Vet Burnt Down in Camp Fire - Ball Keeps Fasting

[Virgil]

I wanted to create a throwaway account for this, but that account can't post, even after waiting a couple of days. Not sure what went wrong there. So I will be deleting this account once this is over, for privacy's sake.

I live in Chico, California. For anyone who may be keeping an eye on the news, the Camp Fire is raging right next to my town. It has burnt down the only reptile-certified vet office within a 45 minute drive of me. I've called every vet in the Chico area, and there's one who is familiar with reptiles, but not certified. I will most likely have to go to Redding to find the next closest reptile vet. Therefore, I'd rather not have to go to a vet unless absolutely necessary, as Virgil hates long car rides and I don't want to stress him unnecessarily.

Virgil's not eating. I wasn't particularly concerned initially, as he is 1) a ball python and 2) we are heading into winter. However, Virgil keeps fasting, and at this point, has not eaten in four weeks. If he reaches five weeks, it will be the longest he hasn't eaten since I went on vacation a year ago and the UTH broke.

Here are the facts:

Virgil is a two year old pastel ball python. He weighed 1729 grams as of November 14th. He has not been losing weight, despite his fasting (the main reason why I haven't dragged him to a vet yet).

He lives in an AP T8. The hot side is ~90 degrees F, cool side ~84 degrees F. He is heated through a Radiant Heat Panel (RHP) and it is controlled by a Herpstat 2. He sleeps in two modified kitty litter boxes that has newspaper in them to help him feel more secure. Despite this, he often likes to wedge himself between the cool hide and the wall, and hide under the fake flowers.

I have been having massive problems with humidity, which have gotten much worse since the Camp Fire began. The air quality here is horrible, and the smoke has been leaking through the apartment door and windows. I have a fan with two filters attached in an attempt to filter out some of the smoke next to the front door. Humidity fluctuates between 34 and 67, depending on the time of day. During the daytime, it sits around 50-54. It tanks at night, and I have been keeping the humidity up during the day with four terry cloth towels (which sit on top of his hides) and two massive fistfuls of sphagnum moss. The humidity spikes when I wet the towels and moss in the morning, and just before bed. I measure the humidity and temperatures with an Acurite thermometer.

Virgil eats medium sized f/t rats. Previously, he has not been a picky eater. In fact, when I last visited the vet last November due to an eye issue, I was ordered to start feeding Virgil every two weeks, as he was becoming overweight. The vet said to do this for the rest of his life, so I have. Virgil has occasionally gone on fasts before, but usually no longer than three of four weeks, and with months in between them.

Virgil last ate on October 17th. Before that it was October 3rd. When he ate on October 3rd, I was ecstatic because he hadn't eaten since September 5th. Before that, he was eating normally and on schedule. I naively thought on October 17th, that since he had started eating on schedule again, he would keep eating on schedule. Nope!

Behavior wise, Virgil hasn't changed. He enjoys doing a couple lazy laps around his tank between 10pm-midnight, but otherwise spends all day sleeping in his cold hide. When I take him out, he is inquisitive and curious, with his tongue going, but doesn't try to escape anywhere or move particularly fast. He just cruises lazily around. His eyes are clear and undented, and the rest of him looks normal.


My Plan of Action:
I am going to follow the Psychology of Problem Feeders (https://jkrballstreetjournal.com/201...-eating-again/) from the sticky thread. First, I am going to change all of his bedding before his next feeding. I am going to make new, smaller hides, since I can't place him in a new tank or tub. I am not going to feed him on a Wednesday like I normally do. I will make sure all the lights are off, and try to stay out of his line of sight next time I feed him.

Does this sound like a good plan? Is there anything I should keep an eye out for, or do? How can I protect Virgil from the smoke?

Due to multiple reasons, I cannot currently leave Chico to get out of the smoke. Unfortunately, packing up and leaving is an option that is only left if I am forced to evacuate.

[SquirmyPug]

Sounds to me like you might need to cool things down a bit. There are a few things you said that make me think that.

Also, a few weeks without food isn't a problem or uncommon for ball pythons. I wouldn't worry about it especially since he's not losing weight.

[Craiga 01453]

I definitely wouldn't worry about 4 weeks. And as long as there isn't substantial weight loss, I wouldn't even worry at 4 months.

Also, you'd be fine switching to small rats at that age and size.

[silverbill]

1729g is quite large for a 2 year old male. A bit of fasting wouldn’t hurt him at all.

