humidity/temp problems?

[rottendj]

Hi, i am using the analogue temperature and humidity gauges made by exo-terra. they have been in the plastic (temporary) enclosure for a few days now and it seems that the humidity is too high (%70) and the temperature is too low (73). i see that most people use digital measuring equipment so could this be the problem although i can't see they would be out that much.
my perminent viv should be here in the next week and im not sure what road to take.
i'm using kitchen roll as substrate and have an under tank heat pad, just a hide and a water bowl are in the tank at the mo.
how would i go about lowering the humidity and raising the temperature?

any advice would be much appreciated as im starting to worry
regards, Mike...

[frankykeno]

As far as the analog ones Mike they can be off quite a lot, sometimes as much as 10 degrees so I've heard. The digital really are best.

For your humidity you can put in a smaller water dish with less surface area and make sure it's on the cool side of the enclosure. Since it's a plastic enclosure you can add a lot more holes into the sides and lid. You can move the enclosure of a room with better air movement (as long as it's not in direct sunlight or drafts). Make sure that the snake cannot tip over it's water dish, that will only make the humidity issues worse.

As far as temps, can you turn up the UTH a bit more? Is the house very chilly?

Two hides, one per end, is usually best.

[GirDance]

Here's an idea for you about exactly how much they can be off:



Go with digi, then tweak from there That humidity guage stays between just about 50 (thats the lowest it ever said) and 65 at all times.

[rottendj]

wow thats quite shocking! so basically i bought a load of cr*p. i want the best for my royal so what would be the best kit i could get (within reason) such as thermostat and digi gauges bearing in mind i will have a 24" x 15" x 15" viv soon. and can a thermostat work with the habistat heat pads?
any other tips greatly appreciated

kind regards, Mike...

[dr del]

Hi Mike,


I managed to get a thermometer on ebay that shows humidity and in and out temps all the time as well as a clock for about £12 shipped.

Thermomstat wise we don't have the same choice they do in America for the most part.

Though today I did find out it is possible to get the johnson controls a-419 but it costs £78 - which is more expensive than we can get proportional thermostats (normally £55 - £69). Though ebay has them even cheaper.

Brands to check out online would be habistat, microclimate ( seem to have cool safety features) or lucky reptile (the only digital one).

I have only ever used habistats and have had a couple fail on me but this is over a period of ten years or so.

I like the idea of the microclimate safety features but like habistats their temperature range is small and your setup would have to be designed with that in mind.

Lucky reptile looked quite good as well but I couldn't find an all singing all dancing model but they would definately be worth considering.

The a-419 has a great reputation for reliability on these boards but (as of this morning) ther aren't any actually in europe at the moment so there would be a possible 5 week delivery time and they are still on/off, but personal recomendations count for a lot so I'd also consider them.

Helix did suggest they would be releasing a line of reptile thermostats in europe in the latter half of the year but they haven't emailed to say they have done so yet.

Any of the thermostats will work fine with a habistat mat but I found those matts couldn't get hot enough to be effective as a sole heating solution. But I do have a cold house so if your room was heated to 82f they might be able to do it ok.

All mine are quite old so that may be the reason for that though - plug it into the wall unregulated and measure what temperature it gets too as a test. Not while it's anywhere near an animal naturally.

I did just import some flexwatt (prewired and rated at 240v) direct from the manufacturer and that stuff rocks.


dr del

[GirDance]

A thermostat will work with any heating device that plugs into an electrical outlet. You just place the probe wherever it gets hottest and what they then do is manage the electrical output to the heating device so that it maintains a specific preset temperature for you.

[rottendj]

fascinating stuff dr del. its a lot to take into account so i'll sift through ebay and see what crops up. the heat pad i have (when in the mains) is not consistant heat over the area of the pad and feels just warm to the touch so around 25 - 30 degrees C. its my sisters old one and may be worth investing in a new one.
should the temp of the viv be measured about an inch off the ground and how should the cool spot be regulated, i would guess with another heat pad and dual thermostat?
thankyou so much for everyones help so far

regards, Mike...

