BP tempatures okay?

[Ruby]

I have a 47 gallon tank for my hatchling BP.
During the day the warm side of the tank is 88F-94F and a 90F-104F basking spot.

The cool side is 70F-80F. Humidity usually stays around 60℅-70℅ but can drop down to 50℅.

At night the warm side temps are around 70F-78F and cool side is 70F. Are these tempatures okay?

[Bogertophis]

No. Max temp about 90* is safer- 104* is too hot. Lowest temp. not below 75* is best. Humidity is fine- 50-60% is okay for most of the time, but when your snake is in shed, 65-75% is best- you can also provide a humid hide. 47 gal. tank for a hatchling is gigantic- most young BPs would be refusing food, feeling "insecure" with so much space, but if your snake is eating, don't change things right now- just try to provide more "cover" (hiding places) & privacy (cover sides & back, for example). Posting pics of your set-up would help us offer suggestions.

[dakski]

I have a 47 gallon tank for my hatchling BP.
During the day the warm side of the tank is 88F-94F and a 90F-104F basking spot.

The cool side is 70F-80F. Humidity usually stays around 60℅-70℅ but can drop down to 50℅.

At night the warm side temps are around 70F-78F and cool side is 70F. Are these tempatures okay?

Honestly, they are very much not okay.

Cool side should not be below 77-78F ever. Basking spot/warm side hot spot should not be more than 88-90F.

Night temps should not drop significantly, if at all, IMO.

Humidity is fine. I would up for sheds, but 50% most of the time is fine. I wouldn't go below that.

How are you heating the tank? How are you checking temps? Temps should be ground temps measured with an IR temp gun?

What are you using for temp control? What type of thermostat?

Anything over 94F you are risking neurological damage. Over 98F you can pretty much guarantee it, if not death. 104F I am surprised your BP is still alive and not neurologically impaired.

I would lower the hot side temps immediately. If you are not using a thermostat I would unplug the hot side heating element. Better to have a colder snake while you get your setup correct than a dead or hurt snake. DO NOT FEED YOUR SNAKE NOW. Get everything dialed in and then feed. Snakes need heat to digest, but your cold side is too cold and your hot side dangerously hot. That's a bad combo.

Any questions, please ask. We want to help, but your setup now is extremely dangerous for your BP.

[Ruby]

I use IR temp gun to measure inside the hides and the basking spot.
To measure the air tempatures I use zoo med environmental control center thermostat.

The air on the hot side doesn't go above 93, but the basking spot (rocks on top of hide) are 100F.
Inside the warm hide stays around 85F.

I keep a lot of hides and clutter in her tank so she can choose her exact tempatures.
She spends an equal amount of time on both the cold side, hot side, and in between.

What can I do to improve? The cold side always stays in between 70-80F.
How can I stop it from dropping at night?
I use a UVB and UVA bulb during the day and a DHP that stays on day and night.

[dakski]

I use IR temp gun to measure inside the hides and the basking spot.
To measure the air tempatures I use zoo med environmental control center thermostat.

The air on the hot side doesn't go above 93, but the basking spot (rocks on top of hide) are 100F.
Inside the warm hide stays around 85F.

I keep a lot of hides and clutter in her tank so she can choose her exact tempatures.
She spends an equal amount of time on both the cold side, hot side, and in between.

What can I do to improve? The cold side always stays in between 70-80F.
How can I stop it from dropping at night?
I use a UVB and UVA bulb during the day and a DHP that stays on day and night.

What are you using to control the DHP? I wouldn't be using bright lights and BP's don't need UVB like many lizards do. BP's hunt at night and spend most days in burrows. A small bulb would work well for daytime light (LED is fine and doesn't affect temps). If you are relying on the UVB and UVA for heat, I wouldn't.

I would use the DHP and a CHE (Ceramic Heat Emitter) on thermostats (or a thermostat that can run two devices) to control temps.

Which side of the tank is each on? I would use the DHP for the hot side and the CHE to keep middle of tank/ambient temps up. If you do that the cool side should take care of itself. The CHE, if large enough and with a proper lamp should project so that the ambient temps are about 80-84F (ideal) and the cool side is about 78-80F.