[Bogertophis]

I'd put a few layers of damp towels over Virgil's cage to help block the smoke. It will help the humidity too. (helpful for humans to breathe thru a
damp cloth too, btw) Sorry for what your going thru there & the loss of your nearest herp vet.
I'm a former Californian of many years...wildfires suck! I hope it comes no closer & that you don't have to evacuate. I wouldn't worry about Virgil's
current fast....it's not that long (& very "normal" for a BP, especially this time of year) and the smoke might be throwing off his sense of smell too?

I'm not sure why you're worried about having a throw-away account here? Stick around, we don't usually bite.

[pretends2bnormal]

Unless you see substantial weight loss, I wouldn't worry. It sounds like he is fasting from winter or maybe detecting the fires. 2 years old sounds like he's reaching that age where they just have girl BPs on the brain.

I bought an adult breeder male this time of year who only ate 20-30g of live mouse at a time every 1 to 1.5 months for the first 5 months I had him despite on-point husbandry. He was "in the mood" and didn't want much food until March. He lost maybe 100g or so overall out of about 1400g, which isn't much. He put that weight back on pretty easily in March eating only small rats.

Sorry to hear you've lost your vet, though. Sending good wishes your way!

For humidity, maybe hooking up a basic humidifier like you use when you're sick with just water and put it on a basic timer to come on for a bit every hour or 2 overnight by the cage could help? I havent needed it or tried it, but that's my tentative backup plan if I need to boost humidity in my snake room.

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[bcr229]

I had a two year old male that I produced go 8 MONTHS without eating. Nothing changed - he was in the same tub in the same rack. One day he just started eating again, took a few more meals, and then took another four months off.

Four weeks is nothing; in fact some of my adults only eat that often of their own volition.

Bear in mind that most snakes in captivity are grossly overfed and many end up with health issues due to obesity. Just monitor his weight.

At this point I wouldn't be taking him to the vet.

[Crowfingers]

I don't have any recommendations on the humidity, sounds like you're doing all you can - but a 1700+ male (are you positive he's a he?) is on the large size based on most peoples' males. Mine is 3 years old and a decent eater and is hovering around 1100 and on small rats. When he gets a rat larger than 80 grams he goes into fasting mode for 4-6 weeks - if he gets 50-60 gram rats he eats every 10-20 days.

Could be that with his size and the fact that he is on medium rats that he doesn't feel the need to eat. These snakes are built to handle large infrequent meals when needed. In the winter mine usually fasts for about 70ish days from Nov/Dec to March/April and hasn't yet lost more than 20-30 grams. I wouldn't worry at all (easy for me to say, but hard to do lol) unless you see significant 10% or more of body weight.

They are also from an area that see fire regularly, so he could be biologically programmed to not eat in case he would need to flee the fire that he can surely smell. The smell of smoke from fires puts many animals on edge so it wouldn't surprise me if ball pythons are the same.

Good luck with the fires and hope you stay safe

[Virgil]

Thank you to all for your fast replies!

It is reassuring to know that I'm on the right track, and that I shouldn't panic about his fasting yet.

For those who are wondering about his weight, I am not 100% certain if Virgil is a boy or a girl. I was told he was a male when I bought him a reptile show two years ago when he was six weeks old. I impulsively bought him, and therefore made the mistake of not making sure I bought from a reputable breeder. I know that measuring the spurs or going off the shape of his tail is unreliable, so I only have his length and weight to base his sex off of until I take him to a vet or someone experienced who can "pop" him.

He is about four feet in length, although that's not incredibly accurate because I'm not good at measuring a moving snake, even with a marked ball of twine. He is longer than my leg, and I'm 5'5".

After his stint with his eye and learning more about overweight ball pythons, I've been very aware of the potential signs. I know to look for fat rolls around the tail and against the spin, and for extra folds when the ball is creating a tight S shape. However, those are signs for very obese ball pythons, and Virgil may just be on the chunky side. I'm not sure. He looks like a healthy ball python, but I think when everything has settled (I'm currently volunteering 7+ hours at the emergency animal shelter every day), I will take him to a certified vet and get a health checkup. Have him popped, see if he is overweight, etc.

For those who wished me safety, I thank you. I am safe, and much luckier than many.

[SquirmyPug]

If you don't mind me asking, why do you think you need a throw away account for this thread? It's a bit unusual so I'm just curious.