please help with these cage set ups!

[gplegend11]

Hey everyone, This is long and in depth with a lot of detail, but if your up to the challenge I could use all advice I can get on as many things as you can help me with. Seriously I would love anything you have for me. I Got my firt BP maybe just over two weeks ago now. Been trying so many different things to make his home absolutely perfect.

i got it down pretty dang good I think on my final set up which is as follows....

20 gallon glass aquarium. Mulch substrate. Uth on one side with basking temp 88-91 and hide above it. Large water bowl in the middle. One humidity hide and one other hide on the cool side. A few pieces of bark for something he can rub against f needed. Ambient temps never below 75-78 according to probe thermometers on each side, but My heat gun measured almost every contact point in the cage between 80-85, with any high points like bark or tops of hides at 87-90. I Taped aluminum foil around three sides of the glass to try and Retain heat( idk how effective that really is). Aluminum foiled the entire top mesh screen except for the area where I had a wire fixture with a 100 watt ceramic heat emmiter. Lastly I had a digital hygrogometer a few inches from the floor close to the middle of the cage with an average 62% humidity.

i thought I was doing awesome and I now have an obsession.... seriously...

i went to to an exotic pet store because I knew that had a snake specialist. He has worked with hundreds of snakes, multiple and exotic types, and even had Steve Irwin visit the facility he worked at. He seemed like he really knew his stuff so I listened to his advice and wanted to try what he said.

He he taught me a WHOLE different way of doing things than I have ever heard or read ON THIS FORUM OR ANYWHERE ELSE and am trying it out.

Please tell me your thoughts on this. Here is the set up he had me do that he uses on all his 6 snakes....

20 gallon wide exoterra. an uth directly in the middle of the bottom, but the size that fits a 30-40 gallon tank. There is a minimum of six inches on each side of the tank not in contact with the uth if he needs to cool down. A very thin layer of aquarium pebbles on the bottom. Then you put water in the bottom but not enough so that it comes above the pebbles(basically the tiniest layer of water possible). Then a layer of reptisoil on top of the pebbles, just enough the cover the pebbles. Then a Very thin layer of mulch substrate on the reptisoil. No heat source overhead. Digital thermometer and hygrogemetor on one side of the cage. Thermostat probe hooked between the uth and the glass bottom. Digital thermometer probe laying on top of substrate over the uth. I have one hide over the uth and two hides on either end of the cage and a very small water dish.

by the way I also bought my 2nd BP as well when I was there I couldn't help myself... in fact they had a year old female piebald and I almost was gonna buy her for 650.....

so here is the problem with this one now. Had it set up and running for 15 hours. Humidity stays between 80-90. Ambient temp reading is 76 which is fine if my temp gun readings on the floor seemed right. But even above the uth, my temp gun readings vary from 77-88 And it changes that drastically every inch or two I move the trigger point, and I have my thermostat maxed out. Barely any area reaches 88.

the reason he had me change in the first place was because he said my first set up did not allow enough air flow into my cage with covering the majority of the top with foil.

The weird thing is, I did the same change in my cheap glass aquarium and the humidity is only 64, the probe for ambient temps is just below 74.6, but my hot spot fluctuates between 88-94 depending where I point my temp gun, and it is a larger area that is hot than in the exoterra. The same amount of substrates are used and they are plugged into the same thermostat. I took away the ceramic heat emitter from my glass aquarium and opened a much larger hole in the foil on top of the mesh lid.

what is goin on? Was this layered substrate idea a horrible one? Or is it just some crazy advanced technique that I am not ready for?

and why is such a small area being heated by these uth. It's like 11'x8'' size but it's like a 5''x5'' area is being heated. And inconsistently from inch to inch.

heres how I want to go about it and you guys can give me what you think is correct...

.cage 1.... cheap aquarium...put my CHE back over the glass aquarium but keep the hole larger to allow more air flow.

cage 2..... exoterra... don't put any water into the bottom to keep the humidity down and take out as much substrate as possible with ought allowing him to come into full contact of the pebbles( to raise the hot spot temps).

also random questions...
1. Is reptisoil good for pythons as substrate in the first place?.
2.Could the pebbles harm him( the guy said they may like to dig in and rub against them to shed)? They are rough and not the super smooth kind.
3. Why does my thermostat when maxed out only get the uth to only like 105 in the hottest spots according to my temp gun.
4. Why does the uth itself vary in temp on each spot?( reptitherm)

if you got something for me have at it. And if I have made any horrible mistakes please be kind, I am in the learning process and trying to perfect this.

by the way my thermostat is a reptitemp 500r

[sufficio]

I'm no expert but 80-90 humidity all the time is WAY too much. 50-70 is ideal, I think. I've never heard of a setup like this. The only scenario I can think of why you'd need to go to such weird measures with the rocks and water is if your house is VERY dry or something. But even then, the UTH right in the middle of the tank? A heat gradient from one end to the other is usually ideal. Rocks seem kind of dangerous right on top of the UTH too- they could heat up way too much and burn the snake, no?

I'm not sure for most of your questions but this whole setup seems questionable at best. I've NEVER heard of anything like it.

[GoingPostal]

Honestly a glass tank is not a good setup for a ball python period, that's why it's nothing but hassle to keep your temps steady and humidity right, you end up having to use heat lamps and kill airflow, it's just the reality of trying to maintain reptile needs in a fish tank. Personally I'd scrap both and get yourself some pvc cages with radiant heat panels and flexwatt underneath. Your first setup is better temp wise and the experts advice sounds insane to me, water and pebbles why? Undertank heaters don't affect your ambient temps so unless your room is above 75 it's not really feasible to run tank or tub with only belly heat. What kind of thermostats controlling the UTH?

[JodanOrNoDan]

It literally takes five minutes to set a tub up. I do not understand why people go through all the craziness to try to balance out some elaborate setup that does not benefit the animal. I am so tired of flipping pet stores recommending this type of crap to beginners just to make a couple bucks.

[gplegend11]

Thanks for the feedback guys. Yea honestly I think in trying to make everything perfect and immaculate I have confused myself and turned it into some over complicated project. I'm just going to trust my instincts and do what I think is right. I know the peramiters of what they need and I am resourceful, so I am going to clear my head of everything, simplify it and make it happen.

[gplegend11]

What kind of thermostats controlling the UTH?

It is zoo med reptitemp 500r

[gplegend11]

Update. So I reset everything according to what I thought was best. Now at 55% humidity with ambient temp at 80. Hot spot levels range 89-94. I got this 👍🏼