In summary, I would be focused on heating elements for heat and a separate, non-heating element, for light. For now, focus on the heat. Ambient light during the day is enough for your BP.

On temps, again, nothing the BP can reach should be over 90F. If you want the ground hot, get a heat pad for the hot side as well. You can get a thermostat that runs the both devices, or set the heat pad on another thermostat. However, that's probably overkill if you have a DHP and CHE. You also have the option of a small heat pad for the cool side if you cannot get those temps up. Again, it will need a thermostat.

Why are the temps dropping at night so much? Is it because the UVB/UVA go out? Again, I wouldn't rely on those for heat. They are also probably too bright and too hot for your BP.

Please let me know if this makes sense or if you have other questions. I, and others here are happy to help and want you and your BP to have a great experience together.

EDIT: Also - air temp isn't as important as ground temp. If the ground is 84F, for example, where your snake is, the air temp above it will be fine, especially with the CHE and DHP which project down.

BP's can digest at 86F just fine. 88-90F speeds it up some, but inside the warm hide sounds okay. Again, you can use ground heat, OR a smaller or thinner hide for heat to get through from above. I use cheap plastic hides like these:

https://www.reptilebasics.com/medium-hide-box

These has all the sizes: https://www.reptilebasics.com/hide-boxes

[Ruby]

I've reprogrammed the thermostat to keep the warm side at 88F with a basking tempatures of 92F.
At night the warm side stays between 75-80F the temp drops because I don't have UVA/UVB on at night.

Should I buy a heating mat for night?
I don't know what to do about the cold side, people have told me the cool side doesn't matter and the snake will regulate itself if the hot side is proper.

[Ruby]

The thermostat I use has multiple outlets, it automatically dims/turns all lights on and off.
I'm currently using 3 lamps, I should get a forth for the CHE?

[dakski]

I've reprogrammed the thermostat to keep the warm side at 88F with a basking tempatures of 92F.
At night the warm side stays between 75-80F the temp drops because I don't have UVA/UVB on at night.

Should I buy a heating mat for night?
I don't know what to do about the cold side, people have told me the cool side doesn't matter and the snake will regulate itself if the hot side is proper.

The thermostat I use has multiple outlets, it automatically dims/turns all lights on and off.
I'm currently using 3 lamps, I should get a forth for the CHE?

1. Basking temp still too hot. Make warm side 86-88F with no more than a 90F basking spot.

2. Cool side is important. Snakes to need to thermoregulate. That means pick the temps that are good for them at that time. However, it's up to us as keepers to make sure those temps are correct. That means not too hot on the hot side and not too cold on the cool side. Please read what I said in above post about cool side options - either a CHE or a heat mat on thermostat.

3. You should not have lamps at all IMO. You should have heating elements, like CHE's that don't give off light and therefore can stay on all the time. This should keep your night temps from dropping because you are turning off heating elements to eliminate light.

What kind of thermostat are you using? Some bulbs, like UVB, aren't really made to dim. A thermostat and a dimmer is not the same thing. Do you have a dimmer or a thermostat? Again, if the latter, what kind? If it's a proper thermostat it will have a probe for reading temps and a dial to adjust temperature. IMPORTANT: What you set the thermostat to and ground temps are not always, in fact rarely the same. A thermostat probe should hang, ideally halfway between the heating element and the ground. You could set it to 85F and depending on the type of heating element, it could be much warmer or colder at the ground. The thermostat will set the temp to the thermostat probes temp, which is not necessarily the temp you want on the ground where your BP is. It's fine if they are not the same as long as the ground temp is what you want. That could be 85F on the thermostat, or 80F, or 90F. You have to do some trial and error depending on tank, tank size, height, type of heating element, and thermostat.

I would recommend dialing it in without your BP in the tank so it doesn't get too hot.

