Temp question

[55fingers]

Quick question here, I'm running an RHP on a thermostat in a tub and I am trying to achieve a hot spot surface temp of 90f.

My dilemma is there is quite a large hide under the RHP that takes up about 1/3 of the enclosure, and would be very easy to climb on. Every time I reach a ground-level temp of 90f the top of the hide, being closer to the RHP, reads up to 100f surface temp. If I lower the temp so that the top of the hide reaches no more than 90-92f, the inside of the hide/ground level won't reach any more than 85.

My question is, will the surface being closer to the RHP and able to be climbed on, propose a danger to the snake if it is reading this high? If so, will the snake be alright with the top of the hide being the only hot spot of 90 while the rest of the hot side is around 85? Or does someone have a better solution?

[Malum Argenteum]

I kept a pair of bloods (brongersmai) for a handful of years -- grew out a pair of hatchlings, bred them (maternal incubation is the coolest thing), sold the hatchlings (feisty monsters, oh my goodness) and then moved on to other projects. Just so my experience level here is clear (full life cycle, but not with a wide range of specimens).

I checked my recollection against Kara's site (The Blood Cell), and confirmed that 90F is really hotter than is a good idea. I recall running my warm ends (PVC cages with RHPs) somewhere in the mid 80s, and TBC recommends 80 -84F, with a hot spot of up to 86 for animals that prefer/require more heat.

I would start out at a more reasonable temp and if the snake always sticks to the warm areas then bump up a degree or two and see if the snake prefers that. A tub might not be the best option since bloods don't need or benefit from a wide range of enclosure temps -- the warm and cool ends are best kept within a few degrees. That's how I approached them, anyway.

Another option is to also use a heat mat on its own thermostat channel under the warm area so to supply heat both from underneath and above. Personally, if I did that (which I might) I would offset the RHP more into the center of the enclosure to give a more gradual heat gradient.

[55fingers]

Thank you for your help and insight! I decided to go ahead and try that out. I have moved the RHP to the center of the enclosure and I have a heat pad on the hot side to warm up the surface temp under the hide. Temps are currently sitting around:

76 ambient temp hot side, 75 ambient temp cold side
90 surface temp hot side (on top and under hide), 80 surface temp cold side

So now I have the issue of why is my ambient temp so low. I'm thinking it's because the thermometers are on the back wall of the enclosure, near the vents (where the heat would be escaping), on the far left and far right (away from the RHP). I may try moving them to see if they are just in a bad spot, as the majority of the enclosure should be reading higher. It may just be because they are in either farthest corner.

That being said, with my ball pythons, I generally go by the rule of, as long as the ambient is around 80 and I have a surface hotspot of 90 then it is okay. What would be the steady ambient temp to go for, if I already have surface temps reaching the desired temps?

[Malum Argenteum]

An IR temp gun is a much more useful tool than a static thermometer (although having a simple digital thermometer in the enclosure can be useful for a quick check each morning, so long as one remembers that if the temp looks off the first thing to do is confirm the reading with the IR gun). They're also cheaper than a couple thermometers, can be used on every enclosure in the collection and last decades.

That said, it may be helpful to post photos of the enclosure, and also note room temps. If you've got a freestanding plastic tub (Xmas tree box?) in a cool room temps are going to be a function of room temp as much as anything, and be a perpetual headache. If you need to run the warm end at 90F to get the ambient up to only 75F, that's not going to be a great situation.

[55fingers]

I measure my surface temps with an IR temp gun and my ambient temps with ThermoPro thermometers. I'm just having a hard time getting both ambient and surface temps correct without one off-setting the other.

That being said, we have found a temporary solution. I have the RHP mounted in the center to maintain a majority of the ambient heat, an UTH under the hot side to maintain a hot spot for a slight gradient if the snake so chooses, and in order to stabilize the general ambient temp we had to run a small ceramic heater in the closet which the tub is in. All heating devices are on thermostats of course, including the ceramic heater. This is giving us temps of:

80 ambient temp hot side, 80 ambient temp cold side
90 surface temp hot side (on top and under hide), 80 surface temp cold side

This is exactly what I'm going for, but this means we are running a total of 3 different heating devices on 1 quarantine tub just to get it up to temp, which frankly is just ridiculous to me in theory (never mind the electricity costs) so though it will work temporarily, I'm going to be aiming for switching to a PVC enclosure with a simple RHP ASAP.