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  1. #1
    BPnet Veteran
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    Did I do everything wrong?

    A few months ago, I had three beautiful baby ball pythons born, one male and two females. They were all undersized, and I was worried about them, but they were beautiful and acted normally. However, the male was born with prolapsed hemipenes, and the females never ate on their own. I tried everything I could. I cluttered their tubs (I don't know the quart size, but they were smaller than the average shoebox by a significant margin, though I think a little bigger than a six quart tub), I added hides, I monitored their temperatures (88-92 hot spot, ambient 77-80), and I never handled them except to clean their tubs (they were kept on paper towels, by the way). Naturally, since the females were so small, I started assist feeding when they continuously refused. Still, they never ate on their own. They were offered frozen thawed and live pinky rats, I tried braining, I tried tease feeding, I tried freaking everything I knew how to do. I started breeding mice in my bedroom because I hoped that hoppers might help, and I can't buy hoppers where I am since no one sells them.

    However, I went to check on them today, and well, I guess those hoppers won't be needed for them. Both of them were lying dead in their tubs this evening. They never were able to gain weight since I couldn't give them large prey while assisting. They always spit it out. And maybe I wasn't assisting frequently enough. I don't know. I just... did I do everything all wrong? I did the best I could, but they went from acting totally normal just a few days ago (I was out of town so hadn't seen them for a few days) to dead. I'm terrified now since I have four more young snakes (though admittedly MUCH larger and more robust) that I've also had to assist feed since they won't eat. They're only slightly younger than the ones that died. I really don't know what else to do anymore. The brother of the two that died is still alive (though he hatched with prolapsed hemipenes, he is now totally okay and seems normal), and he's eating well. I just don't know what's going on with these other snakes. I have no clue what's gone wrong. I feel like a failure as a keeper, and I'm not sure if this is something I want to do anymore. Just.. does anyone have any idea what went wrong? I just haven't the slightest clue. The male was kept in identical conditions and had underwent more stress in his life due to having surgery on his hemipenes, and he was born smaller, but he ended up okay. I don't know what to do from here.
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  2. #2
    BPnet Veteran Ladybugzcrunch's Avatar
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    First, you should always start with live prey. Mouse hoppers are best but I start with rat babies. This gets tough with really small hatchlings as they do not usually respond to rat pinks. However, it can be done. Extreme example: I had twins pip one year. The egg was small to begin with and only one baby made it out of the egg. She was 17 grams. I assist fed rat pink limbs from the beginning. It took a lot of time and effort. Her first meal was a rat pink front leg. The second was the same. The third and fourth were a pinks back leg. The fifth meal was the limbless body. The fifth meal was a bit large for her but she managed to get it down. The sixth meal was a full newborn rat pup. We went up from there. This was every 4 days for a couple months. Once she got to be 35 grams, I started offering her a live rat pink. Of course she refused the first few times and there was a couple assists in between just so there was no back sliding. She ended up making it in the end. It was a Normal by the way. Success starts with the size and health of the mother snake. She should be at least 2 years old and 2000 grams before you pair. She should also be eating well at least weekly. Some will say 1200 grams is big enough but I disagree. Many ball pythons will go on a prolonged fast around this size which you do not want while pairing. It is called the 1000 gram wall if you want to do a search for that. Next you must check for eggs twice a day after she refuses pairing and you are confident they are on the way. Eggs left too long in a bin not set up for maternal incubation can go wrong in so many ways. Next is the incubator and egg tub. These have to be pretty spot on as well. To hot, cold, humid, or not warm or humid enough can do damage to the babies. After they pip, they should have a small tub that is dark and private with wet paper towels until they shed. Some leave the whole clutch together until this happens but I do not. Now we’re back to first meal and choice prey. I will usually offer a live meal the correct size two days after first shed. Since I offer defenseless rat babies I just leave it in over night and check in the morning, no peeking. Usually, the rat is gone. If not, I repeat in a week. If the baby starts to look unthrifty, I will begin assist feed with the same item (dead and maybe a bit smaller) as I am offering live. This is how I assist. Take everything out of the tub. In left hand, grab snake just behind the head with thumb on one side and index on the other. Keep the snake in the tub, upright, with the body supporting itself on the tub floor. With the right hand open the mouth with the rodent nose and place as far back into the mouth as you can without forcing down the throat. Ignore the flailing snake tail and body. Lower the snake head so the bottom of the bin closes the mouth around the rodent head somewhat. Take right hand out of bin and unravel body from left wrist if needed. Hold snake head in place until chomping begins. This could take some time. The snake has to realize it can breathe with the rat in its mouth, then it has to decide it wants to swallow it. Loosen grip slightly but don’t let go. If you relax and the snake does not try to pull back away from the rat right away, very quickly and deliberately, remove your left hand. If the snake pulls back in any way hold the position for longer. Be very still until the snake swallows the entire meal and starts to roam the tub. If done correctly, they usually will swallow. If the entire clutch had issues, And you did pretty much what was written above, I would guess something went wrong inside that you could not see. Something with the female, something during incubation, something to cause the clutch not to thrive. Good luck.

    Also, a hatchling can usually hold out for more than a few months. I had one that did not take its first meal (unassisted) for 6 months. I still have that one. She is a 2016 hatchling that is 200 grams. Soon she will catch up though because she has decided that she loves rat pups and now looks like a very plump 2017 baby. This kind of thing is rare though, like 1 in 100 for me. I am thinking something is, or was, very wrong with your babies if their environment was spot on.
    Last edited by Ladybugzcrunch; 02-01-2018 at 08:57 PM. Reason: Additional input
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