Will They Miss Their Space?

[JoshJP7]

It has nothing to do with feelings... its all about OFFERING the option to climb... thats it... I NEVER told ANYONE to put their BP in an aboreal cage so i think your taking this to the extreme... I didnt know a 66qt tub thats like 14inchs high was considered aboreal? ... again when did i say they were excellent climbers? NEVER i never said they were like spider man ... i simply said based on experience... mine climb... period... thats it nothing more... Again lets put more words in joshs mouth... please show me where i said " i let mine out to roam so they can have fun and play"... you wont find it bc I NEVER SAID IT!!... I let them out for free roam to get some exercise and a little more stimulation... I think your all taking this a little too far... All i told the OP is if he wanted to provide more room so his snakes could move and climb... go with a 66qt tub and again i still stand 100% behind this statement...

Lets remember this post isnt about josh and what he does with his

[littleindiangirl]

In the end everyone will read the posts and make up their own mind.

[JoshJP7]

Which is fine... I have no problem with some putting their snake in small enclosures and others in larger one... I have a problem when someone tells me Im giving bad advice when i tell them they can go with a 66qt for a baby.

[Spaniard]

I'm going to go out and say this, no one will be able to tell me different because I'm sure none of you have tried it, I bet a ball python could live in my house and roam all over IF it had sufficent conditions: hides, humdity, temps, etc.
A lot of people act like these snakes will perish if they're not kept in a tiny enclosure.

Until you try you won't know for sure so you're argument proves nothing.

One is that snakes don't feel emotions. They survive on instinct, and can't feel happy or sad about their enclosure, handler or food. I believe they can feel either stressed and fearful, or secure and content. Whether it's towards their enviroment or keeper. They strive to find a secure setting, and strive to find food because they are basing their actions on their instincts.

Then the other idea is, snakes judge their surroundings and find them either pleasing or constrictive by reasoning. They feel a whole range of emotions like anger, love, affection, disgust. They can identify those people they care for, and strive to be with them or please them. Or they strive to please themselves with activites and actions based on them reasoning.

I don't believe the second one. I don't think snakes can feel emotions the same way mammals and higher animals do. I would never agree with your statements that your snakes are trying to visit with you and want to roam for fun.

I am of the mind they want to secure their settings by first confirming there are no immediate threats, then they will find a small secure place to hide until it is time to feed or breed.

I agree with you here.

For all you people that have snakes which "like" doing things there should be things your snakes "don't like" doing; which to me demonstrates preference. Right? Preference requires some sort of rational brain process, "I like cherries because they're sweet". To like something requires a reason, what are you snakes reasons for liking climbing? How do you know for sure?

If this is the case and snakes have these rational thought processes then why on feeding day when the smell of rat is in the air will you get tagged if you stick your hand in their enclosures? Shouldn't they recognize you as the hand that feeds them, no pun intended?

[JoshJP7]

You get tagged bc theyre hungry and they want food... They confuse your hand for the rat alot like a shark confuses a human with a seal... They smell the rat... Know theyre getting food... and strike at the first thing they see... Ive never had this problem bc i feed in a feeding tub... never been tagged reaching in my snakes tubs bc they know they dont get fed in there...

Do i know they "like" to climb... No i cant speak snake and none of em have ever wrote it down for me... BUT... I do know that ALL TEN of my snakes use the fake trees for climbing on at night so common sense... not preference.... tells me they enjoy climbing on what Ive provided them with or else

why would they be on there??? Your explanation is "theyre trying to get out... they want food".... well the doors to my custom cages are in the front... Why would they be climbing up if the doors not up??.... "They want food"... Theyve never been fed in their enclosures so why would they think theres food in there? Plus theyll be out THE DAY AFTER being fed... climbing around... They must want more food right?


Maybe its that they just slept for the past 10hrs... and want to move around a lil bit... Kinda like a human sitting in a car for 10 hrs wants to get up and walk... Oh wait i prolly shouldnt mention human charateristics cause youll pull the "emotions" card on me again...

You have nothing back your explanations up but "maybe its this... maybe its that"... How to scientists prove out a hypothesis?? They run an experiement right? Well my mini experiement was.. will snakes climb on this fake tree if i put it in its tank? or am i wasting my money?

10 snakes later and the answer is still the same... yes they will climb... whether or not they "like" it... i could care less.. all I know is they use it... and nothing anyone says will change that...

Why dont yall take 1 snake... offer it room to climb and something to climb on and see if you ever find them on it... I got 10 saying they do... Any takers?

[MikeC1212]

Until you try you won't know for sure so you're argument proves nothing.

Argument? It was an exaggerated prediction. I never told anyone it was a good idea. I was making a statement of my belief.. which is BPs can and should live in something larger than a 12qt tub. Thanks for tuning in. Re-read if you have to.

Another belief: (not argument, let's straighten that out for the "haters") Just because a snake is terrestrial doesn't mean he's grounded from climbing. It means a majority of the time is spent on the ground, not all of it's time.

[littleindiangirl]

To say that "it's silly" that ball pythons aren't built for climbing is wrong. Ball pythons CAN climb, it does not mean they are exceptional climbers, or "built" for climbing.

I think that's what I said.

[JoshJP7]

OK so why was it even mentioned that theyre terrestrial??... No one said they were aboreal or were built for climbing... simply put... given the option to climb... they will climb... are you disputing that?

[littleindiangirl]

OK so why was it even mentioned that theyre terrestrial??... No one said they were aboreal or were built for climbing... simply put... given the option to climb... they will climb... are you disputing that?

Oh no, I'm not disputing that at all. I have said they are not good climbers, and can fall and hurt themselves when given the opportunity to climb. (Compared to an arboreal animal)

(This is my first post on this thread)

On that note, ball pythons are terrestrial, bulky and slow, and are rarely found at heights. They are particularly clumsy climbers. I know when I had a tall setup, my BP tried to climb everynight, and he fell several times. They can get injured, I worried about it all the time until I moved him into a tub.

That's been my view this whole time. They don't climb extremely well, and will fall.

[JoshJP7]

OK so why are you and I arguing bc I agreed with you haha? I admitt they are clumsy as babies but I honestly dont think theyd be hurt seriously falling from the top of a 14inch tub. If there was a good chance that would happen would i keep a 4k snake in there? no way in hell... but since it would take freak accident for that to happen... i guess im will to take the risk.