[Bogertophis]

I think Ruby is using this for control- https://www.chewy.com/zoo-med-enviro...RoCzvcQAvD_BwE

One problem is that it's very hard to control (keep warm enough for a BP) a tank that's 47 gallons, not to mention that glass tanks don't retain warmth very well unless insulated. Ruby- if you cover the sides & back (& also the underside except where any UTH is located) with something that provides insulation*, that will help stabilize the temperatures, but please understand that using this size tank is not ideal to achieve the temperature & humidity needed. It can be done, but you need to make modifications to help.

Such a large air space is greatly influenced by the room temperature where the tank is located- that may be what is complicating the adjustment of your temperatures. Another issue is where the probes are located to measure temperature etc.- and you never rely on what the thermostat is set to- you always need to measure various locations independently to make sure what your equipment is actually achieving.

*As mentioned before, covering the sides (etc.) can provide privacy that snakes appreciate, but at the same time if you use the right materials, it can help insulate the tank to keep warmth in. Many different materials can be used for this, & some are easier to install than others. Things like poster board- the kind with a foam core that comes in black or white in large sheets sold where school & office supplies are sold, also thick corrugated cardboard (which isn't pretty, but you can first install scenery on the glass, & the cardboard behind it), sheet cork or cork self stick tiles, etc. How chilly does this room get, where the snake is located?

Ruby- I wouldn't use lights either- snakes don't like them (they cause stress for nocturnal snakes like BPs) and just the ambient room light is preferable for them. Instead of overhead lights you can use a CHE for warmth without light.

Also, since this is a glass tank, what is on top? A ventilated screen top, I assume? If so, that allows too much air flow, so you easily lose both heat & humidity from inside the tank. By covering most of the screen top (not where the CHE is, of course!) you'll better retain heat & humidity. Keep in mind that when you make any such modifications you'll have to keep a close eye on temperatures & likely make multiple adjustments, since it can take days for warmth to build up after you make changes. (This is the reason it's best to completely set-up & test for a week or more any new reptile home. It's not as easy or safe to do this with "an occupant".)

What are you using for substrate? (I don't recall seeing that mentioned?) As you can see there are so many variables that it's a challenge to help you online, especially when we're not even seeing your set-up.

[dakski]

Yes, it would be very helpful to see the setup, the thermostat, where the probes are placed, etc.

That would help us help you and your BP the best.

Bogertophis, it appears Ruby is using Forest Floor Cypress Mulch. https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...ew-ball-python

Regarding the lighting. I stopped using lighting for my BP, Shayna, a while ago. I have a light in her tank but keep it off. She prefers that. Room light and light from the other tanks is plenty for her. She usually doesn't come out during the day anyway. BP's are generally pretty shy and like to hide a lot. Some other snakes don't care as much and I do keep lights on their tanks. However, light is more for us than for them in general, as most snakes are nocturnal because their food is too.

If you have trouble with your glass tank, you might want to look into something PVC for the long-term. I have Boaphile tanks and I know many here use Animal Plastics (AP) as well as Reptile Basics, and there are others. I have nothing bad to say about AP or Reptile Basics, but have not used them personally. PVC tanks are much lighter, while still strong, compared to a glass tank. Further, they are better insulated and keep heat and humidity in much better. They also aren't much more expensive when you look at bigger sizes that, frankly, are difficult to move, keep warm, etc. in glass tanks. They are also usually sealed on 3 sides and the top, giving your snake a more secure feeling.

One reason I have boaphile tanks, is that I am not super handy. Jeff Ronne, who builds the tanks, builds them to order with all the heating elements you want/need and they are preassembled. Some manufacturers have you put the tank together (for some large tanks it's necessary due to shipping restrictions). For a BP tank, you wouldn't need one too large so that shouldn't be an issue.

Whatever way you go, it's probably a good path. Between trouble you are already having, using multiple heat sources, thermostats you will have to get, etc. to make your setup work long-term, it might make sense to consider going that way sooner than later.

Not trying to overwhelm you, but you will probably have an easier time RE temps and humidity, your snake will be happier, and you will save a ton of money on electricity. My point here is there are other options for you besides a glass tank.

In the meantime, please take a deep breath. This will be fine. We are here to help. Having said that, please get us as much information as you can on your setup (pics too if possible). That will help us help much more easily.

Keep us posted and ask any more questions you have.