guy getting his painties in a bunch over this naming thing -- just wait and see how many times this comes up this issue comes up in the next 2-3 years.

I think a rule book is in order. I've got it! A think-tank should be formed at Daytona this summer and this "name game" should be settled once and for all!!! LOL

Seriously, I'm with you Justin. Name combos according to what made them. But, if someone hits a combo and gives it a hideous/ridiculous/infantile name -- FOLLOW SUIT!

[bigballs]

what if you have a super pastel, spider, albino, pied???

wouldnt you rather just call it a "super paspiedbino"?

[Ophiuchus]

Or how 'bout a "super alpastyspider pie?" See how ridiculous this can get?

Let's just mix all the morphs together and call them the "Ultimate Balls of Steel" or something.