thrilled new BP owner - first problem. Help!

[bearhart]

We had a boa when I was a kid and a few months ago out of nowhere I decided I wanted a snake. I went to a well-established exotic pet store in town and walked out with an approximately 5 month old male BP.

Things have gone great and we're absolutely in love with the little guy. Everything I read suggests that he's a model BP - in that he never has those problems.
* He always eats right away.
* He exhibits no aggressive behavior even when disturbed at bad times (post-feed, in-blue, pre-poop).
* I took him back in after a few months and the guy at the pet store said he looked great - and I couldn't disagree.

But....his behavior has changed in the last month.

When I first got him he would come out of his hide box every night at about 10pm or so like clockwork and cruise his cage. He'd often lay stretched out in a location that made him easy to pick up and would make no effort to prevent it. In fact, he would sort of lie real still as you put your hand in as if he was co-operating with you. The only times he would stay holed up were:
* 2-3 day break post-feed.
* roughly 7 days for shed cycle.
* 2 days pre-poop. And, he was always extra active after the poops.
We went through several feeds, two or three poops, and one shed this way.

Then after one of his feeds his normal digestion period went by and no Snakey. After a couple more days I inspected him and he was in-blue. So then I waited until he shed about a week later and still no Snakey. I inspected him again and he was getting fat at his vent. So then I waited a few more days and sure enough, he pooped. But then he just continued being reclusive for good!!

I've fed him since and he ate just fine. We moved his cage to a quieter part of the house. I checked his temperatures and his cage was a bit cool so I corrected that. But he still just hides out all the time! If I open his hide box he'll ball up but as soon as I take him out he relaxes right away. I can hold him just like before and when I put him back he remains active for the night.

So my angst is coming from the fact that I always have to extract him from his hide box now.

Am I being too uptight? Many people don't seem to think it matters to much when you pull them out.

He always seemed kind of fun when I had him out but the "Ball Python Manual" has me scared that he's stressed out whenever he moves around.

Am I crazy? Am I doing something wrong?

[AzureN1ght]

I'm fairly sure the rule of thumb is: "a secretive BP is a happy BP". Most of them spend the majority of their time chilling in a hide. Mine really only comes out at 2AM or so (and I'm almost always asleep--the few times I' haven't been asleep were the ones where I saw him out and about). I know he comes out anyway, because he likes to knock things over

They're nocturnal and secretive, so it sounds to me like you've just got a happy boy I wouldn't sweat about it too much.

[darkangel]

He sounds content They're really not that active. Mine is a total bum, only leaves the hide to poop and eat.

[SnakeEyes]

He sounds content They're really not that active. Mine is a total bum, only leaves the hide to poop and eat.

Exactly how my male is...lazy bum....damn am I jealous...

[bearhart]

Yea, that's what the guy at the pet store keeps saying. I think he's getting sick of me....

Ok, so what about handling? I've mostly read "Handle them a little bit daily" all the way up to "He's my best friend and we hang out together all the time."

I love holding him and letting cruise around (supervised, of course). But, "The Ball Python Manual" is ultra conservative on the subject. They say eventually you can handle them "occasionally for short periods" and suggest that movement by the snake while being held is a sign of discomfort. I'd live to hear some more testimonials on this subject!

[SnakeEyes]

Only time I touch mine is to take him out to weigh him before each meal, other that, hes in his hides.

[lord jackel]

Just to be safe...what is your setup like? Temps, humidity, hides, cage size, substrate. Check the basics...you have had him long enough that a sudden change in routine is worth looking at all the basics again.

[darkangel]

I hold my little guys maybe 3 times a week. I let him sit in my lap or in my arms, and I keep him out until he gets really squirmy, which is usually about 15 minutes. I've also noticed if I took him out everyday of the week, he likely won't eat for me that week. You have to find a comfortable medium between your desire to handle him and what he will tolerate without getting stressed out.

[AzureN1ght]

I've only had Auryn for about 3 months. From my observations with him, he'll be quite content to sit still for awhile--and when he starts zooming around/getting fidgety I know that he's getting uncomfortable and wants to find somewhere safe to hide (He's usually zooming/fidgeting toward anything that looks dark and safe). I don't really ever have him out longer than 20 minutes. Once he starts getting zoomy, I put him back and he zips right into one of his hides

EDIT: I've also noticed a difference between Auryn moving around to explore and Auryn zooming around because he's getting nervous/uncomfortable.

[bearhart]

Yea, he does have a sort of "chilled out" period when you first take him out and then eventually he starts getting more active. One thing we do is put a temporary hide in the area over a heating pad on low. Once he gets squirmy we let him cruise in there for a while. He eventually comes out and explores some more.

lord jackel:
Yes, the change is what drives me nuts. I have regularly improved his cage both for his sake and for aethesic reasons. I started out with the recycled paper substrate, an upside down coaster holder for a hide, and a cool rock I found in my backyard (and boiled for safety), and a little water dish.
Over time I've made the following changes:

* I switched to a spagnum/fir substrate
* Got a big water dish he could fit in and half covered it with a peice of cork bark. I also moved his dish to sit on the warm side next to his hide.
* I changed his hide to be an upside down peice of curled cork bark with pete moss to fill in the walls. This is right next to his water dish so he can snake back and forth easily.
* I got him this really cool peice of grape wood that has all sorts of ways to crawl on.
* I started misting his cage about once a day. He really seems to like drinking the droplets off the cage walls.

I've always had a 50W red heat lamp on most of the time. He's always had an under-tank heater.

The floor of the warm side it about 82-87 degrees. I keep the bedding very thin in his hide to let the undertank heat come through. I imagine its 90deg at least because sometimes when I take him out he feels about the same temperature as a person that's been under blankets. Nice and warm... (I should measure it though).

I just got a Hydrogemeter (sp?) that says about 50% but I don't have much confidence in it yet.

Perhaps he didn't like his cage at first and now he's happy and acting normal? Its pretty sweet compared to the pet store.