Ribbon Snake in Paludarium?

[jspuds]

I have been keeping Frank, my ball python, for about 3 years. Next year I graduate college, and I'm looking into getting another snake.

I'm thinking I would really like to try my hand at a paludarium-type setup, with a semi-aquatic type snake. Obviously, I'd build the setup and get it running before getting one. I do not plan on keeping anything else besides the one snake in the enclosure, I have seen others have plenty of problems trying to mix species.

(what do you mean I can't have guppies, cichlids, anoles, fire-belly toads, fire-belly newts, a red eared slider and an ig in a 20 gallon? THEY'RE FINE, STOP HASSLING ME!) Joking.

I was thinking a paludarium setup with probably 4-5 inches of water in the bottom of a 10 or 20 gallon tank (filtered), with a plexiglass-type terrestrial area covering most of the tank over it, hopefully made into a sort of terrarium-type setup, with probably silk plants; live seems a bit too tough and easy to grow bacteria in. And obviously, hides. I don't know how a UTH would work in this type of setup, so I was either planning on using a CHE or looking into snakes that thrive around room-temperature. Screen top would allow ventilation / stop the humidity from being too high.

It seems like a ribbon snake fits the bill for this - they're small and relatively aquatic. The one concern I have is feeding. I would really like to be able to feed f/t mice, as this provides complete nutrition, and I always get concerned that the diet will lack calcium, d3, etc if I'm feeding crickets. Plus dusting, and more important, gut-loading is a bit of a P in the A.

So, Questions:
- How old do ribbon snakes have to be before than can reasonably be switched to pinkies?
- Would they really like this type of setup?
- Anything else that might work that is beginner-capable? I'm beginning with non-BPs, and have only had a BP and a corn snake in the past, so I don't want to get in over my head.

Sorry about the verbosity, I like to plan this kind of thing in advance, and I have too many questions.

Thanks,
Jim

[Ophiuchus]

Its really not so much age as size. If the pinky is close in girth to the largest point in the snake's body, thats the when he should start eatin pinks.

As long as there is some dry area for it to get to, this set-up should be fine. I would defintely do a 20-30 gall though.

[qiksilver]

I agree with what was already said. Although I have one of my own, why even have a paludarium if you're going to have silk plants? To me that seems silly, no offense intended, I just really enjoy my plants. With that said, for a paludarium search for bog plants, you can check out the dartfrog forums for fantastic ideas, they really have great setups. With a working setup good bacteria will thrive and you shouldn't have problems with bad bacteria (if it's balanced). Also be careful with leaving dry areas because you will need them in order to allow your snake to dry out and not get blister disease which could kill your snake. When I was young I had a ribbon snake with a planted vivarium, and if you provide low growing plants, I had Selaginella in mine, there is no need for hides.
I loved my ribbon snake, she was great, so I'm sure you'll enjoy it. They're not as calm as the snakes you've previously kept though, and certain individuals may always just musk you, but some can be pretty calm.

[Hardwikk]

Shouldn't you try something more exotic (that doesn't necessarily mean harder)?

[jspuds]

Well, I understand girth is the deciding factor regarding feeding; I guess what I meant to ask is, approximately how old does the typical ribbon have to be to be big enough for pinkies? I realize growth rates vary, etc, I was just wondering if I'd be able to feed pinks after 6 months or if I'd have to wait 3 years.

I could try for real plants, but I'd need more info on how. I have read into dart frogs, but they seem not to be ideal for beginners, especially since I can't reasonably acquire suitable insects on a regular enough basis indefinitely. I don't want to assume responsibility for a pet I can't properly care for. For a few months, I could probably do crickets and guppies etc.

I'm now thinking I should try establishing a 10-20 gallon paludarium this summer, when I'll have time, and if I can get that up and running, look into a ribbon snake.

Thanks,
Jim

[qiksilver]

Oh, I just meant take set up cues from those guys, animal choice is yours, whatever you're comfortable with. But I find setting up a planted tank to be at least half the fun.



And why exotic? Why not just let a person pick what animal they'd like to keep/are comfortable with keeping and not put it down?

[Hardwikk]

Shouldn't you try something more exotic (that doesn't necessarily mean harder)?

Since I didn't have enough time to edit the above post, I'm making another one for some suggestions. Western Hognose snakes, Rosy boas, and Kenyan Sand Boas all make great beginner snakes and are very easy to care for. If you happen to be reluctant to get a Hognose snake because of the venom, you shouldn't be. Their venom isn't close to dangerous and they will never bite for defense (they have other harmless ways to defend themselves that you could find interesting... PM me if you want to know what they do).

[jspuds]

I'm not married to ribbon snakes by any stretch of the imagination.

I began looking into them because they do well in a wetter environment anyway, (though I certainly realize they need dry land, I'm thinking more a terrarium with a large water feature than a true paludarium.)
Ribbons seemed like an ideal snake for a small paludarium for this characteristic. If anyone has other suggestions on snake choice, by all means please let me know.

Neither the rosy boa, sand boa, or hognose seem to be particularly suited for a paludarium to me... ? I'm interesting in building and maintaining a paludarium that I can put a snake in. I'm not new to snakes in general, I'm simply new to the more aquatic snakes, and am pretty familiar with all of the above but the hognose.

Thanks for all the advice, I'm finding anything helpful, this project is still in its infancy and I probably won't really work on the tank in earnest until this summer.

Jim

[Hardwikk]

I'm not married to ribbon snakes by any stretch of the imagination.

I began looking into them because they do well in a wetter environment anyway, (though I certainly realize they need dry land, I'm thinking more a terrarium with a large water feature than a true paludarium.)
Ribbons seemed like an ideal snake for a small paludarium for this characteristic. If anyone has other suggestions on snake choice, by all means please let me know.

Neither the rosy boa, sand boa, or hognose seem to be particularly suited for a paludarium to me... ? I'm interesting in building and maintaining a paludarium that I can put a snake in. I'm not new to snakes in general, I'm simply new to the more aquatic snakes, and am pretty familiar with all of the above but the hognose.

Thanks for all the advice, I'm finding anything helpful, this project is still in its infancy and I probably won't really work on the tank in earnest until this summer.

Jim

Sorry. It's just before you said you only kept a corn and a BP so I thought you would go in the same direction as those two. Do you enjoy handling your snakes? If you do Ribbonsnakes aren't the most handle-able snakes around (that's why I'm not such a fan of them). That's why I suggested those 3 species. I thought these were one of those snake care info topics, so I didn't understand that you were really looking into getting a Ribbonsnake.

[jspuds]

Yeah, that is true, and I have taken it into consideration. It's a good point - I don't want to get musked too often!

However, the paludarium is mostly for the way it will look in the first place, and apparently ribbons are diurnal. I'm OK with not be able to handle the snake, especially since I have my BP to handle all I want (and he seems to enjoy it... for a snake )

Sidenote: the corn I had (which unfortunately died of an illness when under the care of my highschool biology teacher... *grumble*) was, contrary to their reputation, the nastiest snake I have handled. It always had somewhere to go and struck me several times, even when it reached 2.5'. I did try all the tactics, including gloves, giving it time alone, handling it daily, and so on, and it didn't help - quite a mean snake. I do understand this is totally contrary to corns' reputation, but if the ribbon is half that bad, I'll be surprised. My BP on the other hand is the most gentle snake I've ever seen, total polar opposite.

Jim