[dr del]

Hi,


Yeah I've found that as they age they can develop "hot spots" - though generally nothing dangerous like the kind hot rocks can have.

They never seem to give the heating performance of the american stuff though - mine only ever seemed capable of raising the ambient air temp by about 10 degrees c approximately. Whereas flexwatt can hit 115f no problems sitting in my living room when the ambients are 76. It's possible the newer matts have a better performance though as all of mine are old - the store you buy them from should have some idea what they can do and advise you on this hopefully.

Yeah if you needed one for the cool side too (I know I do ) then either two seperate thermostats, a dual channel one or possibly even running the cool end heatmat off the same thermostat as the hot end but putting it through a dimmer would work. The last one take a bit more fiddling to make it work though.

The temperatures should be taken in side the hides at both hot and cold end as thats where the snake will actually spend almost all of its time and also under the substrate at the hot end when first setting it up to make sure that that area (which the snake can burrow down to etc) does not have to get to dangerous temps to get the hot end hide temp correct. Try and arrange the depth/type of substrate so that the under substrate temp is arround 95 when the in hide temp is 92-94.

This means the animal has access to the full temperature range it needs while never being exposed to temps high enough to cause burns or anything.

Its also a good idea to try and design everything so that the thermostat probe is outside of the actual enclosure so that the snake itself cannot interfere by lying on it, moving it or p'ing on it - if you feed live this also stops any prey items from gnawing on it as the little boogers seem to know which is the most expensive and important peice of kit to chew.

Any other q's just ask away - and if you find a really good perice of kit over here then feel free to tell us too.


dr del

[rottendj]

ok thanks, i had a gander on ebay this morning and ended up spending as usual...
i opted for a new habistat 11" x 17" heat mat, habistat day/night dimmer thermostat, habistat night eye day/night switch and an all in one hygrometer and thermometer with min and max temps. and of course at the cheapest prices on ebay.
i figured i could keep him happy using the night/day switch by having the light sensor on the windowsill behind the curtain. i guess i'll have to wait and see if the cool spots warm enough when its ready, that way i can judge whether i need another mat and thermostat.

as you mentioned about having the thermostat probe outside the viv, do you mean something like drilling a hole about an inch off the floor, in the side, big enough for the end of the probe and sealing it in place? and where should i position the hygrometer/thermometer probe???

kind regards, Mike...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...MEWN:IT&ih=018

[dr del]

Hi,


Nice looking thermometer.

Now for the slightly less fun news.

Unless your breeding the snakes you want to keep the night and day temps the same. I always just used a couple of cheap plug in timers to control the lights and night time drops in the breeding season as we have a different day/ night cycle than ghana. That may just have been me being economical though so I would get a second opinion.

I hadn't realised you were using a wooden viviarium which changes the advice slightly.

You really don't have any choice but to put the probe inside the tank at that point but there are a few ways of minimising the snakes impact on it.

I had tacked mine onto the wall of the viv with cable tacks to stop the snake moving it much and used one to bend the probe outwards from the wall so it hovers a couple of millimeters above the substrate ( I use newspaper) just inside the hot end hide and had cut a hole into the inside of the hide (peices of cork siliconed together) so it was inside but the snake couldnt lie on it.

Of course I then decided to use plastic boxes with holes in the top so at the moment it merely waves in the air behind it till I decide which I prefer and redesign if necesary.

These are just to give you some ideas as obviously you know your setup best.

The thermometer probe your going to want to keep mobile for a little while till you have finished checking everything out but you can use velcro stips siliconed onto the back of the base unit and slightly elevated off the substrate of the cool end ( to try and avoid getting it p'd on) if you like.

I have held it in place with bluetack once or twice but it always ended up falling off.


dr del